N-400 Decision cannot be made - HELP PLEASE - married twice to the same person

I

Infiniti0

Registered Users (C)
Hi,

Had my interview in OKC, OK for the citizenship based on a 3 years marriage to an American citizen and I've received the N-652 Form with the "A decision cannot be made about your application".

The IO got upset because I did not mention on the N-400 that I was previously married to my wife in OK. She said she needs to review the case further and look through the papers I have processed at the Embassy when I've got my I-130 approved.

In 2003 I married my wife in Oklahoma then applied for Adjustment of Status and 2 months later I left to Europe. Application was initially denied due to problems with the initial marriage license saying the marriage was not valid.

I left US before I've found out that application was rejected and never knew about a deportation order. Now at the N-400 Interview the IO said I had a deportation order in 2003, but I never got the mail because I already left the US. I've answered on the N-400 saying I was never deported.

Later on we married again in Europe just to be sure there are no legal issues and we've applied for the I-130 which was approved and processed oversees at the Embassy. We've arrived in US 3 years ago, I've got my 10 years GC, I have been through "Remove conditions from the permanent resident status" and all that.

At the Embassy and on the N-400 I did not mention my previous marriage from OK because I knew it was invalid from what the denial letter said. We've never been married before to anybody else. We just re-married in Europe to make sure its legal and never paid attention to it enough to mention it to the IO, because the Embassy already accepted it, approved the I-130 and I already removed the conditions from the permanent residence.

The current Immigration Officer said I didn't say the whole story, she was upset, she did not accuse me of lying, but she was upset. I told the truth. She said I was supposed to mention it to her that I was married before and said I did not say the whole story, not on the N-400 nor at the Embassy.

She gave me the N-652 saying she will review the case and let me know.

Based on the fact that I've considered the first marriage as invalid I decided not to mention it anywhere, why would I? I remarried the same person and we did not get divorced or get the first one annulled because I knew it was invalid.

Obviously some of the questions on N-4O0 were answered based on the fact that we did not consider the first marriage as been valid.


Questions:
1. If I do get denied, what will happen to us?
2. Will they take my 10 year green card away?
3. Can I keep my greencard and appeal hoping to correct my N-400 and mention the first marriage (even though we knew it was invalid based on their denial letter)?
4. If appeal will fail, do I have a chance in the Federal court?
5. Can they actually deport me based on these facts, or can I reapply based on the 5 ys residency that I will have in 2 years?
6. I've been living here for 3 years and I have a great job, we bought a house, cars and we're completely integrated into society? Does that matter, or will they just deny the N-400 and deport?

I do appreciate any help you guys have, maybe you've heard about something like this before.

We are scared s***less.
 
I don't see any issue with your case. The IO was peeved because you left out the fact that you did not disclose your previous marriage. All your facts must be verified before your case can be adjudicated.
In the event that they deny your case based on not disclosing previous marriage and deportation order, you have a good chance to appeal based on the fact that the first marriage was invalid and that you were already out of the US when deportation order was issued.
Also, if they deny your N-400 they wouldn't deport you or take away your GC as it was obtained legally.
 
if your marriages(first and second one) to the same woman was 100% legit, then you have nothing to worry about.
just make sure you can document and back up your claim. There is no law that says you can't get married to
the same woman over and over again. People are entitle to change their minds... besides, your divorce lawyer
probably has some kind of multiple-divorce discount for you, yes? :)

my cousin was in a similar situation several years ago. didn't cause a problem... but then again, he and his wife
showed up together while she was VERY pregnant.(in fact, she gave birth to their twins just 5 days after the interveiw)
 
I did not mention the first marriage on the n-400 and the I-130 at the embassy because the first marriage was invalid, but only based on the denial letter from INS (back in 2003) for my previous Adjustment on status based on that marriage.

When I received that denial I was already gone from US, because I had to go back to Europe. I only heard about my denial from my mother in law and she claims she never got papers for me about any deportation orders.

I just called the Court House where we got married the first time and they claim the first marriage is valid and they have nothing on file to dissolve it (We never got divorced, we never annulled it). From their point of view, the first marriage is completely valid. I didn't know about this until I called today.

So what do I do, the first marriage in OK is valid, and we are also married in Europe. We got the i-130 approved and got my Permanent Residence based on the marriage in Europe 3 years ago. Does that matter?

It made sense to us to think our last marriage was widely accepted because we've been through FIRE with the US Embassy abroad. We also had to go through hell with USCIS when we did the Remove the conditions on permanent residence based on marriage to a US citizen.

IS there any way for me to write to the IO and request permission to correct my current N-400 form and include information about my first marriage, all this before she would actually give me the DENIAL response? Does this sound dumb? Is this considered lying? Would I be able to file an affidavit and swear we did not know about deportation letters, or the first marriage was still valid?

I appreciate your answers.
 
Infiniti0 said:
IS there any way for me to write to the IO and request permission to correct my current N-400 form and include information about my first marriage, all this before she would actually give me the DENIAL response? Does this sound dumb? Is this considered lying? Would I be able to file an affidavit and swear we did not know about deportation letters, or the first marriage was still valid?
Click to expand...

You can write to the IO now, or you can wait for the decision and appeal.
Also, based on what the decision says, you can appeal, or re-file with revised application.
Maybe they will just approve it.
But if the decision is negative, it will at least tell you their line of thinking. If they allege serious issues, you fight it. If they deny with "no prejudice to future filings", maybe forget the appeal and re-file with a detailed explanation.
I have not seen too many (or any) cases of people being able to intervene in the decision process after the interview ... unless the IO asked for some evidence.
 
Infiniti0 said:
I did not mention the first marriage on the n-400 and the I-130 at the embassy because the first marriage was invalid, but only based on the denial letter from INS (back in 2003) for my previous Adjustment on status based on that marriage.
Click to expand...

When you were applying for green card via consular processing from abroad, did your disclose the fact that you had previously applied for adjustment of status and that that application was denied?
 
Infiniti0 said:
Application was initially denied due to problems with the initial marriage license saying the marriage was not valid.
Click to expand...
Infiniti0 said:
I just called the Court House where we got married the first time and they claim the first marriage is valid and they have nothing on file to dissolve it.
Click to expand...
Who told you the original marriage was invalid since this contradicts what the court house told you?
 
Baikal - as far as I can remember I did not mention that on the i-130 because I didn't think it mattered then.

The only thing I know about that, was from my mother in law when she read the initial denial letter over the phone (when I was in Europe). The denial letter simply said the application is rejected because of the marriage being invalid. I didn't think they even processed it.

I did not mention at the embassy about my previous Adjustment of status application and the only reason I ever knew the marriage was considered invalid was from the denial letter.
 
At the embassy you were supposed to disclose that you applied for a green card before.

And the embassy or USCIS saying your marriage is invalid doesn't mean it is invalid. It only means you failed to provide enough evidence to prove the validity. Your mistake was accepting their conclusion of the validity without checking with the authorities that issued the marriage certificate.
 
Jackolatern, you are right, I did not check with the court house for the validity myself. I wasn't in US to do so, but that's no excuse.

Can they revoke my GC based on the 2nd marriage in Europe?
 
Infiniti0 said:
Jackolatern, you are right, I did not check with the court house for the validity myself. I wasn't in US to do so, but that's no excuse.
Click to expand...

When you applied for adjustment of status in the U.S. after getting married in the U.S. in 2003 (I assumed you filed I-130 and I-485 concurrently, right?), did you have an immigration interview before the application was denied? What was your visa status in the meantime?

And what precisely did the denial notice say, verbatim? Do you still have that denial notice?
There are two basic possible reasons for denial in such a situation:
1) The application was fundamentally incomplete in some way, e.g. if some of the required documents were missing. In such a case the application would be rejected and returned almost immediately.
2) The INS/USCIS decided that your marriage was fraudulent and that you got married just in order to get a green card.
The denial letter should have stated which one of these reasons was applicable.
 
I am sure my first AOS was incomplete and had problems. I am fine with that.

I left the USA before I've found about about my Adjustment of Status being rejected and even before the IO said my deportation papers were mailed.

I was in Europe and I had my mother in law read the reject notice over the phone. I never had the actual papers in my hand. It stated my application was rejected because of the marriage was not valid. Nobody mentioned any deportation letters. None.

That's why I considered it was not even processed. They never mention any fraudulent, or any big words like that, nor threats or anything.

If it was rejected and not processed, do I still need to declare it?
 
No. I've only sent the i-130 and AOS, as far as I can remember and I never went to an interview in 2003.

I didn't even care about those forms. I've filled the form and mailed them, after that I really did not take it seriously. I just moved on.

In 2005 we remarried in Europe, and we started the process from scratch with I-130 at the Embassy where we had interviews until 2007 when our I-130 was approved.
 
Infiniti0 said:
If it was rejected and not processed, do I still need to declare it?
Click to expand...
Didnt the embassy paperwork include a question about whether you applied for a green card before? Such a question is asking about whether you applied, not whether it was approved, so you should have mentioned it.
 
Infiniti0 said:
No. I've only sent the i-130 and AOS, as far as I can remember and I never went to an interview in 2003.

I didn't even care about those forms. I've filled the form and mailed them, after that I really did not take it seriously. I just moved on.

In 2005 we remarried in Europe, and we started the process from scratch with I-130 at the Embassy where we had interviews until 2007 when our I-130 was approved.
Click to expand...

Hmm. I am sure there is a lot more to the story than you are telling us here.
The only concrete piece of advice I have for you now is to talk to an immigration lawyer and to try to get copies of all the documents related to your 2003 application: the denial notice, deportation order, etc. If you don't have these things, the lawyer will explain to you how to recover them (possibly by filing a FOI/PA request for a complete copy of your A-file).

Regarding some of the other things you asked: you had your chance at the naturalization interview to explain things to the IO. So unless you receive a request for additional evidence from USCIS, you should just wait for the decision now and make preparations for the possible adverse outcome.

There are three possible things that could happen:

1) your N-400 is approved and you receive an oath letter; possible, but, in my personal opinion, fairly unlikely.

2) your N-400 is denied on the lack of good moral character grounds (for concealing relevant material facts in your N-400 application) and your N-400 is denied without them attempting to revoke your green card. In this case you'll be able to re-file a new N-400 in a few years and possibly be approved then.

3) your N-400 is denied and they try to revoke your green card and initiate removal proceedings.
Thus might happen if the IO, after reviewing your immigrant visa and I-130 application used to obtain a green card after your marriage in Europe, decides that significant misrepresentation and fraud was involved in that application, and that this merits revoking the green card.
In this case you'll have the opportunity to contest such a decision in court.

First, regarding the "invalid marriage" thing. USCIS (and, previously, INS) does not have the power to invalidate a marriage certificate. All USCIS can do is to decide that, for immigration purposes, a marriage was fraudulent and was entered into only to obtain a particular immigration benefit and that therefore an applicant is not entitled to that immigration benefit (such as a green card). Most likely this is what happen in your case. Such a finding by USCIS does not legally invalidate the marriage and only a court, after a divorce or an annulment proceedings, can legally terminate a marriage. Your claim that you did not understand this and that, based on some phone conversation with your mother-in-law who read you the denial notice, you decided that you were no longer married, strains credibility and you will have a difficult time convincing USCIS of this.

There are also possible problems with your denial of any prior knowledge about the deportation order. Before a deportation order is issued, the subject usually receives a "Notice to appear" (NTA) with the date and time of the deportation hearing. If the subject misses the hearing, there would be a default judgement and a deportation order would be issued and mailed to the subject. In your case both the NTA and the deportation order would have been sent to the home address specified on your I-485 application, which, as I understand it, was your mother-in-law's address. It is somewhat difficult to believe that both the NTA and the deportation order somehow never arrived.

Then there are problems with your immigrant visa and I-130 application that your filed from Europe. I am not familiar with the details of the consular processing route for obtaining a green card, but I am pretty sure that there were forms you had to fill with questions about your immigration history, about any prior deportation orders, etc where you most likely would have had to disclose your previous green card application. These questions could also have been asked during the interview you had at the consulate for your green card application. As you say, you did not disclose the info about your first green card application then. Plus you presumably specified the "married since" date corresponding to the date of your getting married in Europe. Depending on the particulars (which exactly you wrote in those forms and what you said at the consular interview), the IO reviewing your naturalization case now may quite possibly decide that you intentionally concealed and misrepresented relevant material information during your (second) green card application. In that case the IO might decide to revoke your green card and try to deport you.

Basically, a great deal depends on the individual judgement and discretion of the IO considering your N-400 applications as well as on the particular details of your green card applications. So, like I said, the possible outcome ranges from getting your N-400 approved to getting your green card revoked.
That's why I'd much suggest that you talk to an immigration lawyer now.
 
baikal3 said:
Such a finding by USCIS does not legally invalidate the marriage and only a court, after a divorce or an annulment proceedings, can legally terminate a marriage.
Click to expand...

It seems the OP thought the USCIS decision was not about termination of the marriage, but that USCIS investigated the marriage details with the issuing authorities and found that the marriage was never valid due to an improper marriage license or some other bureaucratic glitch.

Still, it's odd to just sit back and accept that based on a letter read over the phone without investigating or challenging it.
 
I can't stop blaming myself for my own mistake of not checking the validity of the first marriage when I got back to US. It was impossible for me to check it when I was in Europe, because I didn't have anybody to help us (we were in Europe).

I've abandoned the applications Ive sent to INS in 2003, I was gone before I got the denial and any letters from them (even if nobody told me, or nobody mentioned anything besides the denial letter). The family on my wife's side probably lied to me and I will eventually find out now.

Is it too late? Do you think an affidavit or a new testimony will help saying that I've told the truth and I did not lie about the first marriage, based on what "I thought I know"?

Why didn't the Embassy oversees say anything, they had all my records. They knew all the information (names, SSN) . They accepted our marriage, never mentioned anything else. I just didn't mention the first marriage based on what I thought I knew, without intention to commit false testimony. Did not mention AOS in 2003 because I thought it wasnt processed at all and simply rejected and not processed and denied. It was totally abandoned.

Why did USCIS remove my conditions for the permanent residence in Nov. 2009 and I gave them identical information as I did for the N-400.

I didn't come in US through the back door, I've been processed at the Embassy, airport, USCIS here in US, removed conditions. total of more than 5 years of papers....just to let me integrate into society and then hit me with technicalities? (of course I am guilty too for not checking)

I will hire a lawyer and I will update this post if I have something new. Feel free to post your opinions based on other similar cases. More information doesn't hurt me...
 
#1. I think the denial letter said that the marriage was not bona fide. Bona fide not as in the marriage certificate was not good, but bona fide as in they believed you married to get immigration benefits, and hence it was not genuine in their mind. This is my assumption only because it seems none of us has the full information, but it fits what I have been reading. Also, I do not think it is a question of family mis-quoting the letter, it might be a question of "my english" vs "your english".

#2. When dealing with such legal matters, it is never good to rely on what you heard, but have the right evidence. It will be hard to fight your case if the evidence is that someone told you over phone about the marriage being invalid. Not only do you need to get the evidence by FOIA or whatever means, you need to lay out your timeline (not here, but for USCIS perspective) in very clear and understandable manner.

#3. Hiring a lawyer will be a best course of action given your situation. It is possible they may not deny, but then they might too. Given the complexities of your case, you should hire a lawyer now as it gives you time to prepare your case. Just in case the denial letter is lost or delayed, you will be able to get the appeal up and running within days.

Why did USCIS remove conditions? CIS can do anything - because they are government!! They can make mistakes, and if they discover the mistakes before the statute runs out, they can just send you a notice and fix their mistake. It is for this reason many people here are advised to file N400 after 5 years of GC, since then the CIS needs to go to a judge and prove fraud to overturn the GC. Anyway ... all this is moot point now.
 
1. It was not a bona fide denial.
2. Obviously my mistake. I should of check, but I thought if I start the whole immigration process from scratch it would not be a problem. Bad judgement on my side.
3. Meeting with immigration lawyer tomorrow.

Thank you for all the help. Do you have any information about N-400 appeals and denials based on stories like this?

Do I have a chance to correct the N-400 form before a denial or approval decision? The IO never asked me the question: were you married before? I was under OATH and I was prepared to tell the truth. She just told me I did not tell the whole story because I did not mention the first marriage and the AOS application in 2003, and deportation orders.
 
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