False USC Claim on Community College Application

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I think there are following options assuming the OP did claim citizenshop on college application and he did know it
(The OP can concentrate on practical matter and forget about consicience for a while)

(1) file N400 and disclose the citizenship claim on the application
disclosing it on the N400 must come with asumption it can be forgiven by the USCIS
or at least there is such a chance. Otherwise it is meaningless to send teh application.

(2) file N400 and do not disclose the citizenship claim on the application

(3) Do not file N400 at all

(4) Voluntarily leave the country if there is no mood to live here any more

Perhaps if the choiece is (4), then there is nothing to lose by trying (1) and (2).

By the way, this assume The OP clearly know he does know he claimed to be a citizen once. If he is not sure, then
he can give himself benefot of doubt and assume he did not do such thing. Again the only thing it can cause
USCIS suspition is that lack of I20 record in his A file if the IO feel he attended college befor egetting teh GC.
For this purpose, the OP can delay his N400 application by a few years. APplicants only need to list employment/school history
past 5 years.
 
Bobsmyth said:
You fail to see the potential seriousness of the OP's false claim to US citizenship. Without knowing the details of his case, it's foolish to suggest that he should straight out lie and not disclose the issue.
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I think you also miss the previous poster's point. Just because it is a seriosu matter so the OP is dead anyway even if he disclose it.
So let's forget about conscience for a while and there are only three things OP can do for practicaly reason

(1) Do not apply at all
(2) Apply but not disclose
(3) Leave this country.


Again I said forget about conscience for a while. If concience is that demanding, then the OP should just leave this country.
if one does not deserve to be naturalized, then one does not deserve to be a PR either.
 
So the discussion is if the USCIS can find out about the college application or not. Well as mentioned, you need to fill out the N-400 honestly or have it considered fraud.

IO's not only read through the N-400, but also ask you if you have ever claimed to be a USC. Like other border officials they are trained in looking at nervous body language or signs that someone is lying. So saying no to the IO, and the IO seeing various signs that you aren't telling the truth can be a big problem. Telling the truth, of course can also be a big problem as well.

So far things seem to point to not getting your citizenship or not applying for it right now. Best bet is to try and get a copy of your college application to see if you had or hadn't actually claimed to be a citizen rather then going by "I don't remember". Then you will have a clear indication if you should pursue the N-400 or not...
 
warlord said:
So the discussion is if the USCIS can find out about the college application or not. Well as mentioned, you need to fill out the N-400 honestly or have it considered fraud.

IO's not only read through the N-400, but also ask you if you have ever claimed to be a USC. Like other border officials they are trained in looking at nervous body language or signs that someone is lying. So saying no to the IO, and the IO seeing various signs that you aren't telling the truth can be a big problem. Telling the truth, of course can also be a big problem as well.

So far things seem to point to not getting your citizenship or not applying for it right now. Best bet is to try and get a copy of your college application to see if you had or hadn't actually claimed to be a citizen rather then going by "I don't remember". Then you will have a clear indication if you should pursue the N-400 or not...
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Yeah, they will deport him becuase of his body language................................really. I wouldn't suggest he say "I don't remember" the answer is NO, plan and simple. Let USCIS find out otherwise. If it's not in writing, it didn't happen.

People, USCIS does NOT have the resources to send investigators to the local community college. Thay bearly can deal with all the applications they have now.

Reality people.
 
trialanderror83 said:
People, USCIS does NOT have the resources to send investigators to the local community college. Thay bearly can deal with all the applications they have now.

Reality people.
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Without anything leading to it, I agree it is like find a needle in a haystack for USCIS to just accidently find an applicant once claimed to be a citizen on one college application. But I am not sure if the IO is detective -minded person or not. If the OP
applies, The IO may find he does not have a college record in the past 5 years and only assume he must have attended college before 5 years ago. Either he attanded college outside USA or in USA. The age amy not addup to assume the OP attended college outside USA. So the IO can assume he attaned cololge in USA before the green card was granted. But for non-PR foreiegn to attend college, he must have applied for F-1 cisa or F-1 visa status. But the IO may find there is no such record
in his A file.

Again, I am not sure if teh IO is that detective minded or not. To be safe the OP can delay N400 for say 3 years.

The bottoline is: OP need to make up his own mind.
 
Jackolantern said:
No, because some colleges allow out-of-status people to attend.
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Some college allowing it does not mean USCIS being OK with it.
It is what USCIS thinks that matters. and we don't know if the OP fit that kind of situation or not. There must be rule about non-PR alien attending colleges
otherwise why there is such thing as I-20 application is if it is noty legally required not only for a visa application from outside USA but
also required for peopel who are already physically in USA.

If I were the IO who interview the OP, either I do not notice or do not care to notice but if I do notice, I would not assume it is OK
for the OP to attend college without applying to USCSI for I20 first.
 
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WBH said:
Some college allowing it does not mean USCIS being OK with it.
It is what USCIS thinks that matters. and we don't know if the OP fit that kind of situation or not. There must be rile
otherwise why there is such thing as I-20 application is if it is noty legally required not only for a visa application from outside USA but
also required for peopel who are already physically in USA.

If I were the IO who interview the OP, either I do not notice or do not care to notice but I would not assume it is OK for the
OP to attend college without applying to USCSI for I20 first.
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Or, if the IO doesn't see a college listed on the applicant's N-400, he/she may just assume that the applicant never attended college to begin with.
 
Vorpal said:
Or, if the IO doesn't see a college listed on the applicant's N-400, he/she may just assume that the applicant never attended college to begin with.
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Well, the OP need to list employment history for the past 5 years. What if teh IO only see titles like engineer/serior engineer etc.
 
WBH said:
Well, the OP need to list employment history for the past 5 years. What if teh IO only see titles like engineer/serior engineer etc.
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A few years back, I worked for an engineering firm and personally knew a couple of engineers who didn't have any kind of college education. They started off as draftsmen/CAD operators and learned as they went.

I definitely see your point, though. Granted, the IO can assume that the applicant went to college. However, with the overabundance of higher learning institutions, trying to locate the college where the applicant got his/her degree would be a challenge. For all the IO knows, the applicant may have received a degree by enrolling in an online program at an overseas college.

Personally, I can't advocate lying about something as serious as claiming to be a U.S. citizen in writing. However, if the OP decided to do it anyway, the USCIS probably would never find out.
 
Vorpal said:
Personally, I can't advocate lying about something as serious as claiming to be a U.S. citizen in writing. However, if the OP decided to do it anyway, the USCIS probably would never find out.
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You have to assume the IOs do not read this forum or other forum like this. If they want to leanr how to screw applicants, they
better learn from applicants who discuss how they can be screwed.
 
Vorpal said:
I definitely see your point, though. Granted, the IO can assume that the applicant went to college. However, with the overabundance of higher learning institutions, trying to locate the college where the applicant got his/her degree would be a challenge. For all the IO knows, the applicant may have received a degree by enrolling in an online program at an overseas college.
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The IO can simply ask.

IO: where did you go to collegse
the applicant: I went to XXX county community collge in XXX satte
IO: when was that
the applicant: 6 years ago
The IO: how come I do not see you have I20 in your A file. Did you file for I20?
the applicant: I don't remmeber etc
The IO: I am sorry I have to re-schedule this interview. Here I give you a N14 form. Please bring a copy of collge application
when you come to teh reschedule interview
 
Vorpal said:
Personally, I can't advocate lying about something as serious as claiming to be a U.S. citizen in writing. However, if the OP decided to do it anyway, the USCIS probably would never find out.
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Has anyone ever tried to search for suthings for famous people like Arnold Schwarzenegger? What if they did once claim to be a USC before they were naturalized?
 
WBH said:
I think you also miss the previous poster's point. Just because it is a seriosu matter so the OP is dead anyway even if he disclose it.
So let's forget about conscience for a while and there are only three things OP can do for practicaly reason

(1) Do not apply at all
(2) Apply but not disclose
(3) Leave this country.


Again I said forget about conscience for a while. If concience is that demanding, then the OP should just leave this country.
if one does not deserve to be naturalized, then one does not deserve to be a PR either.
Click to expand...
Conscience? I guess you don't realize the consequences of falsely signing a sworn declaration on the N-400 application.
Your argument for not disclosing it is based on your assumption that USCIS could not find out about it, since by disclosing it the OP would be denied anyways (which is not necessarily the case). This is flawed logic. The decision to disclose something potentially important on the application should be based on your legal obligation to do so, not on whether you think USCIS could find out or not.
 
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Bobsmyth said:
Conscience? I guess you don't realize the consequences of falsely signing a sworn declaration on the N-400 application.
Your argument for not disclosing it is based on your assumption that USCIS could not find out about it, since by disclosing it the OP would be denied anyways (which is not necessarily the case). This is flawed logic. The decision to disclose something potentially important on the application should be based on your legal obligation to do so, not on whether you think USCIS could find out or not.
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This issue has been discussed back and force enough and it is up to OP to decide. It is not directly my busineess nor yours. I don't think anyone has and will convinced another to change his position regardless whtaever his original posiiton is. The worst outcome of anything in this area is not getting the citizenship
and not keeping the green card. When that comes, most people will take it well

Talking about legal obligation, I think all undocumented aliens should just pack up and leave and who would listen? Sure someone leave but perhaps they think it is better for them to leave not because tehy are legally obliged to do so. If everyone does what he is obliged to do, you won't see this kind of posts.


Again, enough is said about this issue. Let the OP make his own decision. Whatever he will do is his own matter
 
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WBH said:
It is not directly my busineess nor yours.
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It is my business to advise against lying on an application as much as it should be your business to not tell someone to lie on their application.
WBH said:
Talking about legal obligation, I think all undocumented aliens should just pack up and leave and who would listen? Sure someone leave but perhaps they think it is better for them to leave not because tehy are legally obliged to do so. If everyone does what he is obliged to do, you won't see this kind of posts.
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Illegal aliens?? That's a terrible analogy to argue what an applicant should respond on a sworn document. Not at all the same thing.
 
Bobsmyth said:
It is my business to advise against lying on an application as much as it should be your business to not tell someone to lie on their application.
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I do not tell him what to do I only list all possible things Ithink he can possibly do. The OP will make his own decision. We will never kwno what decision he will make because he will not come back to share with us. Enough is said.
 
WBH said:
I do not tell him what to do I only list all possible things Ithink he can possibly do. .
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You've listed several possible things the OP can do. One of your suggestions involved the OP not disclosing a potential serious issue. In essence you're saying he can lie on his application without stating the possible consequences. Terrible advice.
 
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