TheRealCanadian
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The chances of getting an annulment is a valid topic for discussion. This isn't.
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The chances of getting an annulment is a valid topic for discussion. This isn't.
I don't know why you are so negative. Is it a crime to give someone positive reinforcment? every time I do, you come along with the negativity. Good lord, all I said is the judge must have seen a lot so basically she might have a chance. And he WOULD get deported. Some cases do not require proof of fraud. That's a fact. Also, it sounds like he did use her for the green card. If you don't like the way things work, then drop it. The fact is, annulments are filed all the time, she may or may not get one, with or without proof. The world and the law isn't perfect and doesn't always work fairly, like you seem to think it does, things happen without proof all the time. I know this from personal experience, that the law doesn't work fairly a lot of the time and things don't go the way they are suppose to. So stop trying to make her think she has no chance. The green card was based on a good faith marriage, people seem to totally forget about the marriage part and simply want to stay here.
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You are entitled to your opinion but resorting to personal attacks when you can not defend your positions in a debate is so low.
I do not think I am defending anyone just arguing the facts as presented by the OP. My position is that the OP will not succeed in getting an annulment let alone cause her soon to ex husband to be deported considering "evidence" that she has presented. Even her own attorney told her it was a stretch.
I know there are a lot of hard feelings when people believe they have been taken advantage of and/or a fraud has been perpetuated on them but being vindictive and vengeful does not make it any better and only leads to more bitterness especially when you can not achieve what you want. Letting your emotions dictate your thought processes can only lead to an unwillingness to accept hard facts the are unpleasant and followed by making bad decisions.
I have already said I do not know whether the OP's husband married her for immigration benefits only but going by what OP has said I believe she has failed to make conclusive case.
That being said I rest my case on this one. The OP will do what they want to do regardless of what you or I think. Just restrain your self from personal attacks on others simply because you may not agree with what they say, right or wrong.
My only interest in this thread was that the OP goes in with their eyes wide open. All I have seen is you and others giving her bad advice about how tape recording being illegal and making it seem like a slam dunk, get an annulment and problem solved. I have included BIA precedents and case law to back my arguments. There is two sides to every story and in you have only heard one side. So what would you tell the op's husband if he also started a thread on here stating his wife physically abused him and he reported her to the police, that he has a police report and tape recordings to prove she is/was verbally and emotionally abusive. That she is irrational and jealous about text messages he sent to a female friend ...blah.. blah..blah and now she is trying to get him deported because he will not put with it anymore ? Would you see things any differently or the because he is a man, he is 5'8 180 lbs and she is only 5'2 125 lbs and he is the immigrant therefore he must be a lair.
And oh yes there has to be PROOF of fraud for the courts to make a finding of fraud and grant the annulment. The courts will not grant her an annulment based on fraud simply because she thinks she was defrauded. Even her own attorney told her it was a stretch but like all good attorneys he will take the case and her money even if he thinks he wont win
. Now for him to get deported that BIA has ruled that there has to a finding of fraud and that such a finding “inherently involves a factual determination based on clear, unequivocal, and convincing evidence, that that respondent engaged in fraudulent conduct by entering a ‘for the purpose of procuring his…entry as an immigrant.’” Matter of Agdinaoay, 16 I&N Dec. 545, 547 (BIA 1978).
Basically what I am saying is that the OP needs a lot more proof to get her marriage annulled on the basis of fraud and her philandering husband deported than she has presented here.
Bad advice? Are you kidding me? It IS illegal in SOME states.
an example:
"It is a misdemeanor in Alaska to use an eavesdropping device to hear or record a conversation without the consent of at least one party to the conversation, or to disclose or publish information that one knows, or should know, was illegally obtained. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.310. A person who intercepts a private conversation cannot legally divulge or publish the information without consent of at least one party. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.300. The eavesdropping statute carries a fine of up to $1,000 and/or one year in jail, though suppression of illegally obtained information in court is the only civil penalty authorized. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.330."
Real Canadian showed you the site where it clearly states that in 12 states in normal circumstances, it is illegal and that it has now included in person taping in some of those states. So according to you, you are smarter than the person who did all the research and made the site? You're saying they're lying or wrong that it's illegal? It seems you're the type to go that far even though it clearly states it's illegal and some have gone to JAIL for it in some states. So no, it's not bad advice, I'd really love to know how you can say it's bad advice, since what I said is true. It clearly states it is illegal. Obviously you are not American, and have never dealt with the courts but seem to think you know better than everyone else about everything. Just because the law states something, doesn't mean it happens. It also says innocent until proven guilty, but we all know that's not true.
Just because they say there has to be proof of something, doesn't mean there needs to be or isn't enough in the judges eyes. it is up to the JUDGE. That's what appeals are for. I just finished one of two court cases with my ex husband where the judge made SURE there was proof on my end and he listed all of it, so there could be no appeal by him. Otherwise it leaves room for appeal. I never said she COULD get an annulment. I told her to TRY and she may or may not get one. So get your facts straight before you claim I give bad advice that she CAN get an annulment. I never in fact said that. I've dealt with court more than most people. I know how it works, and how it should work. They are rarely one in the same.
I also don't care what her husbands side is. He didn't ask for help, she did. So that's who I have to take at face value. We're not here to debate his and her sides. She is the one who came for advice, not him.
an example:
"It is a misdemeanor in Alaska to use an eavesdropping device to hear or record a conversation without the consent of at least one party to the conversation, or to disclose or publish information that one knows, or should know, was illegally obtained. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.310. A person who intercepts a private conversation cannot legally divulge or publish the information without consent of at least one party. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.300. The eavesdropping statute carries a fine of up to $1,000 and/or one year in jail, though suppression of illegally obtained information in court is the only civil penalty authorized. Alaska Stat. § 42.20.330."
Real Canadian showed you the site where it clearly states that in 12 states in normal circumstances, it is illegal and that it has now included in person taping in some of those states. So according to you, you are smarter than the person who did all the research and made the site? You're saying they're lying or wrong that it's illegal? It seems you're the type to go that far even though it clearly states it's illegal and some have gone to JAIL for it in some states. So no, it's not bad advice, I'd really love to know how you can say it's bad advice, since what I said is true. It clearly states it is illegal. Obviously you are not American, and have never dealt with the courts but seem to think you know better than everyone else about everything. Just because the law states something, doesn't mean it happens. It also says innocent until proven guilty, but we all know that's not true.
Just because they say there has to be proof of something, doesn't mean there needs to be or isn't enough in the judges eyes. it is up to the JUDGE. That's what appeals are for. I just finished one of two court cases with my ex husband where the judge made SURE there was proof on my end and he listed all of it, so there could be no appeal by him. Otherwise it leaves room for appeal. I never said she COULD get an annulment. I told her to TRY and she may or may not get one. So get your facts straight before you claim I give bad advice that she CAN get an annulment. I never in fact said that. I've dealt with court more than most people. I know how it works, and how it should work. They are rarely one in the same.
I also don't care what her husbands side is. He didn't ask for help, she did. So that's who I have to take at face value. We're not here to debate his and her sides. She is the one who came for advice, not him.
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The OP has said she is from SC and that it is a single party consent state not that it would have mattered anyway. Immigration is federal and federal law allows single party tape recording so the op's husband could have used those recordings to defend themselves in immigration court or at a hearing. What I have said is simply that the OP will have an almost zero chance of getting an annulment or getting her philandering husband deported simply because he was cheating on her with ex girlfriend based on the evidence she has presented here. The law is very clear on what the standard is in these cases and in my opinion the op has not met that standard. What you are doing is egging her on .. yeah go get an annulment and if that fails then you can go for a divorce without thinking things through. Its like telling her to spend $2000[ attorney fees] or so on the lottery but add don't worry if you do not win, You will get paid next week.
And like I said before my only interest in this thread was to let the OP know what was likely to happen if she went ahead with this. The OP will do what they want to do regardless of you or I think so I think I will this thread a rest.
And like I said before my only interest in this thread was to let the OP know what was likely to happen if she went ahead with this. The OP will do what they want to do regardless of you or I think so I think I will this thread a rest.
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All I see is you being ignorant or else not reading what I've said, or taking it in some weird way it's not meant. You won't even admit you were wrong that it is illegal. I felt I had to defend myself because you claim I basically lied that it was illegal and clearly I was not wrong.
He's cheated on her twice I think she said, and she wants out of the marriage so um, why not tell her to get a divorce if not an annulment? I answered her questions truthfully. It's common bloody sense to tell someone who wants out of a marriage, to try an annulment if it was fraudulent and if not, get a divorce. I'm pretty sure you're the only person who thinks telling her to get a divorce is "egging" her on. This is why I don't post. I'm actually shocked someone would think telling her to get a divorce is considered egging someone on lol. I think I'll go back to never posting, this is bloody ridiculous.
He's cheated on her twice I think she said, and she wants out of the marriage so um, why not tell her to get a divorce if not an annulment? I answered her questions truthfully. It's common bloody sense to tell someone who wants out of a marriage, to try an annulment if it was fraudulent and if not, get a divorce. I'm pretty sure you're the only person who thinks telling her to get a divorce is "egging" her on. This is why I don't post. I'm actually shocked someone would think telling her to get a divorce is considered egging someone on lol. I think I'll go back to never posting, this is bloody ridiculous.
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immigrant27
Registered Users (C)
I never said that I wanted to deport him. I actually in some way don't want him to be deported. I do want to get an annulment though because I don't believe that I deserved to be used. Also, he lived with his ex gf for several years prior marrying me. When I met him he told me that they broke up b/c she cheated on his with him best friend. I believed him. We dated for about 8 months and then he started telling me how it is bad now for illegals and he might be deported. BUt if I would give him papers then he could support our family better. In addition, when they were dating they purchased the house and there living in it together before the break up and meeting me. So even during an interview, officer knew her name (she is also illigal in the country). he straight up asked me how I can believe him. I told him that it is for me to find out. I guess now I did.
I repeat I do not want him to be deported. I was an annulment. I want to start my life over. I am in pain. Yes I am very upset and hurt about the situation. But I do not want to be evil and mess his life up, even though he messed up mine. Otherwise I would write a letter with my explanation to the officer who interviewed us and attach the phone bills. Mom was right when she said that law is not only black and white there are a lot of gray areas. A lot of time when ppl go to the court they take a chance because you just never know what the Judges believe to. I am sorry to say but a lot of white american men don't like hispanics for one reason or another, so may be just may be I would get one of those judges and will get my annulment. As soon as I get it and IF I get it, I would close the door to my past life and move on, if not then I would get my Legal Separation and will wait for a year to get a divorce.
Also, I do not believe that you AzBlk is paying my attorney's bills. So please don't worry about it. But just as a side note, he is my friend and is helping me for free.
I repeat I do not want him to be deported. I was an annulment. I want to start my life over. I am in pain. Yes I am very upset and hurt about the situation. But I do not want to be evil and mess his life up, even though he messed up mine. Otherwise I would write a letter with my explanation to the officer who interviewed us and attach the phone bills. Mom was right when she said that law is not only black and white there are a lot of gray areas. A lot of time when ppl go to the court they take a chance because you just never know what the Judges believe to. I am sorry to say but a lot of white american men don't like hispanics for one reason or another, so may be just may be I would get one of those judges and will get my annulment. As soon as I get it and IF I get it, I would close the door to my past life and move on, if not then I would get my Legal Separation and will wait for a year to get a divorce.
Also, I do not believe that you AzBlk is paying my attorney's bills. So please don't worry about it. But just as a side note, he is my friend and is helping me for free.
Ok I think I have put my two cents in on this thread. But I just need to clarify a few things.
In the first post of this thread you said:
In post 15 you said
Thank you all for your support. I live in "one-party consent" state, South Carolina. I went to an attorney yestarday, and he agreed to represent my case. I am filing for an annulment. I have his phone bills where he was constantly talking to her through text messages. He even called her while we were on our honeymoon. My attorney told me that it is a stratch but I just want to try. Also in my state, we have to be separated for 1 year before we can get a divorce. That would be soooo bad if I would have to be married to him for another year. As to the recordings, he gave me those recordings. I actually have tape recorder, but I really cannot trust him again. No one knows, may be he has other recordings or re-recorded the same to the other tape and kept it just in case. I cannot believe that someone would use another person in such a bad/mean way. I trully believe what goes around comes around. I would never do something stupid again and trust another person that is illigal in US.
Are you all sure that if I would get an annulment, he would be deported?
While you may not have explicitly said you wanted him deported. The implication seemed to be that you were looking for an annulment so he could be deported.
But I think that is all besides the point. I simply pointed out that you would have a very hard time getting an annulment because he cheated on you with ex and so it follows that the marriage was fraudulent. I never said I was paying you attorney bills and since I work very hard for my money I assumed you did too and therefore would not want to waste it on a fools errand, I did not know your attorney was doing this as a favor.
I will stop posting on this thread now because I do not think anything good can come of this. You are dead set on getting what you want to the point of hoping a racist white judge who dislikes Hispanics for one reason or another grants you an annulment not on the merits of your case but because he does not like Hispanics.
BornintheRSA
Registered Users (C)
I'm glad you got a lawyer to help you.
Get an annulment or divorce and get the slime out of your life !!!!
He has emotionally abused you with those threats. It's sickening.
What happens to him after that is up to immigration.
Get an annulment or divorce and get the slime out of your life !!!!
He has emotionally abused you with those threats. It's sickening.
What happens to him after that is up to immigration.
immigrant27
Registered Users (C)
i am not trying to hurt anyone. I am hurt myself. I am confused. I feel betrayed. I am not sure why it is so hard to understand. Sometimes people say stuff they don't mean. If I wanted to deport him I would have a while ago. Now I am just confused and can't believe it is happenning to me. I guess AzBlk might say I am stupid, which would be true. Sorry guys for feelng sorry for myself. The reason I posted my thread here was just to hear what people think about annulment on grounds of fraud and sure deportation. I am not sure what is a right thing to do. I want out and forget him, but I will be married to him for another year I won't be able to get him out that fast. And anyway, I've never said I was God. I cannot play with people's lives. I know only one thing and it is "what goes around comes around." He will get what he deserves sooner or later! Thank you again for your all support and discussions.