Number of days outside the USA with approved N-470

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sargodhian

Registered Users (C)
Hello Fellows,

I am working with an American company outside the USA for last 2.5 years with an approved N-470 and REP. I am going back to USA next week on a long leave from my company to fulfill 3months of physical state presence requirement. I will file my N-400 around last week of August 2010. My only concern is that I have exceeded the numbers of days outside the USA to about 32 days (number of days outside the USA 946 days). I am wondering if I can still apply for my citizenship after completing three months of physical presence in the state of residence.

I own home, have bank account, driving license, filed my both state and federal taxes. I know N-470 takes care of continuous residence requirement but question is does it help in physical presence requirement as well. I have 30 months of physical presence since I became LPR (Feb 28, 2005) but if I count it from the day of filling N-400 then I am in excess of about 32 days outside the USA. Please share your expert opinion.

Thank you
 
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Unless your approved N-470 specifies it also coves physical presence requirement, you will need to have at least 30 months of physical presence in US before you apply.
However, if you currently are only missing 32 days of physical presence in the last 5 years, in 3 months (in US) you will have made them up by the time you apply in August.
 
Bobsmyth said:
Unless your approved N-470 specifies it also coves physical presence requirement, you will need to have at least 30 months of physical presence in US before you apply.
However, if you currently are only missing 32 days of physical presence in the last 5 years, in 3 months (in US) you will have made them up by the time you apply in August.
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It could take much later than August, if there were no or few days outside the US in the first few months of the 5-year lookback period. It could even take a couple of years to reach the 2.5 years of presence, if the bulk of the OP's absences are in the last 3 years. In such a situation, a day gained by waiting in the US now would just be offset by losing a day of presence lost at the beginning, so there is no net gain until the days outside the US start to drop out of the picture much later.
 
Jackolantern said:
It could take much later than August, if there were no or few days outside the US in the first few months of the 5-year lookback period. It could even take a couple of years to reach the 2.5 years of presence, if the bulk of the OP's absences are in the last 3 years. In such a situation, a day gained by waiting in the US now would just be offset by losing a day of presence lost at the beginning, so there is no net gain until the days outside the US start to drop out of the picture much later.
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The OP mentioned that he currently has 30 months of physical presence since Feb 2005, so how do you conclude it can take longer than August and even a couple of years to reach 2.5 of presence by the time he applies given that he's returning next week to US.?
 
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Bob, we need to look at a "sliding window" of 5 years.

If the OP stayed in US for all first month on GC, when he/she comes back and stays a month, he will discard that first month (from calculations) when adding this new month to the day count.

Net result = no change.

If the OP stayed 30 months in US (with no break), then 30 months out (with no break) ... now he will need to stay another 30 months before his presence starts having an effect on the days count.
 
sanjoseaug20 said:
Bob, we need to look at a "sliding window" of 5 years.

If the OP stayed in US for all first month on GC, when he/she comes back and stays a month, he will discard that first month (from calculations) when adding this new month to the day count.

Net result = no change.

If the OP stayed 30 months in US (with no break), then 30 months out (with no break) ... now he will need to stay another 30 months before his presence starts having an effect on the days count.
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Again, that doesn't explain why it would take more than August for OP to regain physical presence. The OP mentioned he is currently 32 days short of obtaining 30 months or physical presence, yet has 30 months of physical presence since Feb 2005. So next week when he returns to US, he will be about 40 days short of 30 months of physical presence and will obviously make up those 40 days by August when he plans to apply.
Btw, even if OP was out for 30 months straight since Feb 2005, then 30 months out, he would still have accumulated just below 30 months of physical presence up to now. I don't know where you get the idea that he would need to stay another 30 months in US before his physical presence can be counted again.
 
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Thank you Fellows,

Here are my days in and outside the USA:

Days in the USA

Became LPR on 02/28/2005
02/28/2005------11/16/2006-------626
01/20/2007------05/13/2007-------113
05/26/2007------11/01/2007-------159
12/28/2007------01/04/2008-------7
05/14/2008------06/06/2008-------23
08/08/2008------08/22/2008-------14
03/09/2010------03/19/2010-------10

Total Number of days in the USA since becoming LPR: 952


Days outside the USA

11/17/2006------01/19/2007-------63
05/14/2007------05/25/2007-------11
11/01/2007------12/27/2007-------56---------With Approved N-470 & REP
01/05/2008------05/13/2008-------129--------With Approved N-470 & REP
06/06/2008------08/07/2008-------62---------With Approved N-470 & REP
08/22/2008------03/08/2010-------563--------With Approved N-470 & REP
03/20/2010------05/21/2010-------62----------With Approved N-470 & REP

Total Number of days outside the USA since becoming LPR: 946

I hope this will clear some of the confusion. Thank you again for your help and support
 
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sargodhian said:
Days in the USA Days outside the USA
2/28/2005 11/16/2006 626 11/17/2006 1/19/2007 63
1/20/2007 5/13/2007 113 5/14/2007 5/25/2007 11
5/26/2007 11/1/2007 159 11/1/2007 12/27/2007 56
12/28/2007 1/4/2008 7 1/5/2008 5/13/2008 129
5/14/2008 6/6/2008 23 6/6/2008 8/7/2008 62
8/8/2008 8/22/2008 14 8/22/2008 3/8/2010 563
3/9/2010 3/19/2010 10 3/20/2010 5/21/2010 62

Total Number of days 952 946
Click to expand...

This is a nice example for "sliding 5 year window".
Let us see when his physical presence days will be met.
 
sanjoseaug20 said:
Let us see when his physical presence days will be met.
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Physical presence requirement is calculated in the statutory period (in OP's case previous 5 years before applying).The OP is planning to apply in August 2010, therefore physical presence would be measured from the period of August 2005 to August 2010.During this period the OP has been out of US for a total of 946 days, which indicates that he would not meet physical presence requirement. Since he's short by about 35 days, he would have to wait roughly until 35 days after 11/16/2011, meaning that by the end of next year he will have meet physical presence and can apply by then.

So yes, the sliding scale does play an important role (as you and Jackolantern stated) when calculating physical presence, especially when the bulk of days outside of US are close together during the statutory period.
 
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Does this mean that my N-470 won't help in this case? I cannot stay more than 4 months in the USA and this is specifically to fulfil my state residency requirement.

Thank you
 
As Bob said in his first comment... unless you got approval to maintain "physical presence", it will not.
You need to return for quite some time (nearly 15 months ... maybe more depending on when you return) before you can meet the physical presence requirements.
 
Thank you Sanjoseaug20,

How can I tell if it's approved for "Physical presence" as well? It only state and I quote "It is Ordered that the within-named applicant, and his spouse, (name), be granted the benefits applied for in this application to cover absence from the united state from the date stated therein to an indefinite date thereafter so long as he remains in the employment of the employer and is absent for the purpose alleged therein"

Undersigned
 
Bobsmyth said:
So yes, the sliding scale does play an important role (as you and Jackolantern stated) when calculating physical presence, especially when the bulk of days outside of US are close together during the statutory period.
Click to expand...

The biggest factor is whether the bulk of the absences are towards the end or the beginning of the statutory period. If the absences are mostly towards the end, the sliding window has to move forward much more to make the absences start dropping out and get replaced by new days in the US. If the absences are mostly in the beginning, the absences drop off soon and are replaced by the new days in the US.
 
Sorry Fellows,

I entered a wrong date in one of the trips it’s

12/11/2007------12/27/2007-------16---------With Approved N-470 & REP

Which brings the total number of days outside the USA to 905.
 
sargodhian said:
Sorry Fellows,

I entered a wrong date in one of the trips it’s

12/11/2007------12/27/2007-------16---------With Approved N-470 & REP

Which brings the total number of days outside the USA to 905.
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Then you can go ahead and apply right now, if you're currently living in the same district/state as before you left. You don't need to spend another 3 months now if you already lived there for 3 months before and returned to the same district/state without living anywhere else in between.
 
Jackolantern said:
Then you can go ahead and apply right now, if you're currently living in the same district/state as before you left. You don't need to spend another 3 months now if you already lived there for 3 months before and returned to the same district/state without living anywhere else in between.
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The OP is only returning next week, so he can't apply now. 905 days outside it too close to call as USCIS is liable to count 30 months as (30x30)= 900 days , not 913 days (5x365)/2, and therefore consider that he has spent too much time outside the US.
 
Bobsmyth said:
The OP is only returning next week, so he can't apply now. 905 days outside it too close to call as USCIS is liable to count 30 months as (30x30)= 900 days , not 913 days (5x365)/2, and therefore consider that he has spent too much time outside the US.
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Oops, I misread something and thought he was already back in the US for a while. But he should be good to go sometime next month.
 
Thank Fellows,

I stayed in the same state, same house for 10 plus years before I left the country. I still own the home and therefore use it during my short trips to USA (including the trip that I made in March 2010).

Jackolantern,

Do you mean to say I do not have to fulfill 3 months of physical presence in the state of residence and can file as soon as I reached there? Is this documented with USCIS? Do you know someone with similar situation as mine on this forum?

Thank you Fellows for your unselfish support
 
Thank you Sanjoseaug20,

Great, looks like I do not have to wait 3 months as I was there about two months ago for 10 days. I will apply within couple of weeks after arriving my residence in the state
 
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