Who Is with the Latinos March-Please Vote

[lahoritamia]

Sam,
I did admitted that they broke the immigration laws, and did wrong coming to USA without inspection, and I honestly believe that if getting a visa was just a bit easier for a qualifying person, I know for sure that immigration laws where followed. As for legalization, this is going to be a long journey and many requirements to fullfill for a person to be able to qualify or even apply. We are not asking to be rewarded for breaking the immigration laws, but jet to be recognized as hard working human beings, and give us a chance to ammend what we did wrong. There is no way I feel stupid to do what it was correct (my dad stood in line for almost a day, rejected two times for "missing information"), but I do consider my self to be one of the lucky ones when I obtained my visa, I will be thankful to my dad forever. Yo tampoco tengo nada contra nadie, todos merecemos respeto!

They always use terms like "undocumented worker" or "without papers" - never "illegal alien". Why is that?

Maybe because, the term "alien" is used for outer space creatures as well. Honestly, I rather be called frijolero, mojado, ilegal. But then again we are in a freedom of speech country.
lahoritamia

 

[Suzy977]

I know that they are not doing the right thing, but when you have some much need, and you can not even afford to buy food for your family, or you have an ill family member and cannot pay for treatment, one goes to look for it. I do hope for a legalization, and I do feel that there is a lot of people out there that deserve it. It will not be easy, and for sure it will not be free. So this is going to be a good chance to identify the good ones from the bad ones, and do the appropriate with the ones that do not deserve to be here.

lahoritamia

There are a lot of people in Africa and in parts of Asia who eat once or twice a week and work much, much harder than Mexicans and they don't come here because they "have so much need"...but, well, is a little bit harder to cross the Atlantic or the Pacific than Rio Grande, right?

The Mexicans are not coming here because they are starving in Mexico, but rather because THEY CAN...people from every country over the world want to come over here, UK, Germany, Japan, Australia, etc...but only Mexicans and the ones coming through Mexico are the ones who cross the border illegally, why? because they can

I know it is an extremely small percentage of illegals who come from north or other avenues...but 99.9% are from Mexico and the majority are Mexicans.

 

[Xkuger]

I think we are to be blamed...

Well I busted my butt to get a H1 and went thru to get here legally and too so much crap from my IT employers to keep my GC alive, however that is way below the hardship that many of these other immigrants (illegals) go through.

Yes, they broke the law, many came in without papers. But we are to blame, see the border with Mexico, its a joke. I saw the minuiteman campaign, it clearly shows how washington and the lawmakers are so jilted. They are fights ghosts all over the world when you can walk in thru mexico with a WMD.

Fine the border was messed up, how did you allow them to get work. How did you let their children to enroll in school.

Worse he CEO's of large corp. happily exploited them when they got rich on cheap labor. Now they are asking for some right, you cannot now tun around and say "HEY GET OUT".

They are where they are because you didn't do enough.

I would say, get them an opportunity, Maybe a temperory worker VISA, maybe extendend period before you can get a GC as you did not get here legally, maybe citizenship possibily only after 20 years.

They are our problem because we ignored them and we shoudn't have in the first place.

 

[Suzy977]

I would say, get them an opportunity, Maybe a temperory worker VISA, maybe extendend period before you can get a GC as you did not get here legally, maybe citizenship possibily only after 20 years.

Yeah sure...and after they get that GC, they will start screaming from the bottom of their lungs DISCRIMINATION...others get the Citizenship in 5 years and them, poor hard working discriminated people, have to wait 20 years

 

[Xkuger]

Oh come on now..

You cannot have the cake and eat it too....

You cannot compare yourself with everyone, You broke the law "No soup for you"

But look that the other scenario... we we made everyone Permenant residents overnight and made people citizens couple of years later. It just sets a bad example.

Now people know... hey why bother just get in and hang around, we all eventually become PR/Citizen's anyway.

Also we cannot ignore the problem, the numbers are growing they do stress the social system. Uncle sam's got to collect taxes...

 

[sam_c]

Well I busted my butt to get a H1 and went thru to get here legally and too so much crap from my IT employers to keep my GC alive, however that is way below the hardship that many of these other immigrants (illegals) go through.

Yes, they broke the law, many came in without papers. But we are to blame, see the border with Mexico, its a joke. I saw the minuiteman campaign, it clearly shows how washington and the lawmakers are so jilted. They are fights ghosts all over the world when you can walk in thru mexico with a WMD.

Fine the border was messed up, how did you allow them to get work. How did you let their children to enroll in school.

Worse he CEO's of large corp. happily exploited them when they got rich on cheap labor. Now they are asking for some right, you cannot now tun around and say "HEY GET OUT".

They are where they are because you didn't do enough.

I would say, get them an opportunity, Maybe a temperory worker VISA, maybe extendend period before you can get a GC as you did not get here legally, maybe citizenship possibily only after 20 years.

They are our problem because we ignored them and we shoudn't have in the first place.

Xkuger,

you have made good points. Of course, any new legislation that comes out will have to have something like this - a legalization path that has some penalties in it (like longer wait for GC/Citizenship) otherwise it will amount to amnesty and won't pass Congress. Also those who committed identity theft (and a lot of illegal people do so because they need to show SSN or get a driver's license) should face additional penalties. After all it's not fair to those whose identities were stolen.

I also completely agree with you that the Govt. has turned a blind eye mostly because the farming, construction and meat processing companies (amongst others) are benefitting from the cheap labor. It's modern day slavery.

Maybe because, the term "alien" is used for outer space creatures as well. Honestly, I rather be called frijolero, mojado, ilegal.

My point was why the Hispanic advocacy groups and their spokespersons don't use the word "illegal"... forget the "alien" part - I never liked that term myself.

Sam

 

[lahoritamia]

There are a lot of people in Africa and in parts of Asia who eat once or twice a week and work much, much harder than Mexicans and they don't come here because they "have so much need"...but, well, is a little bit harder to cross the Atlantic or the Pacific than Rio Grande, right?

Suzy977,
That might be right, but I'm sure if those people find an easy way to make it here, those would it be the next ones to blame? We are all looking for a better life, find a good opportunity here. But there's still people who come that way. Willing to pay a lot of money to be brought to USA. But that's is not our foult, I don't understand why americans keep blaming Mexico for the ilegal immigration, we come from all over the world, and for different reasons. And again just because all Latinoamericans look brown and Mexico just around the corner I does not meand that every brown skinned person comes from this country.

I know it is an extremely small percentage of illegals who come from north or other avenues...but 99.9% are from Mexico and the majority are Mexicans.

Out of that 99.9% you mention I'll say that about 30% is from the Mexican nationality, others claim to be Mexican just to be sent to the border, and not to be sent home(central america, south america) not to mention that some of the middle eastern people are brown skinned too.

Yeah sure...and after they get that GC, they will start screaming from the bottom of their lungs DISCRIMINATION...others get the Citizenship in 5 years and them, poor hard working discriminated people, have to wait 20 years

Legalization will be benefit all nationalities, it is not our foult that the system takes their time processing applications. Luckly the system have game a fair chance and I will be done for now in about a month. My naturalization process will take approx. three in a half months.
lahoritamia

 

[Suzy977]

Suzy977,
I don't understand why americans keep blaming Mexico for the ilegal immigration, we come from all over the world, and for different reasons. And again just because all Latinoamericans look brown and Mexico just around the corner I does not meand that every brown skinned person comes from this country.

We're blaming the Mexicans not because of the color of their skin (there you go, someone is trying again to play the race card ) but because of the colors of the flags waved at any demonstration.
To give you just a few "samples" look at the images attached bellow:



Out of that 99.9% you mention I'll say that about 30% is from the Mexican nationality, others claim to be Mexican just to be sent to the border, and not to be sent home(central america, south america) not to mention that some of the middle eastern people are brown skinned too.

The official numbers say that 6.5 millions out of 11 millions of illegals are from Mexico and another 2.5 millions are from South America.

The middle-eastern people don't speak Spanish and don't care much about the Mexican flag
And once again don't try to derail the conversation toward the "skin color/race" path...nobody cares about the color of the skin, if is brown, white, black, green or blue...it is about who are the illegals, and 6,5 millions out of a total of 11 millions are Mexicans...almost 60% of the illegals.


lahoritamia

 

[GreenCardVirus]

I have seen first hand recent demonstrations/protests. In my opinion they are nothing but show of "goon power". I get a feeling that they are trying to say "look, we are big and growing community now, you better watch out and give us what we want".

I saw a woman on TV shouting something like "this is our country, you took it away it from us". May be most of them feel this way but they are'nt insanely vocal. They got to understand one thing clearly - it takes immense power, both economic and military, to rewrite history. So they better take that "our country" feeling quickly, accept the facts, assimilate and feel part of the society.

 

[qili]

"we are big and growing community now, you better watch out and give us what we want".

the prison population is big and growing too. Should we give them what they want: let them out and run the government and enforce laws?

 

[qili]

Yes, they broke the law, many came in without papers. But we are to blame, see the border with Mexico, its a joke.

yeah, I agree with you. Our border is too inviting, our quality of life here is too tempting, our houses are just too nice, our women too pretty. How can you blame those guys for rapping your beautiful sisters and brothers and taking over your nice homes and robbing your thick wallets and driving your luxury cars. They are all just too inviting and irresistable!

We are to blame for enticing those poor criminals to commit numerous crimes against us!

We should be set to jail, not the criminals!

 

[sam_c]

yeah, I agree with you. Our border is too inviting, our quality of life here is too tempting, our houses are just too nice, our women too pretty. How can you blame those guys for rapping your beautiful sisters and brothers and taking over your nice homes and robbing your thick wallets and driving your luxury cars. They are all just too inviting and irresistable!

We are to blame for enticing those poor criminals to commit numerous crimes against us!

We should be set to jail, not the criminals!

I was going to post earlier about how it's good to see a mature discussion going on in this thread from both sides of the debate, without exaggerations, distortions and personal attacks. But then here comes your post!
Please! We are having a decent conversation here - no need to pollute it with such posts. Stick to the facts and make your points just like everyone else is making. OK?

Sam

 

[Suzy977]

I have seen first hand recent demonstrations/protests. In my opinion they are nothing but show of "goon power". I get a feeling that they are trying to say "look, we are big and growing community now, you better watch out and give us what we want".

I saw a woman on TV shouting something like "this is our country, you took it away it from us".
. So they better take that "our country" feeling quickly, accept the facts, assimilate and feel part of the society.

It is exactly what is happening.

And before I'm going to be accused again of racism, those are Mexicans. This a fact.
Everybody have seen the Mexican flags and...I've never heard a Salvadorian, or an Argentinian or an Ecuadorian or...any other individual from South or Central America claiming this is their land...only the Mexicans do that.

And this is their way to "take it back" by overpopulating it, and refusing to learn the language and assimilate as real American citizen.

And this is why they have to be deported (besides the fact that they are illegals) because if it is going to be an amnesty, they will not assimilate and become American citizen (when I say American citizen, I'm thinking of people who love America, respects its laws and are not attached to other country and its flag) they will just use the opportunity to bring more Mexicans (legally or illegally) and to achieve their dream, to overwhelm us by number.

 

[thanks2rajiv]

If you break the law, you are punished...Don't change the law to be rewarded !!!

I am completely against illegal immigration.

I am not sure why the government think us to be idiots. I read the section in immigration in http://www.whitehouse.gov. They are against amnesty but they would give GC and citizenship if you are here for certain years/employed etc. It is just a "slow amnesty".

If you break the law (and caught) you will be punished, be it, stealing or whatever. When thousands of people (all of whom have broken the law) stage a rally, they all should be caught and deported. It does not matter how long you live here....bottomline..break the law, get the punishment.

It does not matter whether you are from whichever part of the globe, color of the skin etc. Let's see if this goes into the thick heads of people who think otherwise (both inside and outside of the goverment).

Yeah, the immigration department is the worst and the most incompetent in the government. It has not changed over the years and I don't expect it to change for the next few years (sorry about the pessimism).

So all of you who have somehow illegally come to this great wonderful country ..Remember this.. you are ILLEGALS !!! You are legal from where you came. Don't demand that this is your country. IT IS NOT !!!!

In fact, I hope they make a law that people born here, whose parents (both) are illegal, will also be considered illegal.

What a cheap trick by the current government to get votes for a long time !!! Pathetic !!

 

[Miss.PinK]

I was going to post earlier about how it's good to see a mature discussion going on in this thread from both sides of the debate, without exaggerations, distortions and personal attacks. But then here comes your post!
Please! We are having a decent conversation here - no need to pollute it with such posts. Stick to the facts and make your points just like everyone else is making. OK?

Sam

I agree with you Sam. I'm reading everybody post. I luv' it how all can be so mature and not attacking anyone .. keep continuing this way will be highly appreciate it .. I can see both point of view. I compassionate with those illegal immigrant and don't know exactly "how hard" is their life with that kinda status (since I've never been in such status). .. but I also disagree if they can get "what we have" as legal resident, that easily (just by protesting) ...

but yeah .. whenever I read one post that against .. I agree with them ...
when I read the post that support .. I kinda agree too with them because .. I feel sorry too ..

so .. still end up with .. "cannot decide" whether to support or to against.

 

[Suzy977]

but yeah .. whenever I read one post that against .. I agree with them ...
when I read the post that support .. I kinda agree too with them because .. I feel sorry too ..

so .. still end up with .. "cannot decide" whether to support or to against.

This is why they (the anti American and pro Mexican illegals) are so loud because they need to "convince" people like you, who for some reason don't know the facts and are real easy to be fooled

 

[Miss.PinK]

I honestly do not think that my voice is count anyway. I'm not a citizen yet.

 

[Suzy977]

I honestly do not think that my voice is count anyway. I'm not a citizen yet.

They are not citizens too (moreover, they are ILLEGALS) and their voices are loud, so anybody can hear them...because they do whatever it takes to have their voices heard and to impose their demands.

 

[qili]

Please! We are having a decent conversation here - no

Sam

the idea that we, the victims of illegal immigration, are responsible for others committing illegal activities is so absurd that the only appropriate response is an absurd one.

 

[SlowJedi]

Don't Confuse To Separate Issues!!

I think the reason why so many people are on opposite sides of the issue is because they are trying to mingle and mix two issues that just don't belong with each other: (1) Legalization of illegal immigrants and integration of them into the society they've been serving for many years, and (2) granting them a citizenship or greencard.

(1) Status legalization - I'm completely for it. It's better for them because they don't have to look behind their shoulder all the time being afraid of cops, INS or overzealous morons from Border patrol, or worse yet: Texas militia. It's good for the US too, because most of Gringos here in San Diego don't want to go to pick strawberries but they all love to eat them. It's also good for the US because the government can now account for immigrants that are in the country.

(2) Should they be granted a greencard or citizenship just because they came here illegally and worked here for the last 10 years? ABSOLUTELY NOT! They should be legalized thru some type of a work visa, guest worker visa, and then they can apply for a GC and then citizenship following established timelines if they have been clean, no criminal records, and they can prove that they can support themselves once moving to a permanent status.

Why are those two issues mingled together? Legalizing illegal immigrant should NOT mean that they should go directly to citizenship or GC! These two issues should be looked at separately and solved separately. There are a lot of nuclear scientists, computer scientists, engineers, doctors, managers, who have been waiting to become permanent residents and citizens, why are they put on the same level play with those whose only accomplishment to date is to run really fast across the border? Imagine that their applications will be pushed back for years because the USCIS and FBI will now have to deal with an inflow of illegal immigrants who will be able to apply now too? I just don't think it's fair.


Think practically: Let's say you have a guy who works now for $3/hour, he doesn't pay taxes and he doesn't get anything from the government. Now you give him a Green Card, now his employer can not pay him $3/hr anymore because it's below minimum wage, so the guy gets fired. He trys to find a job, but the market is now overcrowded with the newly legalized greencard holders with no market skills, so he ends up unemployed or finds a low paying tem job that is not enough to support him and his family, so he immediately applys for wellfare, Section 8, SSI, Medicare and everything else that you are I have been paying for with our taxes. Now, the reason why he came here illegally in the first place because he wanted to support his family back home, so now he can legally bring the entire family here too, eventually they become GC holders or citizens too, and now the whole family is on Welfare, Section 8, SSI and everything else. Impossible? Think again. I've seen it too often in California among so called "political refugees" and family reunion newcomers, who immediately become legal receipients of subsidized help.

Think balance and fairness.