I-485 RFE received for birth certificate of parents. Can't get Non-availability of Birth Certificate from India

AAMR said:
Hello JayP -

We were not able to get the Non Availability of Birth Certificate nor the Birth Certificate for both my parents - even though my parents were born in a metropolitan city like Bombay. But we had hired a lawyer in India and had him apply for the Birth Certificate at the Birth Registrars office in India's Local office where my parents were born and obtained a copy of the application receipt. FYI - till date we do not have any response to that application even after multiple follow ups - cannot even expect any now considering the pandemic.

To have a professionally formatted response to the RFE we hired a lawyer in the USA and she responded with the following to the RFE:

1. The below details from USCIS website stating Visa Reciprocity - as my parents were born in 1940's
2. All additional available Government Documents of my parents - copy of ration card, copy of their school certificate (which for weird reason did not mention the place of birth), their school report cards, professional certification documents, copy of their employment appointment letters, domicile certificates and a few other documents - which specifically did not state their place of birth - but was very clear of their place of birth and existence. Fortunate enough they had retained all the above documents even though they are almost disintegrated but were readable.
3. The Birth Certificate application receipt - stating we have applied but have not received any thing yet.

The lawyer responded with all of the above on Jan 27th 2020 and we got an update on the USCIS website on Feb 24, 2020 where we are awaiting for an interview date - and then the lock down from March happened. So are awaiting the interview date or otherwise. We will have to wait and see.

Hope the above helps and hope you find a way around. Sorry you are going thru this but I know how stressful it could be.

Birth Certificates
Available: For persons born after April 1, 1970, birth certificates are available. For persons born prior to April 1, 1970, birth certificates are considered unavailable.
Fees: Fees vary from each Municipal authority, or any office authorized to issue birth and death certificates by the Registrar of Births & Deaths.
Document Name: Birth Certificate
Issuing Authority: Municipal Authority, or any office authorized to issue birth and death certificates by the Registrar of Births & Deaths.
Special Seal(s) / Color / Format: Varies substantially from state to state.
Issuing Authority Personnel Title: There is no issuing authority personnel title.
Registration Criteria: The registration criteria varies
Procedure for Obtaining: Procedures vary from each authority.
Certified Copies Available: There are no certified copies available.
Alternate Documents: If an individual is born after April 1, 1970 and is unable to obtain a birth certificate, the individual must obtain a certificate of non-availability from the local authorities with jurisdiction over their place of birth. In addition to a non-availability certificate, the following documents can be accepted as secondary evidence:
  • School-leaving Certificate (document provided to students when they cease attending a particular school, be it public or private),
  • Matriculation Certificate,
  • Certificate of Recognized Boards from the school last attended by the applicant (Boards are exams)
  • A notarized affidavit executed by either a parent, if living, or another close relative older than the applicant. This affidavit should clearly state the relationship between the deponent and the applicant, how well the deponent knows the applicant, the date and place of the applicant's birth, the names of both parents, and any other related facts. If the applicant has no living relatives that witnessed their birth, a self-attested affidavit detailing their knowledge of the facts of their birth may be accepted.
Exceptions: None
Comments: For all births after April 1, 1970. It is mandatory under the law (as per the Registration of Births & Deaths Act, 1969) to register every birth with the concerned state or union territory.
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Hello - can you please share lawyer contact in India who helped on parents birth certificate or NABC . I am looking to get some help for my mother’s NABC . Thanks !
 
Can someone share there experience on getting NABC or birth certificate for parents as I am looking to get Green card done for my mother . I have tried approaching trichy municipal but they are just delaying and not providing it yet . My mother has her matriculation certificate and passport no other documents exsist. Please guide and help . Thanks !
 
Hello -
We have received an interview date (after CoVid related delays) of early January 2021.

Please advise if any one has recently done a similar interview for parents in USA and what we should expect. Is there a standard interview questions list etc that may help?

We do understand that each case is different - but any suggestions will be helpful.

Regards.
 
priyapg said:
Can someone share there experience on getting NABC or birth certificate for parents as I am looking to get Green card done for my mother . I have tried approaching trichy municipal but they are just delaying and not providing it yet . My mother has her matriculation certificate and passport no other documents exsist. Please guide and help . Thanks !
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As far as I can understand the language in the reciprocity schedule - if your mother is born prior to 1971 you do not need either - Birth Certificate or a NABC. So you should be good.
 
Hi @AAMR, can you please share the final documents you submitted for your parents in absence of their birth certificate? I am curious why you received the RFE if the rule in reciprocity schedule mentions that birth certificate or NABC are not required if born prior to 1971. I am in the same situation and will greatly appreciate your inputs.
Also, could you please share their interview experience?
 
amgc1 said:
Hi @AAMR, can you please share the final documents you submitted for your parents in absence of their birth certificate? I am curious why you received the RFE if the rule in reciprocity schedule mentions that birth certificate or NABC are not required if born prior to 1971. I am in the same situation and will greatly appreciate your inputs.
Also, could you please share their interview experience?
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Hello @amgc1 -

1. We submitted 2 birth affidavits from our relatives on stamp paper and notarized, school leaving certificate, college certificates, job appointment letters etc and the visa reciprocity schedule printouts which state the assumption of not available. Also we sent a cover letter with explanation. But there are specific documents listed on uscis website that are required in lieu of the birth certificate
2. To answer your question why?....I guess with uscis there can be no logical answer to that question. But we feel - the person reviewing the case may have had a checklist and if anything missing from that list there is a immediate RFE generated. We had two applications - for both my parents - with identical documents and similar birth years - and one parent received a RFE and the other didn't. Also all the above documents were submitted with the original application but we still got an RFE and had to present them again. So the logic surprises me as well.
3. Interview: One of the most pleasant experiences ever with uscis was the interview. Very cordial, very well organized, to the point and most amazing officer. We carried a ton of documents though....all originals and copies. We had to resubmit another set of copies at the interview again. We did not need a interpreter so that was helpful as well. Not everyone gets called for an interview though. It's on case to case basis.

Hope things get sorted out for you.
 
AAMR said:
Hello @amgc1 -

1. We submitted 2 birth affidavits from our relatives on stamp paper and notarized, school leaving certificate, college certificates, job appointment letters etc and the visa reciprocity schedule printouts which state the assumption of not available. Also we sent a cover letter with explanation. But there are specific documents listed on uscis website that are required in lieu of the birth certificate
2. To answer your question why?....I guess with uscis there can be no logical answer to that question. But we feel - the person reviewing the case may have had a checklist and if anything missing from that list there is a immediate RFE generated. We had two applications - for both my parents - with identical documents and similar birth years - and one parent received a RFE and the other didn't. Also all the above documents were submitted with the original application but we still got an RFE and had to present them again. So the logic surprises me as well.
3. Interview: One of the most pleasant experiences ever with uscis was the interview. Very cordial, very well organized, to the point and most amazing officer. We carried a ton of documents though....all originals and copies. We had to resubmit another set of copies at the interview again. We did not need a interpreter so that was helpful as well. Not everyone gets called for an interview though. It's on case to case basis.

Hope things get sorted out for you.
Click to expand...
Thank you so much @AAMR for your prompt reply. Makes sense and I appreciate it!
 
priyapg said:
Hello - can you please share lawyer contact in India who helped on parents birth certificate or NABC . I am looking to get some help for my mother’s NABC . Thanks !
Click to expand...
Hi

Can you please share update on how you managed the RFE? I am in similar situation

Thanks
rags
twitter said:
Hi, I've applied for I-130/I-1485 concurrent processing of my parent's GC. Last week both received a RFE asking for either a birth certificate or a secondary evidence along with a proof from letter from government authority. My relatives have tried to get NABC from local municipal departments but they have absolutely refused to issue such a letter. My parents were born in early 1950's and there was no local government at the time.

I've already sent the properly translated high school certificate which should work as the secondary evidence but don't know what to do for for non-availability of birth certificate.

Has anyone been in the similar situation and has some ideas for me. Should I contact an immigration attorney?
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AAMR said:
ragsiyer said:
Hi AAMR
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Can you please share how you responded for the second RFE which was raised even after sending all the document?

The application also asks for a "government ID with photo" , did you submit the passport for this requirement? I am wondering , do we need to submit Adhar card in any case

Thaks
Rags
AAMR said:
Hello @amgc1 -

1. We submitted 2 birth affidavits from our relatives on stamp paper and notarized, school leaving certificate, college certificates, job appointment letters etc and the visa reciprocity schedule printouts which state the assumption of not available. Also we sent a cover letter with explanation. But there are specific documents listed on uscis website that are required in lieu of the birth certificate
2. To answer your question why?....I guess with uscis there can be no logical answer to that question. But we feel - the person reviewing the case may have had a checklist and if anything missing from that list there is a immediate RFE generated. We had two applications - for both my parents - with identical documents and similar birth years - and one parent received a RFE and the other didn't. Also all the above documents were submitted with the original application but we still got an RFE and had to present them again. So the logic surprises me as well.
3. Interview: One of the most pleasant experiences ever with uscis was the interview. Very cordial, very well organized, to the point and most amazing officer. We carried a ton of documents though....all originals and copies. We had to resubmit another set of copies at the interview again. We did not need a interpreter so that was helpful as well. Not everyone gets called for an interview though. It's on case to case basis.

Hope things get sorted out for you.
Click to expand...
 
AAMR said:
Hello JayP -

We were not able to get the Non Availability of Birth Certificate nor the Birth Certificate for both my parents - even though my parents were born in a metropolitan city like Bombay. But we had hired a lawyer in India and had him apply for the Birth Certificate at the Birth Registrars office in India's Local office where my parents were born and obtained a copy of the application receipt. FYI - till date we do not have any response to that application even after multiple follow ups - cannot even expect any now considering the pandemic.

To have a professionally formatted response to the RFE we hired a lawyer in the USA and she responded with the following to the RFE:

1. The below details from USCIS website stating Visa Reciprocity - as my parents were born in 1940's
2. All additional available Government Documents of my parents - copy of ration card, copy of their school certificate (which for weird reason did not mention the place of birth), their school report cards, professional certification documents, copy of their employment appointment letters, domicile certificates and a few other documents - which specifically did not state their place of birth - but was very clear of their place of birth and existence. Fortunate enough they had retained all the above documents even though they are almost disintegrated but were readable.
3. The Birth Certificate application receipt - stating we have applied but have not received any thing yet.

The lawyer responded with all of the above on Jan 27th 2020 and we got an update on the USCIS website on Feb 24, 2020 where we are awaiting for an interview date - and then the lock down from March happened. So are awaiting the interview date or otherwise. We will have to wait and see.

Hope the above helps and hope you find a way around. Sorry you are going thru this but I know how stressful it could be.

Birth Certificates
Available: For persons born after April 1, 1970, birth certificates are available. For persons born prior to April 1, 1970, birth certificates are considered unavailable.
Fees: Fees vary from each Municipal authority, or any office authorized to issue birth and death certificates by the Registrar of Births & Deaths.
Document Name: Birth Certificate
Issuing Authority: Municipal Authority, or any office authorized to issue birth and death certificates by the Registrar of Births & Deaths.
Special Seal(s) / Color / Format: Varies substantially from state to state.
Issuing Authority Personnel Title: There is no issuing authority personnel title.
Registration Criteria: The registration criteria varies
Procedure for Obtaining: Procedures vary from each authority.
Certified Copies Available: There are no certified copies available.
Alternate Documents: If an individual is born after April 1, 1970 and is unable to obtain a birth certificate, the individual must obtain a certificate of non-availability from the local authorities with jurisdiction over their place of birth. In addition to a non-availability certificate, the following documents can be accepted as secondary evidence:
  • School-leaving Certificate (document provided to students when they cease attending a particular school, be it public or private),
  • Matriculation Certificate,
  • Certificate of Recognized Boards from the school last attended by the applicant (Boards are exams)
  • A notarized affidavit executed by either a parent, if living, or another close relative older than the applicant. This affidavit should clearly state the relationship between the deponent and the applicant, how well the deponent knows the applicant, the date and place of the applicant's birth, the names of both parents, and any other related facts. If the applicant has no living relatives that witnessed their birth, a self-attested affidavit detailing their knowledge of the facts of their birth may be accepted.
Exceptions: None
Comments: For all births after April 1, 1970. It is mandatory under the law (as per the Registration of Births & Deaths Act, 1969) to register every birth with the concerned state or union territory.
Click to expand...
ragsiyer said:
Hi , do you had to get any police clearance certifictae for your parents?
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@JayP_2020
JayP_2020 said:
I am in the same situation and given the current situation with Covid-19, the state which my mother was born is under complete lock down. Any thoughts on how to proceed in these unprecedented times?
What was outcome of your case?
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Hi! I have received RFE for my mother as well. She was born in 1952 and I am unable to get NABC from GHMC in Hyderabad. They are not even willing to consider the application as we don't have address proof. I have another 4 weeks to respond to USCIS. We have already submitted 2 affidavits from relatives and her school leaving certificate. Could you please share how did you respond in your mother's case? Thank you!!
 
AAMR seemed to use a lawyer in India to get the NABC. Have any one else tries this approach? I am looking for a lawyer contact in mumbai
 
Sk5817 said:
@JayP_2020

Hi! I have received RFE for my mother as well. She was born in 1952 and I am unable to get NABC from GHMC in Hyderabad. They are not even willing to consider the application as we don't have address proof. I have another 4 weeks to respond to USCIS. We have already submitted 2 affidavits from relatives and her school leaving certificate. Could you please share how did you respond in your mother's case? Thank you!!
Click to expand...
We used a lawyer in the USA (as my parents are in the USA with me) and responded with the Visa Reciprocity Schedule - which clearly states that if a indian parent is born prior to April 1970 the Birth Certificate is deemed to be unavailable. The lawyer drafted a letter and attached the Visa Reciprocity schedule - plus the affidavits, and secondary documentation - after which they accepted the response. Eventually after six months we did receive my mothers Birth Certificate - thru a family member who applied in Bombay.
 
Hi AAMR,

Thanks for the details. I'm in a similar situation where i cannot get the birth certificate corrected nor get a NBAC since certificate exists but with wrong date. What exactly did you send in the Visa Reciprocity Schedule, did you take a print out of the Birth certificate section from the state.gov website and added a cover letter or was it some other form? Can you help in some way to share a template? Appreciate your help!
 
dvs2021 said:
Hi AAMR,

Thanks for the details. I'm in a similar situation where i cannot get the birth certificate corrected nor get a NBAC since certificate exists but with wrong date. What exactly did you send in the Visa Reciprocity Schedule, did you take a print out of the Birth certificate section from the state.gov website and added a cover letter or was it some other form? Can you help in some way to share a template? Appreciate your help!
Click to expand...
Hello - 1. Did you get a RFE from USCIS? We sent the Visa Reciprocity Schedule with highlighting the sections indicating the Birth Certificate un available, in the response of the RFE. We did add a cover letter - indicating the same - and also added the following:
1627158654259.png
2. We did sent all secondary evidence (birth affidavits, my birth certificate indicating my mothers name, her school and college certificates etc) with the original application - we were really not expecting an RFE.

Hope this helps. Good Luck.
 
thanks AAMR. No i'm yet to apply. Just preparing since we do not have a NABC and i'm not sure if affidavits are sufficient. Sort of hitting a road block in getting the nabc, since the certificates have wrong name and date :)

I've heard from mumbai lawyers that the birth certificate affidavits are only valid for 6 months, is this true even for immigration offices here?
And What was your experience in terms of when to apply after parents arrive to the states?
 
AAMR said:
We used a lawyer in the USA (as my parents are in the USA with me) and responded with the Visa Reciprocity Schedule - which clearly states that if a indian parent is born prior to April 1970 the Birth Certificate is deemed to be unavailable. The lawyer drafted a letter and attached the Visa Reciprocity schedule - plus the affidavits, and secondary documentation - after which they accepted the response. Eventually after six months we did receive my mothers Birth Certificate - thru a family member who applied in Bombay.
Click to expand...
Hi AAMR,
This is very useful. My US Citizen son petitioned for me. I am in the US. Along with the I-485 application, my lawyer in the US sent excerpts from the reciprocity schedule, one affidavit, and other documents such as school leaving certificate, passport, voter id, aadhar card, etc. I received an RFE now which says they need NABC and other documents. In that list, they have mentioned "2 affidavits". My lawyer is saying that it will be sufficient if I send one more affidavit. I am also trying to get NABC but not sure when I will get it. Could it be that they were expecting 2 affidavits whereas we had submitted only one? Not sure.
In your case, was there an interview after they accepted your response to the RFE? Did your parents get green cards?
 
ramwal said:
Hi AAMR,
This is very useful. My US Citizen son petitioned for me. I am in the US. Along with the I-485 application, my lawyer in the US sent excerpts from the reciprocity schedule, one affidavit, and other documents such as school leaving certificate, passport, voter id, aadhar card, etc. I received an RFE now which says they need NABC and other documents. In that list, they have mentioned "2 affidavits". My lawyer is saying that it will be sufficient if I send one more affidavit. I am also trying to get NABC but not sure when I will get it. Could it be that they were expecting 2 affidavits whereas we had submitted only one? Not sure.
In your case, was there an interview after they accepted your response to the RFE? Did your parents get green cards?
Click to expand...
Hello @ramwal, Sorry was not able to reply back to you earlier.
1. We had submitted - two affidavits for each of my parents - with the original application

2. I believe in your RFE response - you may have to send the reciprocity schedule, highlighted, underline the relevant section - with a cover letter - indicating that it clearly mentions that a NABC is not needed for people who are born after 1970. NABC is needed for persons who are born after 1970 and do not have a birth certificate. Thats what we had done with our RFE - and in addition we sent all other secondary evidence again - my parents school leaving certificate, college leaving certificate, their employment appointment letters, their retirement letters etc. etc.
From what I understand is the people in the USCIS office who intake the forms may refer to a check list for support and if anything is missing - will request a RFE without reasoning it. They may not reason to a why a certain document is not submitted and is missing. Again the usual disclaimer - that I am not a lawyer and you may want to discuss your specific case with your lawyer.
3. To answer your question - yes my parents had an interview schedule for March 2020 which got cancelled as that was the month when we had the lockdown for COVID-19. So eventually they had a interview in Jan 2021 and received the GC shortly after.

Hope the above helps.

Regards,
 
AAMR said:
Hello @ramwal, Sorry was not able to reply back to you earlier.
1. We had submitted - two affidavits for each of my parents - with the original application

2. I believe in your RFE response - you may have to send the reciprocity schedule, highlighted, underline the relevant section - with a cover letter - indicating that it clearly mentions that a NABC is not needed for people who are born after 1970. NABC is needed for persons who are born after 1970 and do not have a birth certificate. Thats what we had done with our RFE - and in addition we sent all other secondary evidence again - my parents school leaving certificate, college leaving certificate, their employment appointment letters, their retirement letters etc. etc.
From what I understand is the people in the USCIS office who intake the forms may refer to a check list for support and if anything is missing - will request a RFE without reasoning it. They may not reason to a why a certain document is not submitted and is missing. Again the usual disclaimer - that I am not a lawyer and you may want to discuss your specific case with your lawyer.
3. To answer your question - yes my parents had an interview schedule for March 2020 which got cancelled as that was the month when we had the lockdown for COVID-19. So eventually they had a interview in Jan 2021 and received the GC shortly after.

Hope the above helps.

Regards,
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Hi AAMR,
Thanks a lot. I have 2 additional affidavits now (that makes it to a total of 3) and all the other documents (10th certificate, Aadhaar Card, Voter ID, PAN Card, Passport, Indian Driving License, etc). I am sensing that there will be difficulty in getting the NABC. As per my lawyer's suggestion, I would like to go ahead and respond with these two additional Affidavits that I have now. The only concern is - if I want the lawyer to prepare a response and send it, it may take time because he will have to make time to respond to this from his schedule. I am not sure if it is going to take days or weeks. Looking at the urgency, I was thinking of responding to the RFP myself. I guess for USCIS it won't make a difference if the response came from the applicant or a lawyer. Was your response sent by a lawyer? Do you mind sharing the text - including the link to the reciprocity schedule?
 
ramwal said:
Hi AAMR,
Thanks a lot. I have 2 additional affidavits now (that makes it to a total of 3) and all the other documents (10th certificate, Aadhaar Card, Voter ID, PAN Card, Passport, Indian Driving License, etc). I am sensing that there will be difficulty in getting the NABC. As per my lawyer's suggestion, I would like to go ahead and respond with these two additional Affidavits that I have now. The only concern is - if I want the lawyer to prepare a response and send it, it may take time because he will have to make time to respond to this from his schedule. I am not sure if it is going to take days or weeks. Looking at the urgency, I was thinking of responding to the RFP myself. I guess for USCIS it won't make a difference if the response came from the applicant or a lawyer. Was your response sent by a lawyer? Do you mind sharing the text - including the link to the reciprocity schedule?
Click to expand...
@ramwal We had hired a lawyer - only for RFE response. We found out that a lawyer responding carry more weight on the application than we responding on our own. But its up to you. FYI - a Aadhaar Card, Voter ID, Pan Card etc - I don't think can be considered as additional proof of birth- as think about it - after getting a US citizenship we get similar documents for US - but that does not prove our birth is in the USA - which is really the case. But again I am not a lawyer - just doing a rational reasoning.

Below is the snip from our letter.

Below is the link for the reciprocity schedule.

India

travel.state.gov travel.state.gov

1633559341965.png
 
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