Non RIR Discussion Only !

vexlak · Oct 17, 2006

labordrags said:
RIR
Filing applications Mail in for processing of Form ETA 750 application for alien employment certification and prevailing wage determination optional, with each SWA using its own form

Processing time Varies by region (e.g., about 25+ months in Region VI)

Involvement of SWA Prevailing wage determination and preliminary review

Period of recruitment Pattern of recruitment within 180 days of filing

Number of ads Pattern of recruitment - No minimum specified, but ultimately 2 became acceptable, if other recruitment efforts. Print ads required and increasingly DOL requesting at least 1 additional form of recruitment.

Special requirements Limited number of skill requirements accepted (e.g., computer language, operating system, etc.)

Alternative experience requirements Yes

Business necessity justifications Limited

Include job duties in ads Not required

Include employer name in ads Not required

Include wage in ads Not required

Include job site in ads Yes

Okay to require experience gained with predecessor employer or related company Limited

Ability to reject candidates unable to satisfactorily perform job offered Yes

Wage offer 5% of prevailing wage or higher

Revocation of certified applications

Impact of recent lay-offs Discretion of DOL

Results of recruitment Employer letter describing the recruitment effort and summarizing the results of recruitment, but without the reasons for each rejection

Include resumes of job applicants No. Retain for audit.

THANK YOU!
This is one of the best information!
In other words, (just to be sure) have a three recruiting ads placed one every two/three weeks. Resumes and interviews for add responders have to be processed by your employer not the BEC. Again read between the lines!

File for the conversion.

gptexan · Oct 17, 2006

labordrags said:
RIR
Filing applications Mail in for processing of Form ETA 750 application for alien employment certification and prevailing wage determination optional, with each SWA using its own form

Processing time Varies by region (e.g., about 25+ months in Region VI)

Involvement of SWA Prevailing wage determination and preliminary review

Period of recruitment Pattern of recruitment within 180 days of filing

Number of ads Pattern of recruitment - No minimum specified, but ultimately 2 became acceptable, if other recruitment efforts. Print ads required and increasingly DOL requesting at least 1 additional form of recruitment.

Special requirements Limited number of skill requirements accepted (e.g., computer language, operating system, etc.)

Alternative experience requirements Yes

Business necessity justifications Limited

Include job duties in ads Not required

Include employer name in ads Not required

Include wage in ads Not required

Include job site in ads Yes

Okay to require experience gained with predecessor employer or related company Limited

Ability to reject candidates unable to satisfactorily perform job offered Yes

Wage offer 5% of prevailing wage or higher

Revocation of certified applications

Impact of recent lay-offs Discretion of DOL

Results of recruitment Employer letter describing the recruitment effort and summarizing the results of recruitment, but without the reasons for each rejection

Include resumes of job applicants No. Retain for audit.

Hello LaborDrag,
thx for this wonderful info. Can u pls send me link of the sourec of this info, I need to show it to my HR. My HR is saying that as part of recruitment effrots, he has to put the ad in newspaper, company website, company premises and other website such as monster, careerbuilder etc. From your quote, it does not looks like that we have to put it on monster or careerbuilder etc.

Pls let us know the link.

isingh786 · Oct 17, 2006

Thanks Vexlak

You may be correct. However, please consider that the major holidays are approaching and I am very skeptical that any, or very limited amount of TR will be processed in near future. Mainly because I believe that the BEC has no fast system how to process the TR. It appears that they mastered the RIR. That is why they are asking to convert. And with the piling number of conversions (including mine), the TR will be left in the dust. That is my theory but I may be wrong.
__________________

Hi Vexlak,

Thanks for the prompt answer!!!

I can see that your PD is only one week from being current, if you are in EB3...Are you planning to do the RIR conversion?

TIA

balasam · Oct 17, 2006

how about TR cases that made it to the region ??

hello,
my priority date is Apr '04 and after recruitment was completed, the application was sent to the region in Nov 04. If it is now sitting in PBEC, any insight on what priority these would come under ? It is EB2.

I'm hoping these would be right behind RIRs, but would like to know what else is remaining after recruitment in the BEC processing ?

thanks.

fastergcwanted · Oct 17, 2006

This is what my lawyer is saying.....moroooons don't want to work but wait for others to do it before they move their aaaasssses..

"Your interest and excitement regarding this is completely understandable.
We have already had one round of discussions with <EMPLOYER> to discuss
the announcement and <EMPLOYER> is discussing this internally to look at
the feasibility of moving forward. Given that the announcement is very
recent, we anticipate that it will be a little while before we start seeing
the pattern of how the BEC is handling such requests. We will certainly
keep you advised of the steps to move forward."

From what I know my employer has been doing lot of recruitment for several different positions and they should already have the pattern of recruitment in last several months...this is why it's even more frustrating.....

Any advise on how to convince him to proceed now????

labordrags · Oct 17, 2006

fastergcwanted said:
This is what my lawyer is saying.....moroooons don't want to work but wait for others to do it before they move their aaaasssses..

"Your interest and excitement regarding this is completely understandable.
We have already had one round of discussions with <EMPLOYER> to discuss
the announcement and <EMPLOYER> is discussing this internally to look at
the feasibility of moving forward. Given that the announcement is very
recent, we anticipate that it will be a little while before we start seeing
the pattern of how the BEC is handling such requests. We will certainly
keep you advised of the steps to move forward."

From what I know my employer has been doing lot of recruitment for several different positions and they should already have the pattern of recruitment in last several months...this is why it's even more frustrating.....

Any advise on how to convince him to proceed now????

Show how much money you are pulling for them, and make them think that if you leave, they will nothing but lose the money they are generating from you. Prove them that you are an integral part of the company, and without you they it is hard for them to survive. Press them that if the supervised recruitment ever been received by BEC would lead them in publishing ad in more than few circulation, and lead them to believe that BEC would be keeping their eyes for future recruitment for the same company.

labordrags · Oct 17, 2006

gptexan said:
Hello LaborDrag,
thx for this wonderful info. Can u pls send me link of the sourec of this info, I need to show it to my HR. My HR is saying that as part of recruitment effrots, he has to put the ad in newspaper, company website, company premises and other website such as monster, careerbuilder etc. From your quote, it does not looks like that we have to put it on monster or careerbuilder etc.

Pls let us know the link.

No, it is not necessary to post ad in either Monster or Dice or Carrerbuilder. Find your local newspaper and publish 2 Sunday ad in month apart, followed by 15 days wait to show that the enough recruitment effort being conducted, which will suffice RIR requirement plus one ad in their website will be enough. I had it save the info in my PC from long time, I am not sure where did I receive it. I will search more on DOL website to see if I can come up with the guidelines.

labordrags · Oct 17, 2006

balasam said:
hello,
my priority date is Apr '04 and after recruitment was completed, the application was sent to the region in Nov 04. If it is now sitting in PBEC, any insight on what priority these would come under ? It is EB2.

I'm hoping these would be right behind RIRs, but would like to know what else is remaining after recruitment in the BEC processing ?

thanks.

Your case would be treated as RIR instead of NON RIR as the initial ad requirement being already followed of which SWA forwarded your application after determining the prevailing wage to the Region. Did you check the online Publich Disclosure System to see the status of your application, also sending 7th year H1 extension email would generate the screen-shot of your final determination. Good Luck.

labordrags · Oct 17, 2006

vexlak said:
THANK YOU!
This is one of the best information!
In other words, (just to be sure) have a three recruiting ads placed one every two/three weeks. Resumes and interviews for ad responders have to be processed by your employer not the BEC. Again read between the lines! File for the conversion.

Sure, no problem, I am glad that I can help you out. In other words, 2 Sunday ad in month apart, and 1 company website ad will be plenty to show the RIR pattern is followed. I would encourage to go for conversion as I am doing it too. Good luck to all.

bharatpremi · Oct 17, 2006

labordrags said:
RIR
Filing applications Mail in for processing of Form ETA 750 application for alien employment certification and prevailing wage determination optional, with each SWA using its own form

Processing time Varies by region (e.g., about 25+ months in Region VI)

Involvement of SWA Prevailing wage determination and preliminary review

Period of recruitment Pattern of recruitment within 180 days of filing

Number of ads Pattern of recruitment - No minimum specified, but ultimately 2 became acceptable, if other recruitment efforts. Print ads required and increasingly DOL requesting at least 1 additional form of recruitment.

Special requirements Limited number of skill requirements accepted (e.g., computer language, operating system, etc.)

Alternative experience requirements Yes

Business necessity justifications Limited

Include job duties in ads Not required

Include employer name in ads Not required

Include wage in ads Not required

Include job site in ads Yes

Okay to require experience gained with predecessor employer or related company Limited

Ability to reject candidates unable to satisfactorily perform job offered Yes

Wage offer 5% of prevailing wage or higher

Revocation of certified applications

Impact of recent lay-offs Discretion of DOL

Results of recruitment Employer letter describing the recruitment effort and summarizing the results of recruitment, but without the reasons for each rejection

Include resumes of job applicants No. Retain for audit.

The way to go man labordrags !!! Concise and good info requiring single glance. Thanks.

labordrags · Oct 17, 2006

gptexan said:
Hello Gang
LaborDrags has posted some valuable info on what kind of recruiting can be done to convert to RIR. If anybody has a link that supports this info, it will be highly appreciated. LaborDrags is finding this info at his end but if anybody comes up with it, pls post.

My lawyer and HR manager wont get satisfied with the info unless it is substantiated with a credible link. I am sure it will be the same for lot of us.

This is what I have found in this website.
http://www.immigrationlinks.com/news/news1314.htm

RIR requirements:
one print advertisement in a newspaper of general circulation or a relevant journal,

plus

enough other activities to show evidence that a pattern of recruitment has been completed to adequately test the labor market for the occupation of the subject application. These may include a combination of:

job order with the state workforce agency

internal company recruitment activities

company and commercial internet web page ads (this was I was talking earlier)

Community, college or other job fairs

private employment agency

additional print advertisements (this was I was talking earlier)

GOOD LUCK ALL.

indianpresent · Oct 17, 2006

AJB - Indeed posting's PD

Hi Guys,
Just talked to my attorney about the TR-RIR conversion. He completely agreed that this is a way to go but he gave me another info which is shocking. He is getting some recruitment instruction and and he read to me some PDs for my info.

May-2002(more than one)
March-2003(2 of them)

Now, if PBEC is not following FIFO at all how do you think you can go ahead with a conversion process when you are not sure if by luck PBEC picks up your appliaction for AJB posting ?

I decided not to pursue TR-RIR conversion unless DOL comes back again, which I think they will if they are desperate abt clearing the appliaction.

Thanks.
MA-EB3/TR/June-04

vexlak · Oct 17, 2006

indianpresent said:
Hi Guys,
Just talked to my attorney about the TR-RIR conversion. He completely agreed that this is a way to go but he gave me another info which is shocking. He is getting some recruitment instruction and and he read to me some PDs for my info.

May-2002(more than one)
March-2003(2 of them)

Now, if PBEC is not following FIFO at all how do you think you can go ahead with a conversion process when you are not sure if by luck PBEC picks up your appliaction for AJB posting ?

I decided not to pursue TR-RIR conversion unless DOL comes back again, which I think they will if they are desperate abt clearing the appliaction.

Thanks.
MA-EB3/TR/June-04

I am sensing that your attorney is giving you a BS story. Look at mine PD or check the tracker and you will see what the reality is...

epidural · Oct 17, 2006

indianpresent said:
Hi Guys,
Just talked to my attorney about the TR-RIR conversion. He completely agreed that this is a way to go but he gave me another info which is shocking. He is getting some recruitment instruction and and he read to me some PDs for my info.

May-2002(more than one)
March-2003(2 of them)

Now, if PBEC is not following FIFO at all how do you think you can go ahead with a conversion process when you are not sure if by luck PBEC picks up your appliaction for AJB posting ?

I decided not to pursue TR-RIR conversion unless DOL comes back again, which I think they will if they are desperate abt clearing the appliaction.

Thanks.
MA-EB3/TR/June-04

NO F#$^#ing FIFO . I Guess they are having different tracks based on states too. So the people in the backlogged states like NY/NJ are again F@#$%ed. I think indianpresent's lawyer is saying the truth. How on earth otherwise could we see ad's posted for MA,DE,FL and today one for TN. These states were processing cases well into 2003. So people like vexlax NY/4/28/2001 and me NJ/4/30/2001 wont have a clue when we will get our ad posted.

BruceWillis · Oct 17, 2006

Hi ,

Your attorney is possibly lieing. Can you request him for the P-\D- number.

We can search for the ad.

The BEC's inefficiency in executing is the one that is hurting. In my opinion they never had any idea of what was ahead of them. Even now(after finishing data entry) they may not be clear about where they are in terms of realistically estimating their pace of work.

They are not ignoring any states as far as I can see. They just are salivating and gyrating towards anything that will make their job easy.

-Bruce.

indianpresent said:
Hi Guys,
Just talked to my attorney about the TR-RIR conversion. He completely agreed that this is a way to go but he gave me another info which is shocking. He is getting some recruitment instruction and and he read to me some PDs for my info.

May-2002(more than one)
March-2003(2 of them)

Now, if PBEC is not following FIFO at all how do you think you can go ahead with a conversion process when you are not sure if by luck PBEC picks up your appliaction for AJB posting ?

I decided not to pursue TR-RIR conversion unless DOL comes back again, which I think they will if they are desperate abt clearing the appliaction.

Thanks.
MA-EB3/TR/June-04

hingo · Oct 17, 2006

http://murthyforum.atinfopop.com/4/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=1024039761&f=4694050912&m=4971084831

bidme_786 · Oct 18, 2006

Got advertising instructions!!

I got a call from my attorney today and he said he received a letter from PBEC about my advertising instructions. In the letter PBEC mention to complete my recruitment by Oct 27th. The detail instructions for advertisement are mention in the letter. I ask him to fax me the letter which he is going to do tomorrow. My PD is March,2003. EB3/Non-RIR from MD.

I just did the search for the ad on America's Job Bank for my PD and PBEC did place the ad for my position.

indianpresent · Oct 18, 2006

I do not think he is lying. May be he is. But once he told me that he got some instruction, I asked him to read some PDs which he did. I can not ask him the P/D number.. I hope you are right, in that case AILA is going to bring this conversion issue again b4 BEC. Any idea when is the next meet ?

BruceWillis said:
Hi ,

Your attorney is possibly lieing. Can you request him for the P-\D- number.

We can search for the ad.

The BEC's inefficiency in executing is the one that is hurting. In my opinion they never had any idea of what was ahead of them. Even now(after finishing data entry) they may not be clear about where they are in terms of realistically estimating their pace of work.

They are not ignoring any states as far as I can see. They just are salivating and gyrating towards anything that will make their job easy.

-Bruce.

so_depressed · Oct 18, 2006

This is unbelievable!!!!!!!!!! How come they still do this after all applications are in their darn system already!!!! I mean, good for you, but we have PD of 2001 and early 2002! Gosh, I hate DOL, I hate DOL, ................

bidme_786 said:
I got a call from my attorney today and he said he received a letter from PBEC about my advertising instructions. In the letter PBEC mention to complete my recruitment by Oct 27th. The detail instructions for advertisement are mention in the letter. I ask him to fax me the letter which he is going to do tomorrow. My PD is March,2003. EB3/Non-RIR from MD.

I just did the search for the ad on America's Job Bank for my PD and PBEC did place the ad for my position.

NJ-TR · Oct 18, 2006

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