Under what Circumstances a GC can be revoked.?

Originally posted by Silly Man
Bitterman how do you define permanent?
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As stated in some prior posts, "permanent" = 6 months to 1 year, the reason the dates are vague is because if you feel like taking a risk then 6 months is fine, but if you want to be safe then it is 1 year.

Also, if under AC21 it is okay to change employer *before* GC approval, then why does that not apply after GC approval? Or maybe after GC, you should be required to come back to your original employer and start working for him again for 6 months .. thats just horseshit.
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It may be horseshit but it also happens to be the law, and no one had to take an IQ test to be elected to the Congress to pass laws! The discrepancy between AC21 and the post GC scenario was much discussed once upon a time, if you search the archives you will find enough references to the same.

In other words, get gc, change jobs, be merry.
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Be merry until your GC gets revoked (on the proviso that the company filing for GC complains to INS)! I would rather advice people to check with their lawyers and then make the decision on changing jobs.
 
The permanent resident application sponsored by the employer only means that the sponsor intends to employ the beneficiary permanently "at the time of application".same for the employee-he/she intends to work for the sponsor "at the time of application".Therefore, it means that you can change your mind tomorrow and cannot be held accountable for that. I don't believe that a company can complain about an employee to BCIS if he/she left the company within 6 months and state that the GC was obtained with fraudulent intentions.It will not hold grounds in any court of law.
I think these 'rumors' are spread around by paranoid people who are forever going to live in this country with fear of being sent back. Don't fall for that, people....if you are a law abiding citizen, you are home free after you get your GC.Good luck to all!!
Don't forget to kick your employer's ass after you get your GC, particularly if they are kicking yours now!!
 
Originally posted by ECGC
The permanent resident application sponsored by the employer only means that the sponsor intends to employ the beneficiary permanently "at the time of application".same for the employee-he/she intends to work for the sponsor "at the time of application".Therefore, it means that you can change your mind tomorrow and cannot be held accountable for that.
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Nobody will blame you for changing your mind, of course. But they won't give you a Green Card either. As soon as your intent to be "permanently employed" is gone, the basis for getting an Employment-Based Green Card is gone, too.

And, no, those are not "rumors" as you chose to put politely. Read through some Administrative Appeals decisions and Board of Immigration Appeals decisions, and you'll get a more clear picture ;)
 
Originally posted by BitterMan
Nobody will blame you for changing your mind, of course. But they won't give you a Green Card either. As soon as your intent to be "permanently employed" is gone, the basis for getting an Employment-Based Green Card is gone, too.


You are right that they will not give you the green card if you don't have a job at the time of processing (everyone knows that). But what we are talking about is REVOKING a granted GC. So there is no question of 'won't give me the GC' here. I already got it....they cannot take it away from me because i left the job within 6 months or whatever because i can "change my mind" after i get the green card and my company should know that.

By the way....is there anyone whose green card has been revoked just because they quit their jobs within 6 months of obtaining the GC? I would love to hear someone's "real" experience. Until then it still is a "rumor"
PS: don't forget to kick your employer's.....(see above):D :D
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Originally posted by ECGC
Originally posted by BitterMan
there is no question of 'won't give me the GC' here. I already got it....they cannot take it away from me because i left the job within 6 months or whatever because i can "change my mind" after i get the green card and my company should know that.

By the way....is there anyone whose green card has been revoked just because they quit their jobs within 6 months of obtaining the GC? I would love to hear someone's "real" experience. Until then it still is a "rumor"
PS: don't forget to kick your employer's.....(see above):D :D
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It is very interesting that you are so confident about the entire process based upon your own logic and without an firm point of law to support your arguement.

If you search around on Google over this issue, I am sure you will come up with enough immigration lawyers who believe in the 6 months - 1 year rule.

There have been cases in the past when GC's have been revoked, and posted onto this forum.

Offcourse the point to be noted here is that leaving your job prior to the 6 month period does not Guarantee revokation. Just that it is grounds for one. Don't confuse the improbable with the impossible!
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Originally posted by 140_takes_4ever

There have been cases in the past when GC's have been revoked, and posted onto this forum.

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140,
could you post at least one link, so we could read and learn by example :confused:
 
The following Q&A is from a very old page at:
http://www.immigration.com/faq/greenvisa.html#118

The vintage is pre-AC21.


Q39 What is the indication of "permanency" while working with my employer after getting my GC?.

A39 The basic premise (or theory) behind permanent residence through offer of employment is that an employee is accepting a job on a "permanent" bases.

Normally, I would say working for one year or more with the same employer after getting your GC is PROBABLY enough indication of permanency. Less than 4-5 months is perhaps evidence to the contrary But REMEMBER, this is just my own guess. Technically speaking, the moment you decide that you will leave after a certain period of time, "permanent" intent is gone.

There may be considerable relaxation in this interpretation because in the year 2001 Congress has enacted a law that permits employees to leave an employer even while their I-485 is pending. We do not have the regulations or any detailed guidance on these issues. Therefore, it would still be a good idea to adhere to the above
[Index] [Compiled by Law Offices of Rajiv S Khanna]
 
Originally posted by ND022202
could you post at least one link, so we could read and learn by example :confused:
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Tried searching the archive, couldn't find the post, don't have time for a more intensive search. I definitely remember the case though, does anyone else (Oldtimers) remember it?
 
I tried searching the archives also .......couldn't find anything. Until we find a "real life experience" i would consider this only as an "opinion" by some. I agree that atleast some of these people who render these opinions are well informed, reasonable people but i need more concrete evidence.At this point, i don't need another reason to worry about without clear evidence. I hope there are some others here who would share my sentiment.
 
Originally posted by ECGC
but i need more concrete evidence.At this point, i don't need another reason to worry about without clear evidence. I hope there are some others here who would share my sentiment.
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ECGC,

I understand where you are coming from, as mentioned in one of my prior posts, not that something will happen for sure, just that the chances are higher.

Everything boils down to the fact that how much risk are you willing to take? In matters of immigration when so much is at stake, I would say better safe than sorry.

If the job situation is really terrible, then after seeing approvals on/around my RD/ND dates, I would go ahead and change my job regardless of RFE under AC21. Which is WAY WAY better understood than the documentation for "permanent" intent, which is not saying much!
 
I believe that this 6 months rule (assumption) was made before AC21 comes in to effect. Before AC21 no body thought of leaving the sponsoring company before he gets green card and even after getting GC stay of more than 6 months was advisable. After AC21 law I have not seen any case were somebody's GC was revoked due to dumping his employer before 6 months.

Now we all are saying it could happen but we have not seen. When people are changing jobs before they are getting GC and then getting GC without an issue, so how come INS could stop anybody doing that after GC. When you have changed your job before your GC so obviously you are not intent to work for your sponsoring company and INS knows about it.

It means its OK to tell INS that you are not intent to work for your employer before getting GC and still get GC (using AC21) . So what is the point of telling or not telling. In both the cases you will get it.

Think about a case where you are thinking to change the employer before getting GC (using AC21) and every thing is set only thing you have to join and suddenly you get your GC. Now you can not change your job otherwise it will be fraud ?
 
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Originally posted by vipsha
Now we all are saying it could happen but we have not seen. When people are changing jobs before they are getting GC and then getting GC without an issue, so how come INS could stop anybody doing that after GC.
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All true and logical, but the question is Who will bell the cat?
 
Who will bell the cat?

I did, but you will see after 4-5 yrs from now.

Since I changed my job just after getting my GC, even before getting my plastic card.
 
I have found this link:
http://www.immigrationportal.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=80661#post80661

this is not the real evidence but a useful speculation:

Originally posted by rjngh2000
AC21 law and the green card
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The green card candidate may or may not be working at the green card sponsoring company but would have to take up employment when he is approved. The green card is granted to the candidate because the employer requires his skills.

But what is the duration of the requirement and his employment. Is the application fraudelent - Has all this work been done with the sole intention of somehow getting a green card for the candidate. If the INS is able to prove that either the employer or employee did not have any intention of honoring their commitment to grant employment or the candidate had no intention of working at the employer then even though the green card has been granted it can be revoked. Now this happens if INS detects such cases because of random surveys or because of complaint by either some individual or by the sponsoring company or someone.

Does this mean that the employer and the employee are bound forever - Generally if the employee changes jobs after 6-8 months the INS cannot revoke the green card - Good lawyers will appeal and win the case. But what happens if the sponsoring company changes its business or goes out of business - The candidate should seek a letter from the company clearly explaining the situation. Why is this important - This review of the candidates employment history comes up when he is seeking Citizenship and it is better to have a clean record.
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Personally, I agree with ECGC that, say, if someone has been working for the same company for 3-5 years, first, as H1B and, then, as 485-adjustee, and 180 days passed since filing 485, and GC comes and this person leaves in 1 week, it is possible to prove (in unlikely and unfortunate situation) that both the applicant and the company had bona fide intention for GC process.
 
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