Who Is with the Latinos March-Please Vote
- Thread starter 4Jasmin
- Start date
Screaming_Eagle
Registered Users (C)
AlexanderG said:
You're entitled to your opinion, however, that kind of rudeness is uncalled for.
I would like to participate in this post and other politics related posts but for some reasons, I don't feel confortable expressing my political point of views on this forum or any other public forum. In fact I don't feel I have the freedom to do so, I'm afraid that my liberal ideas will be taken as anti-patriotic and who knows what happens next...
Strange, I had the same feeling when I used to live in Lebanon when it was, back then, terrorized by the Syrian/Lebanese intelligence services.
...and I thought this feeling would go away when I come to the states.
for the time being, let's just talk about immigration stuff, hopefully I still have the freedom to criticize how bad the USCIS service is.
Maybe I should thank president Bush for this.
Strange, I had the same feeling when I used to live in Lebanon when it was, back then, terrorized by the Syrian/Lebanese intelligence services.
...and I thought this feeling would go away when I come to the states.
for the time being, let's just talk about immigration stuff, hopefully I still have the freedom to criticize how bad the USCIS service is.
Maybe I should thank president Bush for this.
AlexanderG said:
You may live under the impression that you're superior to others, but I have news for you: YOUR LANGUAGE IS THE MEASURE OF YOUR "SUPERIORITY"
Try to think before you insult members...or to be safe, do what you do best, COPY PASSAGES FROM CLASSICS
...since your own opinions are of such a low quality
Some people may wait in line to emigrate legally in the US, the illegals don't bother...
Check this picture, to see how some people emigrate to US, "outsmarting" us, the ones who did it legally, and the long legal immigration process
http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060430/...oPgdbq9IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA3bGk2OHYzBHNlYwN0bXA-
Check this picture, to see how some people emigrate to US, "outsmarting" us, the ones who did it legally, and the long legal immigration process
http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060430/...oPgdbq9IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA3bGk2OHYzBHNlYwN0bXA-
Suzy977 said:The legal immigrants were always welcomed in this country, and will always be, AND THIS IS THE WAY SHOULD BE.
The illegals...this is a different story
Especially the ones who mock this country and its flag by waving their national flag and demanding rights here...those should be deported a.s.a.p.
I see ur point here. I saw the news. I agree about the flag. it's NOT appropriate. or shall I say "contradict" ... , the fact that they want to stay n work in here but wave their national flag ... , it's more make sense if they wave american flag .. to show that they "intend" to be a nationalist U.S citizen later in the future.
but somehow I cannot pull myself to against them. they want a better life in U.S .. (aren't we all?) .. , I came to this country with a student visa 'n then applied asylum 'n now got my gc. I never experienced living as "illegal" alien .. , but I have several illegal friends and hearing their story made me sad .. they are not bad people.
the only illegal alien that I dislike ... are the one who become identity theft. using our ssn and ruin our credit history. NOW .. these people need to be out of this country !!! 100% agree. but then again .. identity theft can be done by any legal alien too .. so ..
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
4Jasmin said:
AlexanderG said:
4Jasmin said:
I did not expect you to be offended ! No offense intended ! I said that your head would NOT be as big as the one of a donkey. Please check. (And with that I mean, please 'check what I wrote')
Under the obvious assumption that your head is indeed not largely oversized, I cannot possibly see why this analogy would hurt your feelings. If I have though wrongfully suggested that your head is smaller than it really is, I would have to apologize for unintentionally deminishing your person, I agree.
I regret though certainly that this analogy gave once more someone the opportunity to leave the discussion and move the spotlight on his personal issues in order 'cry wolf'.
Besides - not your head, but the much larger (sorry) issue of what we think how the nation should position itself to the recent pro-illegal immigrant demonstrations, the proposed immigration legislation and border security.
So the question remains unanswered ... if it is, as stated by the administration and the opposition, impossible to deport 12 million undocumtented workers, should you not then move on and talk about practical suggestion to resolve the problem ?
After all, we already made as much progress as to agree on that we all oppose the status quo of a quietly tolerated illegal immigration.
Alex
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
PG2006 said:Some people may wait in line to emigrate legally in the US, the illegals don't bother...
Check this picture, to see how some people emigrate to US, "outsmarting" us, the ones who did it legally, and the long legal immigration process
http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060430/...oPgdbq9IxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA3bGk2OHYzBHNlYwN0bXA-
Good point . So, if it is that easy (in many cases) then our nation did not take its responsibilities to protect our territory very seriously, did we ? We, the United States, tolerated this illegal immigration for two decades. When the water flows down the hill, don't blame the water, build a dam. But for a 'simple' mass deportation we have closed our eyes for far too many years.
So ... what now ?
Alex
P.S. Let's not forget that thousands of illegal immigrants died in the desert, trying to enter the United States - all in the search for a job and better life for themselves and their families.
Last edited by a moderator:
Miss.PinK said:
they are very welcome to stay in this country for a better life if they come to US legal.
for those who are over-stayed, it seems a bit gray area to me. However, for those who came to US illegal without inspection, gosh, go back to their home country and wait on the line.
AlexanderG said:
In my opinion:
First and most urget thing is to secure the borders so the continuous flow of the people coming from Mexico to be stopped.
Otherwise, if, let say for the sake of exemplification, there are deported 1,000 illegals per day...another 2,000 will cross back during the nigh.
Then, after the borders are sealed...we'll see...I still believe the ones who crossed without inspection shouldn't EVER be accepted to stay here and should be banned from US permanently
...and before you judge me, please take a moment and remember all the question from N-400...not to mention the mandatory requirement of English (write/read/speak) knowledge.
AlexanderG said:
We can't be responsible for their own actions, we never forced them to do that, and we never told them to come over crossing the desert.
There are people who do a lot of things for a better life, most of the robbers are committing robberies for a better life, people cheat on their taxes and don't report income, for a better life, and so on...
Many of the people who take risks breaking the law, shouldn't be rewarded for their "courage".
And, I think we should differentiate between people who are out of status and became illegals, and the undocumented illegals who came here without inspection those should be deported.
Last edited by a moderator:
ocworker said:
this is what i would propose...
(o) Support the Guest Worker program, build a wall along the border and strengthen border security
(o) All illegals would be given 90 days to legalize themselves failing which they would be considered felons.
(o) If an illegal does not have passport, he/she goes back, applies for one and waits in line to get in here.
(o) Illegals living here for 5 years or more can stay back and continue to work with legal status and backfile taxes or pay penalty for all years they earned money illegally. (Proof is needed to prove that the illegal has been here for 5 years and above)
(o) Illegals here for less than 5 years or those who cannot show proof go back to their country and wait in line to enter legally.
(o) Once illegal legalizes, they can apply for citizenship provided they become permanent residents first after waiting in line just like the rest of us.
(o) Kids of illegals born in the US have a right to US citizenship but they can only claim their right once both parents legalize. (another checkpoint to catch illegals)
(o) Employers hiring illegals should be fined and they should report any illegal immigrant looking for a job
(o) A chunk of the illegal workers are supported by the home owners who look for cheap labor to babysit their kids, mow their lawns, move their furniture, paint their backyard or build their house. I hope all home owners realize that the money saved by getting cheap labor goes into paying higher auto insurance and higher taxes. Keeping this in mind, the home owners should avoid hiring illegal workers at all cost.
We all know the advantages we been having as a result of illegal immigration; cheap labor and low prices. These advantages no way tip the scales back in balance compared to the problems of illegal immigration (which is draining our financial resources as they utilize free education, medical benefits and other things). I agree that deportation of 12 million illegals would cost the US a LOT of money so giving them a chance to do what is right is the best way to sort things out. Giving them amnesty is like kicking dirt on faces of people who have been struggling so long to get GC and CZ the legal way and i definitely oppose granting them amnesty.
Having said all this, i still believe that the march was a pathetic attempt to gain attention but i must commend on their solidarity and unity for the cause. On a last note, i dont post in the citizenship forum for the sole reason that the discussion in the threads never stay on topic and alway ends in flame wars, ego clashes, personal attacks and mud-slinging. Everyone here thinks they are right and expect others to accept their opinion and give them the approval nod. I wanted to share my opinion and what i wrote above is nothing BUT my opinion. Have a nice day!
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
PG2006 said:
I agree with on several points. I question though why illegals who overstayed their visa should be treated any differently. There is the same intend of violation, no matter if you walk, swim or fly to this country and become illegal immediately or sometime later. People are not 'a little bit illegal'.
The N400 standards do not need automatically apply as such - simply because 'being legal' does not mean that you are 'being naturalized' ! You will find a majority of US citizens (72%) says the undocumented workers should get some form of legal status - but citizenship does not even have to be an option at all.
And I agree there should be no reward for committing a crime! We as a nation are the 'judge' in that case - but we were also an accomplice. Since we cannot dismiss ourselves we have to be careful not to appear hypocritical when we make our accusations.
Alex
Last edited by a moderator:
AlexanderG said:
Just for the sake of exemplification I'm going to say this:
It's, if you want, the difference between a violent criminal and the one who committed same crime by accident, or another example: a murderer who's planing and intentionally follows his victim in the night to kill her (murder one) and someone who commit a manslaughter....
I repeat, it was only for the sake of exemplification, I'm not calling the illegals, murder one criminals or any names for that matter.
Besides that undocumented illegals could be very dangerous...since they are not inspected do we know who they are? Terrorists, drug dealers, criminals...maybe they are not...but what if they are?
AlexanderG said:
I don't think we all as a Nation are accomplices. I, for one, and many millions like me, if it was up to us the southern border was sealed long time ago...and not only human beings, but flies too weren't crossing without inspection...so, I don't think the blame should be on us as a whole Nation, but just on the ones who made the decision to let this happening.
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
ari4u said:
That sounds like a good plan. I'd agree with the 5 years if we would not exclude a number of currently undocumented workers that we cannot handle in terms of deportation. If the number of 'remaining' illegals is too large and their means to suport themselves is taken away, then this may backlash into an increase in crime and other illegal activities. We have to be sure that we can deport those who will not fit the requirements.
The citizenship of US-born children of undocumented workers has been accepted as settled law based on the 14th Ammendment - if that would be part of any new immigration legislation, opponents would surely challenge it.
Either way, if that suggestion would be debated in Congress, then it would apply to future children ... and hopefully in the future undocumented workers will be a rare exception.
Alex
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
PG2006 said:
Ok ... but if one does not leave the US after one's visa expires you don't 'happen to be illegal'. It's a choice. It's easy, I admit, and tempting. But even if one 'only' overstays his/her visa it's no accident, it happened on purpose, right?
About who's dangerous or not ... I don't think that Islamic Jihadis hook up with some Mexicans and cross the desert with them. Terrorists have usually a well planned, well funded cover. Take the (legal) 9/11 Hijackers for example. They could be elegant business men on an L1-visa for all we know.
However, if somebody -anybody except of natural born US-citizens of course- would become a drug dealer, terrorist, rapist, pedophile or murderer he/she ought to be sentenced, jailed and stripped of their status, even naturalized citizenship, and be deported. No status nor naturalization certificate should be able to block deportation in that case. I think honestly, that the number of 'bad guys' among the undocumented workers is not larger than among the rest of us.
Alex
AlexanderG
Registered Users (C)
PG2006 said:
That is why not an individual or group deserves the blame but the nation. You may have been active trying to fix the border issue all along - you were on the right track, you worked while others looked the other way. But as a nation with all institutions, we did not make a serious effort, did we ?
I did not agree with the Iraq war, I would not have voted for the current administration, especially in 2004 - but now that administration represents us, me included. I must not think that as a nation we have no responsibility for what is happening, just because I could not stop it.
Alex
Last edited by a moderator:
AlexanderG said:
In conclusion (my personal conclusion) to what you say and what I've said:
If we really care, and if we are strong about opinions, we should do our best to make them reality and, at least at the end of the day, we can say, "I've tried!"
Staying (this is only for me and the people who agree with me) on the side of the road and watch 3-400,000 illegals, waving Mexican flags asking for "rights" ahead of the legals who wait in line for years is not an acceptable option.
AlexanderG said:
Not and argument, not a correction just a comment:
I don't see them as a competition, at least for myself, I'm an American citizen, but the poor people waiting every day for the mailman to bring them the good news either from local DO or from the US Consulate...when USCIS will start processing 12 millions, or only 9 millions, or only 6 millions...those poor law obeying guys will feel it not like a "competition" but like a big slap in their faces.