Visa refused and CEAC data changed to Refuse of main applicant but not the other participants.

[Britsimon]

11 years is GSCE, 13 years is A-levels. You need A-levels for university entrance. 12 years is not enough to get you into university as you do not have A-levels at the end of it.

Yup exactly. In my day, you could leave school at 16 - and the majority did or finished perhaps after A levels. I went on to a BTEC course in Engineering (A level equivalent), but I did not complete the course - I finished 1 additional year. So - if I had to qualify for DV - I would have to do that on work experience (which I could, given that I qualified for my H1 that way).

The rules in the UK have changed and are still changing. Kids these days have to stay "in education" until 17 (changed to that last year) and the plan is to make that 18 starting next year.

You are correct about UK schooling standards - it is considered high. In fact, studies have shown that a Brit who left education at 17 makes more sense than a Russian with multiple degrees.

 

[SusieQQQ]

Yup exactly. In my day, you could leave school at 16 - and the majority did or finished perhaps after A levels. I went on to a BTEC course in Engineering (A level equivalent), but I did not complete the course - I finished 1 additional year. So - if I had to qualify for DV - I would have to do that on work experience (which I could, given that I qualified for my H1 that way).

The rules in the UK have changed and are still changing. Kids these days have to stay "in education" until 17 (changed to that last year) and the plan is to make that 18 starting next year.

You are correct about UK schooling standards - it is considered high. In fact, studies have shown that a Brit who left education at 17 makes more sense than a Russian with multiple degrees.

Is that a particular Russian you are taking about ...and a particular Brit?! ...and one particular study...

 

[veronice]

Yup exactly. In my day, you could leave school at 16 - and the majority did or finished perhaps after A levels. I went on to a BTEC course in Engineering (A level equivalent), but I did not complete the course - I finished 1 additional year. So - if I had to qualify for DV - I would have to do that on work experience (which I could, given that I qualified for my H1 that way).

The rules in the UK have changed and are still changing. Kids these days have to stay "in education" until 17 (changed to that last year) and the plan is to make that 18 starting next year.

You are correct about UK schooling standards - it is considered high. In fact, studies have shown that a Brit who left education at 17 makes more sense than a Russian with multiple degrees.

You act nice, look nice, talk like a Knight... but you are really really mean inside (which is, btw, a sign of high intelligence) hahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

[Britsimon]

Is that a particular Russian you are taking about ...and a particular Brit?! ...and one particular study...

Yes it was quite a focused study. Hehe

 

[Britsimon]

You act nice, look nice, talk like a Knight... but you are really really mean inside (which is, btw, a sign of high intelligence) hahahahahahahahahahahahaha

You think I am mean??? Lolol

 

[veronice]

You think I am mean??? Lolol

You know what I "mean" hahahahahahahahahaha

 

[Sm1smom]

Yes it was quite a focused study. Hehe

Yeah, highly or is it rightly focused too, if I may say

 

[Sloner]

Yup exactly. In my day, you could leave school at 16 - and the majority did or finished perhaps after A levels. I went on to a BTEC course in Engineering (A level equivalent), but I did not complete the course - I finished 1 additional year. So - if I had to qualify for DV - I would have to do that on work experience (which I could, given that I qualified for my H1 that way).

The rules in the UK have changed and are still changing. Kids these days have to stay "in education" until 17 (changed to that last year) and the plan is to make that 18 starting next year.

You are correct about UK schooling standards - it is considered high. In fact, studies have shown that a Brit who left education at 17 makes more sense than a Russian with multiple degrees.

You absolutely do not know Russian education. Reading promotion and advertising.
I absolutely do not see what the British education better than the Russian.
This document can go to any university in the world. 11 years of education

 

[Sloner]

Aldoblack, I want to project and understood by comparing with the Russian educational system. We have a 1) vocational education ; Often the students finish 9 classes school and come to this school . Training lasts 4 years. They are entitled to a visa.2) vocational training. These are simple lessons , they do not give a visa.3) general secondary education ; We in Russia is 11 classes. By the way, it fits your Simon British 12 year education . And people with education get a visa.I understand he studied 5 years? Which of these formations ? How he finished classes in school?

 

[levi2al]

Aldoblack, I want to project and understood by comparing with the Russian educational system. We have a 1) vocational education ; Often the students finish 9 classes school and come to this school . Training lasts 4 years. They are entitled to a visa.2) vocational training. These are simple lessons , they do not give a visa.3) general secondary education ; We in Russia is 11 classes. By the way, it fits your Simon British 12 year education . And people with education get a visa.I understand he studied 5 years? Which of these formations ? How he finished classes in school?

Hi Aldo, fir st of all I really feel sorry for your case. I think your father had finished "Shkolle Nate" mean General High School but you can work also and the school is one day on and one day off, yup? This was done after you finished first 8 year of school (old system till 2005 was 8 year elem school, now from 205 is 9 years).
I did finished the same type of school.; @Sloner this kind of school is for people who don't want to leave their jobs to complete a high school. Mainly is a high school for people who are on ages and didn't finished a high school. They can be parents and/or have an economic status that they must work. Got it?
But after this school you don't need to add nothing else to be eligible to apply in university. The same as my case, I did finished university as well.

 

[vladek]

Hi Aldo, fir st of all I really feel sorry for your case. I think your father had finished "Shkolle Nate" mean General High School but you can work also and the school is one day on and one day off, yup? This was done after you finished first 8 year of school (old system till 2005 was 8 year elem school, now from 205 is 9 years).
I did finished the same type of school.; @Sloner this kind of school is for people who don't want to leave their jobs to complete a high school. Mainly is a high school for people who are on ages and didn't finished a high school. They can be parents and/or have an economic status that they must work. Got it?
But after this school you don't need to add nothing else to be eligible to apply in university. The same as my case, I did finished university as well.

Are you now trying to say that aldos dad diploma was valid ?
And the denial was unfair ?

 

[SusieQQQ]

I found a university of London guide as to what qualifications are acceptable for entry. It seems for Albania the standard school leaving certificate, according to them, is equivalent to O levels/GSCE in the UK so not acceptable, but there is another one which is acceptable for certain courses only. So there does seem to be some uncertainty about this. Another factor is that Aldo's dad presumably got his high school certificate long ago, so trying to figure things out on the basis of what is currently acceptable may not be valid either.

At the end of the day while it is sad, if there is any embassy that understands the system it will be the one there. All we can do is speculate but we have to assume that the CO had a valid reason to reject it.

 

[AldoBlack]

Aldoblack, I want to project and understood by comparing with the Russian educational system. We have a 1) vocational education ; Often the students finish 9 classes school and come to this school . Training lasts 4 years. They are entitled to a visa.2) vocational training. These are simple lessons , they do not give a visa.3) general secondary education ; We in Russia is 11 classes. By the way, it fits your Simon British 12 year education . And people with education get a visa.I understand he studied 5 years? Which of these formations ? How he finished classes in school?

@Sloner , Albanian education system is kinda like Russian education system. My father finished vocational education. Not vocational training. We have grades from 4 (which is the lowest grade to 10 which is the highest grade.) My father finished with an average around 7.5 - 8.

Hi Aldo, fir st of all I really feel sorry for your case. I think your father had finished "Shkolle Nate" mean General High School but you can work also and the school is one day on and one day off, yup? This was done after you finished first 8 year of school (old system till 2005 was 8 year elem school, now from 205 is 9 years).
I did finished the same type of school.; @Sloner this kind of school is for people who don't want to leave their jobs to complete a high school. Mainly is a high school for people who are on ages and didn't finished a high school. They can be parents and/or have an economic status that they must work. Got it?
But after this school you don't need to add nothing else to be eligible to apply in university. The same as my case, I did finished university as well.

@levi2al , no he did not finished night school ("Shkolle nate"). He went to school every morning from Monday to Friday for 5 years. (Are you Albanian or you just know how Albanian education works?)

 

[SusieQQQ]

This page from the US embassy website in Tirana says that vocational high school degrees "rarely" qualify to meet the requirements. http://tirana.usembassy.gov/mobile//dv.html

Unfortunately your lawyer obviously wasn't aware of this because if he was he should have checked first.

I have been battling to find similar on US websites but there are a number of UK university websites which state that the Albanian school leaving certificate is not acceptable for university entrance.

Again Aldo, I am so sorry about this, and it is such a shame that this wasn't picked up earlier rather than after all the excitement and expense

 

[levi2al]

@Sloner , Albanian education system is kinda like Russian education system. My father finished vocational education. Not vocational training. We have grades from 4 (which is the lowest grade to 10 which is the highest grade.) My father finished with an average around 7.5 - 8.



@levi2al , no he did not finished night school ("Shkolle nate"). He went to school every morning from Monday to Friday for 5 years. (Are you Albanian or you just know how Albanian education works?)

Of course I'm Albanian. I wrote it that I also finished that kind of school. Actually is written down in embassy web pages the high schools who can't be qualified.

 

[Sloner]

Specific rules.
Education: Applicants must have completed a full-time high school education that is at least equivalent to a U.S. high school education (4 years, full-time, general studies). Not all high school degrees in Albania qualify for the program. Part time high school diplomas - without a break from work, evening school, or correspondence - including five year programs or long-term programs (part time, without a break from work, evening school, or correspondence) don’t qualify for the DV. In addition, vocational high school degrees rarely qualify for the DV program. Even if you completed part of high school on the part time system, and part of high school on the full time system, this diploma will not qualify for the DV.

I just do not understand why they did not come vocational education? With this diploma, you can go to university.

 

[Sloner]

Hi Aldo, fir st of all I really feel sorry for your case. I think your father had finished "Shkolle Nate" mean General High School but you can work also and the school is one day on and one day off, yup? This was done after you finished first 8 year of school (old system till 2005 was 8 year elem school, now from 205 is 9 years).
I did finished the same type of school.; @Sloner this kind of school is for people who don't want to leave their jobs to complete a high school. Mainly is a high school for people who are on ages and didn't finished a high school. They can be parents and/or have an economic status that they must work. Got it?
But after this school you don't need to add nothing else to be eligible to apply in university. The same as my case, I did finished university as well.

I get it. In Russia, many are learning so at the university. This we called distance learning. Students come to the university to take the session only 2 times a year. They do not get visas. But they do not go there without a high school.

 

[AldoBlack]

Specific rules.
Education: Applicants must have completed a full-time high school education that is at least equivalent to a U.S. high school education (4 years, full-time, general studies). Not all high school degrees in Albania qualify for the program. Part time high school diplomas - without a break from work, evening school, or correspondence - including five year programs or long-term programs (part time, without a break from work, evening school, or correspondence) don’t qualify for the DV. In addition, vocational high school degrees rarely qualify for the DV program. Even if you completed part of high school on the part time system, and part of high school on the full time system, this diploma will not qualify for the DV.

I just do not understand why they did not come vocational education? With this diploma, you can go to university.

@Sloner , Yes, I've read it many time. And all I see is that my father's diploma is equivalent to High School.

 

[romario]

I'm very sorry for your case Aldo. The only way that makes the embassy right is if your father finished the school without a break from work (written on the diploma) because that is explicitly stated in the rules, otherwise I don't see any problem with the diploma. During the communist era people's education was chosen by the government and not at their will, and I think the embassy needs to understand that.

 

[SusieQQQ]

During the communist era people's education was chosen by the government and not at their will, and I think the embassy needs to understand that.

While it may seem unfair if it wasn't a choice, it unfortunately doesn't change the rules. The education requirement is absolutely strictly applied. And the Albanian embassy is very clear about that fact.