"Out 6 months"

P

Proxyon

Registered Users (C)
Guys,

I have "out 6 months" written with pen under the stamp in my passport. In fact the trip was less than 180 days. When the IO looks on that at the interview what is more important to them - the real lenght of the trip or this thing ? Since that was in my old passport I can always say I have lost it and they can not check that. I mean, I don't want to jeopardize my citizenship, when in fact I don't have a single trip longer than 6 months. What do you think ?
 
Proxyon said:
Guys,

I have "out 6 months" written with pen under the stamp in my passport. In fact the trip was less than 180 days. When the IO looks on that at the interview what is more important to them - the real lenght of the trip or this thing ? Since that was in my old passport I can always say I have lost it and they can not check that. I mean, I don't want to jeopardize my citizenship, when in fact I don't have a single trip longer than 6 months. What do you think ?
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No matter what they know the truth they have it in their system on how many exact days you were out of the country just tell them the truth they are going to ask for your passport if you don't have it there will be a problem because it is required to show it to them in your interview you can explain to them about what happened regarding the trip but do not try to hide anything from the IO.
 
mnprtltt said:
No matter what they know the truth they have it in their system on how many exact days you were out of the country just tell them the truth they are going to ask for your passport if you don't have it there will be a problem because it is required to show it to them in your interview you can explain to them about what happened regarding the trip but do not try to hide anything from the IO.
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Sorry to interrupt...

Are you saying even the old passports will be asked for in the interview? I have like 4 passports and the other one is missing but all my TRIPS were in my current passport. Would this give me a problem? Thanks!
 
astrochimp said:
Sorry to interrupt...

Are you saying even the old passports will be asked for in the interview? I have like 4 passports and the other one is missing but all my TRIPS were in my current passport. Would this give me a problem? Thanks!
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Not to worry in your case this wont be a problem at all. They want to look at your most recent passport even tho they have all of them on file it's just part of the interview procedure that they have to follow.
 
The point is this: I have 2 passports - the current one, and the one that expired. They want all the passports, including the ones that have expired. But by law, my native country requires the expired passports to be returned. "Out 6 months" is in the expired one. So I can simply say I have only the most recent one. I have a big concern once the IO sees "out 6 months" he/she will start nagging with me.
 
Proxyon said:
The point is this: I have 2 passports - the current one, and the one that expired. They want all the passports, including the ones that have expired. But by law, my native country requires the expired passports to be returned. "Out 6 months" is in the expired one. So I can simply say I have only the most recent one. I have a big concern once the IO sees "out 6 months" he/she will start nagging with me.
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If you explain to the IO about the passport returning part and say you don't have it anymore has a chance to work but if they think your trying to hide/lie to them then they will check and try to dig it up so do what you feel is right this may or may not hurt your chances of getting approved. Do you have any other proof of how long you were really out of country? plane tickets or any documents/receipts? they will be great help to you so you can show the IO the real amount of time then she wont have a chance to argue with you about the 6 month rule your best bet is to find another way to prove that you didn't overstay that will be the main concern in your case not the expired passport.
 
Proxyon said:
The point is this: I have 2 passports - the current one, and the one that expired. They want all the passports, including the ones that have expired. But by law, my native country requires the expired passports to be returned. "Out 6 months" is in the expired one. So I can simply say I have only the most recent one. I have a big concern once the IO sees "out 6 months" he/she will start nagging with me.
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The rule is "Never lie to the USCIS" and hence, I would disclose both the new and old passport.

Let's consider the following scenario: They first ask you about your old passport. You say that you do not have it. And then during the interview another situation arises where they require proof of some item but that item can only be proven with your old passport. Now you have a "gotcha moment" since you already stated that you do not have the old passport. I would not risk such a situation.

So I would disclose both passports. If an issue arises about that long trip, you can prove that the trip is less than 6 months via the entry stamp in the destination country and then the return stamp from US border control. If available, you could also take the itinerary and ticket receipts for that trip with you as well.

Long story short: Tell always the truth and disclose all passports as required.
 
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Proxyon said:
The point is this: I have 2 passports - the current one, and the one that expired. They want all the passports, including the ones that have expired. But by law, my native country requires the expired passports to be returned. "Out 6 months" is in the expired one. So I can simply say I have only the most recent one. I have a big concern once the IO sees "out 6 months" he/she will start nagging with me.
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How come you have the old passport if your native country by law wants old PP back. Don't they take it while issuing new ones. Something does not gel.

My advice is not to tell a lie. USCIS may have more knowledge about your native country than we all think.
 
nwctzn said:
The rule is "Never lie to the USCIS" and hence, I would disclose both the new and old passport.

Let's consider the following scenario: They first ask you about your old passport. You say that you do not have it. And then during the interview another situation arises where they require proof of some item but that item can only be proven with your old passport. Now you have a "gotcha moment" since you already stated that you do not have the old passport. I would not risk such a situation.

So I would disclose both passports. If an issue arises about that long trip, you can prove that the trip is less than 6 months via the entry stamp in the destination country and then the return stamp from US border control. If available, you could also take the itinerary and ticket receipts for that trip with you as well.

Long story short: Tell always the truth and disclose all passports as required.
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+1 The truth shall set you free. Just disclose both and have proof in hand about the overstay issue.
 
On arrival, at the airport, the IO asked me: "How long have you been outside" of the US ? I answered: "Almost 6 months". Still couple days under 180. But he put "out 6 months". Anyways, I have the old passport, cause I asked to delay the return, cause I will be having naturalization interview and they said OK, though I filled out a declaration and I still have to return it after the interview.

On the other side, my native country is a member of the European Union. And because I have connecting flight, on arrival they do not stamp the passport with the arrival date. So I can not prove when I left the US. The only way to prove it is if they have me on a record when I left. I don't know if they have that, cause on departure no one stamps my passport. They still should have some records though. I am not sure.
 
Proxyon said:
On arrival, at the airport, the IO asked me: "How long have you been outside" of the US ? I answered: "Almost 6 months". Still couple days under 180. But he put "out 6 months". Anyways, I have the old passport, cause I asked to delay the return, cause I will be having naturalization interview and they said OK, though I filled out a declaration and I still have to return it after the interview.

On the other side, my native country is a member of the European Union. And because I have connecting flight, on arrival they do not stamp the passport with the arrival date. So I can not prove when I left the US. The only way to prove it is if they have me on a record when I left. I don't know if they have that, cause on departure no one stamps my passport. They still should have some records though. I am not sure.
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As far as I know they also scan your GC when you check-in at the airport. I assume that info is going to DHS as well, so USCIS might already have info about when you departed from the US.

Also, as I stated before, try to locate your itinerary and/or plane tickets for that particular trip. That should be proof about when you left the US. Also, you can truthfully explain to the interviewing officer that you told to border control "almost 6 months" but that they stamped it as 6 months. Frankly speaking, I think you will be fine. As I said before, as long as you disclose everything truthfully you will stay clear of trouble.
 
I requested the airline, to send me a record of all my trips. Lets hope they will do so, cause I do not keep the tickets. The worst scenario will go like that:

IO: Why do you have "out of 6 months" in the passport?
Me: I said "almost 6 months", but the IO at the airport wrote "out 6 months".
IO: Hm, since you don't have any proof of the actual days out of the US, I consider you've been out of 6 months, so give me evidence you haven't broken your continuous residence...

...and it will become complicated.

However, the passports still don't give them the full picture, cause they have just the arrival date. I wonder in case they need the dates, can they check it immediately, or it takes time.
 
Proxyon said:
I requested the airline, to send me a record of all my trips. Lets hope they will do so, cause I do not keep the tickets. The worst scenario will go like that:

IO: Why do you have "out of 6 months" in the passport?
Me: I said "almost 6 months", but the IO at the airport wrote "out 6 months".
IO: Hm, since you don't have any proof of the actual days out of the US, I consider you've been out of 6 months, so give me evidence you haven't broken your continuous residence...

...and it will become complicated.

However, the passports still don't give them the full picture, cause they have just the arrival date. I wonder in case they need the dates, can they check it immediately, or it takes time.
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USCIS must have the correct data on all your travels, because when you travel as a permanent resident, they scan your GC! I was advised at the local DO that dates of arrival/departure in passports sometimes erroneous, but GC scans show everything! In my case, the U.S. passport control officer stamped the wrong year at the arrival (Jan. 04 2007 instead of Jan. 04 2008 - probably, he did not get used to the new year by that time, but I was in a hurry and did not check the stamp. By the way, since that time I always check stamps before leaving passport control). I was concerned about this, took an info pass appointment, and they told me that the they have correct data through my green card scanning. My advise: DO NOT HIDE your old passport! Hand-written "6 months out" will not affect your naturalization, if indeed you were absent less than 183 days: your green card will "tell" the true information.
 
Proxyon said:
The point is this: I have 2 passports - the current one, and the one that expired. They want all the passports, including the ones that have expired. But by law, my native country requires the expired passports to be returned. "Out 6 months" is in the expired one. So I can simply say I have only the most recent one. I have a big concern once the IO sees "out 6 months" he/she will start nagging with me.
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1) As a GC holder, the U.S. law does not require you to have a national passport at all, expired or new. Most IOs don't ask for national passports, and if they do ask for them at all (e.g. to double-check the entry dates), you are still not required to have the passport/passports with you. However, if you do have the passport(s), it is a good idea to bring them anyway.

2) The IOs are very well aware that when a CBP agent writes something like "out 1 month" or "out 6 months" below the entry stamp, that indicates approximate, not exact, length of the trip.
If the IO has an issue with the length of the trip and wants to check the exact dates, they'll not go by the informal notation below the entry stamp but will look at the actual departure and arrival dates.

3) You can request a copy of your arrival/departure recors from the CBP:
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/976/kw/exit records/session/L3NpZC82NTJ6SmxYaw==

That record will contain the actual departure and arrival dates, not approximate ones. As noted above by others, when you do a check-in for an international flight from the U.S., the airline scans your GC and passport and transmits this data, with the passanger manifest, to the CBP.
 
mixing apples and oranges AGAIN!

Continuous Residence and Physical Presence are NOT the same thing. The statute uses six months NOT 180 days to discuss "continuous residence". Physical presence is described as "at least half" of the 5 year period. Physical presence can be counted in days but "continuous residence is counted in months". Compare the date of departure and date of return.

INA 316

(a) No person, except as otherwise provided in this title, shall be naturalized, unless such applicant,
(1) immediately preceding the date of filing his application for naturalization has resided continuously, after being lawfully admitted for permanent residence, within the United States for at least five years
and
during the five years immediately preceding the date of filing his application has been physically present therein for periods totaling at least half of that time,
and
who has resided within the State or within the district of the Service in the United States in which the applicant filed the application for at least three months,
(2) has resided continuously within the United States from the date of the application up to the time of admission to citizenship,
(3) during all the periods referred to in this subsection has been and still is a person of good moral character, attached to the principles of the Constitution of the United States, and well disposed to the good order and happiness of the United States.​


(b) Absence from the United States of more than six months but less than one year during the period for which continuous residence is required for admission to citizenship, immediately preceding the date of filing the application for naturalization, or during the period between the date of filing the application and the date of any hearing under section 336(a) , shall break the continuity of such residence, unless the applicant shall establish to the satisfaction of the Attorney General that he did not in fact abandon his residence in the United States during such period. .........
 
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