I got denied need help please

Do you believe that the USCIS would react by sending me a :


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Sony55,

During your N-400 interview, what explanation the IO give you as to why the application wasn't being recommended for approval at that moment? Did you have name check pending? Are you originally from a country that is being scrutinized more?
 
Harish Krishna said:
Sony55,

During your N-400 interview, what explanation the IO give you as to why the application wasn't being recommended for approval at that moment? Did you have name check pending? Are you originally from a country that is being scrutinized more?
she didn't mention nothing. as if there was nothing wrong. the whole interview was so smooth, and she said that i should hear from them within 6 months, the normal average to take a decision in memphis , tn.
 
sony,

I think the ultimate answer to your citizenship resides on "intent". Did you come to the US on an F1 with the intent to study or not ? Also if you were on F1 in 1999, how come in 2004 you applied for your citizenship ? Did you become a PR as soon as you come to the country (with an F1?).

You may have a case if you could prove that the circumstances under which you abandoned your studies were legit. You surely need a good attorney. Best of luck
 
Rahul Kumar said:
sony,

I think the ultimate answer to your citizenship resides on "intent". Did you come to the US on an F1 with the intent to study or not ? Also if you were on F1 in 1999, how come in 2004 you applied for your citizenship ? Did you become a PR as soon as you come to the country (with an F1?).

You may have a case if you could prove that the circumstances under which you abandoned your studies were legit. You surely need a good attorney. Best of luck
thank you rahul.
ofcourse i came to study, the proof is that i am still in school right now, i graduated with a diploma in CIS in 2004. now i am in Western kentucky university. i have received many awards such as deans list, national deans list, student of the month, phi theta kappa, and much more. my GPA is 4.00 with summa cum laude. after i came to the state, my brother lost his job, and i have a proof for that. then i stayed here. a year later, i married my wife that i was seeing for a year back then. i adjusted my status without any little trouble. removed my condition without even an interview! now, they are mentioning that crap! i cannot believe the interviewer didn't even give me the chance to provide any documents to prove my case. specially that their whole decision is built on " assumptions" and " intentions"!!!
what do you think could help in my case, what kind of documents. once again thanks.
 
First of all, you should try to understand that USCIS is absolutely (100%) correct in their conclusion about you being having pre-intent of emigrating to USA for good when you arrived here on F-1 visa in 1999, regardless you disagree with their conclusion. Because the truth is- you did enter into the United States on F-1 visa in 1999, but then NEVER attended the school back then. Even though you have your reasons to justify your reasoning of not having attended the school at that time, yet still the truth remains the same that you DID NOT attend the school at all at that time despite of being entered on F-1 visa. Under immigration laws, it is called a Fraud/misrepresentation/lie to US govt. in order to obtain immigration benefit.

Moreover, you should know the terms of F-1 visa (nonimmigrant visa) before you even try to give any justification on your previous situation. Do you honestly think/believe that USCIS would agree with you as if it was okay for you to hang out here without attending a school despite of entering into the country on F-1 visa just because you were a "victim" of "unfortunate circumstances"? By the way- can you try to explain us why US govt. should even care even if you were happened to be a “victim” of "unfortunate circumstances" in your life at that time, when the truth is-you never attended the school being entered on F-1 visa? Just because your brother lost his job in Europe, who might be the only source of yours to attend the school here in the US, doesn’t mean that this reasoning gave you the automatic right to violate immigration laws. If you had no means to attend the school here once your brother lost his job in Europe after you landed in the US on F-1 visa then you should have either returned back to your country or changed your visa status immediately (pay attention-change of visa and not extension of visa); otherwise no matter what you say to justify your situation-it surely seems that you used F-1 visa as a tool just to enter into the United States, which you should not have done so as it is a clear violation of immigration laws.

Your pre-intent is now surely proven to USCIS, especially when-(1) your brother’s financial circumstances changed ALL OF SUDDEN when you placed your foot on US soil; (2) you did not attend the school even for one day at that time despite of being entered on F-1 visa; (3) you did not bother to return back even though your application for extension of F-1 visa was properly denied; (4) you deliberately chose to stay in this country despite of having no financial support from your brother, which is a solid proof in itself that you had pre-intent to live here permanently; otherwise how strange it was that you could not be able to attend school because of having no financial mean for schooling, but then you were able to live and hang out here without having any financial means. Don't you think that all these facts lead to believe that you did have pre-intent to migrate here permanently. I might sound harsh here, but you know that I talk based upon facts on the record. And the facts are saying something different than what you are claiming to defend your past action. Besides, people cannot read your mind. They (including USCIS) determine/conclude something based upon what they see than reading someone's mind.

Further, I think you might be aware of the fact that million of foreign students attend school in the US while working hard at the same time in order to keep continue their studies. Mostly students are not that rich to study in US. So obviously, they work hard at the same time of their schooling. And if they are really rich then obviously they don't have any problem in attending the school anyway. So obviously, you cannot say that your circumstances were very special than others, which prohibited you in attending the school while working. Hence, given all the said facts, how can you even say/think that your citizenship application is wrongly denied based upon pure “assumption” or “crap”? I don’t think that it is an assumption on their part; instead that’s how it looks as a fact. You have only your empty words to deny this allegation of pre-intent, but USCIS have facts and evidence to prove this allegation against you, especially when you did not attend the school at that time after entering on F-1 visa, nor left the country after finding yourself in "unfortunate" situation. I mean-anyone in his right mind can understand very easily that what made you to hang out for so long over here if you really had no intention to migrate here permanently? I mean-why did you not go back immediately if you really had no intention to migrate here permanently? Again, I'm not trying to be harsh here; instead I'm trying to prepare you for any possible questions that might be raised in your situation as I've witnessed these questions being asked in a siutaion like yours.

To me-you don’t seem to realize/accept that regardless of what circumstances you had ("unfortunate" one, being "victim", or whatever), yet still you did not attend the school at that time while being entered on F-1 visa. Also, the ONLY REASON you were actually given the permission at first place to enter into the US just to attend the school, which you did not attend at that time. You were not given F-1 visa to get married first or to attend the school later on whenever you wish or whenever your circumstances change. Just because you were able to attend the school later on (obviously couple years later), and graduated later on, and received so many awards, yet still all these DON’T prove that you were initially intended to go to school when you came here on F-1, nor it proves that you did not have pre-intent to emigrate here permanently when you entered on F-1 visa. Million of people come to US every year for many reasons than going to school, but later on they sometimes end up going to school. Just because they finally end up going to school later on, doesn’t mean that they had initial intention to attend the school when they entered into the US. Similarly, just because you attended the school later on, doesn’t prove that you had bona fide intent of attending the school when you initially entered on F-1 visa in this country. Hence, you cannot justify your initial intent with your actions that occurred many years later of your arrival into this country. I don’t think USCIS would buy this story.

It’s true that many violations of immigration laws are automatically forgiven at the time obtaining Permanent Residency if applicant is an immediate relative of a US citizen. Those violations are-overstaying (regardless of how long a person overstayed illegally), working and studying without USCIS permission and etc. But, obtaining a US visa under false pretence is not included in those violations in order to be forgiven. Be noted-you might disagree with the fact that you misrepresented yourself when you obtained F-1 visa, but the truth is USCIS now believe that you obtained F-1 visa just as a tool to enter into the US as you did not attend the school at that time. Thousands of people use different kind of visa as a tool just to enter into the US. Student and tourist visa are most of them. That’s why USCIS is fully aware of this misrepresentation. That’s why, obtaining these visas are very hard from most of third world countries. If adjudication officer had paid attention to this crucial fact at the time of Permanent Residency, then s/he must had denied your application for Permanent Residency at that time even though you were married to a US citizen. Keep in mind that just because someone is married to a US citizen, doesn’t mean that s/he has an automatic right to have LPR; otherwise USCIS won’t be interviewing both spouses during Permanent Residency time. Besides, don’t forget as well that granting a LPR is a privilege and not a right. Misrepresenting to US govt. in order to obtain immigration benefit is a very serious matter to USCIS. Therefore, there is a lifetime ban/bar if someone is found to have lied to them. But if someone has US citizen spouse or parents (not US children though) then s/he might be able to file a waiver. But obtaining a waiver is not only very hard, but also it is completely discretional. No need me to mention that there is no appeal as well if a waiver application gets denied.

You should also know that USCIS is not questioning your ‘out of status’ at that time because it is automatically forgiven when an applicant is an immediate relative of US citizen (like a case like yours), nor they are questioning about your marriage regardless of how soon or late you got married as they already got convinced that your marriage is bona fide marriage and not a shady one; otherwise they had not approved your LPR at first place. Instead, they are questioning only your initial (pre) intent when you entered on F-1 visa, wherein you did not attend the school at all during that time. The officers who interviewed you during LPR and Removing the condition on your temporary status were not able to detect this crucial fact, but this time it is known to USCIS. Now they believe that you obtained F-1 visa just to enter into this country. They call this- lying/misrepresentation. To be honest to you, they have very easy and strong case against you, especially when you did not attend the school nor left the country at that time.
 
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Lots of folks don’t knoq/understand that once they apply for a US citizenship then their whole immigration journey to US becomes a part of scrutiny, this includes any application that applicant made with US Consulate and USCIS in the past, even at the port of entry in US upon arrival. Also, many people mistakenly argue that all these issues should have been raised during the time of LPR and not at the time of citizenship. But they are completely wrong. During Citizenship time, their whole record is reviewed very carefully and investigated thoroughly. During the citizenship time, officer can question even a small trip that applicant might have made 30 yrs ago to US, wherein applicant is found to have lied about something. A lot of times, adjudication officers don’t pay attention to certain crucial facts during the time of Permanent Residency because of their mistake or lack of experience in adjudicating job, but that doesn’t mean that those mistakes cannot be pointed out/rectified during Citizenship time. I’ve seen thousands of cases, wherein applicants were easily able to secure LPR like a piece of cake, but during the time of citizenship, officers were able to detect something. Then, not only these people's citizenship applications got denied, but also they were deported for lying to US govt. in order to obtain immigration benefit. That’s why, it is very important for an applicant to have an immigration attorney reviewed their whole immigration file before filing citizenship application. Trying to save money, or thinking that they can handle their case by themselves without an attorney, sometimes can put them in a limbo situation.

Also, there is now a very strong possibility that USCIS might be in the process of placing you under Removal proceeding because sometimes it takes some time to start a removal proceeding. I hope this is not the case with you, but you cannot rule out this possibility now, especially when they were able to detect a Fraud, even though you are not ready to accept that your past action was indeed a fraud/lie in your part. I know that you don’t agree that you were involved in any lying or fraud, but your past action is indeed seemed to be a fraud if you carefully pay attention to all this as an impartial person, or you may ask a prominent attorney about all this, who have handled this kind of situations previously. Don't talk with those attorneys who want to tell you what you want to hear out.

Do not forget that you did not leave the US when you found out that you could not be able to attend the school because your brother had lost job in Europe. And, you did not leave the US as well when your application for extension of F-1 visa denied. Instead, you deliberately chose to ignore immigration laws and overstayed here without USCIS permission. But only now, when you are caught/questioned, you are telling that you were a “victim” of "unfortunate situation". Could you enlighten us how you were a “victim”? Nobody told you to disregard/violate immigration laws by staying here illegally if you had no means to go to school at that time. You could have left happily without being a "victim" of "unfortunate" circumstances, and could come back on some other time when you could have means to attend the school, rather than completely disregarding immigration laws and choosing your own discretion on whether to attend school or not at that time. My whole point is- nobody pointed the gun on you to force you to stay here if you had no means to go to school. Then, how can you justify that you did not do anything wrong. I'm not criticizing you, nor I'm blaming you for anything. Instead, I'm telling the logical facts, which make sense. Besides, you know that I don't play diplomacy in giving right information, nor I sugar coat. I believe that I better tell the right information than telling something diplomatic. Further, I’m fully aware of many cases similar to yours, wherein USCIS deported people for lying to them. You will be very lucky if USCIS won’t initiate a Removal Proceeding against you.

About your case, all I can say that you unfortunately got very strict Adjudication officer/Supervisor, even though your interview went so smoothly. Actually, it all depends on individual officer. Some officers are easy-going than others. That’s why many people who lied more terribly than yours got away easily. And, it could also be possible that the reason for your record to have highly scrutinized is because you are from a country of US “watch list”. But one thing I am very sure about that you should not have pressured them so hard about disposing your case. I remember you visiting local district office many times, repeatedly pressuring them thru congresspersons, writing to Director of local district office and indirectly threatening to sue them in the Court under 120 days law. I mean- if you would have laid low and waited for a while, this might not happen. In my personal opinion, you made yourself vulnerable to all these scrutiny, which made your case to have reviewed very carefully. Because of all those pressure, I believe USCIS purposely found this reason in your case to deny your CZ application, or maybe they are in the process of placing you under deportation. Who knows all your pressure pissed them off a big time. You should have known that USCIS could find even a little reason to deny your citizenship application and to place you on Deportation Proceeding, especially when you have such a big issue in your case.

Since you don’t reside in a big city then obviously you don’t have the advantage of choosing good immigration attorney. Because, mostly immigration attorneys make their living in this field by practicing in a big city, where many immigrants live; otherwise they cannot make their living by practicing alone in this field if they practice in a small city/town. Immigration is a federal matter, hence you can hire immigration attorney from anywhere in the country to represent you, but then it might cost you a fortune. Because, then you might need to pay all their travel expenses, and attorney may charge you hourly too. Therefore, it is better for you to do some search to find a good one in your area. Don’t retain just any other attorney. Mostly attorneys are very manipulative. They would tell you what you want to hear. For example-they will try to convince you by saying that you have a better chance in overturning USCIS decision, and that USCIS has no case against you as they are alleging based upon their assumption alone, and etc..etc. Therefore, it is very important that you should talk to at least 3-4 different attorneys before making a final decision. You should not forget that your life is in stake here. Therefore, you should not think about money also as people can always make money so long they would be allowed to live here. And remember: Sometimes money do buy happiness and peace.

Attorney’s fee would depend on many factors, such as- (1) how complex your case is; (2) how much time and efforts need to be spent on your case; (3) how prominent an attorney is, who will handle your case. Because, a reputed attorney who has so many years of experience in his/her belt would normally charge more than other attorneys. (4) If you need to be represented only for a hearing with USCIS then attorney’s fee won’t be that much. But if you would need attorney’s representation in appeal matter in front of Immigration Judge/BIA/Federal Courts then attorney's fee would be very high. Because, then it would be A LOT of work for an attorney.

You need to now start out with filing a Motion for Reconsideration with USCIS first. You have a very limited time to file such Motion. During that hearing, there would be only one or two officers at most who would argue the matter. You (or your attorney) would have the chance to refute anything they will allege. I’m not saying that you don’t have any chance at all to prevail even though it looks very slim, but the truth is-situation doesn't look good in your case given all the facts of your case. However, try to focus primarily on your initial intent when you entered on F-1 than any other irrelevant issues like saying that you have a proof that your brother lost his job (nobody would care whether your brother lost his job or not, and why should anyone care about this anyway as F-1 visa was not issued to you with the condition that if your brother would lost his job then you would not attend the school and would remain in the US), and that you met your wife and married her a year later (nobody is questioning the bona fide of your marriage, so it would be useless to bring up something about your marriage), and that you were a “victim” of "unfortunate situation" (do not even think to say to anyone this; otherwise some people who might be interested in buying your stories, would go against you), and any other tales to justify it. Because, all these tales still don’t prove your initial intent otherwise as alleged, nor those prove that you really had bona fide intent to attend school at that time when you entered on F-1 visa. Rather than being emotional, you should think a logical answer to your situation.
 
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JohnnyCash said:
I remember you visiting local district office many times, pressuring them thru congresspersons, writing to Director of local district office and indirectly threatening them to sue them under 120 days law. I mean- if you would have laid low and waited for a while, this might not happen. In my personal opinion, you made yourself vulnerable to all these officers to review your case very carefully. Who knows all your pressure pissed them off. You should have known that USCIS could find even a little reason to deny your citizenship application and placing you on Deportation Proceeding, especially when you have such a big issue.

i remember you advised me the same. I will keep in my mind not to press them too much. i might just inquiry my case every 2 months or so and write to the officer after 120 days and see what would happen.

JohnnyCash said:
...if you really had bona fide intent to attend school then you would have at least attended school for a while at that time even if you had to work so hard to support your studies like other students, or you should have left the country and returned on other visa if your sole breeder, your brother lost his job at that time wherein you found yourself unable to attend school in the lack of financial means. We can argue that what made you to hang out here for so long until you got married if your brother lost the job? Why did not go back to your country once you found out that you cannot attend the school as your brother lost his job?

I remmeber some of my friends who came to US on F-1 visa. they came to school for a quarter or so, and because of financial situation happened in their families, they had to go back to their countries. Some of them tried to find more jobs at school, or even worked under the table in some places to support themself going thru school.
 
"I remember you visiting local district office many times, pressuring them thru congresspersons, writing to Director of local district office and indirectly threatening them to sue them under 120 days law. I mean- if you would have laid low and waited for a while, this might not happen. In my personal opinion, you made yourself vulnerable to all these officers to review your case very carefully. Who knows all your pressure pissed them off. You should have known that USCIS could find even a little reason to deny your citizenship application and placing you on Deportation Proceeding, especially when you have such a big issue."

I think that insisting too much, especially before the 120 days are up, gives the impression you're trying to hide something. Guilty conscience, perhaps? You might have some difficulties explaining how you managed to support yourself during that 1 year. Did your brother help you out? Your folks? Apartment, food, clothing cost sometimes more than, say, attending a state or community college. Or were you working without a work-permit?
 
I had to split my postings because of the limitaion on the size of a text on one single posting on this forum. So, here is the continuation of my full posting...


Just keep in mind that talking/saying a thing means nothing if you don’t act accordingly to your talking/saying/wordings. In your case, you are kept saying that you had genuine intent to attend the school when you arrived here on F-1 visa in 1999, but the problem is-your acts didn’t match with your talks, even though your circumstances are to blame for it. Anyone, including me and USCIS might easily be able to argue (and prove) that if you really had bona fide intent to attend the school in 1999 then you would have shown at least a little effort by attended the school for a while at that time even if you had to work so hard to support yourself for your studies like other students do, or you should have left this country if your sole breeder (your brother) had lost his job at that time wherein you found yourself unable to attend the school in the lack of financial means. Also, after leaving at that time, you could come back some other time when you could be able to support your studies or under another visa. We can easily argue that if you had no initial intent to migrate here permanently then what made you to hang out here for so long (at least until you got married)? USCIS might also argue that how did you manage to support yourself here during the whole time while you could not support your studies? They will surly argue that you were given the permission to enter into the US not to support yourself, instead to attend school only. They might question other questions too, like-Why did you not go back to your country once you found out that you cannot attend the school as your brother lost his job? Why did you deliberately choose to violate/disregard US immigration laws? Do you expect us to believe that you chose to ignore/violate immigration laws because your situations were extraordinary and exceptional than others? And even if we believe that you had extraordinary and exceptional situations at that time, yet still it did not give you the right to violate immigration laws. I mean- how you could prove your initial intent otherwise in the light of all these facts/questions? Further, don’t forget also that F-1 visa is issued only when applicant can convince the officer at Consulate that s/he has proper financial means somehow to go to school and maintaining living in the US; otherwise a student visa cannot be issued under the 'Public Burden' law. But in the light of the fact that you did not attend the school at all at that time, it is very clear for USCIS to prove that you used F-1 visa as a tool just to enter into the US; otherwise you might have made efforts to attend at least some classes than nothing. I think they have very easy case on you.

The only chance you have here is-if your attorney can able to convince the USCIS that when F-1 visa was obtained in US Consulate and when you arrived here at port of entry, your only intention was to attend the school here. Therefore, you did not lie/misrepresent to US govt. either at US consulate or to Immigration officer at port of entry. But after arrival, you found yourself in a sudden changed circumstances, which were out of your control. Also, because of having some financial difficulties as well, you had no other chance to go to school, and could not go back home because of lack of financial means. Therefore, you chose to stay here until your circumstances change. Just hope and pray that they would buy your story on this; otherwise I don’t think you have any other chance to prevail here as you don't have any other logical reason to prove otherwise. Remember again- you have only your empty words to justify your initial intent (unfortunately), but they have fact and evidence to prove your intent otherwise (unfortunately also). Therefore, if you really like to prevail then you should think something very reasonable and convincing, which could seem like “walk to walk, and talk to talk” in a real world.

Good Luck.
 
JohnnyCash said:
I had to split my postings because of the limitaion on the size of a text on one single posting on this forum. So, here is the continuation of my full posting...


Just keep in mind that talking/saying a thing means nothing if you don’t act accordingly to your talking/saying/wordings. In your case, you are kept saying that you had genuine intent to attend the school when you arrived here on F-1 visa in 1999, but the problem is-your acts didn’t match with your talks, even though your circumstances are to blame for it. Anyone, including me and USCIS might easily be able to argue (and prove) that if you really had bona fide intent to attend the school in 1999 then you would have shown at least a little effort by attended the school for a while at that time even if you had to work so hard to support yourself for your studies like other students do, or you should have left this country if your sole breeder (your brother) had lost his job at that time wherein you found yourself unable to attend the school in the lack of financial means. Also, after leaving at that time, you could come back some other time when you could be able to support your studies or under another visa. We can easily argue that if you had no initial intent to migrate here permanently then what made you to hang out here for so long (at least until you got married)? USCIS might also argue that how did you manage to support yourself here during the whole time while you could not support your studies? They will surly argue that you were given the permission to enter into the US not to support yourself, instead to attend school only. They might question other questions too, like-Why did you not go back to your country once you found out that you cannot attend the school as your brother lost his job? Why did you deliberately choose to violate/disregard US immigration laws? Do you expect us to believe that you chose to ignore/violate immigration laws because your situations were extraordinary and exceptional than others? And even if we believe that you had extraordinary and exceptional situations at that time, yet still it did not give you the right to violate immigration laws. I mean- how you could prove your initial intent otherwise in the light of all these facts/questions? Further, don’t forget also that F-1 visa is issued only when applicant can convince the officer at Consulate that s/he has proper financial means somehow to go to school and maintaining living in the US; otherwise a student visa cannot be issued under the 'Public Burden' law. But in the light of the fact that you did not attend the school at all at that time, it is very clear for USCIS to prove that you used F-1 visa as a tool just to enter into the US; otherwise you might have made efforts to attend at least some classes than nothing. I think they have very easy case on you.

The only chance you have here is-if your attorney can able to convince the USCIS that when F-1 visa was obtained in US Consulate and when you arrived here at port of entry, your only intention was to attend the school here. Therefore, you did not lie/misrepresent to US govt. either at US consulate or to Immigration officer at port of entry. But after arrival, you found yourself in a sudden changed circumstances, which were out of your control. Also, because of having some financial difficulties as well, you had no other chance to go to school, and could not go back home because of lack of financial means. Therefore, you chose to stay here until your circumstances change. Just hope and pray that they would buy your story on this; otherwise I don’t think you have any other chance to prevail here as you don't have any other logical reason to prove otherwise. Remember again- you have only your empty words to justify your initial intent (unfortunately), but they have fact and evidence to prove your intent otherwise (unfortunately also). Therefore, if you really like to prevail then you should think something very reasonable and convincing, which could seem like “walk to walk, and talk to talk” in a real world.

Good Luck.
I chose to go back to my country when the decision for extension was denied, but i sat with my wife-to-be then, as i have known her for a while back then, and i told her about the whole situation, but she said, no, i want to get married and i want you to stay with me, i had the same strong feeling, but did not want her to think that i just want to get married to overpass that situation with the immigration.
and that is why i didnnot go back '
 
sony55 said:
I chose to go back to my country when the decision for extension was denied, but i sat with my wife-to-be then

Firstly, you telling that you did choose to go back to your country when the decision for extension was denied, is seemed nothing more than empty words just to justify your presence in this country at that time. Because, the truth is-you did not leave this country. Saying something without an action means nothing.

Secondly, why you chose to go back ONLY when your application for extension of F-1 was denied? Why not before that when you entered into the US on F-1 visa and found yourself all of sudden in "unfortunate" circumstances? No need me to mention that your intent is in question because of the beginning period of your stay in this country, and not because of 'out of status' period later on.

Thirdly, what was the point to ask for an extension of F-1 visa when you did not even bother to attend the school even for one day on previously issued F-1 visa to you? Did you expect USCIS to believe that you would comply with the terms of F-1 visa if it had extended to you? Since you did not comply with the terms of F-1 visa at first place, USCIS refused to extend your F-1 visa; otherwise they always extend F-1 visa if someone is involved in an on-going studies. To me-you were just trying to be in a Status by making a request for extension of F-1 visa. That is. But you did not have any intent to attend school even if an extension might have granted to you.

Fourth, if you would say that you requested for an extension on your F-1 visa because you were in a position to support your studies at that time, which you were unable in the beginning when you arrived in this country then question could be asked-why did not bother to go back and try to get another student visa from all over than being hung around here for so long?

Fifth, your situation would surely sound very fishy to USCIS as they would wonder that how strange that you were able to support yourself being living here for so long after placing your foot on your US soil, but the main reason for you to be here at first place-studying, you could not do even for one day because you found yourself all of sudden in "unfortunate" circumstances.

Sixth, if you REALLY wanted to go back, you would have left this country without someone telling you otherwise. If someone tells you to jump in the ocean, would you do that? Won't you have your own consciousness for what you do in your life? Besides, no need me to mention that your wife was not in the picture in the beginning when you arrived here to attend school as you said that you met your wife later on, and not right away after placing the foot on US soil. So obviously, I'm not talking for the period after you met with your wife; instead I'm talking about a period before that. And now if you would say that you came to know your wife right away or even before arriving here then your motive/intent to arrive here on F-1 proves more strongly to USCIS.

Seventh, I did not ask you why you did not leave this country after meeting with your wife; instead I asked you why did you not leave this country when you found yourself in "unfortunate" circumstances which made you not to attend the school even for one day when you placed the foot on US soil on F-1 visa?

Eight, I'm repeating myself again that you were not given the permission to come here and meet your wife; instead you were given the permission to come to this country to attend school. If you would have attended school and have met your wife in-between then your intent would not have questioned.

Like I said earlier that I'm not criticizing you, instead I'm telling you about the possible questions that could be argued in your situation as I've seen many cases like yours. And again, it would be better if you could focus on logical and reasonable reasoning to answer about your initial intent than emotional one.
 
JohnnyCash said:
Firstly, you telling that you did choose to go back to your country when the decision for extension was denied, is seemed nothing more than empty words just to justify your presence in this country at that time. Because, the truth is-you did not leave this country. Saying something without an action means nothing.

Secondly, why you chose to go back ONLY when your application for extension of F-1 was denied? Why not before that when you entered into the US on F-1 visa and found yourself all of sudden in "unfortunate" circumstances? No need me to mention that your intent is in question because of the beginning period of your stay in this country, and not because of 'out of status' period later on.

Thirdly, what was the point to ask for an extension of F-1 visa when you did not even bother to attend the school even for one day on previously issued F-1 visa to you? Did you expect USCIS to believe that you would comply with the terms of F-1 visa if it had extended to you? Since you did not comply with the terms of F-1 visa at first place, USCIS refused to extend your F-1 visa; otherwise they always extend F-1 visa if someone is involved in an on-going studies. To me-you were just trying to be in a Status by making a request for extension of F-1 visa. That is. But you did not have any intent to attend school even if an extension might have granted to you.

Fourth, if you would say that you requested for an extension on your F-1 visa because you were in a position to support your studies at that time, which you were unable in the beginning when you arrived in this country then question could be asked-why did not bother to go back and try to get another student visa from all over than being hung around here for so long?

Fifth, your situation would surely sound very fishy to USCIS as they would wonder that how strange that you were able to support yourself being living here for so long after placing your foot on your US soil, but the main reason for you to be here at first place-studying, you could not do even for one day because you found yourself all of sudden in "unfortunate" circumstances.

Sixth, if you REALLY wanted to go back, you would have left this country without someone telling you otherwise. If someone tells you to jump in the ocean, would you do that? Won't you have your own consciousness for what you do in your life? Besides, no need me to mention that your wife was not in the picture in the beginning when you arrived here to attend school as you said that you met your wife later on, and not right away after placing the foot on US soil. So obviously, I'm not talking for the period after you met with your wife; instead I'm talking about a period before that. And now if you would say that you came to know your wife right away or even before arriving here then your motive/intent to arrive here on F-1 proves more strongly to USCIS.

Seventh, I did not ask you why you did not leave this country after meeting with your wife; instead I asked you why did you not leave this country when you found yourself in "unfortunate" circumstances which made you not to attend the school even for one day when you placed the foot on US soil on F-1 visa?

Eight, I'm repeating myself again that you were not given the permission to come here and meet your wife; instead you were given the permission to come to this country to attend school. If you would have attended school and have met your wife in-between then your intent would not have questioned.

Like I said earlier that I'm not criticizing you, instead I'm telling you about the possible questions that could be argued in your situation as I've seen many cases like yours. And again, it would be better if you could focus on logical and reasonable reasoning to answer about your initial intent than emotional one.
Johny cash,
i have much respect for you. you might be a bit harsh, but i do understand your way and i certainly appreciate it.
I just like you to know as i will tell the uscis that, i have nothing to hide. i will present my whole situation and i will lay my carpet infront of them simply and exactly as it happened. everything might not make much since to them. it might not seem spontaneous , but i don not care, that is what happened. if they believe me , fine, if not, fine as well. i listened to my wife then because i love her and she does too. they want to deport me for commiting no crime at all!? why do you think i would apply for extension if i had bad intention or if i wanted to just come here! i would have known that my application then would be denied since i am not going to school! i will give it a shot.
i am not posting here to ask for excuses to make up. i have a case, and i have a good attitude toward it.
your opinions will be appreciated.
 
sony55 said:
Johny cash,
i have much respect for you. you might be a bit harsh, but i do understand your way and i certainly appreciate it.
I just like you to know as i will tell the uscis that, i have nothing to hide. i will present my whole situation and i will lay my carpet infront of them simply and exactly as it happened. everything might not make much since to them. it might not seem spontaneous , but i don not care, that is what happened. if they believe me , fine, if not, fine as well. i listened to my wife then because i love her and she does too. they want to deport me for commiting no crime at all!? why do you think i would apply for extension if i had bad intention or if i wanted to just come here! i would have known that my application then would be denied since i am not going to school! i will give it a shot.
i am not posting here to ask for excuses to make up. i have a case, and i have a good attitude toward it.
your opinions will be appreciated.
johny , please check your private messages. thank you.
 
Sony

First of all, I’m glad to know that you did not take my postings as offensive since you said that you already know my way of expressing my opinions.

Secondly, thank you so much for having respect for me. I also have respect for you and for others. We are all human beings first before anything else, and we should respect to each other regardless of our differences/disagreements. And I do know that sometimes I do sound harsh in my opinions, but I certainly don’t mean to purposely offend/criticize anyone unless someone offends me first. Besides, JohnnyCash is here to help people, and not to create problem to them, which people sometime forget.

Thirdly, I did receive the private messages that you sent to me. However, I’m choosing to answer those over here because- (1) since you know well that I give a very detailed explanation on a given situation by putting all the cards on the table, but because of the limitation of size of a text on a private message, it is kind of hard for me to write everything in one message; (2) I believe that if I answer to those questions over here then a lot of people might be able to know the answer to those questions, who are or would be in a similar situation like yours.

So, let me break it down those questions for a better understanding of yours and others.



“what do you think about the uscis issuing a decision after the 120 days? is that completely legal?”

It is completely legal if USCIS would make a decision on a case even many years later of having an interview with applicant. I’m personally aware of two cases in NY, wherein USCIS hasn’t made a decision yet in those cases despite of having conducted interview more than 2 yrs ago. There is nothing written in any law/rule that USCIS MUST need to make a decision within 120 days of interview if other processing on N-400 is not completed. That’s why; thousands of people are still hanging in there for years despite of being interviewed. USCIS can hold a decision because of many reasons, such as ‘background check’, Name Check, reviewing the case by Supervisor, investigating the case, etc…

I don’t know how much you know about all these lawsuits, which were/are filed against USCIS under 120 days rule, but the truth is 95% of those cases were dismissed because Courts ruled that other processing must need to be completed before a decision can even be made by USCIS on N-400 despite of USCIS having interviewed the applicants so long ago.

Technically, USCIS should not interview people until all the processing is completed, but obviously they are interviewing people for sometime before even others processing are completed on an application. Besides, there is no any law to prevent them not to conduct an interview before all the processing is even completed. The reason for them to conduct an interview before other processing is completed is because they want to dispose a case quickly, but it is not their fault if other processing is not completed. Because, other processing involves other govt. agencies and other departments of USCIS.



“how long does it take for the Uscis to schedule and appointment”

It doesn’t take that long for USCIS to have a hearing on a ‘Request for Hearing on a Decision in Naturalization’. I would say-a month at most unless your local district office is VERY busy one. In order to have this hearing, you must need to file Form N-336 with USCIS with the correct fee within 30 days after your receive a denial letter.



“once the hearing is done, how long do they take to issue a decision, whether denial or approval?”

Once a hearing is done with USCIS on a Motion for Reconsideration, they sometime tell their decision right away after the hearing, while other times they like to inform their decision in the mail within 2-3 weeks at most.



“will the hearing be with the same interviewing officer who conducted the initial citizenship intierview, or will it be in a court of law?”

The hearing on a Motion for Reconsideration with USCIS won’t be in a Court; instead it would be in a local USCIS office.

Most probably, hearing would be with the same officer who interviewed you on your N-400 as one-on-one meeting. During the time of interview, officer was not aware of this crucial fact of your case; otherwise officer might have already asked your explanation on this to decide a case right away. This crucial fact came in the picture during the process of reviewing your entire immigration files by other officers or Supervisor.

However, there is a very slight chance, very slim one though that the Supervisor of that officer will be there as well; otherwise there would be only one officer and it would be the same one who initially interviewed you as officer would have already consulted/discussed your case with his/her Supervisor before coming to hearing. Further, it could also be possible that your case can be heard by any other officer if a new officer is assigned to your case, or if the interviewing officer has been transferred to other office or on another duty or if s/he is on leave.



“can you give me a clue regarding the cost of the legal assistance for hearing?”

I believe I already answered this in a very detail in my earlier postings. Nevertheless, I honestly don’t know how much it would cost in your specific case. It would depend on an individual attorney who would represent you. But it should not be more than $1,000 for this kind of hearing with USCIS. Try to consult with many attorneys, and then choose the right one based upon their experiences and expertise. Like I said earlier, you should not weigh your life with money as you can always make money if you will be allowed to live here. Try to borrow from someone, get loan or from credit cards or whatever if you have money problem, especially when your life is on stake here. Don’t make a stupid decision based upon your troubled financial situation, wherein you might repent it later on.



“what should i do regarding the form G-639, should i send it to you, my wife, or the USCIS? and how can i endorse you to be authorized to go through my file and study it?”

It is my understanding that you cannot authorize this form to anyone except to your attorney. Under the Privacy Act, the record would be disclosed to either you or your attorney. Besides, it takes a long time to get a record on your file from USCIS, which you obviously cannot have prior to a hearing with USCIS. Further, what is use to request your whole record when USCIS has questioned your initial intent only, which would not be there on your file.
 
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Sony

I’m glad that you have a great attitude towards your case. You said that you don’t care if USCIS would not find your true answer as reasonable, nor you care if they send you back to your home country. However, if you do care to live in this country, especially if you want to live with your wife in this country and if she is willing to live here with you as well then I think you should be caring about living here. It’s now no more about your life alone; instead now you have other person in your life (your wife) to think about too. So you cannot make such a big decision of your life by keeping in consideration your wishes alone, which could impact her life too. As you know that I defend people. So obviously, I would use all the tactics in the book to defend a person.

That said, if I were your attorney then my advise to you-stay firm on your original story by saying that when you obtained F-1 visa at US Consulate and when you entered at Port of Entry in US, you were really intented to attend the school in US. But after coming here, you found yourself in different circumstances like your brother lost the job who supposed to take care of your financial needs for your studies. That situation was completely out of your control. That’s why you could not be able to attend the school at that time. Therefore, you decided to postpone your initial decision of attending school and decided to work so that you could go to school after earning some money. That’s why you stayed here without going to school while working. In between, you met your wife over here and fell in love with her. Both of you decided to marry and finally got married later on.

If officer would be a kind one, s/he would let go this matter easily as no one wants to separate a family for the mistake that happened many years ago. But again, it would entirely depend on the kindness of officer as chances don't look good in your favor.

Good Luck
 
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“can you give me a clue regarding the cost of the legal assistance for hearing?”

I believe I already answered this in a very detail in my earlier postings. Nevertheless, I honestly don’t know how much it would cost you. It would depend on an individual attorney who would represent you. But it should not be more than $1,000 for this kind of hearing with USCIS. Try to consult with many attorneys, and then choose the right one based upon their experiences and expertise. Like I said earlier, you should not weigh your life with money as people can always make money if they will be allowed to live here. Try to borrow from someone, get loan or from credit cards or whatever if you have money problem, especially when your life is on stake here. Don’t make a stupid decision based upon your troubled financial situation, wherein you might repent it later on.


“what should i do regarding the form G-639, should i send it to you, my wife, or the USCIS? and how can i endorse you to be authorized to go through my file and study it?”

It is my understanding that you cannot authorize this form to anyone except your attorney. Under the Privacy Act, the record would be disclosed to either you or your attorney. Besides, it takes a long time to get a record on your file from USCIS, which you obviously cannot have prior to a hearing with USCIS. Further, what is use to request your whole record when USCIS is question about your initial intent only, which would not be there on your file.[/QUOTE]
thank you johny for your replies and rich information.
sorry, the last two questions were directed to my lawyer and i forgot to change the pronouns!
regarding the freedom of information act, i heard that the law says that they should reveal the information requested within a time frame of 14 days max, unless, they exceed that period too as they do with the 120 days law too!
i consulted a lawyer, the same one who did my adjustment of status from the beginning, and he advised to release my file to him first to have an idea of what kind of information they have on my file, and what notes they got. he said , in this case he can study the case much better and have more answers to their questions.
i filed the hearing application that came with the denial letter along with the fee, 250 dollars. and the lawer asked them to schedule the hearing not sooner than 45 days to get enough time to study the case, specially that i was not in the country at the time i got the denial letter!
eager to hear your opinion again. thanks
 
At last, I would like to clarify two points here.

(1) A hearing request can be made for a specific time like 45 days or 60 days or any other suitable date with the prior approval of USCIS. But, a request for hearing with USCIS must need to be filed within 30 days of receiving a denial letter unless applicant can prove that s/he was not aware of denial letter.

(2) Any time when there is a hearing or appeal is involved, attorneys do want to review the whole case. That's why they wish to have whole record in front of them. However, in your specific case, there is no need to have whole record because-USCIS has questioned your initial intent when you arrived on F-1 visa, which won't be on your file obviously. So, I don't know what your attorney would accomplish by seeing your whole file, but it won't hurt either.

There is nothing more left for me to say on your case than what I've already said except GOOD LUCK.
 
JohnnyCash said:
At last, I would like to clarify two points here.

(1) A hearing request can be made for a specific time like 45 days or 60 days or any other suitable date with the prior approval of USCIS. But, a request for hearing with USCIS must need to be filed within 30 days of receiving a denial letter unless applicant can prove that s/he was not aware of denial letter.

(2) Any time when there is a hearing or appeal is involved, attorneys do want to review the whole case. That's why they wish to have whole record in front of them. However, in your specific case, there is no need to have whole record because-USCIS has questioned your initial intent when you arrived on F-1 visa, which won't be on your file obviously. So, I don't know what your attorney would accomplish by seeing your whole file, but it won't hurt either.

There is nothing more left for me to say on your case than what I've already said except GOOD LUCK.
and I need that good luck johny. i appreciate you , with all respect, thank you!
 
JohnnyCash said:
“what do you think about the uscis issuing a decision after the 120 days? is that completely legal?”

It is completely legal if USCIS would make a decision on a case even after many years of having interview. I’m personally aware of two people’s cases in NY, wherein USCIS hasn’t made a decision yet in their case despite of them been interviewed more than 2 yrs ago. There is nowhere written in any law/rule that USCIS MUST need to make a decision within 120 days of interview if other processing on N-400 is not completed. That’s why; thousands of people are still hanging in there for years despite of being interviewed. USCIS could hold a decision because of many reasons, such as ‘background check’, reviewing the case by Supervisor, investigating the case, etc…

I don’t know how much you know about all these lawsuits, which were filed against USCIS under 120 days rule, but the truth is 95% of those cases were dismissed because Courts ruled that other processing must be completed before a decision can even be made by USCIS on N-400 despite of USCIS having interviewed the applicants so long ago.

I remember you advised me not to bring a lawsuit against USCIS right after the 120 days rule. However, should I try to go to DOs for every month or 2 months or so for inquiring my case at all? i just worry about the "background check" will drag my case for years and years.

When would be the "right time" to involve congressperson / senator and bring USCIS to a lawsuit per 120 days rule?

thanks in advance
 
Ocworker

You may visit your local USCIS office every month to inquire your case, even two times a month would be okay. But don't inquire them in writing (thru mail). Because, they keep all the correspondences in the file, which may annoy them.

You may involve Congresspersons after 120 days of your interview.

As far as 'background check' is concerned then nobody can help in expediting it, including Congresspersons and USCIS. Because, it is out of their hand being in the hand of FBI. I know that a lot of people mistakenly believe that if they involve Congresspersons or if they write/contact to FBI then their request would be heard and dealt in a timely manner. But they are completely wrong. If some people were able to complete their background check by FBI on a timely manner then that doesn't mean that it was done because of their efforts. Instead, it was done because of their luck or FBI randomly completed the check on them during the same time when they were making their efforts to have it done thru FBI by their own efforts.

Further, there is no any law that can force/dictate FBI to handle background check if FBI doesn't want to do it on timely fashion. When it comes to 'background check' then all a person can do is-PRAY. That is all. Sometimes prayers work more than anything else even though my prayers for myself haven't answered yet. But I do have a faith in God. Good Luck and keep your finger crossed for the best.
 
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