Why do people get so exited about having US citizenship and feel proud of their new..

Of course it is a form of racism. To not call it that would be dreaming.
i.e. if you have a resume in Germany, you attach a picture, name religion, family etc.
Thus you clearly provide much more private information then you would do in the US.

Whilst the politicians are all over the map when it comes to integration, the people are simply not (for the most part).

That's just the simple truth and what a migrant/immigrant has to deal with.

Again, I don't want to judge whether this "protection" of national identity is good or bad - I am merely stating the obvious and difference.
 
I think what makes some people proud to be newly American Citizens is the vision of the US as a land of opportunity and freedoms. The country was founded on the belief that all men are created equal, a very unique idea at the time. Considering that many countries around the world still deny their citizens basics freedoms, I think we in the Western world sometimes fail to see what makes the US so attractive to the outside world.
 
I don't think that pride in becoming an American citizen necessarily has anything to do with displaying a flag or any other visual symbol. To me, pride in becoming an American (in a few months, hopefully) symbolizes a victory in a struggle to assimilate, become a productive member of society, and attain something that many natural born citizens take for granted. It's pride in having accomplished something significant.
 
sobelle, i agree with you on that point. in fact when talking about feeling discriminated against here in the US, my only personal experience has been from A GERMAN IMMIGRANT. seriously, i had to laugh so hard when i was told by a common american friend that the german woman's comment about me was 'she must have met her hubby over the internet.' granted, wasn't worth getting into it with her as i feel most people discriminate against an immigrant is because of major insecurities going on with them.
there is pride that i feel being here. this was my dream and living my dream (minus the painful waiting) is something to feel proud about. i think i will be very proud as well if i ever travel to germany and wave my american passport at the airport. ok that was not meant to be a dig against germans but i think it is a well-known fact immigration procedures in germany aren't easy. in fact even if one does become a german citizen the discrimination against immigrants will always exist and they always get referred to as 'gasterbajter" (sp?).
citizenship and nationality are different things, aren't they? I am proud of my nationality, but heck not proud of the citizenship i was born into. therefore once i become an american i will be proud of my nationality and citizenship. wow, the best of two worlds.
 
Citizenship is a natural conclusion of the "immigration process" and unless you want to be labled as an "alien" for legal purposes, the only option is to aquire citizenship. Any and all kinds of discrimination you may face after citzenship become issues that this country and culture has to deal with as opposed to dismissing them as "alien problems". After becoming a citzen now if any one tells me "go back to your country if you dont like xyz" I dont feel a thing in retorting back "there is no country to go back to. This is my country"
 
sobelle said:
If Europe was that good why immigrants don't settle there? I lived in France for 6 years; prejudice and racism prevail in that part of the world. You are really considered a second class citizen, even for first generation of immigrants. An example, you can be the most accomplished person you can be but when it comes to job and if you name happened to be Mohammed your chances of getting that job are so slim. I heard personally from one of the recruiters in France that he didn't even have to open the resume as soon as he saw an Arabic or African name on the envelope he tossed it in the garbage!!!
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I totally agree with you whatever you have said here. I personally know hundreds of people who immigrated to these countries in the Europe and have always been treated as a second class citizen. Some of them have lived there for 10-15 yrs. For example, 3 people I know who have been living in Germany for 20 yrs and speak German very fluently, but they are never given the German citizenship as I'm told that German laws don't allow German citizenship to immigrants. I don't know how true it is, but that's what I'm told by these people. They all married to German women and have children born there.

Same goes to Switzerland. They have very tough citizenship laws. UK and France are quiet easy in obtaining citizenship. However, we are not talking about how tough their citizenship laws are, or whether or not these countries allow an immigrant to be their citizen. Also, we are not talking about how the job market and opportunities are there. Plus, we are not talking about how hard it is to immigrate to these European countries as well. Instead what I meant in my earlier posting is about natural citizens of these European countries, and NOT immigrants in there. We all know United States is the only country in the world where everyone is treated equally compared to any country in the world. And then Canada.

As per my personal observation and the experience of people who lived there for many years, some Western European countries are better than US in many ways like in economy wise, job market, cleaner and etc. I can attest this for Germany for sure as I've been there many time. Nevertheless, there is nothing wrong in immigrating to another country. And as we all know that people move to another country for their specific situation/reason/circumstance. Each person has their own specific reason to move to another country or to become a citizen of another country, regardless which country they came from. Some do it for an economic reason, freedom of speech/religion/lifestyle, while others do it for a family reason. Thus, we cannot judge someone why they moved to another country and their reasoning of obtaining citizenship in another country. It's just that I was only wondering in my personal view as to why some European nationals move here...that's all. But as I said, each person has his/her own specific reasoning for it, which is totally justifiable and understandable.

To me, we should be proud of where we originally came from (motherland) and of our adopted country as well.

:cool:
 
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Sorry, not true.

Germany has fairly liberal immigration laws and officially allows dual citizenship - unlike the US for example.

As per Switzerland - there immigration is left (after federal requirements are fulfilled) to the local community.

However, both countries require extensive knowledge of the local language and the wait is usually longer then for the US. i.e. 8 years for Germany.

The term "treated equallity" is very relative.
 
MartinAub said:
Sorry, not true.

Germany has fairly liberal immigration laws and officially allows dual citizenship - unlike the US for example.

As per Switzerland - there immigration is left (after federal requirements are fulfilled) to the local community.

However, both countries require extensive knowledge of the local language and the wait is usually longer then for the US. i.e. 8 years for Germany.

The term "treated equallity" is very relative.
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As I said earlier that I don't know anything about immigration laws of these two countries. It's just that I was told by those who lived there for 15 yrs. And it was many years ago. Who knows laws have changed now over there. Anyway, it was told to me by many people over there.
 
AFAIK, it takes at least 10 years to get a Swiss citezenship after becoming a permanent resident. Some ppl think it's worth the wait.
-albertr
 
MartinAub said:
Sorry, not true.

Germany has fairly liberal immigration laws and officially allows dual citizenship - unlike the US for example.
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Well that is not completely true. It is half way true.
You can get german citizenship but you may loose your original citizenship. This is from German Consulates website.

"- by naturalization
Naturalizations of people with permanent residence outside Germany are rare. Applicants have to meet a host of requirements; you typically have to give up your present citizenship(s) in order to become a German citizen, fluency in the German language is another precondition - for more information, contact the competent German Mission in the US."

and also "How can I lose German citizenship?

- by voluntarily acquiring a foreign citizenship
If you willingly apply for a foreign citizenship and obtain it, the German citizenship is automatically lost. If you obtain a foreign citizenship without an application for naturalization, you remain a German citizen.

- Please note: Loss of citizenship can be avoided by obtaining a special permit ("Beibehaltungsgenehmigung") before you are naturalized in a foreign country. For more information, see here.

- By voluntarily entering into the armed forces or other armed units of a country whose citizenship you also have (Example: a person with German and US citizenship starts a career in the US Navy). Male persons can avoid the loss of citizenship by getting a special permit."

and this is from the USICIS
"In the United States, dual citizenship is not explicitly prohibited; the United States has no laws or policies addressing this issue."

You can have dual citizenship in US by default. There is no law that prohibit this.
 
fidelfs said:
You can have dual citizenship in US by default. There is no law that prohibit this.
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There is also no US law that officially recognizes dual citizenship. The US govt sees you as a US citizen, period. They don't want to care whether you are also a citizen of UK or Japan or Mars or the Moon.
 
Well,

that's why I got the permit. It's the same all over the place. You "just" have to follow the rules and as it states, once you have the Beibehaltungsurkunde, you are home free.

If one has to write all the little pieces that are needed for any eventualities, this forum would explode.
 
Don't take it wrong. Everybody is entitle to help here. The only thing in this forum is when somebody mention something as a fact, I tried to verify it.

Nothing wrong, It is not like you mislead anybody or anything. US has one of most liberal immigration laws (I am not saying is the most liberal.) even has a lottery program.

That is another reason this country is so great, everybody is welcome, just follow the rules. I am hispanic as you can tell from my handle, European countries are well behind US in hispanic immigration because the laws. It is fine every country is entitle to open the doors as they please.

:)
 
Nothing wrong with that and I don't take it that way.
Since this is for US immigration and not the zweipaesse Yahoo group, a lot of diving into details on other immigration regulations seems to be over the top.

Add-on, the dual citizenship permission is only valid for 2 years, after that you need to file for an extension BEFORE you take the oath or you lose the German citizenship.
After you get your US certificate you have to file it with the German authorities.

The really nice thing about this is that you retain your EU citizenship and that can come in very handy as even on possible longer job assignments in the EU you never need a visa. With the Schengen countries expanding all the time, this is certainly a nice benefit, should it ever be needed.

As per earlier note from someone else about Switzerland - since they are about? or already fully integrated? into Schengen, even that country isn't a problem any longer.

I for one am happy that the world comes closer together - maybe not for everyone right now, but in time it will.
 
My view

newuscitizen said:
Before 2005, US citizens cannot be deported. But with new law passed in 2005, Naturalized citizens can be deported with just a court order. So this advantage is no more there.
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I believe the only time when a naturalized citizen can be deported is if he/she is involved in terror activities or acquired citizenship through fraudulant means. No other exceptions.
 
Didn't apply to me since I already had a passport that offered me visa free travel without the animosity (in some parts of the world).

Jelexy said:
1.Traveling, using the us passport will be much less stressful (no visa for most western European countries and a few other)
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Being the child of a career diplomat, at a very early age, I had decided never to work for any government in any capacity.

Jelexy said:
2. for employment purpose with in a us government organization
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True, but the same Americans will then tell you "I'm Irish", "I'm Italian", "I'm Scottish", "I'm German", "I'm Korean", etc.

Jelexy said:
You still gone have your foreign accent and because of your hard accent, Americans will always ask you where do you originally come from?
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I actually socialise more with non-Pakistani Americans than Pakistani Americans. As far as intermingling is concerned, my wife is born and bred in the Bronx!!! I intermingle just fine with her in every sense of the word.

Jelexy said:
You will always look for your background culture to associate with (Indian, Morocco, turkey, Iranian , African, chines etc), this is due to that fact that you can’t intermingle with people who were born in the USA ..ahhh that strong accent again!!
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atanase said:
well, I probably can say something here because I was working and living in many countries for quite a long period of time (although I was not a citizen of any of
these countries nor spoke fluently in their languages):

Russia - 10 years
Switzerland - 6 years
France - for some time
Belgium - for some time
USA - 10 years (and became citizen after that)

Although I love all these countries because of many nice and great people I met/worked with, but comparing these countries,
the laws or habits of citizens in USA are much closer to "All man are created equal"

About question why one should be proud, the feeling to be a proud is pretty personal, so one probably can comment only on his/her own feelings.
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All Men are created equal. Such a great, seemingly simple, but indeed a unique concept of its time. Still very much relevant even now. Indeed says "All Men"
Not All American.
What a great idea.:)
 
Hmm,

I always wonder why much older democracies (still in existance) never get credit for that. Gotta rule out the Swiss since there it was litrally mostly only for man to vote.
But then there are others.....
 
MartinAub said:
I always wonder why much older democracies (still in existance) never get credit for that. Gotta rule out the Swiss since there it was litrally mostly only for man to vote. But then there are others.....
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What others do you have in mind? There are very few democratic republics that have been in existence as long as the United States.
 
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