How to apply for a derivative

A

Aprodita

Member
Dear members. I am a DV visa holder and my derivative did not face the interview since he is aged out by the time of the interview. Now I want to apply for him once I get the GC. I have few questions and glad for your views/advice.
1. Is there a difference between F2A and F2B?
2. Can I file for my child who is over 21 now when my DV visa turns to LPR straight or do I have to get a job first?
3. Can't I file showing any liquidized finances?
4. He is a F1. If I submit an application on behalf of him, does he needs to return to the motherland until it is heard, can he continue to stay until he can do AoS? May I know the pros and cons pl?

Thanks once again for these guidance and information.
 
1. Yes.
F2A - Spouses and unmarried children (under 21) of LPR
F2B - Unmarried children (21 and above) of LPR.
2. Yes you can file an I-130 as soon as you enter the US and get processed as a LPR.
3. You’re a several years way from the financial requirements step (yes, when you get to that step you may be able to use assets)
4. Also several years away from this step. As long as he is able to continuously maintain a legal status, he can remain and process AOS when he gets to that step, if he’s unable to do so he’ll need to depart from the US and process CP. (I believe I already mentioned this to you a couple of times before in the DV Lottery sub forum).

Anyway I suggest you go through the official website (link below) to enhance your understanding of the process and help you better prepare.

Submit a Petition

travel.state.gov travel.state.gov
 
To expand on some of the above - and note please that your son will be the beneficiary of a petition you will file for him, not your derivative.

First, again, please read the link properly to understand the process. Then, read the instructions of the forms to understand what you need to do there (there is nothing anywhere saying you need a job to file, for example). To repeat the other link you were given earlier for filing a petition : https://www.uscis.gov/i-130 Again, please take the time to read this page and its sections properly.

Second, just like you used to watch the visa bulletin for DV, now you watch it for F2B. https://travel.state.gov/content/tr...in/2022/visa-bulletin-for-september-2022.html First table shows visa availability. You can see visas are currently available for F2B for petitions filed before 22 Sep 2015. So you can see there is about a 7 year wait for visas in this category. Second table shows when documents can be filed at NVC for the case (this will be some years after you file the i130, maybe 5-6 years). If your son is processing consular processing this is when NVC will contact you for submissions. If he is doing AOS (more on that below), this is when he can submit his AOS application.

Linked to above - part of the documents submission stage in 5-6 years time is the i864 affidavit of support. This is the stage at which you need to show income or assets. Again, you should read the explanations in the instructions properly to understand how to do this. Be aware that while you can use assets, using income is much easier and more straightforward than assets. https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/forms/i-864instr.pdf

Third, your son can do AOS IF he is able to maintain a student or other legal status for the 6 or so years before he would need to submit documents under table B. Be aware that if he falls out of status, violates the terms of his student visa etc, he becomes ineligible to do AOS as your beneficiary either then or at any stage. Furthermore, if he is out of status for longer than 6 months and then leaves the US to try do CP, he may face a re-entry ban of 3 or 10 years depending how long he has been out of status. So it is very important that he does not violate status. If his studies end and he cannot stay legally under OPT or a work visa, for example, then he needs to return to his home country and await consular processing. On the other hand if he is able to extend F1, do OPT, change status to H1B etc, then he can stay until he can file for AOS.

Fourth, F2B requires that he stays single. If he gets married at any stage before you become a citizen, then the petition dies. If you become a citizen before his process is complete then it is ok if he marries, but then his category changes to F3 and adds another 6 or so years to the wait.

So to sum up, you have a long wait ahead of you. Plenty of time to read up and understand everything. Just ensure that everything is done correctly so no complications in the future, especially for if your son wants to AOS.
 
Last edited:
Aprodita said:
Dear members. I am a DV visa holder and my derivative did not face the interview since he is aged out by the time of the interview.
Click to expand...
Are you sure he aged out? Whether he aged out is determined by (his age on the first day on which the Department of State can allocate a visa number based on the principal applicant’s rank number) - (the period of time between the start of the DV Program registration period to the date of the DV selection letter).
 
newacct said:
Are you sure he aged out? Whether he aged out is determined by (his age on the first day on which the Department of State can allocate a visa number based on the principal applicant’s rank number) - (the period of time between the start of the DV Program registration period to the date of the DV selection letter).
Click to expand...
At this stage it’s moot, as derivative is in the US and has no time to do AOS process before the end of the FY even if he qualified under CSPA (I’m not sure the specific age/calculation has been discussed in the poster’s history).

Edit: found it, child turned 21 in April 2021, so definitely aged out. I believe OP’s case number was current in May 2022.
 
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Sm1smom said:
1. Yes.
F2A - Spouses and unmarried children (under 21) of LPR
F2B - Unmarried children (21 and above) of LPR.
2. Yes you can file an I-130 as soon as you enter the US and get processed as a LPR.
3. You’re a several years way from the financial requirements step (yes, when you get to that step you may be able to use assets)
4. Also several years away from this step. As long as he is able to continuously maintain a legal status, he can remain and process AOS when he gets to that step, if he’s unable to do so he’ll need to depart from the US and process CP. (I believe I already mentioned this to you a couple of times before in the DV Lottery sub forum).

Anyway I suggest you go through the official website (link below) to enhance your understanding of the process and help you better prepare.

Submit a Petition

travel.state.gov travel.state.gov
Click to expand...
Thank you so much. So much more to understand about this F2B process too, just like the DV process in the other forum, thanks to you.
 
newacct said:
Are you sure he aged out? Whether he aged out is determined by (his age on the first day on which the Department of State can allocate a visa number based on the principal applicant’s rank number) - (the period of time between the start of the DV Program registration period to the date of the DV selection letter).
Click to expand...
Thanks. I have learnt about the "Aging out" by reading Mr Simon's blog as well as from the members of DV forum. Yes, as I learnt he is aged out. He turned 21 in April 2021 though when I applied for DV in 2019 he was 19. Even when I submitted the DS 260 in August 2021, he was under CSPA. But my CN AS 24K became current only in May. So from what I learnt, he is aged out obviously. So I am planning to apply for him once I become LPR. That also I learnt from the kind members at that forum. But, since my questions on this forum were not related to DV, I have posted them here expecting the valuable views.
 
SusieQQQ said:
At this stage it’s moot, as derivative is in the US and has no time to do AOS process before the end of the FY even if he qualified under CSPA (I’m not sure the specific age/calculation has been discussed in the poster’s history).

Edit: found it, child turned 21 in April 2021, so definitely aged out. I believe OP’s case number was current in May 2022.
Click to expand...
I am indebted to you SusieQQQ as always, for enlightening me on this kind of issues on previous occasions. You are correct, my CN became current in May and was granted the DV in August.
 
SusieQQQ said:
To expand on some of the above - and note please that your son will be the beneficiary of a petition you will file for him, not your derivative.

First, again, please read the link properly to understand the process. Then, read the instructions of the forms to understand what you need to do there (there is nothing anywhere saying you need a job to file, for example). To repeat the other link you were given earlier for filing a petition : https://www.uscis.gov/i-130 Again, please take the time to read this page and its sections properly.

Second, just like you used to watch the visa bulletin for DV, now you watch it for F2B. https://travel.state.gov/content/tr...in/2022/visa-bulletin-for-september-2022.html First table shows visa availability. You can see visas are currently available for F2B for petitions filed before 22 Sep 2015. So you can see there is about a 7 year wait for visas in this category. Second table shows when documents can be filed at NVC for the case (this will be some years after you file the i130, maybe 5-6 years). If your son is processing consular processing this is when NVC will contact you for submissions. If he is doing AOS (more on that below), this is when he can submit his AOS application.

Linked to above - part of the documents submission stage in 5-6 years time is the i864 affidavit of support. This is the stage at which you need to show income or assets. Again, you should read the explanations in the instructions properly to understand how to do this. Be aware that while you can use assets, using income is much easier and more straightforward than assets. https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/forms/i-864instr.pdf

Third, your son can do AOS IF he is able to maintain a student or other legal status for the 6 or so years before he would need to submit documents under table B. Be aware that if he falls out of status, violates the terms of his student visa etc, he becomes ineligible to do AOS as your beneficiary either then or at any stage. Furthermore, if he is out of status for longer than 6 months and then leaves the US to try do CP, he may face a re-entry ban of 3 or 10 years depending how long he has been out of status. So it is very important that he does not violate status. If his studies end and he cannot stay legally under OPT or a work visa, for example, then he needs to return to his home country and await consular processing. On the other hand if he is able to extend F1, do OPT, change status to H1B etc, then he can stay until he can file for AOS.

Fourth, F2B requires that he stays single. If he gets married at any stage before you become a citizen, then the petition dies. If you become a citizen before his process is complete then it is ok if he marries, but then his category changes to F3 and adds another 6 or so years to the wait.

So to sum up, you have a long wait ahead of you. Plenty of time to read up and understand everything. Just ensure that everything is done correctly so no complications in the future, especially for if your son wants to AOS.
Click to expand...
Well, now I understand the complexity. This sure is a long wait depending on many factors. I think if I submit I-134 once I become LPR that will also affect if he applies for H1B or OPT (He will be finishing his undergrad by Fall next year). (I know he is an adult now, but becoming an LPR in another country would be worthwhile if my child will also be in that country. It is personal. Hope you understand)

Yes as you say, I will be having some years to get myself informed about the process- just as I got myself informed about the DV process almost a year long from last October from the DV forum! If not for the information provided, I would not have had the chance to well prepared for the interview.

PS: Please do not misunderstand if it seems I am asking the same kind of questions repeatedly. My mother tongue is not English and sometimes the websites have complex information. (Well, when I first visited this forum, I did not even know some terms, ex CN or AoS, CP etc)

Thanks for your detailed reply SusieQQQ and also Sm1smom. I think all what I need to know is summarized there and now I can find the specific information related to my questions and understand. God bless you.
 
FYI, H1B itself is a little complex (he does not apply - a company does, there is usually a lottery etc), but note that H1B is a dual intent visa/status which means immigrant intent is allowed - so it is no problem to have an immigrant petition in the system when applying for H1B.
anyway you should be thinking longer term/strategically too in the event that there is a conflict - what is more important, a shorter term non immigrant visa or a green card eventually?
if a green card really is the goal I would not advise waiting at all - as you can see it’s a long process, the earlier you can get a priority date locked in for the petition the better, in my opinion.
 
Aprodita said:
Well, now I understand the complexity. This sure is a long wait depending on many factors. I think if I submit I-134 once I become LPR that will also affect if he applies for H1B or OPT (He will be finishing his undergrad by Fall next year). (I know he is an adult now, but becoming an LPR in another country would be worthwhile if my child will also be in that country. It is personal. Hope you understand)

Yes as you say, I will be having some years to get myself informed about the process- just as I got myself informed about the DV process almost a year long from last October from the DV forum! If not for the information provided, I would not have had the chance to well prepared for the interview.

PS: Please do not misunderstand if it seems I am asking the same kind of questions repeatedly. My mother tongue is not English and sometimes the websites have complex information. (Well, when I first visited this forum, I did not even know some terms, ex CN or AoS, CP etc)

Thanks for your detailed reply SusieQQQ and also Sm1smom. I think all what I need to know is summarized there and now I can find the specific information related to my questions and understand. God bless you.
Click to expand...
An I-130 filing will have no impact on H-1B nor his OPT application. Plus H-1B allows for an immigrant intent, as it is a dual intent visa/status.
 
SusieQQQ said:
FYI, H1B itself is a little complex (he does not apply - a company does, there is usually a lottery etc), but note that H1B is a dual intent visa/status which means immigrant intent is allowed - so it is no problem to have an immigrant petition in the system when applying for H1B.
anyway you should be thinking longer term/strategically too in the event that there is a conflict - what is more important, a shorter term non immigrant visa or a green card eventually?
if a green card really is the goal I would not advise waiting at all - as you can see it’s a long process, the earlier you can get a priority date locked in for the petition the better, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Thank you, appreciated very much. Actually, there is a vast information out there and finding the correct one is difficult. The way you explain is simple and easy to understand. After that it is easy to find and understand the processes.

I was concerned about the DS 260 I submitted for him, if you can remember. Later only I found out that it has an impact on NIVs. So I did not know if I-130 too will have some kind of impact on his future applications (if any submitted). Also with the info provided by you and Sm1smom, the process was easy to understand and I will follow the information provided and try to understand. With your reply I am relieved and thanks so much. Your suggestions were very valuable. I will do so. God bless you
 
SusieQQQ said:
FYI, H1B itself is a little complex (he does not apply - a company does, there is usually a lottery etc), but note that H1B is a dual intent visa/status which means immigrant intent is allowed - so it is no problem to have an immigrant petition in the system when applying for H1B.
anyway you should be thinking longer term/strategically too in the event that there is a conflict - what is more important, a shorter term non immigrant visa or a green card eventually?
if a green card really is the goal I would not advise waiting at all - as you can see it’s a long process, the earlier you can get a priority date locked in for the petition the better, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the simple and direct reply. Now it is clear to me and I have an idea which way to follow to get more information. I feel so relieved too since I had a fear submitting I-134 will have some kind of impact on his future applications if any, just like the DS-260. For instance, I should have delayed submitting his DS 260, knowing about this "Ageing out". Anyway, I did not know such thing exists. Also I was ignorant about many things along the DV process too, and thanks to the forum - by reading the posts again and again and answers provided by the expert members I educated myself. Best regards.
 
Aprodita said:
Thank you, appreciated very much. Actually, there is a vast information out there and finding the correct one is difficult. The way you explain is simple and easy to understand. After that it is easy to find and understand the processes.

I was concerned about the DS 260 I submitted for him, if you can remember. Later only I found out that it has an impact on NIVs. So I did not know if I-130 too will have some kind of impact on his future applications (if any submitted). Also with the info provided by you and Sm1smom, the process was easy to understand and I will follow the information provided and try to understand. With your reply I am relieved and thanks so much. Your suggestions were very valuable. I will do so. God bless you
Click to expand...
Aprodita said:
Thanks for the simple and direct reply. Now it is clear to me and I have an idea which way to follow to get more information. I feel so relieved too since I had a fear submitting I-134 will have some kind of impact on his future applications if any, just like the DS-260. For instance, I should have delayed submitting his DS 260, knowing about this "Ageing out". Anyway, I did not know such thing exists. Also I was ignorant about many things along the DV process too, and thanks to the forum - by reading the posts again and again and answers provided by the expert members I educated myself. Best regards.
Click to expand...
Mind you, the already demonstrated immigrant intent (with the DS260 submission) is still there though regardless. That is something he will still need to overcome if he ever departs from the US and needs to return with a new NIV. Whenever he applies for a new NIV from the embassy, he will still be required to overcome the already demonstrated immigrant intent in order to be issued with a new visa.

p.s. you're not filing an I-134 to sponsor him, you will be filing an I-130 - those are two different forms serving different purposes.
 
Thanks Sm1smom. Well, seems very complicated. But grateful to you for pointing out these so I am aware of them and have time to learn more in the coming years. Your service to the forum is appreciated, if not for you all, I would not have had made it. Thanks once again.
 
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