Don't expect anything from the current administration.

[indian_gc_ocean]

Although I do not agree with the 150K post, I do not know what's the problem, why do you think it "needs to be reported to Rajiv". Why was that post such a big offense to you or what? I do not see any offensive in that post.

"Any generalizations about H1Bs, IT guys... will be reported to Rajiv Khanna" -- because misrepresentation/false propagnada without any statistics can effect everyone leave alone proactive steps to solve the problem. This is not first time we are ending up with this kind of situation. Anyway, if you see the context of the thread, I said what I have to say. If you feel it is ok, no big deal.

 

[qplearn]

do you see any light?

perm_lc,

I have followed this thread closely and it has been amusing to see the detailed analysis of who is skilled and who is not and who really deserves the GC and who does not.

You have rightly touched upon every issue affecting the legal immigrant community. I have maintained for the longest time that that the biggest culprit in all this is the system that has been put in place and the crazy ways in which laws have been passed and implemented without regard for the situation on the ground.

How can a system go from handing out GCs in 6-8 months a few years ago to what it is now. It simply boils down to a lack of oversight, foresight and proper planning.

At this point it really doesn't matter. The situation is what it is and we will have to just wait on another stupid law that may benefit some in the short term and will screw others in the long term. The law makers are incapable of coming up with provisions that will solve all problems that plague this system. Those of us who are currently stuck just have to wait our turn to get lucky based on another crappy bill or law.

regards,

saras

saras:

do you see any bill for the skilled people or the semi-skilled people (like me) in the visible time horizon?
The CIR seems to have takeoff problems, and until the CIR is declared dead, the SKIL bill may not be allowed to be born.

 

[Jackolantern]

In all seriousness; everyone needs to get realistic expectations instead of whining/crying of how they are being so harmed and they are so precious. Everything I am reading is that there is problem with undocumented and now the American IT people are going after Bill Gates and H-1b. Maybe the non IT people going for greencard should ask to be separated into different categories since there doesn't seem to be opposition there.

So your apparent point is that IT people aren't very important to the US, and if they did a points system or something similar most of us would get rejected.

If that is the case, I don't have a problem with that, as long as they are up front and prompt with it. If you (the US) don't want me here, then let me know that before or shortly after I apply, and I would have been gone at the end of my 6th year of H1B, to move on to a country that does want me or back home into a good job. Now with this crazy priority date game, I don't know if my green card is six months or six years away or if it will come at all.

 

[nyc8300]

Everybody is entitles to their opinions. Everybody is entitled to disagree and to report to Rajiv Khanna as well....

"Any generalizations about H1Bs, IT guys... will be reported to Rajiv Khanna" -- because misrepresentation/false propagnada without any statistics can effect everyone leave alone proactive steps to solve the problem. This is not first time we are ending up with this kind of situation. Anyway, if you see the context of the thread, I said what I have to say. If you feel it is ok, no big deal.

 

[indian_gc_ocean]

Everybody is entitles to their opinions. Everybody is entitled to disagree and to report to Rajiv Khanna as well....

Thats right. Opinions are different from repeated mass generalizations from self experiences as if they are universal truths. Hope we understand that. If you see anyone addressing a community like H1B, IT people, consulting companies, absolutely -- be my guest.

Did you ever recently notice the changes in Yahoo! news boards for example they say,

As they were set up, the Yahoo! News message boards allowed a small number of vocal users to dominate the discussion.

Now they stopped taking messages for news items. I have little doubt that it is the direction we are going here.

 

[perm_lc]

So your apparent point is that IT people aren't very important to the US, and if they did a points system or something similar most of us would get rejected.

If that is the case, I don't have a problem with that, as long as they are up front and prompt with it. If you (the US) don't want me here, then let me know that before or shortly after I apply, and I would have been gone at the end of my 6th year of H1B, to move on to a country that does want me or back home into a good job. Now with this crazy priority date game, I don't know if my green card is six months or six years away or if it will come at all.

Here comes buddy. Exactly right. This employment based system is inefficient, and badly designed. Therefore it can be easily abused. The sad part is no one cares. The bodyshopers controls the system. who is boddy shoppers? All these folks supply supply man power from India to IT companies. Thatswhy Indian IT guys visible in this process. As UN mentioned, everone is having urgent. Everyone has got trapped in the broken system after a long wait. There is no point in talking who is skilled and who deserves first. It is a crapy discussion. We are all victim of broken system. Therefore, everyone stayed legally for a certain period of time desrves GC. It is as simple it is. The best solution is fix the abuse or pray for CIR.

 

[indian_gc_ocean]

So your apparent point is that IT people aren't very important to the US, and if they did a points system or something similar most of us would get rejected.

If that is the case, I don't have a problem with that, as long as they are up front and prompt with it. If you (the US) don't want me here, then let me know that before or shortly after I apply, and I would have been gone at the end of my 6th year of H1B, to move on to a country that does want me or back home into a good job. Now with this crazy priority date game, I don't know if my green card is six months or six years away or if it will come at all.

That’s what it is. If we stop running the marathon out of exhaustion one day, we would be deemed unfit to participate in another race, as we would be burned out by then. Only option would be to retire gracefully. As Saras pointed out "The situation is what it is and we will have to just wait on another stupid law that may benefit some in the short term and will screw others in the long term." Either wait or retire gracefully would be our choice.

 

[GotPR?]

Therefore, everyone stayed legally for a certain period of time desrves GC.

I think this one sentence summaries why you(beneficiary) and authority don't agree each other(I mean why immigration bills were turned down by government though we wanted it).
Basically, you and the authority are not on the same page.
You think you deserve GC which shows your idea that GC is a reward, but in fact, it is not what EB GC is for. EB GC is for the expectation of your future contribution, therefore shout based on your suffer will never work. You need to show objective analysis on how current situation will hutr the US rather than subjective outcry. I personally think it is not easy task as even in this retrogression there are about 140000 people steadily approved every year and the US LPR population is proportionally increasing anyway.
So, the argument that system is broken does not work because the thing is working as the goverment expects.

Now how are you going to shoot ? May be praying for CIR to pass as you said is the only way.

 

[perm_lc]

I think this one sentence summaries why you(beneficiary) and authority don't agree each other(I mean why immigration bills were turned down by government though we wanted it).
Basically, you and the authority are not on the same page.
You think you deserve GC which shows your idea that GC is a reward, but in fact, it is not what EB GC is for. EB GC is for the expectation of your future contribution, therefore shout based on your suffer will never work. You need to show objective analysis on how current situation will hutr the US rather than subjective outcry. I personally think it is not easy task as even in this retrogression there are about 140000 people steadily approved every year and the US LPR population is proportionally increasing anyway.
So, the argument that system is broken does not work because the thing is working as the goverment expects.

Now how are you going to shoot ? May be praying for CIR to pass as you said is the only way.

I do not know or do not care whether I contribute to US economy now or in future. I know I am highly skilled and have a degree in one of the top 10 engineering school. My employer is happy with me. My skills brings revenue to my company. Thats all. My point is, very simple. I have a job offer in US and I lived legally for a certain period. I need my card. Thats it. I paid enough taxes, SS contribution etc..The approval of immigrat visa pettion has given me the hope. Based on that, I am holding my decisions. If US do not need me, I should have been told upfront before 5 to 7 years. Not now. As I mentioned earlier, the govenrment or authority is clueless. They do not know what they are doing. That is why I mentioned testing the labor market in 2007 for a job oppertunity that is going to exist in 2027 is a hight of stupdity.

There are about 1 million peoples are becoming LPR in US every year. Out of 1,000,000 EB is just 140K. Remaining 860K are from FB, asylum, Lottery ect..Most of family based guys coming not for family reunification. The intension of FB immigration is for family union not for employment. However, they are coming here better life style and a job. There is no labor market test for those. Is it a good system? Furthermore, there is no country quota in spouses of US citizens and there is no numarical limitations. Why thery are exempted? Why they are special? Are they contributing to US or interest of the nation to have foreign spouse? It is just the desire/personal need of a US citizen. After all, US employer also does the same thing; brings foreign workers for their bussiness needs. Why employment based system suffer in country quota and limitations? Is it not stupidity? Atleast in EB system, there is labor market test. However there is no bridegroom/bride market test by U.S department of Date to certify that there is no available, willing, U.S citizen, before an U.S guy apply immigrant visa for a foreign spouse.

Further, if you add your spouse before I-485 aproval, he/she will get card immediatly with you. If you apply PR for spouse after 485 approval it will take ever. Is it not stupidity?

My argument here is admin/government has no clue or interest as you mentioned.

 

[saras76]

Its pure luck from this point on ..

saras:

do you see any bill for the skilled people or the semi-skilled people (like me) in the visible time horizon?
The CIR seems to have takeoff problems, and until the CIR is declared dead, the SKIL bill may not be allowed to be born.

gplearn,

The whole immigration issue has been hijacked by illegal immigration and illegal immigration is a hot button issue with lawmakers and voters alike. In the current climate our (legal skilled immigras) fate is tied to the fate of the CIR. The problem with CIR is that it has been totally politicized and is being used by different lawmakers for different political purposes. If sufficient law makers find it in their political interest to support the bill then it may make it into law and we might benefit. It is pure luck/fate at this point ...

regards,

saras

 

[ohio_boy]

answer

Thats right. Opinions are different from repeated mass generalizations from self experiences as if they are universal truths. Hope we understand that. If you see anyone addressing a community like H1B, IT people, consulting companies, absolutely -- be my guest.

Did you ever recently notice the changes in Yahoo! news boards for example they say,

As they were set up, the Yahoo! News message boards allowed a small number of vocal users to dominate the discussion.

Now they stopped taking messages for news items. I have little doubt that it is the direction we are going here.

Well, let me tell you something. Generalizations are there because there might be a pattern of things that statistically might be shown but you're not allowed to say it because of "political correctness" (i.e. censorship). I could show you an official example of that, I just do not wanna be "politically incorrect".
Said that I do not now what those generalizations were in this case, you're right.

But going back to the original discussion: My personal opinion is that maybe people who wanted to intoduce CIR considered it risky to introduce right now. I mean generally speaking (please do not tell this to Rajiv-)))) the word immigration seems to be a negative word nowadays unfortunately. Because people cannot distinguish between legal and illegal immigrants. So maybe they leveraged it and came up with the conclusion that they might lose votes after all. (gain 5 million but lose 15 million for example)

 

[tusharvk]

Voters are fed up with the illegal immigration problem. Hence, a fix in this respect is badly needed. Fixing legal system comes much afterwards.
It is for lawmakers to take leadership and try to educate people to fix this system. Sadly, if something does not happen this year, do not expect anything until 2009.
Right now itself, there is a flood of perm approvals waiting to clog up the whole system. One can only imagine what will happen till late 2009.

Well, let me tell you something. Generalizations are there because there might be a pattern of things that statistically might be shown but you're not allowed to say it because of "political correctness" (i.e. censorship). I could show you an official example of that, I just do not wanna be "politically incorrect".
Said that I do not now what those generalizations were in this case, you're right.

But going back to the original discussion: My personal opinion is that maybe people who wanted to intoduce CIR considered it risky to introduce right now. I mean generally speaking (please do not tell this to Rajiv-)))) the word immigration seems to be a negative word nowadays unfortunately. Because people cannot distinguish between legal and illegal immigrants. So maybe they leveraged it and came up with the conclusion that they might lose votes after all. (gain 5 million but lose 15 million for example)

 

[tusharvk]

Voters are fed up with the illegal immigration problem. Hence, a fix in this respect is badly needed. Fixing legal system comes much afterwards.
It is for lawmakers to take leadership and try to educate people to fix this system. Sadly, if something does not happen this year, do not expect anything until 2009.
Right now itself, there is a flood of perm approvals waiting to clog up the whole system. One can only imagine what will happen till late 2009.

 

[saras76]

August is it ..

Voters are fed up with the illegal immigration problem. Hence, a fix in this respect is badly needed. Fixing legal system comes much afterwards.
It is for lawmakers to take leadership and try to educate people to fix this system. Sadly, if something does not happen this year, do not expect anything until 2009.
Right now itself, there is a flood of perm approvals waiting to clog up the whole system. One can only imagine what will happen till late 2009.

tusharvk,

You are absolutely right. If the CIR fails to make it to law by August '07 then nothing will happen until after Jan '09. Unless something magical happens I am not to excited about the prospects of the current CIR. It is just to controversial and both parties will be very catious about making any risky moves ahead of the presidential elections.

cheers,

saras

 

[ohio_boy]

i really do not know what to do

tusharvk,

You are absolutely right. If the CIR fails to make it to law by August '07 then nothing will happen until after Jan '09. Unless something magical happens I am not to excited about the prospects of the current CIR. It is just to controversial and both parties will be very catious about making any risky moves ahead of the presidential elections.

cheers,

saras

... at his point. 09 seems too far away for me, although my I-140 was approved. I am starting to carefully examine other options. One of the things I regret a lot that 7 years of my contribution to SSA might be lost when I will be gone. My daughter is a US citizen of course.
Yes, I wanted to stay badly and I know that I will miss this country badly but I do not know if it is worth the price. I had to be medicated because of stress related issues related to immigration. Boy it was bad!

Regarding educating the public: People do not care and that's understandable. I must admit, I do not know about my country's immigration system a lot. Just like Indian and Chinese, etc. friends on this thread probably do not know about immigration into their country a lot. For example, I heard there was a significant immigration into China nowadays.

 

[qplearn]

gplearn,

The whole immigration issue has been hijacked by illegal immigration and illegal immigration is a hot button issue with lawmakers and voters alike. In the current climate our (legal skilled immigras) fate is tied to the fate of the CIR. The problem with CIR is that it has been totally politicized and is being used by different lawmakers for different political purposes. If sufficient law makers find it in their political interest to support the bill then it may make it into law and we might benefit. It is pure luck/fate at this point ...

regards,

saras

I agree. I too have always thought that CIR was not going to help us much. I guess we should wait until April end to see if CIR is tabled in the senate. If it does not happen, we will have to wait our turn in the queue as it stands today. Those on EADs will have to continue renewing them, and those on H1s will have to keep getting them renewed.

At the current rate, ppl from India are getting their GCs after a 5-yr wait in EB-2 and a 7-yr wait in EB-3.

 

[garam.chadi]

CIR is possible this year ...

tusharvk,

You are absolutely right. If the CIR fails to make it to law by August '07 then nothing will happen until after Jan '09. Unless something magical happens I am not to excited about the prospects of the current CIR. It is just to controversial and both parties will be very catious about making any risky moves ahead of the presidential elections.

cheers,

saras

Saras,
I do not think CIR will be risky stuff for both parties ---- The state of GOP is bad now .. every thing is going bad --- atleast if they are able to do something solid on immigration ... then more Latinos will go and vote GOP ..

So I think CIR might be one of the cornerstone thing to brag about in next election and so Pred Bush might do everything to do get this pass during his presidency.


Senators Edward Kennedy and John Kerry have called for Congressional investigations when the illegals were arrested by Immigrations officials and there children's were left without parents for several hrs.

Senators do care for immigrants .. and they know very well with national unemployment at 4% ... how can they afford to loose people from the workforce ...

 

[ohio_boy]

I wish you were right...

Saras,
I do not think CIR will be risky stuff for both parties ---- The state of GOP is bad now .. every thing is going bad --- atleast if they are able to do something solid on immigration ... then more Latinos will go and vote GOP ..

So I think CIR might be one of the cornerstone thing to brag about in next election and so Pred Bush might do everything to do get this pass during his presidency.


Senators Edward Kennedy and John Kerry have called for Congressional investigations when the illegals were arrested by Immigrations officials and there children's were left without parents for several hrs.

Senators do care for immigrants .. and they know very well with national unemployment at 4% ... how can they afford to loose people from the workforce ...

But do not forget that the marchers back a few months ago marched with Mexican flags (I mean some of them, which were shown by the press and media). That caused some outrage among American people which is completely understandable. In other words the big question is whether the "net change" in votes would be positive for the party who introduces it or negative. I am not sure it's positive right now.

 

[mariner555]

But do not forget that the marchers back a few months ago marched with Mexican flags (I mean some of them, which were shown by the press and media). That caused some outrage among American people which is completely understandable. In other words the big question is whether the "net change" in votes would be positive for the party who introduces it or negative. I am not sure it's positive right now.

I think it will pass. there is 50% chance of failure though.
I saw some of the provisions for illegals ..it is way too difficult ..pay back taxes, work for 5-6 years then apply for GC etc etc. it depends on how politicians sell it ..majority of americans want to solve this issue so that more people pay taxes and are in the system. I am sure there is a big group of lobbyists (lawyers, small business owners, farm interests etc) who want some sort of reform.

 

[Jackolantern]

Most of the controversy with the CIR bills in its various versions seems to be centered around two things: H1B, and what to do with illegals.

However, the legal GC provisions in the bills were quite generous, and I'm surprised but happy that there haven't been major objections. Not counting the House's enforcement-only bill, the CIR bills have included one or more of the following: (1) increase EB quota to 290K, (2) don't count dependents in the quota, (3) recapture unused numbers from prior years. Any of the first two would make a huge difference, and at least one of the above probably will make it into whatever CIR bill gets passed into law ... if and when a CIR bill becomes law.