*** Transcript of hearing is NOW attached - 9-24th Hearing ***

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Rajiv,

I have in my possesion pdf file I-485 Standard Operating Procedure . I don't remember where I got it. It's not up to date I believe (2001) but I thought you might be interested. Please let me know

Thanks for all your efforts.

A.
 
Thanks. I have it

thinkpad365 said:
Rajiv,

I have in my possesion pdf file I-485 Standard Operating Procedure . I don't remember where I got it. It's not up to date I believe (2001) but I thought you might be interested. Please let me know

Thanks for all your efforts.

A.
Click to expand...

We do have that.
 
ClevelandGuru said:
I read through the entire transcript. Rajiv really did a good job. The Judge also seems to be a really nice guy. The only concern the Judge has is that he doesn't want to interfere in how the CIS is run. He wants us to prove that the CIS is breaking the law. The court also wants to know what is the relief that we are expecting.

Here is what I want.

1. After 180 days of filing, the applicant should be in par with a green card holder. There should be no restriction in employment changes. The green card should be approved soley based on the employment history before the 180 days. This can be done by CIS without any big changes and it could be done within the AC21 law.

I would like to know what relief Ravij has proposed.
Click to expand...


I agree with you about the relief you have proposed. Six months of work with the sponsoring emplyer in the same job should be enough but I dont have much hope that this is going to happen.
 
Rajiv, of course we cannot ask uscis to approve certain cases first. However, we could for sure ask uscis to follow the court ruling. for example as many folks have pointed out, employment based cases should be processed within six months otherwise the applicants are free to move to the next jobs, etc. I think it's a very reasonable relief we can/should request. Please DO NOT WALK AWAY WITHOUT ASKING FOR RELIEFS after we have put in so much time and effort.

what's your proposed relief?
 
The minimum relief to ask for would be to treat all cases in the order of their receipt. How does it make any sense for a Californian to get 485 in 3 months while those from other service centers to wait for two years? A couple of months here and there is understandable but three months and two years, who are you kidding?
 
hrithikroshan11 said:
The minimum relief to ask for would be to treat all cases in the order of their receipt. How does it make any sense for a Californian to get 485 in 3 months while those from other service centers to wait for two years? A couple of months here and there is understandable but three months and two years, who are you kidding?
Click to expand...

hrithikroshan11,
Im not sure why you are particulary harsh on californian about 485 getting
approved in 3 months. Not everyone in California is so lucky to get approved in 3 months and only handful of cases are done so.

To set the record straight, SFO DOL is currently processing RIR cases filed in Feb 2003, whereas Denver DOL is processing RIR cases filed in Aug 2004, and New York DOL processing cases May 2004. Is there a explanation that why CA is behind everyone by 1.5 years in LC processing ? Eventhough it doesnt make sense for waiting 3 years for LC approval in CA, but what can we do ?

It will be better for everyone not to attack each other and focus our effort on improving the processes. At LC stage or 485 stage, delay exists for everyone in US and there is no state in US where you will get everything done by less than 6 months.
 
Like the posts earlier said,
let us ask for freedom to join another company after six months
of applying I140/I485.

that would free us from a hell of a lot of stress.
 
Please don't take it personally. The comparison between 485 dates in different service centers was to point the inconsistencies among different service centers.

It is not that only Californians have had to wait for LC, even the people from east coast like NY and NJ have had to wait for two to three years to get the labor. That is not the point. The point is why the inconsistencies and to make all service centers perform equally else everyone will be flooding the service center that is performing better than others.

The government has been claiming that they approve cases in first in first out basis. But that theory is thrown to pieces if you consider the fact that some cases are getting approved in three months while others have been pending for more than couple of years. How can you or government or the court justify that?
 
perumpulli said:
hrithikroshan11,
Im not sure why you are particulary harsh on californian about 485 getting
approved in 3 months. Not everyone in California is so lucky to get approved in 3 months and only handful of cases are done so.
Click to expand...

Let's not get this to personal levels. The basic truth is CIS is applying the rules haphazardly and randomly without a set process. No one wants to take advantage of anyone. Just to be fair, the applications should be processed in an order that doesn't delay older applications. I guess freedom is everyones right and should not be selected on random order.
 
CSC clearly announced that they are trying a 'New Pilot Program' which will enable the cases to be approved in less than 90 days provided they meet certain conditions ( EB2 / Concurrent Filing / No issue at FP etc).

They also mentioned that based on the success of the program, it will be expanded to other centers. Now we are in the middle of the program and thats why we are seeing some gets approved in 3 months.

I would suggest everyone to wish the 'Pilot Program' a great success so that
it motivates INS to expand it to other centers.

On the Same token, the INS has set up 'Backlog Reduction Centers' in PA and not in CA. I believe when they introduce a new program, they randomly pick a center. So it might appear that the people in the particular center will have a slight advantage over others due to this.

Im repeating my earlier stand that everyone has to wait atleast 3 years to get his Green card and doesnt matter one state approves LC faster than others. The process has to improve on the whole.
 
ClevelandGuru said:
I read through the entire transcript. Rajiv really did a good job. The Judge also seems to be a really nice guy. The only concern the Judge has is that he doesn't want to interfere in how the CIS is run. He wants us to prove that the CIS is breaking the law. The court also wants to know what is the relief that we are expecting.

Here is what I want.

1. After 180 days of filing, the applicant should be in par with a green card holder. There should be no restriction in employment changes. The green card should be approved soley based on the employment history before the 180 days. This can be done by CIS without any big changes and it could be done within the AC21 law.

I would like to know what relief Ravij has proposed.
Click to expand...

Rajiv.
I think that every one more or less agrees with the above (quoted) suggestion regarding what relief we should seek.
 
Discrepancy in 485 processing dates between 4 centers

As of Oct 6 2004,
CSC is processing Nov 2003, whereas VSC, NSC and TSC are stuck in 2002.
Can we use this in our case ?
 
perumpulli

you are again just looking at your case which is probably filed using the pilot program. the processing date in california is nov 2003 while in other service centers it is still 2002. that is a big inconsistency not to take into account the pilot program cases that are getting approved so fast.

think how you would feel if your 485 was filed in feb 2002 at NSC and it was still pending. please stop saying that the total time to get gc is still 3 years. people in new york have waited 3 years for their labor and now if they have to wait so much longer to get their 485, their total wait time is like 5 or more years. do you really think it is reasonable? dont u think that those guys will feel frustrated to see cases filed in california getting approved in less than a year?
 
hrithikroshan11 said:
perumpulli

you are again just looking at your case which is probably filed using the pilot program. the processing date in california is nov 2003 while in other service centers it is still 2002. that is a big inconsistency not to take into account the pilot program cases that are getting approved so fast.

think how you would feel if your 485 was filed in feb 2002 at NSC and it was still pending. please stop saying that the total time to get gc is still 3 years. people in new york have waited 3 years for their labor and now if they have to wait so much longer to get their 485, their total wait time is like 5 or more years. do you really think it is reasonable? dont u think that those guys will feel frustrated to see cases filed in california getting approved in less than a year?
Click to expand...

Just to clarify, my case is still waiting in the SFO DOL for the last 3 years, so please dont assume that my case has been approved by pilot program or something.

If you talk about frustration, how about some states are approving LC in 6 months whereas we are waiting for more than 3 years for the same ? We cannot do anything about it. Instead of getting angry with people whose cases are moving forward, let us support Rajiv's effort who is trying to improve the system so that everyone will be benefitted.
 
Exactly, the biggest issue is the inconsistencies in all steps of GC process.

Since this hearing is for 485, doesn't it make sense to point the issue of inconsistencies in processing on 485 at various service centers? It is a big plus point for this lawsuit since the only thing in 485 is the security check which takes few days at most.

Then why keep files in closets in some service centers without even touching them?
 
EAD Until Green Card is approved Or Temporary Green Card

Best Temporary Relief:
EAD Until Green Card is approved Or Temporary Green Card after 180 days.

Solid Point to prove USCIS is not proccessing cases on a first come first serve. There are lot of cases to prove this. - Is this not sufficient?


How can they run a Pilot program to approve recently filed cases, while there are lot of pending cases? -

Why don't they Run Pilot Programs to approve the Backlog Cases?
 
Dear Rajiv,

Is it possible to point the VAST inconsistencies in processing of 485 at various service centers? It is extremely bizzare.
 
Ask CSC to help out with 485 cases in other centers

Can we ask the judge to ask CSC to share the workload of the other 3 centers which are laggging behind in 485 cases?

This will help reduce discrepencies between the 4 centers.
 
Some salient points

After reading the transcript and the discussions on this thread, I am still not sure of a few things. Here's the situation as I see it... I will appreciate any comments


From the Judge's perspective
======================
There are 3 things

1) Commonality of cases and was there a justifiable harm done- I am pretty sure this is a straight forward issue, there is a commonality, all the people that filed 485 have suffered immensly from delays.

2) Did USCIS break any law - I am not too sure about this point. From a pure legal perspective.... did they break any law?
a) Is there a law that mandates that they are supposed to process cases in any particular order?
b) Is there a law that mandates that all service centers MUST be at same processing time frames?
c) Is there a law that dictates that they MUST process I-485 applications within a certain time frame?​

Unfortunately for us, I believe the answer to the above three questions is NO. Even if we look at it in the light of AC-21, there really is no provision for penalizing USCIS for not fulfilling the 180 day "guideline". In this case, even though our position is morally, ethically right... do we have a strong argument from a LEGAL perspective ? I don't know.

3) Finally, we come to the relief part. Everyone on this forum has read and understood the judge's reluctance in dictating the USCIS on their operations... or in other words, he does not want to run the organization. In that case, will our demand of "being on par with green card holders in 180 days or getting an EAD till green card" hold any water? I am not too sure... because... again, who will oversee the compliance of this ? Definitely not the judge. What if the court passes a ruling and the USCIS does not comply ? will the judge have to take steps to ensure that it is done ? This I feel is our weakest position... because no matter what relief we ask, we are in essence requesting the judge to run the organization.


These are just my thoughts and worries. I do not have the answers to any of the questions. But I feel we MUST ask ourselves these hard questions and help Rajiv prepare the appropriate answers before we take the next steps.

regards
BacklogBlues
 
Discrepency between the 4 centers

Can we send email to Ombudsman /someother INS official to request CSC to share the load of the other 3 centers?

Maybe, this discrepency in speed is a USCIS ploy to break the "class" in the case against them ( a case of divide and conquer)
 
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