Purpose of N-470

K

ketanco

Banned
I have a green card. Say a large usa based company offers me a position in a foreign country. As far as using N470:

A) When you are abroad working for the US based firm, if you enter to the usa before 180 days of max. absence period expires and stay a week and go back, do you not need the N470 anyway, because its only purpose is to eliminate the 180 day requirement?

OR

B) its purpose is to make the absence days count as presence days as far as continuous residency?

I am asking because I am offered a position like that, but I do not meet one of the requirements of N470, which is a 1 year uninterrupted presence after getting green card - a 2 weeks trip breaks that for me. But if the purpose of N-470 is like in the first case, then I will come back in less than every 180 days anyway so it means I do not need it.

Please do not give generic answers such as I have to be in the usa as much as possible bla bla... I looked for a job in the usa like crazy after getting laid off due to crisis but no success, just reply to the specific question, case A or case B - if you know it. Thanks for your time...
 
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The N-470 is used to retain your continuous residency requirement for any time spent outside the US working for a US company. This includes moving to a foreign country to work for US company and returning to US just under 6 months and shortly afterwards going back to foreign country.
The N-470 is not used to make absence count as physical presence. Physical presence and continuous residence are two different things.
 
Bobsmyth said:
The N-470 is used to retain your continuous residency requirement for any time spent outside the US working for a US company. This includes moving to a foreign country to work for US company and returning to US just under 6 months and shortly afterwards going back to foreign country.
The N-470 is not used to make absence count as physical presence. Physical presence and continuous residence are two different things.
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Okay, based on what you say, then even if I dont have N470 and work for a US firm abroad, but enter to the US in less than every 6 months, then am I not also keeping my residency? so isnt it the same thing like having N470 approved if I do that?

I am not eligible for N470 due to uninterrupted presence requirement. (a 2 week holiday breaks it!!:mad:) However is it still okay - or subjectively might be okay to the immigration officer during time of iterview - that I go ahead and accept the position from the US company since it is a US company? It is a very good position from the largest US firm in its field and i really couldnt find any job in the US for a long time since they laid me off due to economic crisis. I keep all the job rejection emails. If i take this position, I will enter before 180 days anyway all the time and will satisfy 30 month requirement in the end. I mean I am basically doing the same thing working for a us company abroad with or without that form... I keep ties to the US too such as my stuff being in the storage that I par rent for, my car, my bank accounts credit cards mailing address etc....
 
ketanco said:
Okay, based on what you say, then even if I dont have N470 and work for a US firm abroad, but enter to the US in less than every 6 months, then am I not also keeping my residency? so isnt it the same thing like having N470 approved if I do that?
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If you don't have N-470, then any back to back trips of under 6 months can be seen as break in continuous residency. With an approved N-470, you wouldn't have to worry about having to prove continuous residency for such trips if the IO makes it an issue at your interview.
 
ketanco said:
I am not eligible for N470 due to uninterrupted presence requirement.
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Are you sure about that?

The uninterrupted year in the US can be any consecutive 365 days since you became a permanent resident. And it includes time in US territories like Puerto Rico or US Virgin Islands. Many people think it is the first year, or the last year prior to applying for the N-470, or a calendar year, but it is none of those. Think it over carefully, it is possible you might have done that year if you look at all possible 365-day periods since becoming a PR.
 
Jackolantern said:
Are you sure about that?

The uninterrupted year in the US can be any consecutive 365 days since you became a permanent resident. And it includes time in US territories like Puerto Rico or US Virgin Islands. Many people think it is the first year, or the last year prior to applying for the N-470, or a calendar year, but it is none of those. Think it over carefully, it is possible you might have done that year if you look at all possible 365-day periods since becoming a PR.
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Yes I am sure, I totally understand what u r saying. Trust me I did consider every combination....
 
Bobsmyth said:
If you don't have N-470, then any back to back trips of under 6 months can be seen as break in continuous residency. With an approved N-470, you wouldn't have to worry about having to prove continuous residency for such trips if the IO makes it an issue at your interview.
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So without the N470, the fact that a large US based corporation sending me abroad, doesn't help at all??? (also considering the only reason of not getting N470 is a two week vacation interrupting 365 days and my absences are still under 180 days...)
 
ketanco said:
So without the N470, the fact that a large US based corporation sending me abroad, doesn't help at all??? (also considering the only reason of not getting N470 is a two week vacation interrupting 365 days and my absences are still under 180 days...)
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It terms of continuous residency, being employed by a large US company overseas is not considered proof of maintaining US residency ties.
 
Bobsmyth said:
It terms of continuous residency, being employed by a large US company overseas is not considered proof of maintaining US residency ties.
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But the very same thing becomes perfectly fine if you have the form N470?? What a nice set of rules!! Plus they don't even care that I waited totally in the USA for 8 years before getting the green card...
 
ketanco said:
But the very same thing becomes perfectly fine if you have the form N470?? What a nice set of rules!! Plus they don't even care that I waited totally in the USA for 8 years before getting the green card...
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Correct, since the purpose of N-470 is to retain continuous residence requirement for naturalization purposes. And as you indicated, any time waiting for GC does not count towards requirements for naturalization.
 
Bobsmyth said:
Correct, since the purpose of N-470 is to retain continuous residence requirement for naturalization purposes. And as you indicated, any time waiting for GC does not count towards requirements for naturalization.
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I see. well i will still talk to an immigration lawyer about this but i think i will do it anyway - still keeping absences below 180 days. if an officer is reviewing these with myself during an interview, I will explain him/her the situation and hope he or she understands...does this sound like a hopeless situation which i will almost certainly get a denial? (i will also have at least 30 months presence overall)
 
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You're not currently maintaining a residence (ie paying rent/mortgage, utilities) in the US, correct? Keeping your belongings in storage does not equate to maintaining a US abode. Without having strong US residency ties, it's pretty much hopeless to apply in 20 months when you become eligible with the current and future travel pattern required with the prospective US employer.
 
well correct, but actually i have a car in the usa too which i am paying the insurance continuously and i have a mailing address as well... i agree with you it seems a little too much considering the future pattern too... hope IO will understand that the only reason that i wasnt able to get a N470 was a 2 week trip in 365 days.... may be i should apply for N470 anyway just for the record and they will be the ones who deny it just because of that and during the interview the IO will look at it fairly....
 
ketanco said:
well correct, but actually i have a car in the usa too which i am paying the insurance continuously and i have a mailing address as well... i agree with you it seems a little too much considering the future pattern too... hope IO will understand that the only reason that i wasnt able to get a N470 was a 2 week trip in 365 days.... may be i should apply for N470 anyway just for the record and they will be the ones who deny it just because of that and during the interview the IO will look at it fairly....
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A denied N-470 and employment rejection emails is not something that would make an IO consider your more fairly.
Also, if you're not maintaining a US abode (not simply a mailing address or car insurance), then you won't even meet basic district residency requirement, let alone continuous residence, if you apply in 20 months.
 
Eligibility for N470

I have got my GC in July 2010.
Between July 2010- Dec2011 I have visited Toronto,Canada for just 1 day to view Niagara Falls in September,2010.
I have also visited Alaska(US state) in July 2011 by ship where boarding was again in Canada.
Will I be eligible for N470?
Does visiting Canada / just boarding in Canada port also cause interruption for US stay of 1 full year?
Will I be eleigible for N470? Please advise.
 
saiblessus said:
I have got my GC in July 2010.
Between July 2010- Dec2011 I have visited Toronto,Canada for just 1 day to view Niagara Falls in September,2010.
I have also visited Alaska(US state) in July 2011 by ship where boarding was again in Canada.
Will I be eligible for N470?
Does visiting Canada / just boarding in Canada port also cause interruption for US stay of 1 full year?
Will I be eleigible for N470? Please advise.
Click to expand...

You should probably have started your own new thread for this but anyway, here goes.....

Yes you disrupted your uninterrupted stautorily mandated one-year period BUT IF you have been in the U.S. since July 2011, a new full year has accumulated already (you posted in October 2012), therefore so what? What is the real question here?
 
BigJoe,
Thanks for your reply. Sorry for not mentioning my travel in 2012. I know post 2011 December timeframe I will not be qualified because I went to India in Dec 2011 and went to Europe in June 2012. So my only option left is time frame between June 2010 to Nov 2011 . Alaska is a US state but still ship gets boarded only from Vancouver,Canada because of which we flew to Canada and boarded there. We haven't stayed in Canada though. So I am confused on how USCIS looks at this?

Unfortunately we were never aware of this N470 & its conditions before. Else we would have planned better :(


July 2010: Got GC
Aug 2010: Visited Canada for a day
July 2011 : Boarded ship to Alaska from Vancouver,Canada
Dec 2011: India for 4 weeks
Jun 2012: Visited Europe
 
On that cruise to Alaska, were you processed by the Canadian immigration authorities, or did you stay in some kind of in-transit zone in between leaving the aircraft and boarding the ship?

I would think that if you were only in transit in Canada on the way to Alaska, it wouldn't count as leaving the US. But I don't know the official interpretation of that in the context of N-470.

Another interesting question is whether partial days outside the US break the 1-year continuity for N-470 purposes. The N-400 instructions say you should not list trips of under 24 hours, and you should count partial days in the US as full days in the US. So if your trip to Niagara Falls was less than 24 hours, thereby the trip would be unlisted on your N-400 and those partial days in the US would counted as full days for the N-400, but does that also apply to the N-470? I don't know. But I think that would be less likely than being able to have your in-transit stop in Canada NOT counted against you.

What are your options if you don't think your N-470 will be approved? Would you take the assignment abroad anyway? If you'll take the assignment anyway, go ahead and apply and see what happens, then consider the possibility of appealing or cutting your assignment short if denied. But if your decision to take the assignment is based on whether you can get the N-470 approved, consult an immigration lawyer before applying. They may be able to find a court case or USCIS document that establishes it one way or the other.
 
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I was in Vancouver for just 8 hours during my transit to Alaska. But in Vancouver airport we went thru immigration where they verified our GC and stamped in the passport the date we entered Vancouver.

While visiting Toronoto,Canada as we drove in car, the immigration officer at the border just verified our GC's and didn't stamp anything in our passports. But we have stayed for 2 nights so I might not be lucky here.

I hope they have some instructions like <24 hrs similar to N-400 which will help us to forgive my vancouver visit.
I read the instructions for N-470 where it states "we have to list the absence from US to countries(including Mexico,Canada) no matter how short."
Do we have any other source where we can get further more details on the N470 instructions?

The assignement abroad is unavoidable and hence trying my best to preserve our GC which we have received after long wait and huge battle :(.

One more thing.. if I file for N470 do you suggest to list my both visits to Canada no matter whether stamped in passport.
 
Hi saiblessus,

This is a really helpful information, did you show Canada visits in the N470 application ? did you get your N470 approved ?
 
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