Don,t worry,It will pass!reasons:

A

Ali_Sabri

Registered Users (C)
http://thomas.loc.gov/home/lawsmade.bysec/final.action.html#request
first read the link completely.
I chosed this part from that:

The House conferees are strictly limited in their consideration to matters in disagreement between the two Houses. Consequently, they may not strike out or amend any portion of the bill that was not amended by the other House. Furthermore, they may not insert new matter that is not germane to or that is beyond the scope of the differences between the two Houses.


do you remember we were very sad about Senator Byrd amendment?
it failed....
he wanted to delete immigration reforms


result:

as senate was against deleting immigration issue by a very good vote,,
the conference can,t delete 8001 and 8002
 
That is good news if true but there is still one extra problem. Even after conf committee agrees it still needs to go back to both House and Senate for final approval of the same unified proposal.
House bill has passed by 2-vote margin 217-215. Now if Immigration provisions are attached we know anti Immigration Congressman like Lamar Smith and Tancredo who had previously voted for the congress version of the bill will now vote against it.... so you cant be sure that even if Conference committee approves language we want it will once again pass Congress.
 
:-( oops!!

:eek:
texancanadian said:
That is good news if true but there is still one extra problem. Even after conf committee agrees it still needs to go back to both House and Senate for final approval of the same unified proposal.
House bill has passed by 2-vote margin 217-215. Now if Immigration provisions are attached we know anti Immigration Congressman like Lamar Smith and Tancredo who had previously voted for the congress version of the bill will now vote against it.... so you cant be sure that even if Conference committee approves language we want it will once again pass Congress.
Click to expand...
 
ali ay have a point

Authority of Conferees
The conference committee is sometimes popularly referred to as the "Third House of Congress". Although the managers on the part of each House meet together as one committee they are in effect two separate committees, each of which votes separately and acts by a majority vote. For this reason, the number of managers from each House is largely immaterial.

The House conferees are strictly limited in their consideration to matters in disagreement between the two Houses. Consequently, they may not strike out or amend any portion of the bill that was not amended by the other House. Furthermore, they may not insert new matter that is not germane to or that is beyond the scope of the differences between the two Houses. Where the Senate amendment revises a figure or an amount contained in the bill, the conferees are limited to the difference between the two numbers and may neither increase the greater nor decrease the smaller figure. Neither House may alone, by instructions, empower its

Texan where did u read that the bill has to go back to both the houses?

Just wondering
 
Yeah nato BIG OOPS

If what Texancanadian said can be confirmed then that is a BIG OOPS!!!

Talk abt SUCKS :p
 
yeah but they have to go BACK to their individual houses and revote :(

But ok, we have been +ve so far, we'll do the same forever
 
I am not so optimistic about the house when the reconciled bill goes there. When they were making 4241, a counterpart to S. 1932, they deliberately left 8001 and 8002 out. This tells me that there is some significant force in the house opposing immigration or parting immigration with budget bill.
 
rosatiamo said:
I am not so optimistic about the house when the reconciled bill goes there. When they were making 4241, a counterpart to S. 1932, they deliberately left 8001 and 8002 out. This tells me that there is some significant force in the house opposing immigration or parting immigration with budget bill.
Click to expand...

So, house is about local geographic area and its representative concern's as opposed to senate (which is more at the nation level and about future).

But I still fail to realise how enacting the S.1932 immigration sections would displease them. This is not about illegal immigration guest worker program or bringing in more people on h1 visa to eat away local jobs.

I feel its a pro-legal-immigration-streamlining-process!

cheers
 
I posted the same question to other thread and many people replied that after conference commitee, it go to president. It will not go again for re-poll to senet and House.

However I am not sure. We should know the truth; after conference committee amendment, will it go back to senete and house or directly go to President.

Please comment !!!




texancanadian said:
That is good news if true but there is still one extra problem. Even after conf committee agrees it still needs to go back to both House and Senate for final approval of the same unified proposal.
House bill has passed by 2-vote margin 217-215. Now if Immigration provisions are attached we know anti Immigration Congressman like Lamar Smith and Tancredo who had previously voted for the congress version of the bill will now vote against it.... so you cant be sure that even if Conference committee approves language we want it will once again pass Congress.
Click to expand...
 
The immigration issue is only one of the many the committee will have to reconcile. Note that there are differences between the versions of the two houses relating to immigration clause.

legislative process details from Oh's site:

Under the Constitution of the United States, either House (House of Representatives or Senate) can initiate the legislative process in most cases. Or the two Houses can initiate the legislative process simultaneously. Within each House, the bill is first introduced and goes through the relevant Committees and Subcommittees. The Committees' bill is then presented to the full floor of that House. Statistically, the full floor usually rubber stamps the Committee bills in most cases. Accordingly, the major struggle lies with the Committee actions. If one House initiates alone, the bill moves to another House for its action. In the another House, a same process will take place before the another House either amend and pass or reject the bill or just approve the bill. Where two Houses initiate similar bills either simultaneously or sequentially, and the two Houses passe similar bills with difference in some provisions, then the bills go to the Conference committee that is consisted of the House and the Senate. If the Conference Committe reaches a compromise, the bill then goes back to each House and the full floor of each House will either pass or reject it. Statistically, rejection of the Conference committee compromise is very rare. Once the bill is finally passed by the two Houses, then it is presented to the President for his signature. The President has a power either to consent and sign it into law or veto the bill within 10 days. The so called "statute" or "law" takes effect "upon President's signature." Accordingly, even if the Congress passed a bill, there will be no law until the President signs it into law. This legislative process will tell you two things. The bill which the Judiciary Committee in one House, the Senate, passed yesterday is not a law. Second, for this bill to become a law, there is a long road ahead and will go though a painful struggle in both Houses. Roll up your sleeves and work on lobbying!!

priyargc said:
I posted the same question to other thread and many people replied that after conference commitee, it go to president. It will not go again for re-poll to senet and House.

However I am not sure. We should know the truth; after conference committee amendment, will it go back to senete and house or directly go to President.

Please comment !!!
Click to expand...
 
not necessarily. the fact is only that nobody wanted to introduce such amendment to the hr 4241 at the house level.
if they wanted to introduce such an amendment, they would have done it at the committee level itself. by the time it came to the full floor, it probably was too late to introduce such amendment. remember the fate of byrd amendment?

there is a strong tech company-lobby at work here that introduced these provisions in the senate version of the package.
I do not know what this lobby is upto. But, if they had wanted to bring such amendment at the committee level in the lower house, they would have succeeded. something tells me they did not want such amendment either at committee or house level.

haven't done the research on this one yet...anybody knows when the hr4241 was finalized at the budget committee in the house. prior to the severe retro-kicking in (mid sep) or what?
rosatiamo said:
I am not so optimistic about the house when the reconciled bill goes there. When they were making 4241, a counterpart to S. 1932, they deliberately left 8001 and 8002 out. This tells me that there is some significant force in the house opposing immigration or parting immigration with budget bill.
Click to expand...
 
Thanks for clarifying, tusharvk! I just talked to an American co-worker and he said about the same thing. We are still facing three major obstacles: 1. the conference committee has to put 8001 in the bill. 2. when it goes back to senate and house, they have to pass it. 3. the president has to sign it.

Obstable No.1, for me, is the biggest challenge. We do not know who is going to be in this committee and their political opinion about immigration.

Obstacle No. 2 is no small task either. Although statistically reconciled bill usually gets a yes, I am worried about the house, which left 8001 out in the first place. And as I heard, when reconciled bill comes from the conference, both house and senate have to vote, talking to each other is NOT ALLOWED. Republicans talked a lot to get help to pass 4241. This time they will not be able to talk before voting.

Obstable No. 3 is probably easier, considering we have a republican president.

We pray hard for this!
 
After reconciliaton conference (we do no know when it will happen and who are the conference members as of today), YES, the "uniform" bill will be sent to Snate floor and House Floor for vote again. I verified this information by calling my Senator's office.

The fun part begins here..... When Lamar Smith and Tom Tancredo see Section 8000 and 8001 of S.1932 in the "uniform" Bill, they are going to go crazy and vote "NO" on the "uniform" Bill. Remember, they both voted "YES" for H.R.4241 and H.R.4241 was approved by a slim difference of 2 votes. That could mean the "uniform" Bill is defeted in the House. I have no doubt about the Senate passing the "uniform" bill.

In this situtation, the members of the reconciliation conference meet again and try to reconcile and produce second version of "uniform" Bill. The second version is presented to both Senate and House...and the process repeats all over until theres in one final "uniform" Bill that is accepted by both House and Senate.

Thanks,
Senthil Puliyadi
 
Senthilnath said:
After reconciliaton conference (we do no know when it will happen and who are the conference members as of today), YES, the "uniform" bill will be sent to Snate floor and House Floor for vote again. I verified this information by calling my Senator's office.

The fun part begins here..... When Lamar Smith and Tom Tancredo see Section 8000 and 8001 of S.1932 in the "uniform" Bill, they are going to go crazy and vote "NO" on the "uniform" Bill. Remember, they both voted "YES" for H.R.4241 and H.R.4241 was approved by a slim difference of 2 votes. That could mean the "uniform" Bill is defeted in the House. I have no doubt about the Senate passing the "uniform" bill.

In this situtation, the members of the reconciliation conference meet again and try to reconcile and produce second version of "uniform" Bill. The second version is presented to both Senate and House...and the process repeats all over until theres in one final "uniform" Bill that is accepted by both House and Senate.

Thanks,
Senthil Puliyadi
Click to expand...

We are creating all kind of speculations. We forget the politics behind it. This is a budget bill, not a immigration bill. Republicants were struggling hard to pass the bill, though it contains very sensitive issues like, Alaska oil drilling, Madicaid cut, Student loan cut, Food stamps ect.

Compare to these hot issues, the immigration relief is nothing for the politicians. They, some how, managed to pass the bill in midnight. Because they are in urgent to pass the bill and to send to conference and inturn to president.

At the conference level, it (visa) will not be an important issue to discuss. Since it(8001) give more money to government, there is a great chance it will be included in final bill. It is only a 50% chance. No body in the conference committee will support or against this provisions, very aggressivly.

Because government needs the deficit reduction immediatly, the house and senate republicants will not stop the passage of the final unified bill (after the conference committee ), whether it contains 8001 in it or not.
 
Recapturing unused EB visas might be added.
Allowing us to file 485 when the dates are not current will not be added as that will flood USCIS with lot of applications and given the current efficiency of USCIS we all be stuck at the later stage for ever. This does not benefit US employers anyway. No justification. We are just asking for more.

Just remove the per country quota and that should do it
 
labourreplace

There is No provision to remove per country quota, from what i read. Sec 8001 says capture 90,000 unused visas and exempt dependants from being counted against the quota
 
I think exactly opposite..

The AILA lobby will be greatly beneficial if we are able to file 485 even if dates are retrogressed. On the other hand capturing unused visa does not help anybody but us and nobody gives a damn about us !

labor_replace said:
Recapturing unused EB visas might be added.
Allowing us to file 485 when the dates are not current will not be added as that will flood USCIS with lot of applications and given the current efficiency of USCIS we all be stuck at the later stage for ever. This does not benefit US employers anyway. No justification. We are just asking for more.

Just remove the per country quota and that should do it
Click to expand...
 
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