Traffic tickets and naturalization (threads merged)

Welcome to the US:) Open a traffic ticket and see what is written on it. It is a Citation - some explictly say so. The "citation" word may not have been used in your country of origin, in the US it does not need a lawywer to interpret the word citation - any written note handed to you by the police for breaking a law is citation. It can involve penalty or be a simple warning, neverthless it is a citation. However if one is "warned" verbally it is not a citation. Because you are not "cited".

Most people on this forum have strongly held beliefs and have already decided on a course of action and no one can dissuade the person. If you are looking for the answer that you believe in, be prepared to read equally strongly held beliefs that are contrary to your own belief. Otherwise just go ahead with what you want to do. I personally don't think there is any misinterpretation. A person can be cited for any break in law from jay walking or underage drinking to defecating in the public and of course in this case a breaking a traffic law.

suresh_colo said:
I've read the application multiple times and none of the questions on the entire application mentions the words "traffic tickets". You may argue as much as you want that "being cited" and "traffic tickets" are the same thing. They may be for some people, maybe lawyers. I believe the majority of people are neither lawyers nor are they supposed to be familiar with legal jargon.

So this really creates room for misinterpretation, but in no way this would be misrepresentation - no one should be penalized for confused unintelligible language.
My interpretation is that if there were really an interest in knowing information about traffic tickets one of the question on the form would be, "Have you ever had a traffic ticket?". And that's just not the case.
My bet is that the YES would be close to 100% if the question was really related to traffic tickets.
I personally do not know any American citizen who never had a traffic ticket - and I know a lot of people :)

If you go back to the original question you will see that it is related to "volunteering" information.
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brb2 said:
Welcome to the US:) Open a traffic ticket and see what is written on it. It is a Citation - some explictly say so. The "citation" word may not have been used in your country of origin, in the US it does not need a lawywer to interpret the word citation - any written note handed to you by the police for breaking a law is citation. It can involve penalty or be a simple warning, neverthless it is a citation. However if one is "warned" verbally it is not a citation. Because you are not "cited"
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Sorry, I don't agree with you. I even looked it up in the dictionary, and I still can't find any resemblance with traffic ticket. But as you said, people have strong beliefs on the subject, so it's not really my job to try and convince anyone.

citation
Function: noun
Date: 13th century
1: an official summons to appear (as before a court)
2 a: an act of quoting; especially : the citing of a previously settled case at law b: excerpt, quotation
3: mention: as a: a formal statement of the achievements of a person receiving an academic honor b: specific reference in a military dispatch to meritorious performance of duty

Source: Merriam-Webster dictionary
 
1: an official summons to appear (as before a court)
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Here you go ..... When you get a traffic ticket you have 2 choices usually. At least in KS you do.
Pay the fine or go to court to appeal it ! So the court is involved. Why do you think the courtcosts are usually higher than the usual speeding or traffic.
 
suresh_colo said:
Sorry, I don't agree with you. I even looked it up in the dictionary, and I still can't find any resemblance with traffic ticket. But as you said, people have strong beliefs on the subject, so it's not really my job to try and convince anyone.

citation
Function: noun
Date: 13th century
1: an official summons to appear (as before a court)2 a: an act of quoting; especially : the citing of a previously settled case at law b: excerpt, quotation
3: mention: as a: a formal statement of the achievements of a person receiving an academic honor b: specific reference in a military dispatch to meritorious performance of duty

Source: Merriam-Webster dictionary
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hehe Suresh obviously never read his tickets !!!! Minor traffic tickets though they were.
Next time when you get a traffic ticket read it please. hehe:D
 
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Guys,

A citation is a written reprimand or a fine notice, issued by an officer of the law, for an offense where an arrest is not warranted. This can be a traffic ticket, a parking ticket, a desk appearance ticket, a written warning, etc. In layman's terms, any written slip you receive from a law enforcement agent after being stopped or detained by him/her is a CITATION. Upon doing a simple Google search for "traffic citation", this was the first search result: http://www.myfloridacounty.com/services/pay_traffic_citation_intro.shtml

It's a website that allows Florida residents to pay their TRAFFIC CITATIONS online. I hope that resolves this argument.
 
This Traffic/Speeding Ticket has been an on and off issue since the day I joined. I don't think it will ever be solved.
As some may agree it is a Citation others do not agree.
I don't think you will ever come to a conclusion to this argument since there are different opinions on this subject !
 
Ladybuggy said:
This Traffic/Speeding Ticket has been an on and off issue since the day I joined. I don't think it will ever be solved.
As some may agree it is a Citation others do not agree.
I don't think you will ever come to a conclusion to this argument since there are different opinions on this subject !
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Agreed 100%. However, I believe that it's best to cover your behind in this situation and disclose the traffic tickets on the N-400. Consider this: many members of this forum who have already had their interviews reported that the IO specifically asked about traffic tickets. Yes, it's absolutely ridiculous to have to disclose a minor traffic violation from 15 years ago, and even more ridiculous to have to jump through hoops to try to find proof of payment for it. However, what's even more ridiculous is being stripped of your citizenship for lying on your application. Imagine being deported for failing to disclose a $75 "illegal turn" traffic ticket!!!

When I go to my interview, I'll bring an updated N-400, and ask the IO if traffic tickets need to be disclosed. I don't know a single NYC driver who hasn't had a traffic ticket (NYPD has ticket quotas), nor have I ever heard of anyone having their N-400 denied on the basis of traffic tickets other than DUI/DWI.
 
Better safe than sorry right ?
Unless you have a ticket that is over $500 or a long list of tickets it won't even a bit affect your approval of citizenship. I am sure that even an IO or more got a traffic ticket at least once in their lifetime.
It doesn't hurt to check yes on the citation part, bring proof and like I said at the beginning.
Better safe than sorry.
 
The day USCIS deports an N-400 applicant solely for not mentioning a traffic ticket, this debate will come to en end
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I agree but the thing is it is up to a judge at the end to decide whether he/she will be stripped of citizenship because a traffic ticket wasn't mentioned on the N-400 and I am sure the judge stands behind the defendant BUT still do you want to risk it ?
 
I don't think USCIS will ever deport an N-400 applicant solely for not declaring a traffic ticket. My last post was just drawing out the only scenario I think that will bring this debate to an end. Just like the other great debate on this forum, i.e. should GC holders carry their GCs on them or place them in fireproof safes/bank lockers!!!
 
Ladybuggy said:
Better safe than sorry right ?
Unless you have a ticket that is over $500 or a long list of tickets it won't even a bit affect your approval of citizenship. I am sure that even an IO or more got a traffic ticket at least once in their lifetime.
It doesn't hurt to check yes on the citation part, bring proof and like I said at the beginning.
Better safe than sorry.
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Hahaha, I have quite a list of seatbelt tickets. In NY State, it's a violation with no points. I think I have a total of 6 or 7.
 
Triple Citizen said:
I don't think USCIS will ever deport an N-400 applicant solely for not declaring a traffic ticket.
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They'll do it. I've read of others losing citizenship over similar trivialities and technicalities. But it probably won't happen unless you show up on their radar for some other reason. For example, you are falsely suspected of a crime, you get arrested, then they realize they have to release you because the evidence is weak (because you didn't do it, obviously). But they still believe you are guilty and want to get your for something so they dig up your immigration records and try to find something in it they can use against you.
 
I see people debating about what 'citation' means. But why even go there? The N-400 asks the applicant if he/she was EVER detained by a law enforcement official for ANY reason. So unless your speeding ticket was issued based on pictures snapped by hidden cameras, you must have been pulled over by a trooper and fined: meaning that you were detained! That's your answer right there. Never mind that 'traffic ticket' is not mentioned anywhere on the form itself.

So, if you want to be honest, you have to declare this incident on the N-400. If not, that's a different matter. We all know that literally thousands upon thousands of members of both schools of thought have become US citizens. No one should agonize over this item, in my humble opinion.

OY
 
Disclose the traffic stuff now, or it can be used against you in the future by saying you lied on your application. If you are ever suspected and arrested for a crime you didn't commit, it is not uncommon for them to try to dig up something else against you that is unrelated to that crime, if they can't find sufficient evidence about you having committed the specified crime. Your immigration records are an easy target for them, should you ever end up in that situation.
 
Question on Traffic ticket

I am about to file for N-400.
I was cited for a traffic violation which got converted to a parking ticket in the court.
My question is that should I mention that on my application,
Thanks
Jim
 
It's really up to you I think. There is always a heated debate about that as the instructions are not 100% clear in regards to minor traffic violations, not DUI etc. I was under the impression such things did not have to be disclosed like with the GC, so I did not mention my ticket on my N-400 as I did not even have to pay a fine or go to court for mine. Only after coming to this board and reading about it have I decided to mention it at my interview, just so they understand that I am not hiding anything. Minor traffic tickets are usually no big deal, you will definitely not be denied Citizenship because of it. In regards to your specific situation, parking ticket versus traffic ticket I was under the impression parking tickets did not have to be disclosed. Then again what do I know, I m as confused as anyone else is about this matter.
 
I have seen similar debate on this forum relating to moving or traffic violations not involving an arrest or significant injury. I found this on form M-476, "Guide to naturalization:"

"Note that unless a traffic incident
was alcohol or drug related, you do not need
to submit documentation for traffic fines and
incidents that did not involve an actual arrest
if the only penalty was a fine of less than
$500 and/or points on your driver’s license (page 25)."

Thus, it is my belief that this is unnecessary to disclose. However, that being said this is a situation where "good moral character" is under debate, a much more "gray" topic. In order to avoid any character debate I will be stating in my application that although according to form M-476 and the N-400 instructions themselves I do not need to disclose this I will cite that I recall 3 tickets, all paid in their relative states. I may change my mind on this and stick strictly to the instructions before I submit I have not made a 100% decision as yet.
 
xo2008 said:
I have seen similar debate on this forum relating to moving or traffic violations not involving an arrest or significant injury. I found this on form M-476, "Guide to naturalization:"

"Note that unless a traffic incident
was alcohol or drug related, you do not need
to submit documentation for traffic fines and
incidents that did not involve an actual arrest
if the only penalty was a fine of less than
$500 and/or points on your driver’s license (page 25)."

Thus, it is my belief that this is unnecessary to disclose. However, that being said this is a situation where "good moral character" is under debate, a much more "gray" topic. In order to avoid any character debate I will be stating in my application that although according to form M-476 and the N-400 instructions themselves I do not need to disclose this I will cite that I recall 3 tickets, all paid in their relative states. I may change my mind on this and stick strictly to the instructions before I submit I have not made a 100% decision as yet.
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I would definitely disclose traffic tickets if I were you. I didn't disclose any of mine when I filled out the N-400, but will definitely disclose them at the interview. I've read many posts on this forum where the IO demanded proof of payment/court dispositions for traffic tickets, regardless of violation and/or fine amount.
 
Vorpal said:
I would definitely disclose traffic tickets if I were you. I didn't disclose any of mine when I filled out the N-400, but will definitely disclose them at the interview. I've read many posts on this forum where the IO demanded proof of payment/court dispositions for traffic tickets, regardless of violation and/or fine amount.
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Vorpal, What about the tickets have been paid but all records for that do not exist in that particular city/cities? Since the city/cities cannot find any record, what is the correct thing to do? Then it is not possible to supply proof that the tickets were paid. :confused:
 
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