New document procedure being implemented

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#1
KCC are sending emails to some (or perhaps all) cases asking the selected to scan and email the main documents to KCC. I assume this is an attempt to improve processing speed and perhaps help in assisting the embassies make good decisions. I see it as a positive improvement.

So - if you receive such a request, just get on with it.

More info here:

http://britsimonsays.com/kcc-using-new-document-procedure-in-some-cases/
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#2
Interesting. It does introduce a possible delay for some people - where I come from some civil documents can take months to get, so if kcc needs them before even scheduling an interview it could delay the whole process. Do you have any insight as to whether this is done as soon as processing is complete, or closer to numbers being current?

Certainly will be interesting to follow and see if everyone gets them or if they are for selected cases and if so what the trigger is.
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#3
Oh, it’s everyone. The dvselectee pages have been updated.
https://travel.state.gov/content/tr...ersity-visa-prepare-supporting-documents.html

Extract:


Submit Supporting Documents

After KCC receives and processes the DS-260 application form for you and your accompanying family members, you will receive instructions for how to scan and upload required supporting documents. Your interview will not be scheduled until you submit scanned copies of all required supporting documents, following the guidelines below. You will bring the original documents to your interview with the consular officer. It is strongly recommended that you begin this process early.
The applicant and each family member who will accompany the applicant to the United States will need to submit scanned copies and any required translations of original documents or certified copies of the documents listed below from an appropriate office, authority, or issuing entity in your country. You will be required to bring the original documents to your visa interview at the U.S. embassy or consulate, along with any translations required.
Documents
Review the information below to determine which documents you will need to obtain. KCC will send instructions explaining how to scan and email the documents and any required translations after you submit a valid DS-260 application for you and all accompanying family members. Your visa interview appointment will not be scheduled until KCC has received and reviewed all required supporting documents. You will take original documents with you to your interview at a U.S. embassy or consulate. Do not mail any of these documents to the Kentucky Consular Center. All paper documents or correspondence mailed to KCC will be destroyed.
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#4
Oh, it’s everyone. The dvselectee pages have been updated.
https://travel.state.gov/content/tr...ersity-visa-prepare-supporting-documents.html

Extract:


Submit Supporting Documents

After KCC receives and processes the DS-260 application form for you and your accompanying family members, you will receive instructions for how to scan and upload required supporting documents. Your interview will not be scheduled until you submit scanned copies of all required supporting documents, following the guidelines below. You will bring the original documents to your interview with the consular officer. It is strongly recommended that you begin this process early.
The applicant and each family member who will accompany the applicant to the United States will need to submit scanned copies and any required translations of original documents or certified copies of the documents listed below from an appropriate office, authority, or issuing entity in your country. You will be required to bring the original documents to your visa interview at the U.S. embassy or consulate, along with any translations required.
Documents
Review the information below to determine which documents you will need to obtain. KCC will send instructions explaining how to scan and email the documents and any required translations after you submit a valid DS-260 application for you and all accompanying family members. Your visa interview appointment will not be scheduled until KCC has received and reviewed all required supporting documents. You will take original documents with you to your interview at a U.S. embassy or consulate. Do not mail any of these documents to the Kentucky Consular Center. All paper documents or correspondence mailed to KCC will be destroyed.
Good catch Susie - thanks!
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#6
Simon, it would probably be useful if you can encourage your site devotees to give feedback on how long after they upload, they get interview notices. I'm just wondering how long the document review by KCC will take as it seems they are doing more than just confirming uploads, though how substantive their review is I wouldn't guess.
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#7
Simon, it would probably be useful if you can encourage your site devotees to give feedback on how long after they upload, they get interview notices. I'm just wondering how long the document review by KCC will take as it seems they are doing more than just confirming uploads, though how substantive their review is I wouldn't guess.
Yep I will get more info over time. From the timing it seems this is new for Jan onwards. I'm going to recommend people predict getting the email and get ready to respond, but not too soon so the police cert isn't too old by the interview.
 

Reg1

New Member
#9
How the police cert can get too old if it's valid for 1 year? Am I missing some info?
I read police certificates from your country of residence have to be less than 6 months old. From former countries of residence the police certificates can be even over 1 yr old, as long as you did not return there since their issue. So it depends, there was no standard rule, it depended on your case officer accepting or not. Maybe that'll change now.

I guess centralisation (via scanning) will help to standardise processes, so there can be auditing from KCC if need be, and no case officer can deviate too much from set requirements. This is good I suppose, because interviewees who would be placed on AP (ie. delay through lack of required docs) will now be able to go to appointments knowing their officer already got most papers (and might have reviewed them prior to your visit, and before approving even your appointment), and thus are less likely to spring surprises (ie. demanding a doc from a country where that requirement is already waived). I actually read of people who were asked to show papers that are waived by standard procedure, but candidates were at the mercy of non-relenting case-officers, putting them in a catch-22 or infinite loop situation. For example you're not supposed to ask a high school diploma, if you're already showing a university degree, or not supposed to show wedding photos if you've already got a legal marriage certificate, etc.
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#10
How the police cert can get too old if it's valid for 1 year? Am I missing some info?
In some cases (where the CO is sure you have not been back to a country since the report was produced), a police cert can be accepted even if older than 1 year. However, as a principle a police cert has almost no logical validity. I could have a 1 month old police cert but been arrested for bank robbery 2 weeks ago. So - have newer police certs is wise anyway. COs are human and allowed to digress from set norms. So - we have seen COs asking for police certs from a foreign country where the selectee has not lived for more than 1 year. Technically not correct, but once the CO has asked - it becomes the requirement.
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#11
I read police certificates from your country of residence have to be less than 6 months old. From former countries of residence the police certificates can be even over 1 yr old, as long as you did not return there since their issue. So it depends, there was no standard rule, it depended on your case officer accepting or not. Maybe that'll change now.

I guess centralisation (via scanning) will help to standardise processes, so there can be auditing from KCC if need be, and no case officer can deviate too much from set requirements. This is good I suppose, because interviewees who would be placed on AP (ie. delay through lack of required docs) will now be able to go to appointments knowing their officer already got most papers (and might have reviewed them prior to your visit, and before approving even your appointment), and thus are less likely to spring surprises (ie. demanding a doc from a country where that requirement is already waived). I actually read of people who were asked to show papers that are waived by standard procedure, but candidates were at the mercy of non-relenting case-officers, putting them in a catch-22 or infinite loop situation. For example you're not supposed to ask a high school diploma, if you're already showing a university degree, or not supposed to show wedding photos if you've already got a legal marriage certificate, etc.

Yes I agree with your second paragraph to some extent. However, For your two examples, both are justifiable in some circumstances and in both cases the CO will still make the decision of what documents they want.
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#12
For example you're not supposed to ask a high school diploma, if you're already showing a university degree, or not supposed to show wedding photos if you've already got a legal marriage certificate, etc.
I’m not sure who told you these factors, but both of them are inaccurate. For the 2 examples you cited - We always tell people to show their high school diploma if possible because that’s actually the criterion and we know most COs ask for them, and for a recent marriage you should certainly expect to show evidence it’s bona fide, not just a marriage certificate. The CO may decide not to ask for them, but to blanket state you don’t need them in either case is just plain wrong.
 

Reg1

New Member
#13
I’m not sure who told you these factors, but both of them are inaccurate. For the 2 examples you cited - We always tell people to show their high school diploma if possible because that’s actually the criterion and we know most COs ask for them, and for a recent marriage you should certainly expect to show evidence it’s bona fide, not just a marriage certificate. The CO may decide not to ask for them, but to blanket state you don’t need them in either case is just plain wrong.
Nobody told me, and yes it says people need "at least" an HS diploma in the instructions (as a minimal threshold, not a criteria of itself), but during DV online application you clearly have the choice of selecting "your highest level of education", and if a person chooses something that's "higher" than high school, it's logical that CO's should not be asking for a document that's already superseded (unless fraud is an issue). It's like asking a person born in Paris, France if he was born in Europe, or 6 foot tall guy if he was ever 5 foot tall earlier in life!
In any case, I know CO's may ask for anything, even HS diploma's from PHD professors, but it's pedantic if not meaningless if the degree is proven. I was just hoping the new procedure would take the bug (and undue stress) out of such oddness, and I'm sure to a certain extent it will. However since the days of DV are possibly counted, maybe it's all moot.
Yes, you're right that in certain places (especially where fraud is an issue, docs are unreliable, and marriages of convenience may be an issue) that they regularly ask for secondary evidences (photos, witnesses, kids, etc.), which is all reasonable for those cases.
So my statement was general, that people will be better informed before an interview takes place with less chance of unpleasant surprises, and I feel it's a good development...in general.
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#14
Plenty of people enter into green card marriages (or try to, anyway), not just from places where fraud is an issue and not just for DV. It would be kind of naive for someone who got married between dv selection and interview to think that just presenting a marriage certificate is enough. Anyway, that’s what these forums are for, especially the two examples you mention are issues that come up repeatedly and that those of us who have been following DV for some years advise on. Anyway it’s not clear exactly what kcc will do and while they might advise an applicant that they need to upload a HS diploma, I highly doubt they will tell people to upload evidence beyond a marriage certificate, because the judgement involved in assessing that kind of evidence has to be done by a CO.
 

Reg1

New Member
#15
Plenty of people enter into green card marriages (or try to, anyway), not just from places where fraud is an issue and not just for DV. It would be kind of naive for someone who got married between dv selection and interview to think that just presenting a marriage certificate is enough. Anyway, that’s what these forums are for, especially the two examples you mention are issues that come up repeatedly and that those of us who have been following DV for some years advise on. Anyway it’s not clear exactly what kcc will do and while they might advise an applicant that they need to upload a HS diploma, I highly doubt they will tell people to upload evidence beyond a marriage certificate, because the judgement involved in assessing that kind of evidence has to be done by a CO.
Yes, I guess so. And while neither situation actually applies to me, I've always wondered why GED diploma's are not accepted for the DV, and if people with university degrees based on GED are even considered to have met the minimal education level (if they didn't already have relevant work experience). So in a way it's also good there's a human CO to look at the completed submission to make the final assessment.
 

SusieQQQ

Well-Known Member
#16
Yes, I guess so. And while neither situation actually applies to me, I've always wondered why GED diploma's are not accepted for the DV, and if people with university degrees based on GED are even considered to have met the minimal education level (if they didn't already have relevant work experience). So in a way it's also good there's a human CO to look at the completed submission to make the final assessment.
The website makes it clear that only a consular official can make the final decision as to whether an applicant is qualified to receive a visa. This new step at kcc does nothing to change that, I’m assuming its main function is to ensure the minimum documentation exists and is submitted, and possibly reviewed by the CO ahead of the interview, to help streamline procedures at the embassy.
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#17
The intent is that someone has undergone a formal course of education equivalent to a US High school education. So - someone who can only show a GED (and cannot show the formal course of education) does not meet the requirement. Similarly, just getting a higher level degree does not show that a person underwent the formal course of education. The 9 FAM notes are quite comprehensive about this (and have just been updated in a number of areas by the way).
 
#18
I also received the same email this morning.
My last police certificate is from March this year, which is 8 months old now. I am wondering if it's ok to send that one? (I am travelling at the moment, so, not easy to get a new one without flying back and I wasn't planning to fly back until the interview/medical). On the website they say that a certificate is valid if it was obtained less than a year ago. What are your thoughts on this?

Another question I have is, should I also send education documents or only send police certificate, birth certificate and passport? (they didn't mention anything related to the education documents in the email or the travel.state.gov website).

Thanks, appreciate any advice!
 

Britsimon

Super Moderator
#19
I also received the same email this morning.
My last police certificate is from March this year, which is 8 months old now. I am wondering if it's ok to send that one? (I am travelling at the moment, so, not easy to get a new one without flying back and I wasn't planning to fly back until the interview/medical). On the website they say that a certificate is valid if it was obtained less than a year ago. What are your thoughts on this?

Another question I have is, should I also send education documents or only send police certificate, birth certificate and passport? (they didn't mention anything related to the education documents in the email or the travel.state.gov website).

Thanks, appreciate any advice!
Send the police cert you have and get a new one for the interview.

Send what is listed.
 

Reg1

New Member
#20
The intent is that someone has undergone a formal course of education equivalent to a US High school education. So - someone who can only show a GED (and cannot show the formal course of education) does not meet the requirement. Similarly, just getting a higher level degree does not show that a person underwent the formal course of education. The 9 FAM notes are quite comprehensive about this (and have just been updated in a number of areas by the way).
Allright, thanks.
 
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