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DV Lottery 2012 New York Times 06/25/2011

yes they does start payement... thoses who are on a temporary visa pays about 400$... DOS even told them to contact their accountant for a refund...
delit2727 said:
3) This is right BUT DOS has said that they will not process the forms. If they are not processed, you will not be deemed as a potential immigrant so I wouldn't stress about not being able to get a tourist visa...I would be surprised if you have problems.
4) This is not important even if true. It's about the law. There is operational budget that is meant for cases like this so it's not like it would be that much money. It's pennies for the Department.
5) This is the way any institution would have proceeded. You do not make anything public until you come with an official statement. Yes, it's unfortunate but it would have caused more confusion and chaos if they have informed individual people on the phone about the situation, before they released the statement. Also, they do not ask for any payment at this EARLY stage. There are a few cases of people sending checks for AOS but these are getting refunds. So no problem here. Plans are great but DOS and the lottery instruction make it clear that 'selectees' should not make any plans, sell properly, marry, quite jobs, buy flight tickets, etc. BEFORE they have received an immigrant visa. If you have made such a drastic step based on the selection that is your decision; even though you have been advised against such drastic steps...since selection does not guarantee you a green card but a mere chance to have your application processed and to get and perhaps to get an interview.
6) That's not true. The statistic definition of 'randomization', excluded the presence of ANY bias. Here the glitch introduced a biased variable; selectees are clustered around a specific time period. You can claim that the glitch was random and that no-one could have known that people who have applied on the 5th and 6th would be more likely to be selected, but this only makes the event random not the selection itself. Open a statistic textbook and read if you want to learn more...

I have no intention to start an argument over the issue. If you have a certain conviction and you want to defend it, please, do so...you are more than welcome to try. We will have to wait and see what happens with the case. My personal opinion based on what I've read is that there is at best a breach of contract but this would not bring re-installment of the "winners". EVEN if the judge re-installs you, there will be an appeal, so a class-case like this would take years to resolve. Again, those that feel that this will get them somewhere are more than welcome to try an sell their part of the story, they have the right to do so. Good luck.
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Did they actually cash your check? Can you explain to me the procedure; I though that you are not supposed to pay anything until October 1, when you send the AOS documents to Chicago?
 
Wait, are you saying that you haven't got refunded yet?
ToomCraigy said:
Yes, I know that. I also sent a request for refund to abovementioned address the same day I received that email. But noone I talked to can confirm even receiving receipt for payment, not to mention refund check. Looks like the whole thing is on hold until 15th.
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By the way dude, do not worry having an argument with you, i am not an internet gangster, i welcome all different point of views even thoses who are opposite of my though & i discuss them with respect
delit2727 said:
Did they actually cash your check? Can you explain to me the procedure; I though that you are not supposed to pay anything until October 1, when you send the AOS documents to Chicago?
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delit2727 said:
Did they actually cash your check? Can you explain to me the procedure; I though that you are not supposed to pay anything until October 1, when you send the AOS documents to Chicago?
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You have to pay $440 per person to DOS first, the receipt is required for AOS documents in Chicago. Here's more info - http://www.travel.state.gov/visa/visa_4763.html

I have form 6401 from USPS in front of me confirming that my money order was cashed on May, 10th.

Again, I've checked with at least 5 other people who sent AOS fees, none got the refund or even receipt yet.
 
Corewin said:
Sure, and it's right thing to do, look, if you will win again on july 15, you wouldn't need to pay this fee again. I guess that those transactions also cost some money, so they puted it on hold.
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Then why would they tell us to request the refund in their email? Besides, the case number will be different, so the receipt won't be kosher.
 
not mentionning that the chance of being reselected is low...

this new info is strange, something is clearely fishy... I think there is more into it that what DOS told us
ToomCraigy said:
Then why would they tell us to request the refund in their email? Besides, the case number will be different, so the receipt won't be kosher.
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Anyhow. If they cashed your check, then you will get a refund. It's been only 1.5 months. KCC takes a while to process request like this. If you don't get it back in the next couple of weeks, call them. I know that KCC take on average 2 months to process petitions (I guess refunds would be in the same category). My guess is you would get your money back around the two month mark.
 
On CNN there is an article about a militaire man who was arrested for failing to inform that he had applied for a passport prior to the last application. He didn't check that box since he never went forward at that time to get the passport....he can get 10 years for fraud for that...

Then later it came out that even though he thought all his live that he was born in Miami he was actually born in the Bahamas, served for years in the US army and can now face deportation....

Nothing has been done for him so far and his future is unsure...

And you think that 36 foreigners have one bit of a chance....
 
My advise to you ex-22k,is that dont put all your hopes in FORTESTATE?t cos anything could happen.Mr white cannot win the US GOVERNMENT or DOS in court.Guys dont just be dreaming?always see the lawsuit as a 50 -50% chance of a thing.Would still advise to wait till July 15.I know that it is painful to your selected results be voided just like that.Dont pay attention like that to the MEDIA otherwise u would just be having false hopes.July 15 will confirm everything all.
 
Nothing fishy here. It's called bureaucracy. If you've ever dealt with the USCIS or DoS, you'd know that waiting for 2-3 months to have a petition processed is a vary reasonable time frame.
 
this is "fraud", he lied & was illegal... do not compare oranges & apples
bentlebee said:
On CNN there is an article about a militaire man who was arrested for failing to inform that he had applied for a passport prior to the last application. He didn't check that box since he never went forward at that time to get the passport....he can get 10 years for fraud for that...

Then later it came out that even though he thought all his live that he was born in Miami he was actually born in the Bahamas, served for years in the US army and can now face deportation....

Nothing has been done for him so far and his future is unsure...

And you think that 36 foreigners have one bit of a chance....
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1 question... were you a non selectee?
& besides, it is not even that he didn't get a refund but someone call them & they couldn't even tell him the confirmation of the refund request...
delit2727 said:
Nothing fishy here. It's called bureaucracy. If you've ever dealt with the USCIS or DoS, you'd know that waiting for 2-3 months to have a petition processed is a vary reasonable time frame.
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To abide by your own statement that this is an opinion and you do not want to start any argument with anyone, I want point out few things to you.

I am not a statistician, I will leave the statistics part. However, expect expert in the court room with their testimonies-- However, if random is not defined in the statute, a court is likely to use the dictionary to find the common meaning of "random." --( U.S v. Santos 553 U.S 507 128 Supreme Court (2008)) (Courts mostly use Random House Webster's College Dictionary)

Your admission that this case could be won on breach of contract is enough indication that there is hope for the 22K winners.

In law, it is the plaintiff that ask the Judge for the damages or remedies he/she is seeking. In this case the remedy the 22K winners are seeking is injunctive relief or writ of mandamus. (Writ of mandamus means asking the court to order a government official to do something). This means they are asking the court to order DoS to reinstate them.

Also while it possible to ask for money damages, under class action plaintiffs can ask for money damages or injunctive relief (filing writ of mandamus). (Refer to Rule 23 of Federal Rules of Civil Procedure about class action lawsuits)

About the number, in class action law suit, there is no limit for the number of class. It could be only 36 people, 30 people, 40 people, thousand, millions... etc. Once the lawyer is able to show that there is a common question of fact and law among the 36 and class action is the only superior legal vehicle to resolve this issue, a court will likely certify the case action class action. So the court is likely to certify this case as class action. (Refer to Rule 23 of Federal Rules of Civil Procedure about class action lawsuits)

Even if the court fails to certify it as class action, anyone of the 22K winners can join himself or herself as a plaintiff. (Refer to Rule 20 of Federal Rules of Civil Procedure)

Also it is important to note that random is not the only issue, there are other issues beneath the random issue. So my advice is, do not get fixated on only the "random" issue.

Note:We all hear to learn...
 
Yes. I am a 'non-selectee'. While I understand the position that some of the 22k people hold, looking at it objectively, without the whole emotional baggage that comes with having your hopes crushed, it's my personal belief that the case will not get you anywhere. It would only help the attorney earn some cash. He is not doing this pro bono , you know. Again you have the right to argue your position and try your luck.
I am the last person to defend the USCIS or DoS. The whole system is outdated and extremely sluggish. The system and the immigration laws are long overdue for an overhaul. Even though I am in a position to gain from the DV Lottery, I have always hold the stance that the Lottery makes little sense and does not benefit the the American people or the majority of the selectees. Many of the people who come on those 50,000 visas will eventually return home, because they cannot adjust to the life in the U.S. They find themselves in an environment much different from the one that they have expected. The 50,000 visas should be diverted toward people who are already in the U.S. and have advanced degrees such as MAs or PhDs. These are the people that will help the U.S. economy grow and be competitive, not people with a high-school degree.
 
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It might be true that nothing was done for him, but SOMETHING was done for the Paunescu v. I.N.S, in DAYS. He won the DV lottery but was denied at interview and sued I.N.S for the visa to be granted. If not anything at all, the case has a precendential value, which offers a glimmer of hope to the winners.
 
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