Born in Canada to US Parent

König said:
So, in 1970's there was no immigration control at the POE for children born in Canada to American mothers? What documents did her mother use to bring her to the USA?
Click to expand...

Yes, there must have been some immigration control to let them enter US. Maybe the same control let them get social security card. Maybe it was just a US citizen bringing her kids with a Canadian BC (and no passport). This could give the feeling of "all done". Maybe they saw the BC at POE, or maybe they just waved them off via a land bridge.

However, once the family entered US, got the SSNs, the barrier to correcting the status in terms of information availability were much higher than they are today. At the same time, I would think that the barrier to entry and getting SSN were lower than they are today. I know people who nowadays get ITIN used to get SSN quite easily in the 1990s. All it needed was proof of being legal in the country, even if on a non-employment visa. Go 2 decades back, and I expect the laws to be even less defined, and their implementations to be even more inconsistent.

I do not know what actually happened, or what exactly were the laws/controls in those days, this is just speculation based on what I am reading in this thread. Maybe they let the mom enter but go meet INS within 30 days and she forgot or neglected. All I am saying is that things were different.

BTW, not sure if your last question was for me or the OP, but I thought it needed a perspective.
 
sanjoseaug20 said:
However, once the family entered US, got the SSNs, the barrier to correcting the status in terms of information availability were much higher than they are today. At the same time, I would think that the barrier to entry and getting SSN were lower than they are today. I know people who nowadays get ITIN used to get SSN quite easily in the 1990s. All it needed was proof of being legal in the country, even if on a non-employment visa. Go 2 decades back, and I expect the laws to be even less defined, and their implementations to be even more inconsistent.
Click to expand...
Indeed, much of the blame goes the immigration and Social Security authorities for their excessively lax enforcement three decades ago. First, at the border the officer should have given the mother more questioning and instruction, upon noticing the Canadian baby with an American mother. They should have made the mental connection and figured the baby might be a US citizen, and told her to visit an immigration office or passport agency to verify and register the baby's US citizenship, because a Canadian birth certificate should not be used for a US citizen crossing the border.

Then the Social Security office was overly lax. 30 years ago they often didn't ask for immigration status, and if they did ask they often didn't care which type of status as long as it was legal, so people could get SSN with a tourist visa or Canadian passport. That enabled many illegal immigrants (who became illegal after entering legally) to obtain a SSN.

Then the DMVs were lax with checking immigration status before 9/11. Either they didn't ask for status at all, or they didn't care which status as long as it was legal. I have friends who obtained US licenses in the 1980's with a tourist visa.

If the above authorities did a better job of paying attention to immigration laws, we probably would have a few million less illegal immigrants here, and the OP's mother would have been forced or at least informed about doing something to register and organize her children's citizenship status. Unfortunately, they're going overboard these days, such as DMV's not recognizing a passport alone as proof of US citizenship, or granting permanent residents a license that expires in less than two years because their green card expires in less than two years.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Jackolantern said:
Indeed, much of the blame goes the immigration and Social Security authorities for their excessively lax enforcement three decades ago. First, at the border the officer should have given the mother more questioning and instruction, upon noticing the Canadian baby with an American mother. They should have made the mental connection and figured the baby might be a US citizen, and told her to visit an immigration office or passport agency to verify and register the baby's US citizenship, because a Canadian birth certificate should not be used for a US citizen crossing the border.

Then the Social Security office was overly lax. 30 years ago they often didn't ask for immigration status, and if they did ask they often didn't care which type of status as long as it was legal, so people could get SSN with a tourist visa or Canadian passport. That enabled many illegal immigrants (who became illegal after entering legally) to obtain a US passport.

Then the DMVs were lax with checking immigration status before 9/11. Either they didn't ask for status at all, or they didn't care which status as long as it was legal. I have friends who obtained US licenses in the 1980's with a tourist visa.

If the above authorities did a better job of paying attention to immigration laws, we probably would have a few million less illegal immigrants here, and the OP's mother would have been forced or at least informed about doing something to register and organize her children's citizenship status. Unfortunately, they're going overboard these days, such as DMV's not recognizing a passport alone as proof of US citizenship, or granting permanent residents a license that expires in less than two years because their green card expires in less than two years.
Click to expand...

I would not say it was only lax implementation. It was just a different world. Computers have connected us in so many ways it was not possible earlier - this has not only helped us, but also the government. Of course, no denying that there is some politics in terms of managing illegal immigration.
 
Just to clear a few things up.....my mother left shortly before her 19th birthday.....20 days to be exact. I told the immigration person this and still she didn't think there would be an issue, especially since my sisters N-600 was approved. My mother said all she showed was mine, my sisters and her birth certificate to get us into the country. This was a 23 year old woman with a toddler and an infant trying to leave her abusive husband. I think there may have been less controls then and her circumstance may have helped her get back into the country. My mother made some mistakes when she was young but who hasn't? First I was angry at her but I can't really blame her. My mother moved to Canada to be with a man she thought she loved. It didn't pan out for her. She brought my sister and I back to where her family support was and gave us a fabulous life. She did the right thing. Yes she could have made this easier for me, but her job raising me is done. She worked long hard hours as a waitress to put my sister and I through private school because she didn't want her daughters in the Boston Public Schools. I am now an adult and instead of placing blame I will sort this out.
 
confused11 said:
Just to clear a few things up.....my mother left shortly before her 19th birthday.....20 days to be exact.
Click to expand...
Did she take any trips back to the US in the couple of years after entering Canada at that age until right before your birth? Those days in the US can be added to her physical presence to make up the "5 years after age 14" requirement.

However, even if she did not have sufficient presence to confer citizenship at your birth, there are other rules that allowed children of US citizens to derive US citizenship after birth. The rules that were applicable before the Child Citizenship Act were a bit more restrictive than today's rules, but you probably would qualify under the old rules anyway if you didn't qualify at birth.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
confused11 said:
I am now an adult and instead of placing blame I will sort this out.
Click to expand...

Hi Confused. I think we are ok, but just wanted to mention it. Please do not see all discussion on this forum as a commentary (or judgement) on you or family. There are a lot of posters, moderators here ... not all perfect or all knowing. Many of the situations here are common, but some are uncommon and get into a discussion like this, and it is nothing to do with the poster, but the rare nature of the case.
 
I am not sure if she took any trips back between 1975 and 1977. I will have to ask her. I am sure she did. My mother is very close to her sister who is still alive and to her other sister and her mother who have since passed away. I can not imagine that she did not see them for a prolonged period of time. I think my saving grace here is that my sister who was only born 14 months after me in Canada had her N-600 approved under the same circumstances. My sister submitted the same paperwork I did. I can not imagine that her N-600 would be approved and mine would be denied. My mothers POE was Logan Airport in Boston. I have confirmed this with my aunt who picked her up at the airport. I also want to mention, my senior year of high school (1995) I took a trip to Cancun. I was let back in the country with both my birth certificate and my mothers. The officer at Logan never told me there was a problem either. He inspected the documents and let me back in. I am not sure if it was because I was still a student or what. So there was never any reason for any of us to believe I was not a citizen. The immigration office also told me that technically I am not a Canadian citizen because Canada doesnt have birth right citizenship. I am not sure if this is true and I really have no interest in finding out. I just want to make sure I have the documents to work and live as an American citizen.

I want to clarify that I did not think anyone was passing judgement on my mother. When I first found this out I was angry with her as well. I just wanted to explain why my anger has passed. I really appreciate all the comments and assistance I have received as a result of this forum.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I think your reasoning is sound, and if your sister, who was born after you was able to get a certificate of citizenship with that documentation it is likely you will do too. In particular if the number of years of presence in the US by your mother are met.

For the Canadian citizenship it is mostly the same as in the US, you were given wrong information, typically if you are born in Canada you are Canadian. You should apply for a Canadian passport too, there is nothing wrong with dual citizenship, and that's something you may be able to pass on to your children to broaden their opportunities. Just imagine yourself unemployed and without health insurance. At least in Canada they have universal coverage.
 
The OP is clearly a Canadian citizen (even more clearly than the American one ;) ). She can apply for a Canadian passport and Canadian citizenship certificate through the embassy just by presenting her birth certificate. Just like Huracan said, there is nothing wrong with being dual citizen, but it opens a lot of opportunities.
 
I do know that to be a dual citizen of Canada you do have to cross the border at least once a year to retain dual citzenship. My fathers brother lives here and has dual citizenship and has to follow these rules. I have no real desire to go to Canada once a year. And I haven't been there since 1979. Right now I am laid off and paying cobra for health insurance. I have never once thought of going to Canada because of my situation.
 
confused11 said:
I do know that to be a dual citizen of Canada you do have to cross the border at least once a year to retain dual citzenship.
Click to expand...
Research the latest laws on that. They changed that rule recently, so now you don't need to go back at any specific interval to retain Canadian citizenship. And they made it retroactive so you can recover citizenship that was lost years ago under the old rule.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I wouldn't be so dismissive about the Canadian citizenship. If you'd find yourself unable to make the COBRA payments and had some serious condition I would like to have the peace of mind of knowing that I could be treated in Canada under a quality health service. You know how things work here, unfortunately, one usually have insurance while healthy and employed. However if one falls sick then this usually leads to becoming unemployed and losing the insurance (no work, no income, eventually one can not keep up with insurance payments). Unless the health care reform takes care of this I think it is good to know that you have the choice or chance of being treated in another country.

As pointed out you are Canadian, and you don't need to travel to Canada to keep your citizenship and you have the choice of applying for a Canadian passport. You might also be able to pass Canadian citizenship on to your children and give them the opportunity of studying in quality public universities in Canada if prices become prohibitive in the US. It has nothing to do with your current effort on obtaining a certificate of US citizenship, or your loyalty to the US.
 
Huracan said:
If you'd find yourself unable to make the COBRA payments and had some serious condition I would like to have the peace of mind of knowing that I could be treated in Canada under a quality health service.
Click to expand...

Canadian health care coverage only kicks in after you establish Canadian residency ties (usually 3 months) so any notion of immediate access to Canadian health care as a backup for a serious medical condition is quickly squashed.
 
Bobsmyth said:
Canadian health care coverage only kicks in after you establish Canadian residency ties (usually 3 months) so any notion of immediate access to Canadian health care as a backup for a serious medical condition is quickly squashed.
Click to expand...

One can get emergency treatment here. I was thinking about long term illnesses like cancer, or liver disease or something chronic and long term. I know that this is not a solution for a sudden illness. It's just something that could be useful and life saving under certain circumstances. She might even appear in some Michael Moore movie in the future ;)
 
Depends on the province. Alberta for example gives you coverage from day one.

Bobsmyth said:
Canadian health care coverage only kicks in after you establish Canadian residency ties (usually 3 months) so any notion of immediate access to Canadian health care as a backup for a serious medical condition is quickly squashed.
Click to expand...
 
Bobsmyth said:
Coverage is based on residency, so unless you plan to move to Alberta permanently and sever your US residency ties you won't be covered.
Click to expand...
Which is what a Canadian with a long-term health condition is likely to do if they have no US health insurance.
 
I am aware of that, but in Alberta you can go to the ministry of health and say I am moving permanently to Alberta today. Coverage will start there and then :)

Bobsmyth said:
Coverage is based on residency, so unless you plan to move to Alberta permanently and sever your US residency ties you won't be covered.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top