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bad experience with RTD
- Thread starter KWOK008
- Start date
Did you travel to Greece without a Schengen visa?
No, I did not have any visa on my RTD, so the potential risk should be I was refused to fly to Greece, but I had no problem at all for this part. (Greece did require Schengen visa for RTD, I checked the website of Greek Embassy.)
Like I said earlier, there is supposed to be no border or passport control within Schengen area, so I am free to travel everywhere (Schengen country) in principle as long as I entered Germany. The only thing to my surprise is some officers at Berlin SXF airport waited at arrivals to unofficially check passengers' passport and visa, but I guess that is because the flight is from southern Europe and they try to screen some illegal immigrant out.
use the document posted to this link: forums.immigration.com/showthread.php?268046-documents-you-need-to-enter-or-leave-the-USA
It is an official DHS document.
That wouldn't work. Those stubborn airline agent will never bother to look at it. I tried, but they claimed that they only followed their own policy, regardless of what you can show them. I even asked them to check me in to the PHI flight first and I'll speak to immigration officer there if there were any problem, but was refused too. They told me if no passport, I would be sent back and they would be held responsible. And that day with US Airways was really crazy, I believe they really thought they were gonna lose their jobs if they let me in.
Also when I was in Athens, the agent also didn't listen to me, even I showed them the letter copy from German consulate. It was no use at all, they are not immigration officer, not a law practitioner, they won't listen to us.
Compliant channel
Found some useful info. Guys, when you have troubles traveling with RTD, maybe we should draw US government's attention.
Here're some good suggestions: on the bottom part of this webpage, it gave out several complaint channel with US Dept of Transportation and TSA.
airsafe.com/complain/complain.htm
-QUOTED-
Contacting the U.S. Department of Transportation
If your complaint involved a U.S. airline or a non-US airline operating in the United States, you may want to submit your complaint with the U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT). You can file a formal complaint in one of the following ways:
Fill out this online complaint form and have AirSafe.com evaluate your complaint. Depending on the details of your complaint, it may be forwarded to an appropriate public organization such as the NTSB, FAA, or DOT, or it may be published (with personal details removed) by AirSafe.com in FlightsGoneBad.com, in one of its other web sites, or in an AirSafe.com podcast.
Call the Aviation Consumer Protection Division at 202-366-0511 to record your complaint.
Submit your complaint to the Department of Transportation's Aviation Consumer Protection Division using their online form at airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/escomplaint/es.cfm. Note that the DOT form requests personal information that the AirSafe.com form does not ask. Specifically, the DOT form asks whether you are a passenger, relative of a passenger, a lawyer acting on behalf of a client, or a travel agency. The AirSafe.com form makes no such distinctions and does not request this kind of personal information.
Mail a written complaint to the following address:
Aviation Consumer Protection Division, C-75
U.S. Department of Transportation
1200 New Jersey Ave., SE
Washington, D.C. 20590
-QUOTE END-
Found some useful info. Guys, when you have troubles traveling with RTD, maybe we should draw US government's attention.
Here're some good suggestions: on the bottom part of this webpage, it gave out several complaint channel with US Dept of Transportation and TSA.
airsafe.com/complain/complain.htm
-QUOTED-
Contacting the U.S. Department of Transportation
If your complaint involved a U.S. airline or a non-US airline operating in the United States, you may want to submit your complaint with the U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT). You can file a formal complaint in one of the following ways:
Fill out this online complaint form and have AirSafe.com evaluate your complaint. Depending on the details of your complaint, it may be forwarded to an appropriate public organization such as the NTSB, FAA, or DOT, or it may be published (with personal details removed) by AirSafe.com in FlightsGoneBad.com, in one of its other web sites, or in an AirSafe.com podcast.
Call the Aviation Consumer Protection Division at 202-366-0511 to record your complaint.
Submit your complaint to the Department of Transportation's Aviation Consumer Protection Division using their online form at airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/escomplaint/es.cfm. Note that the DOT form requests personal information that the AirSafe.com form does not ask. Specifically, the DOT form asks whether you are a passenger, relative of a passenger, a lawyer acting on behalf of a client, or a travel agency. The AirSafe.com form makes no such distinctions and does not request this kind of personal information.
Mail a written complaint to the following address:
Aviation Consumer Protection Division, C-75
U.S. Department of Transportation
1200 New Jersey Ave., SE
Washington, D.C. 20590
-QUOTE END-
No, I did not have any visa on my RTD, so the potential risk should be I was refused to fly to Greece, but I had no problem at all for this part. (Greece did require Schengen visa for RTD, I checked the website of Greek Embassy.)
Like I said earlier, there is supposed to be no border or passport control within Schengen area, so I am free to travel everywhere (Schengen country) in principle as long as I entered Germany. The only thing to my surprise is some officers at Berlin SXF airport waited at arrivals to unofficially check passengers' passport and visa, but I guess that is because the flight is from southern Europe and they try to screen some illegal immigrant out.
Just because you, on a personal level make the assumption that "there is supposed to be no border or passport control within Schengen area" doesnt mean that there is no border patrol. I really don't know why you are "surprised" when you see border patrol checking visas and passports even within the EU countries. It has been stated many times in this forum that if you think you are being clever and sneaky and arrive in Germany and can think you can go anywhere without being stopped and scrutinized, you are sadly mistaken. You tried to circumvent the rules of Greece which explicitly state you need a visa to enter with RTD which was a big mistake. You entered Greece because you got lucky and no one bothered to check from Germany to Greece. You got into trouble when you tried to go back to Germany from Greece. A visa allows you entry AND exit from a country. Try overstaying your visa when you get one and see if any European countries just let you leave without any hassle. If you had gotten a Greek visa like you were supposed to and not tried to sneak in via Germany without a visa, you would not have had any of these issues. The airline agent would have seen your Schengen visa (Greek visa) in your RTD and you would have had NO problems going back to Germany. There would have been NO question by anyone that the Greek embassy/consulate had put a visa in a non-approved travel document.
You may have a valid complaint with US Airways and I would absolutely complain regarding that matter if it was me.
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I have to agree with ASSYLEE. I still think you have a valid grievance against US Airways, no doubt about that, but you shouldn't knowingly and intentionally break other countries' immigration laws just because there are fewer or no border checks. Remember, you are travelling with a United States Travel Document, and when you engage in illegal actions while abroad, you are encouraging those countries to drop visa free travel benefits to all US RTD holders, as well as making the US govt. look bad.
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These things happen. Its your responsiblity to print out things that says you can travel with a RTD. For example, I used to take a letter from German Embassy saying RTD doesn't need a visa...or a printout from USCIS website that RTD can be used as a passport.
Only way you can educate people is by educating them yourself. I would write a strong worded letter to US Airways and you should expect to be compensated(like a free ticket).
Want, I agree with you 100%. Since my personal goal is to make my flight, we cannot rely on the assumption that other people know how to do their jobs. If I want to get on the flight, I would make sure I am armed with all the ammo (metaphorically of course) that I need to make that plane including several copies of printouts from the respective agencies' websites.
Just because you, on a personal level make the assumption that "there is supposed to be no border or passport control within Schengen area" doesnt mean that there is no border patrol. I really don't know why you are "surprised" when you see border patrol checking visas and passports even within the EU countries. It has been stated many times in this forum that if you think you are being clever and sneaky and arrive in Germany and can think you can go anywhere without being stopped and scrutinized, you are sadly mistaken. You tried to circumvent the rules of Greece which explicitly state you need a visa to enter with RTD which was a big mistake. You entered Greece because you got lucky and no one bothered to check from Germany to Greece. You got into trouble when you tried to go back to Germany from Greece. A visa allows you entry AND exit from a country. Try overstaying your visa when you get one and see if any European countries just let you leave without any hassle. If you had gotten a Greek visa like you were supposed to and not tried to sneak in via Germany without a visa, you would not have had any of these issues. The airline agent would have seen your Schengen visa (Greek visa) in your RTD and you would have had NO problems going back to Germany. There would have been NO question by anyone that the Greek embassy/consulate had put a visa in a non-approved travel document.
You may have a valid complaint with US Airways and I would absolutely complain regarding that matter if it was me.
Yes, you are absolutely right. I don't think I will do it again.
I have to agree with ASSYLEE. I still think you have a valid grievance against US Airways, no doubt about that, but you shouldn't knowingly and intentionally break other countries' immigration laws just because there are fewer or no border checks. Remember, you are travelling with a United States Travel Document, and when you engage in illegal actions while abroad, you are encouraging those countries to drop visa free travel benefits to all US RTD holders, as well as making the US govt. look bad.
I agree with ASSYLEE too, but I was not aware of their visa requirement (Like ASSYLEE pointed out, my assumption was wrong) until I was back and started to study my real situation when you asked me the visa question. And there was no visa requirement for refugees indicated on US Greek Embassy web, finally I found it on their embassy website in UK. Anyway, I will try to do better homework next time on this kinda regulations.
Last edited by a moderator:
Oh I see, sorry about that. From your previous post I thought you knew about Greece's requirements beforehand. I didn't mean to judge you or anything, but in a way we're all in this together, so it's always a good idea to represent asylees and the US in a positive light when abroad.
I'm glad everything worked out for you and that you had a good trip! BTW there's a sticky thread in this forum about visa requirements for people traveling with a RTD. It's really informative and people keep it updated.
I'm glad everything worked out for you and that you had a good trip! BTW there's a sticky thread in this forum about visa requirements for people traveling with a RTD. It's really informative and people keep it updated.
To youngboy, it is okay. I totally understand your concern.
US Airways replied they would address this issue internally with the local manager and provided me with a $200 Voucher. I think I might ask them to share this issue with as many airports as they can, so that it could benefit the future RTD holders.
US Airways replied they would address this issue internally with the local manager and provided me with a $200 Voucher. I think I might ask them to share this issue with as many airports as they can, so that it could benefit the future RTD holders.
wantmygcnow
Volunteer Moderator
And the funny part in all of this story is that Greeks are the nicest in giving a schengen visa.
US Airways replied they would address this issue internally with the local manager and provided me with a $200 Voucher. I think I might ask them to share this issue with as many airports as they can, so that it could benefit the future RTD holders.
That was a good solution, though I expected a higher voucher amount.
Last year, I flew from LA to Oslo-Norway and I didn't have any problems. I checked my bags in LA at the auto-check in and I didn't even see an airliner personnel.Then from Oslo I flew to Venice (Just like a domestic flight) then I flew from Venice to Santorini (Just like a domestic flight also) then I flew from Venice to Frankfurt and Frankfurt to DC. (The only little problem: From Frankfurt to DC they announced my name through the speaker...and at the gate they wanted to make sure I had valid a valid RTD to fly back to America.
Ps: Just because you have a RTD it doesn't mean you are VISA FREE. At the immigration in Oslo, the immigration officer told me that "If you are from a country that doesn't need a visa, you wont need a visa. Now, JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE ONLY A RTD IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE VISA FREE , IF YOU ARE BORN IN A COUNTRY WHERE THEY NEED VISA, DONT BUY YOUR TICKETS AND GO TO THE AIRPORT BECAUSE THE AIRLINER PERSONNEL WONT LET YOU BOARD THE PLANE.
Ps: Just because you have a RTD it doesn't mean you are VISA FREE. At the immigration in Oslo, the immigration officer told me that "If you are from a country that doesn't need a visa, you wont need a visa. Now, JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE ONLY A RTD IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE VISA FREE , IF YOU ARE BORN IN A COUNTRY WHERE THEY NEED VISA, DONT BUY YOUR TICKETS AND GO TO THE AIRPORT BECAUSE THE AIRLINER PERSONNEL WONT LET YOU BOARD THE PLANE.