Getting lost now. You just told me I am inadmissible and now o.k. with both. Plz clear it. I am taking your words as words from bible.
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Non-citizen with two possibe misdemeanor. Can I apply for naturalization ?
- Thread starter Fool_PR
- Start date
Getting lost now. You just told me I am inadmissible and now o.k. with both. Plz clear it. I am taking your words as words from bible.
You GC cannot be revoked. You are OK with naturalization. But you might have (or will have) a problem entering US after absence of more than 180 days.Getting lost now. You just told me I am inadmissible and now o.k. with both. Plz clear it. I am taking your words as words from bible.
Always a good choice. The only problem with lawyers is The old adage goes like this, "The man with one watch knows what time it is. The man with two is never sure",I would hire an immigration lawyer and get advice from him/her.
come tsuciall
No, I had never been out of the country more than 180 days. probbaly i will never need to unless if they deport me as you said earlier.
Have you been absent from US for more than 180 days in a row?
No, I had never been out of the country more than 180 days. probbaly i will never need to unless if they deport me as you said earlier.
I would hire an immigration lawyer and get advice from him/her.
I already hired an attorney and he is eager to apply for naturalization right now. But you know lawyer = liar. He will get some money from me if he starts the process. Later he will just say me sorry if I get deported. On the other hand You won't get anything from me other than best wishes if you give me good advice. In this case I would trust you more than a lawyer.
They would not admit you after a prolong absence, longer than 180 days. They would not deport you otherwise.No, I had never been out of the country more than 180 days. probbaly i will never need to unless if they deport me as you said earlier.
Always a good choice. The only problem with lawyers is The old adage goes like this, "The man with one watch knows what time it is. The man with two is never sure",
That is what i have found. Kinda scared when all the lawyers who are just after money. hard to trust any of them with life.
They would not admit you after a prolong absence, longer than 180 days. They would not deport you otherwise.
Thanks for you good advice. you always show light at the end of the tunnel, but also aware me about the devils of darkness
Jackolantern
Registered Users (C)
I already hired an attorney and he is eager to apply for naturalization right now. But you know lawyer = liar. He will get some money from me if he starts the process. Later he will just say me sorry if I get deported. On the other hand You won't get anything from me other than best wishes if you give me good advice. In this case I would trust you more than a lawyer.
If you approach an attorney with the intention of having them actually help you through the naturalization process, they have a monetary incentive to have you go ahead apply even if the deportation risk is high.
So get rid of that attorney, and arrange a one-time consultation with another. Let the next attorney know you only want a legal opinion about your chances of approval and the risk of deportation, and then if you apply you'll apply on your own. That way, they're only getting a fixed amount from you for the one-time consultation, without the idea that they can profit if you apply, so you have a better chance of getting an honest opinion.
If you approach an attorney with the intention of having them actually help you through the naturalization process, they have a monetary incentive to have you go ahead apply even if the deportation risk is high.
So get rid of that attorney, and arrange a one-time consultation with another. Let the next attorney know you only want a legal opinion about your chances of approval and the risk of deportation, and then if you apply you'll apply on your own. That way, they're only getting a fixed amount from you for the one-time consultation, without the idea that they can profit if you apply, so you have a better chance of getting an honest opinion.
Thanks. I did that too and they said it can be done but no 100% garuntee. but all of them agreed USCIS can not deport me. Even if UCIS wants to deport lawyers are sure that UCIS will lose in a Federal law suite. Now my question is I am o.k. with green card for now. Is it worth to go through all these trouble? your advice needed. thanks
Thanks. I did that too and they said it can be done but no 100% garuntee. but all of them agreed USCIS can not deport me. Even if UCIS wants to deport lawyers are sure that UCIS will lose in a Federal law suite. Now my question is I am o.k. with green card for now. Is it worth to go through all these trouble? your advice needed. thanks
In this case it is probably worthwhile to schedule several one-time consultations with several different immigration lawyers to get their opinions. Try to find lawyer(s) that are on the AILA list - they are generally more reliable, http://www.ailalawyer.com/
Ask them specific questions regarding what might happen if you file for naturalization, and also about different scenarios if you travel broad (both for short periods and for periods over 180 days).
Regardless of what one may think about lawyers, they do provide professional advice which is more competent than what you get in an online discussion forum from a bunch of amateur strangers, such as myself and the other posters in this thread.
Having said that, my (admittedly unprofessional and strictly amateurish) take on the situation is that you should apply for naturalization and see what happens.
The 2009 3d circuit court case cited by raevsky, Garcia v. Attorney General of the United States
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-3rd-circuit/1143416.html
makes it clear that, given that the statute of limitations has expired and you did not conceal any relevant info during the GC application process, even USCIS decides now that your were granted the GC in error in 2002, they cannot deport you now and cannot revoke your GC status, as long as you remain in the U.S.
If you apply for naturalization now (provided you again fully disclose both the 1991 and the 2000 episodes), several outcome appear possible:
a) The IO adjudicating your N-400 will simply decide not to re-evaluate the validity of the decision to issue you a GC back in 2002. In that case your N-400 will almost certainly be approved, you'll become a U.S. citizen and your problems will be solved.
b) The IO adjudicating your N-400 will re-examine the decision to grant you the GC back in 2002 and decide that that decision was valid. This seems entirely possible to me, in part because we don't have all the relevant details of your case here and can't see the relevant court paperwork, but also because it may be that the IO will decide that the 2000 shoplifting episode did not constitute a conviction for immigration purposes, since no punishment was imposed by a judge or a court or a verdict and there was no guilty/no contest plea.
In that case again, your N-400 will almost certainly be approved, you'll become a U.S. citizen and your problems will be solved.
c) Worst-case scenario: The IO adjudicating your N-400 re-examines your GC case and decides that the GC was granted to you in error. Then your N-400 will presumably be denied on the basis that the initial GC was granted to you in error.
However, the denial of an N-400 application (even if it based on the finding that you never became a lawful permanent resident because of the 2002 error) will have no immediate effect on your GC status. GC can only be revoked in a separate hearing in front of an immigration judge. However, in view of the Garcia v. Attorney General decision cited above, they will not initiate the GC revocation and removal proceedings (and if they try, they'll lose), and you will get to keep your GC and remain in the U.S.
So you won't really be any worse off than you are now.
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Wether GC was granted in error or not, it is valid now and cannot be revoked any more.
Thy cannot deny your naturalization application because GC was granted in error, without revoking your GC; and they cannot revoke it.
They could try to find a reason to deny it on good moral character grounds, but they lack reasons for that.
I am pretty sure naturalization application has to be approved.
Thy cannot deny your naturalization application because GC was granted in error, without revoking your GC; and they cannot revoke it.
They could try to find a reason to deny it on good moral character grounds, but they lack reasons for that.
I am pretty sure naturalization application has to be approved.
In this case it is probably worthwhile to schedule several one-time consultations with several different immigration lawyers to get their opinions. Try to find lawyer(s) that are on the AILA list - they are generally more reliable, http://www.ailalawyer.com/
Ask them specific questions regarding what might happen if you file for naturalization, and also about different scenarios if you travel broad (both for short periods and for periods over 180 days).
Regardless of what one may think about lawyers, they do provide professional advice which is more competent than what you get in an online discussion forum from a bunch of amateur strangers, such as myself and the other posters in this thread.
Having said that, my (admittedly unprofessional and strictly amateurish) take on the situation is that you should apply for naturalization and see what happens.
The 2009 3d circuit court case cited by raevsky, Garcia v. Attorney General of the United States
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-3rd-circuit/1143416.html
makes it clear that, given that the statute of limitations has expired and you did not conceal any relevant info during the GC application process, even USCIS decides now that your were granted the GC in error in 2002, they cannot deport you now and cannot revoke your GC status, as long as you remain in the U.S.
If you apply for naturalization now (provided you again fully disclose both the 1991 and the 2000 episodes), several outcome appear possible:
a) The IO adjudicating your N-400 will simply decide not to re-evaluate the validity of the decision to issue you a GC back in 2002. In that case your N-400 will almost certainly be approved, you'll become a U.S. citizen and your problems will be solved.
b) The IO adjudicating your N-400 will re-examine the decision to grant you the GC back in 2002 and decide that that decision was valid. This seems entirely possible to me, in part because we don't have all the relevant details of your case here and can't see the relevant court paperwork, but also because it may be that the IO will decide that the 2000 shoplifting episode did not constitute a conviction for immigration purposes, since no punishment was imposed by a judge or a court or a verdict and there was no guilty/no contest plea.
In that case again, your N-400 will almost certainly be approved, you'll become a U.S. citizen and your problems will be solved.
c) Worst-case scenario: The IO adjudicating your N-400 re-examines your GC case and decides that the GC was granted to you in error. Then your N-400 will presumably be denied on the basis that the initial GC was granted to you in error.
However, the denial of an N-400 application (even if it based on the finding that you never became a lawful permanent resident because of the 2002 error) will have no immediate effect on your GC status. GC can only be revoked in a separate hearing in front of an immigration judge. However, in view of the Garcia v. Attorney General decision cited above, they will not initiate the GC revocation and removal proceedings (and if they try, they'll lose), and you will get to keep your GC and remain in the U.S.
So you won't really be any worse off than you are now.
Thanks. That is very detail. I actually can discuss with the lawyer with all the points you just metioned. Thanks. One thing I am certain travelling overseas with my GC is not very unsafe. I was stopped at the airport once, they reexamined my conviction records and said I am a free man. Also they told me they are putting a note that i had been re-examined at the airport, so should not to bothered again unless any new issues found. I travelled overseas after that without any incident.
One problem I have. I need to go to my home country. My dad is 89 and very sick.. probably he won't make this time. If i do not see him I may not be able to see him again. I could not go home after my mother died either because I applied for GC that time and was scared to leave USA while my case was pending. What you suggest me, can I take a very shot trip to say my dad good- bye who raised me and gave me food and shelter when I needed most? please advice.. whether it is safe.
very figard
Thanks. I believe you are right. But on the other hand I need to re-examine everything, have all the back-ups, have money reseve in a separate account so, even if I in a detention center for 2-3 years my houses are safe, my family can support themsevles and lawyers get their payments. Again as you think also UCIS is getting strict every year. Remember, how easy it was to get waivers 10-15 years ago? Now they are next to impossible to get. I think if I wait 20 years and then apply for naturalization it will be even more difficult. But before that I need to know more and need to prepare myself for the worst. You are always being great help. I am ever greatful to you.
Wether GC was granted in error or not, it is valid now and cannot be revoked any more.
Thy cannot deny your naturalization application because GC was granted in error, without revoking your GC; and they cannot revoke it.
They could try to find a reason to deny it on good moral character grounds, but they lack reasons for that.
I am pretty sure naturalization application has to be approved.
Thanks. I believe you are right. But on the other hand I need to re-examine everything, have all the back-ups, have money reseve in a separate account so, even if I in a detention center for 2-3 years my houses are safe, my family can support themsevles and lawyers get their payments. Again as you think also UCIS is getting strict every year. Remember, how easy it was to get waivers 10-15 years ago? Now they are next to impossible to get. I think if I wait 20 years and then apply for naturalization it will be even more difficult. But before that I need to know more and need to prepare myself for the worst. You are always being great help. I am ever greatful to you.
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Thanks. That is very detail. I actually can discuss with the lawyer with all the points you just metioned. Thanks. One thing I am certain travelling overseas with my GC is not very unsafe. I was stopped at the airport once, they reexamined my conviction records and said I am a free man. Also they told me they are putting a note that i had been re-examined at the airport, so should not to bothered again unless any new issues found. I travelled overseas after that without any incident.
One problem I have. I need to go to my home country. My dad is 89 and very sick.. probably he won't make this time. If i do not see him I may not be able to see him again. I could not go home after my mother died either because I applied for GC that time and was scared to leave USA while my case was pending. What you suggest me, can I take a very shot trip to say my dad good- bye who raised me and gave me food and shelter when I needed most? please advice.. whether it is safe.
Once you get arrest and/or convicted, your prints will be in the NCIC system. So when you enter the country, you will always be flagged for secondary inspections because your prints will show up. No way to get around this unless you get naturalized (where you are not required to be fingerprinted when you at a POE) or you get your conviction and/or arrest records expunged.
You should be able to leave/go. I mean you they let you in the past a few times so if you don't have any new arrests, CBP should let you in. Go see you your Dad.
Also, apply for you naturalization. I think you will get it.
Once you get arrest and/or convicted, your prints will be in the NCIC system. So when you enter the country, you will always be flagged for secondary inspections because your prints will show up. No way to get around this unless you get naturalized (where you are not required to be fingerprinted when you at a POE) or you get your conviction and/or arrest records expunged.
You should be able to leave/go. I mean you they let you in the past a few times so if you don't have any new arrests, CBP should let you in. Go see you your Dad.
Also, apply for you naturalization. I think you will get it.
Thanks. First almost everyone was against my idea for submitting naturalization application. Now everyone is supporting this. Are you guys become sympathetic to me? Please don't. Plz tell me what you think. It won't hurt my feeling. If I need to stay with green card I will, no big deal. My salary is more than 95% USA citizens. Live in the most expensive town in my sate. Happy with that. Need no more. If I can be citizen it is great because no reason to get scared of deportation. Can go outside of the country with my family , have good vacations. But I do not want to apply and then got screwed. I have a loving family and a loving kid whome I love more than my life. If I am in a deportation center for years or get deported my daughter is going to have a very difficult life. Never want to hurt my family. In last 15 years I have seen atleast 50 immigration lawyers. Trust me guys, none of them give a 100% honest answer as you do. I am counting on your each every word. You guys may not have a lot of law knowledge, but whatever you say, you say from heart. That what I count.
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13.4 Question of Meaningful Departure.
Prior to April 1, 1997, if a lawful permanent resident was believed to be inadmissible, you had to first make a determination whether his or her absence was “meaningfully interruptive” of permanent residence. This topic is the focus of a key court decision, Rosenberg vs. Fleuti, 374 U.S. 449 (1963), as well as Matter of Kane, 15 I&N Dec. 258 (BIA 1975) and Matter of Montero, 14 I&N Dec. 399 (BIA 1973). The IIRIRA amended section 101(a)(13) of the Act to codify into statute several of the issues addressed in Fleuti by defining the terms “admission” and “admitted”. A lawful permanent resident is NOT considered to be seeking admission unless the alien:
• has abandoned or relinquished that status;
• has been absent continuously for more than 180 days;
• has engaged in illegal activity after departing the U.S.;
• has departed under legal process seeking removal;
• has committed certain criminal offenses;
• is attempting entry without inspection; or
• has entered the U.S. without authorization by an immigration officer.
If you believe a lawful permanent resident may be inadmissible or no longer entitled to lawful permanent resident status, you must first determine whether the alien is seeking admission within the meaning of section 101(a)(13)(C). If you determine the returning resident is seeking admission, you should refer the alien for removal proceedings under section 240 of the Act as an alien inadmissible under section 212(a) of the Act. If you determine that the alien is not seeking admission, but may be deportable under section 237 of the Act, you may intiate removal proceedings under section 240 of the Act, charging the alien as deportable. Procedures for preparing for removal hearings and processing inadmissible LPRs are discussed in Chapters 17.6 and 17.10. This subject, especially issues involving possible abandonment or relinquishment of status, is a complex one, and may be resolved by the immigration judge during removal proceedings.
That is the reason you were allowed back to US - you were not seeking admission
That is the reason you were allowed back to US - you were not seeking admission
A very helpful info.
I am planning to hire criminal attorney for my dismissed case to find out all the necessary paper work about not having any conviction, dismissal, no judge order etc. So if UCIS thinks the other way atleast I can show them the detail papers on my support. I will try to find out that procecuter if he is still in service to see if I can get any written confirmation from him. The problem is there is no document about this case in the court. Even FBI or UCIS do not have any atterst record (I got that confirmation from UCIS and I have the FBI fingure print result too). God knows how much I can find out. But I am going to try my best.
For the convicted case I can not do much. I can ask for post conviction relief, but it may back fire. I am in touch with a criminal attorney for this case to see what can I do. I deposited the money long before police contact me on 1994. I wish I could get that reciept from that bank. But it is almost 18 years, I do not even know if that branch still exits. But I will try my best. Or ask the criminal attorney to find a way that this case at least looks better to UCIS. If I get some kind of a prove that I deposited the money before I was arrested the conviction will look little better though the outcome will be the same.
A long and expensive plan. This is not a plan from any immigration attorney rather after talking to you I decieded to do something by my own. After a few month I guess, I will know how much is possible. For now I am planning to hire two criminal attorney since they are in two different cities thousand miles apart. First Criminal case work, then if it looks good I will move to immigration paper work. Advice me guys if you like my idea. I need that. Without your advice I am nothing.