Citizenship Denied: Please help me !!!

[GrassRoot]

Thank you for the good job, Copper1 !

Very confused about the following paragraph from your thread:

'...You may also lose your US citizenship if you withheld information or misled the USCIS or INS when becoming a permanent resident. If within five years of becoming a permanent resident, the USCIS finds out that you withheld information from them or misled them in order to obtain your green card, the USCIS may also strip you of your US citizenship. Of course, after five years from becoming a permanent resident, the only way the USCIS would be able to take away your US citizenship would be if you withheld or misrepresented yourself during the naturalization process. .."

So the paragraph means after 5 years after becoming GC holder, CIS has no way to strip your USC or GC even that GC was obtained by fraud ? A lots of example proved otherwise. This is the first time to hear this " 5 years " bar.

 

[copper1]

Thank you for the good job, Copper1 !

Very confused about the following paragraph from your thread:

'...You may also lose your US citizenship if you withheld information or misled the USCIS or INS when becoming a permanent resident. If within five years of becoming a permanent resident, the USCIS finds out that you withheld information from them or misled them in order to obtain your green card, the USCIS may also strip you of your US citizenship. Of course, after five years from becoming a permanent resident, the only way the USCIS would be able to take away your US citizenship would be if you withheld or misrepresented yourself during the naturalization process. .."

So the paragraph means after 5 years after becoming GC holder, CIS has no way to strip your USC or GC even that GC was obtained by fraud ? A lots of example proved otherwise. This is the first time to hear this " 5 years " bar.

Yeah, I agree, I know a couple of years ago they found out that some really old naturalized USC guy was in German army from the Natzi era amd and they were going to strip his citizenship and deport him.

 

[LolaLi]

Where did you pop up from? We appreciate your positive advise regarding this matter but here is what I have to say, if you cannot go to COP after GC then you can never go even after citizenship. what's the difference? Now why can't they revoke your citizenship on basis of fraud? Seems like no one really talks abbout that. I am firm with my opinion due to my experiences. Althought I have not travelled back home but I was never a primary asylee as my mother had filed for asylum, although my GC states As6. I was 17 when I came here and now 11 years later I will go back if I have to. There is no law against it. Times have changed, I have changed and Govt has changed.

Where is everyone getting the idea that one's citizenship cannot be revoked? It most definitely can be revoked and not just because you were a Nazi or terrorist , etc. If CIS proves in court that you got your GC due to fraud, that automatically nullifies all benefits you derived from your status as a PR - including citizenship. In other words, if it is determined your Asylum case was fraudulent, they will strip your citizenship because your GC would have been obtained fraudulently and without a GC - how can you be a citizen. Make sense? I've seen it happen folks - so this isn't just from my head.

Although I feel for this person - I am glad this happened because for months I've come back to see discussions of people returning back to their COP. And to clarify the issue further - regardless of whether or not you have a GC - you are still an Asylee and the rules apply. Think about it for a second... If how we get our GCs isn't so important, they wouldn't have classifications right there on the card. Just like folks who get their GCs via employment have certain rules they must adhere too - like staying with the sponsoring employer for a minimum of 1year after they get the GC, we Aslyees have rules we must stick to. Mainly - not going back to the COP under any circumstance - UNTIL we become US Citizens.

 

[14ksusha]

Where is everyone getting the idea that one's citizenship cannot be revoked? It most definitely can be revoked and not just because you were a Nazi or terrorist , etc. If CIS proves in court that you got your GC due to fraud, that automatically nullifies all benefits you derived from your status as a PR - including citizenship. In other words, if it is determined your Asylum case was fraudulent, they will strip your citizenship because your GC would have been obtained fraudulently and without a GC - how can you be a citizen. Make sense? I've seen it happen folks - so this isn't just from my head.

Although I feel for this person - I am glad this happened because for months I've come back to see discussions of people returning back to their COP. And to clarify the issue further - regardless of whether or not you have a GC - you are still an Asylee and the rules apply. Think about it for a second... If how we get our GCs isn't so important, they wouldn't have classifications right there on the card. Just like folks who get their GCs via employment have certain rules they must adhere too - like staying with the sponsoring employer for a minimum of 1year after they get the GC, we Aslyees have rules we must stick to. Mainly - not going back to the COP under any circumstance - UNTIL we become US Citizens.

Allow me disagree. You are free to travel anywhere you want once you are a PR. You are in a different category now. There is no such a rule in the immigration rule that says that you are not allowed to travel back to your COP once when you are a PR. Even if you are an asylee, traveling back to your COP 'does not immediately indicate fraud. These visits will be carefully examined to determine the nature of visits. For example, visiting a sick member doesn't constitute fraud' (this is from USCIS website)

Taking away your citizenship is a rare and very difficult task for INS. There is no way they will take a citizenship from you for visiting your COP, they simply legally CANNOT! I worked in the immigration court where this type of case first would be heard before heading to a higher court. In eight years, there was never such a case! I also just chatted with a friend , who is an IJ in SAN Francisco, and he also reiterated that legally he cannot take away anybodys citizenship because of past visits to COP.

The poor fellow who got his citizenship denied, just had a bad luck that day. The officer didn't like him, so he decided to make his life a bit miserable. He should apply in ten months again and register with selective service beforehand .

 

[copper1]

Allow me disagree. You are free to travel anywhere you want once you are a PR. You are in a different category now. There is no such a rule in the immigration rule that says that you are not allowed to travel back to your COP once when you are a PR. Even if you are an asylee, traveling back to your COP 'does not immediately indicate fraud. These visits will be carefully examined to determine the nature of visits. For example, visiting a sick member doesn't constitute fraud' (this is from USCIS website)

Taking away your citizenship is a rare and very difficult task for INS. There is no way they will take a citizenship from you for visiting your COP, they simply legally CANNOT! I worked in the immigration court where this type of case first would be heard before heading to a higher court. In eight years, there was never such a case! I also just chatted with a friend , who is an IJ in SAN Francisco, and he also reiterated that legally he cannot take away anybodys citizenship because of past visits to COP.

The poor fellow who got his citizenship denied, just had a bad luck that day. The officer didn't like him, so he decided to make his life a bit miserable. He should apply in ten months again and register with selective service beforehand .

Thanks for sharing the info. That's what I have been trying to tell everyone. visiting COP is not a violation, if it were then you can never ever go back.

 

[cadel]

Where is everyone getting the idea that one's citizenship cannot be revoked? It most definitely can be revoked and not just because you were a Nazi or terrorist , etc. If CIS proves in court that you got your GC due to fraud, that automatically nullifies all benefits you derived from your status as a PR - including citizenship. In other words, if it is determined your Asylum case was fraudulent, they will strip your citizenship because your GC would have been obtained fraudulently and without a GC - how can you be a citizen. Make sense? I've seen it happen folks - so this isn't just from my head.

Although I feel for this person - I am glad this happened because for months I've come back to see discussions of people returning back to their COP. And to clarify the issue further - regardless of whether or not you have a GC - you are still an Asylee and the rules apply. Think about it for a second... If how we get our GCs isn't so important, they wouldn't have classifications right there on the card. Just like folks who get their GCs via employment have certain rules they must adhere too - like staying with the sponsoring employer for a minimum of 1year after they get the GC, we Aslyees have rules we must stick to. Mainly - not going back to the COP under any circumstance - UNTIL we become US Citizens.

I AGREE WITH YOU.What lot of folks don't want to understand is the fact that despite we're PR as any other PRs,uscis continues to allow as to apply for RTD.This means as PRs,we're still being considered as asylees.If this was not the case,we would not be anymore eligible for RTD !Uscis would say ok you're PRs now and you're no longer asylees and you don't need to apply for RTD anymore.Classification of Green card by category means something.If not it would make no sense on putting these codes down on Green cards.If you look on certificate of naturalization,there is no classification no matter where you're from with your Green card(Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong on this issue).

RD Aug 22,2001
Approved Sep 15,2005
GC received Sep 20,2005

 

[Minsk]

This issue has been discussed numerious times here, but the bottom line is that you remain being an asylee after adjusting to a PR status and you cannot visit COP just because you want to see your old friends and parents. However, there are some circumstances when one can visit COP and not being charged with the asylum case fraud. Sick parents is one of them. Period.

 

[guacho]

14ksusha

I agree with 14ksusha, maybe as a permanent resident USCIS can screw you if they want to, eventhough there is no law that prohibits green card holders travel to COP, but once you get citizenship ii would be imposible for USCIS to revoked your citizenship just because you travel to your COP when you had your green card.....

guacho

 

[14ksusha]

I AGREE WITH YOU.What lot of folks don't want to understand is the fact that despite we're PR as any other PRs,uscis continues to allow as to apply for RTD.This means as PRs,we're still being considered as asylees.If this was not the case,we would not be anymore eligible for RTD !Uscis would say ok you're PRs now and you're no longer asylees and you don't need to apply for RTD anymore.Classification of Green card by category means something.If not it would make no sense on putting these codes down on Green cards.If you look on certificate of naturalization,there is no classification no matter where you're from with your Green card(Anyone can correct me if I'm wrong on this issue).

RD Aug 22,2001
Approved Sep 15,2005
GC received Sep 20,2005

Cadel,

'you are allowed to apply for RTD' but you don't have to once you are a PR. Again, you are in a different category. Just like you can divorce your husband immediately after you get your green card. They will not take you GC away. Just like you can leave your job that has sponsored you after you get your GC. If you can and want obtain a NP while a GC AS06 holder, go ahead. While an asylee waiting to be adjusted, it is definitely not advisable to apply for NP, but you can if you really need to go to COp for emergency reasons. I think this topic is so beaten that we should wrap up this discussion that leads to nowhere.

 

[wantmygcnow]

Cadel,

'you are allowed to apply for RTD' but you don't have to once you are a PR. Again, you are in a different category. Just like you can divorce your husband immediately after you get your green card. They will not take you GC away. Just like you can leave your job that has sponsored you after you get your GC. If you can and want obtain a NP while a GC AS06 holder, go ahead. While an asylee waiting to be adjusted, it is definitely not advisable to apply for NP, but you can if you really need to go to COp for emergency reasons. I think this topic is so beaten that we should wrap up this discussion that leads to nowhere.

I agree with Cadel 100%. If you divorce your husband/wife after you get your GC, you can never become a Citizen. USCIS issues conditional green cards to spouses so that they just can't divorce their husbands/wifes after getting a gc...SO USCIS Looks out for that.

THe other topic you gave example of the job and getting another job. You are comparing apples and oranges. The crux of the matter is fraud and that's what USCIS looks for. If a marriage is a fake one or asylee is a fake asylee and never had fear....Employment green cards are totally different and the fraud level is already cleared out during the sponsor process...

Its great to fool ourselves or whoever want to visit their home country but the fact is that, you can get in trouble..because there is no clear cut law out there that says you are safe if you travel to COP if you were an asylee.

USCIS always leaves room for fraud and be careful.

 

[thankful]

So the paragraph means after 5 years after becoming GC holder, CIS has no way to strip your USC or GC even that GC was obtained by fraud ? A lots of example proved otherwise. This is the first time to hear this " 5 years " bar.

This is INCORRECT.

The 5 year provision is just one method of reversing a grant of lpr status. In the first five years the USCIS has the power to revoke status by itself without getting the immigration court involved. However they can always placed you into deportation proceedings before an immigration judge for fraud on the application. There is no time limit to this.

 

[hadron]

If you divorce your husband/wife after you get your GC, you can never become a Citizen.

I think the proper british expression describing this sentence is 'bollocks'.

Of course you can divorce after you obtain your unconditional GC. Just like changing jobs after obtaining GC it is a good idea to wait a couple of months, but I don't know where you go this nonsense from.

 

[wantmygcnow]

I think the proper british expression describing this sentence is 'bollocks'.

Of course you can divorce after you obtain your unconditional GC. Just like changing jobs after obtaining GC it is a good idea to wait a couple of months, but I don't know where you go this nonsense from.

To remove conditions on your GC, you need to show you are still married...then only you get an unrestricted GC for people married to USC...

To remove conditions, you have to show that you are still together. Only women are given consideration if they are abused...

Check it out Mr Bullocks!

Also more on employment here by a lawyer:

Permanent Residents are Not off the Hook Either!

Even people with approved permanent resident status (green cards) can be affected. If the green card was approved through a questionable company, and the beneficiary is still working there, it may be time to leave. This departure, and any allegations against the company that are proven to be true, can create problems when the applicant tries to naturalize (or sooner if the individual becomes part of the investigation). It is best to obtain as much documentation of the genuine nature of the particular case as possible, and the valid reason for terminating such employment. No one is expected to continue to work for a company that is clearly in trouble, but copies of news reports of problems should be retained in case they are needed. Other proof that the case was genuine, such as pay stubs, W-2s, schedules, eMails from the company, and other evidence of employment should be retained.

What Can You Do to Protect Yourself?

Anyone who is entangled in this type of situation with an immigration sponsor should retain all documentation that reflects innocence and/or lack of awareness of any (alleged) fraud in the case. It may be necessary to show that one is a victim, not a perpetrator. Any person who is found to have committed fraud to obtain an immigration benefit is subject to removal (previously known as deportation) from the United States and a permanent bar to reentry. Such documentation, therefore, is essential.

Conclusion

"Look before you leap" is the old adage and it works well when seeking a good company to work for and to sponsor one's immigration to the U.S.! We reiterate our advice at the Murthy Law Firm, given to those with labor substitution cases: "It is necessary to try to determine the reputation of one's sponsor." Of course, even previously reputable U.S. companies have had scandals. But many of these are not connected to immigration. When a company is offering immigration sponsorship for sale, however, and seems to be abusing the immigration system, red flags should go up and that employer should be avoided.

 

[14ksusha]

To remove conditions on your GC, you need to show you are still married...then only you get an unrestricted GC for people married to USC...

To remove conditions, you have to show that you are still together. Only women are given consideration if they are abused...

Check it out Mr Bullocks!

Also more on employment here by a lawyer:

Permanent Residents are Not off the Hook Either!

Even people with approved permanent resident status (green cards) can be affected. If the green card was approved through a questionable company, and the beneficiary is still working there, it may be time to leave. This departure, and any allegations against the company that are proven to be true, can create problems when the applicant tries to naturalize (or sooner if the individual becomes part of the investigation). It is best to obtain as much documentation of the genuine nature of the particular case as possible, and the valid reason for terminating such employment. No one is expected to continue to work for a company that is clearly in trouble, but copies of news reports of problems should be retained in case they are needed. Other proof that the case was genuine, such as pay stubs, W-2s, schedules, eMails from the company, and other evidence of employment should be retained.

What Can You Do to Protect Yourself?

Anyone who is entangled in this type of situation with an immigration sponsor should retain all documentation that reflects innocence and/or lack of awareness of any (alleged) fraud in the case. It may be necessary to show that one is a victim, not a perpetrator. Any person who is found to have committed fraud to obtain an immigration benefit is subject to removal (previously known as deportation) from the United States and a permanent bar to reentry. Such documentation, therefore, is essential.

Conclusion

"Look before you leap" is the old adage and it works well when seeking a good company to work for and to sponsor one's immigration to the U.S.! We reiterate our advice at the Murthy Law Firm, given to those with labor substitution cases: "It is necessary to try to determine the reputation of one's sponsor." Of course, even previously reputable U.S. companies have had scandals. But many of these are not connected to immigration. When a company is offering immigration sponsorship for sale, however, and seems to be abusing the immigration system, red flags should go up and that employer should be avoided.

Of course, you should keep all your documentation properly organized and be ready when USCIS questions you on your failed marriage. But once you are out of conditional status as a GC holder married to a US citizen, you have all the rights to become a US citzen even if you divorced your husband. Same with work, once you fulfilled the 7 year requirement of working for the same company that sponsored you, you can leave and be on your own. Where do you get your info from? Wanmygcnow, only in a legal setting you can prove that a case was fraud. Only with very strong supporting evidence. Thsi kind of legal dispute can go on for decades. If a spouse says she/he doesn't love her/his husband anymore right after getting her GC and getting out of conditional status, what is USCIS going to do? Insist she /he should love the him/her? Keep them as PR for the rest of their lives? Deport them for the reason of 'unability to keep a family together and love an American citizen'? Come on now, get your common sense back!

 

[14ksusha]

I agree with Cadel 100%. If you divorce your husband/wife after you get your GC, you can never become a Citizen. USCIS issues conditional green cards to spouses so that they just can't divorce their husbands/wifes after getting a gc...SO USCIS Looks out for that.

THe other topic you gave example of the job and getting another job. You are comparing apples and oranges. The crux of the matter is fraud and that's what USCIS looks for. If a marriage is a fake one or asylee is a fake asylee and never had fear....Employment green cards are totally different and the fraud level is already cleared out during the sponsor process...

Its great to fool ourselves or whoever want to visit their home country but the fact is that, you can get in trouble..because there is no clear cut law out there that says you are safe if you travel to COP if you were an asylee.

USCIS always leaves room for fraud and be careful.

WantmyGCnow,

You are talking nonsense. PLease read my e-mail below. Of course, you can become a US citizen after divorcing yoru husband/wife when a GC holder.

 

[wantmygcnow]

WantmyGCnow,

You are talking nonsense. PLease read my e-mail below. Of course, you can become a US citizen after divorcing yoru husband/wife when a GC holder.

Maybe I should have been clear. I meant after getting married to a USC and getting divorce is a red flag for fraud...Thats why USCIS issues 2 year conditional GC's to all spouses of USC. Once 2 years are over, you can apply for an unrestricted gc...If you tell them "oh yah the day i got my gc, I got a divorce the next day"...You really think USCIS will say "have a nice day, here is your unrestricted gc"????

Conditional GC was created for this sole purpose..

 

[guacho]

agree

WantmyGCnow,

You are talking nonsense. PLease read my e-mail below. Of course, you can become a US citizen after divorcing yoru husband/wife when a GC holder.

this is the situation, after you pass the interview you get a conditional GC and wantmygcnow is right, you can not divorce during the period you wait to get the unrestricted Gc which is two years, I have a friend who got the conditional and two years later she went to apply to get the new GC and it was denied because shortly before they divorce and he wanted to screw her...and he did.
BUT once you prove that you are still married and getting your unrestricted GC, you CAN divorce, of course you are not going to be so stupid of getting divorced the next day, but this happens all the time, you just wait 5 years to naturalize instead of 3.
There is nothing wrong with getting divorced once you get your unrestricted GC, shit happens and couples divorce everyday.

Guacho.

 

[wantmygcnow]

this is the situation, after you pass the interview you get a conditional GC and wantmygcnow is right, you can not divorce during the period you wait to get the unrestricted Gc which is two years, I have a friend who got the conditional and two years later she went to apply to get the new GC and it was denied because shortly before they divorce and he wanted to screw her...and he did.
BUT once you prove that you are still married and getting your unrestricted GC, you CAN divorce, of course you are not going to be so stupid of getting divorced the next day, but this happens all the time, you just wait 5 years to naturalize instead of 3.
There is nothing wrong with getting divorced once you get your unrestricted GC, shit happens and couples divorce everyday.

Guacho.

Ofcourse you can divorce but the crux of the conversation was divorcing after getting a GC or going to home country after getting a gc etc...fraud issue..

 

[guacho]

right

you are absolutely right, eventhough there is not writen law about that, is better not going right after you are aproved, you never know what kind of IO you are gonna have to deal with in the naturalization interview.

Guacho.

 

[hadron]

Once you have the unconditional GC, you can divorce your spouse or leave your employer. It is a good idea to wait a couple of months in order to pass the 'rapid sequence of events' test, but other than that there is no law tying you to your spouse or job (don't go from the condition removal interview to the county courthouse to file your divorce petition, wait 90 days and the goverment won't care).

Same with work, once you fulfilled the 7 year requirement of working for the same company that sponsored you, you can leave and be on your own.

What ??

No law like that, no AAO or court decisions to support this statement. There is no 7 year requirement.