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Denial at interview because kids were not with me...

bluecheese said:
Hey twolf,

2014EU1xxxx 01 PRS Refused
2014EU1xxxx 02 PRS Ready
2014EU1xxxx 03 PRS Ready

No reason given they say "Please see the letter you received at your interview for more information" which i never got...
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Seeing this makes me think two things.

The 2 kids are listed as derivatives. Are you SURE you did not file the 230 form for the kids? I'm surprised they are there - although that should not have been a problem.

The other thing that is wierd is that your wife is NOT there - and that points at how you listed your marital status on your eDV. You must have got that right. So - how long have you been legally separated? If the court papers are before October 2012 and you listed legally separated, then you are ok on that point. However, if you listed divorced - that would have been a mistake. Given the wife doesn't appear the timing of the legal separation is crucial.

However, again - I am still at a loss as to why this case has been refused. It shouldn't have been in my opinion.
 
SusieQQQ said:
Sorry, I don't know. But having seen your post 6, I think you left someone off the application form, presumably your wife, and that is immediate grounds for disqualification of your entry.
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Not if his legal separation predates the eDV.
 
SusieQQQ said:
Sorry, I don't know. But having seen your post 6, I think you left someone off the application form, presumably your wife, and that is immediate grounds for disqualification of your entry.
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I left no one from any form... Everyone is on the DS230 with correct status (legally separated). And the CO did not tell me i mis filled the form. He just expected to see the kids.
 
bluecheese said:
I left no one from any form... Everyone is on the DS230 with correct status (legally separated). And the CO did not tell me i mis filled the form. He just expected to see the kids.
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Well, if that was his reason it is not justified.

Can you confirm you were legally separated when you sent in the initial entry? I presume you took a copy of the separation agreement to the interview?

Again, no matter what was on the DS230, if there was an error on the initial entry like this that would disqualify you.
 
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britsimon said:
Seeing this makes me think two things.

The 2 kids are listed as derivatives. Are you SURE you did not file the 230 form for the kids? I'm surprised they are there - although that should not have been a problem.

The other thing that is wierd is that your wife is NOT there - and that points at how you listed your marital status on your eDV. You must have got that right. So - how long have you been legally separated? If the court papers are before October 2012 and you listed legally separated, then you are ok on that point. However, if you listed divorced - that would have been a mistake. Given the wife doesn't appear the timing of the legal separation is crucial.

However, again - I am still at a loss as to why this case has been refused. It shouldn't have been in my opinion.
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Kids and future ex-wife are on my DS230.
She is marked as separated (separated sep 3rd 2012, officialized jan 15th 2013 (date of court paper) ).

Do you think I will get some kind of justification?
 
SusieQQQ said:
Well, if that was his reason it is not justified.

Can you confirm you were legally separated when you sent in the initial entry? I presume you took a copy of the separation agreement to the interview?
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this is what is making me crazy actually... I cannot even complain about anyone being un-nice at the embassy, they were all very kind, even the CO...
 
Look Bluecheese. If what you have said here is correct and accurate, then they have messed up. EVEN IF they "suspect" that you are planning to bring your kids later that is not grounds for denial.

So now you have a choice. Fight it or not fight it. If it were me, I would fight it - First of all I would try and contact the embassy and get to the most senior person I could find. Check the ambassadors name and contact him/her direct. I would be doing that tomorrow. Then, if that didn't have immediate success I would seek a Paris based lawyer who is known to the US embassy. You have no RIGHT of appeal - but I would not be surprised if this could be reviewed. However, I would do that sooner rather than later. Once the case goes back to KCC as refused I think things will get stickier.

By the way, you could also call KCC and see if they could give you info or even push it back down to Paris. Their "default position" will be that the CO has the absolute right to make the call - BUT you might get a more sympathetic ear - and maybe, just maybe that gets somewhere.

Please make sure you update us if you decide to fight. Your case (however it turns out) might help others in the future going through the same thing.
 
SusieQQQ said:
Can you confirm you were legally separated when you sent in the initial entry? I presume you took a copy of the separation agreement to the interview?

Again, no matter what was on the DS230, if there was an error on the initial entry like this that would disqualify you.
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If initial entry was the entry to the lottery, i honestly do not remember.

But if there is a difference between the lottery form and the DS230, would they really make you go through all the process (medical, interview) to give you another reason for denial?
 
bluecheese said:
I left no one from any form... Everyone is on the DS230 with correct status (legally separated). And the CO did not tell me i mis filled the form. He just expected to see the kids.
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1. On your own DS-230 form, under which section did you further list your children: 31a or 32b?

2. Did you fill out a DS-230 form for each of the children?
 
SusieQQQ said:
I disagree with these posts. The OP said he had the children on his application - which was correct, irrespective of whether or not they would go with. If he had left them off yes refusal - but he says they were on. There is no problem with wanting the kids to come over at a later stage, as long as DoS is aware that the children exist. I have read a few cases like this. Moreover, I personally know someone in exactly this situation, doesn't have custody of his kids, they were listed on his application, (he is hoping when they are old enough to decide for themselves they will go ); his kids did not go to the interview, but he, his second wife and stepchildren all got visas no problem. I was at the consulate the same time they were doing their interview ...and as many of you will know you can often overhear what is said at others interviews...

However: I think I may see the problem, and it's nothing to do with saying he wants his kids to join him later. There are three cases - principal and two derivatives - listed by the OP in post 6. As he was not divorced at the time of the application, there should have been 3 - not 2 - dependents listed. It looks like he listed his kids but not his wife, and as he was not divorced his wife should have been on the form.

And no, the interview letter will not change. Once KCC sends your file to the embassy they have nothing more to do with the process.
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I think having no custody definitively is safer than battling for custody.

The OP implied when he settles in the US he might bring over the kids. They don't like situations like this. They don't want an LPR or citizen pushing them to get them their children immediately and accusing the US government of "separating the parent from their children by not granting them GCs immediately."

They don't want that hassle. The easier route is to deny the person before he becomes entitled to any "rights."

Had the OP said definitively that he does not intend to bring children over and had not implied that there was a custody battle going on, he would be in a better position.

It's just like a student applying for F-1 and implying at the interview "if things go all right I might stay permanently. Now, I'm just saying IF!" Nu uh! That ain't work.
 
bluecheese said:
Kids and future ex-wife are on my DS230.
She is marked as separated (separated sep 3rd 2012, officialized jan 15th 2013 (date of court paper) ).

Do you think I will get some kind of justification?
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THAT is a problem.

If you were not LEGALLY separated (meaning the court had recognized the separation) on the date of your eDV then you were MARRIED. I think what you are saying means you were not legally separated until jan 15th 2013.

That is cause for disqualification by itself.
 
britsimon said:
Fight it or not fight it.
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Oh, I will definitively fight it... I have drafted some action plan already. Right now, I really wish I would get an official reason (= written) for denial as I kind of know what to find against (bureaucracy, some obscure 212 article, etc.)

I will keep you posted.

I am an optimistic person in general. Of course, I was very nervous before going to the embassy (and of course the ultimate joke about no computers allowed in the embassy really stressed me out). I was thinking about plenty of reasons for not getting the visa, but not about something I cleared with the immigration support before.
 
bluecheese said:
If initial entry was the entry to the lottery, i honestly do not remember.

But if there is a difference between the lottery form and the DS230, would they really make you go through all the process (medical, interview) to give you another reason for denial?
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Yes, there's a difference between the eDV application 'lottery form' and the DS230 form. And yes, they will not point out to you that the information you've provided on both forms do not match. KCC will simply flag the case as possibly fraudulent when it gets sent to the embassy
 
britsimon said:
THAT is a problem.

If you were not LEGALLY separated (meaning the court had recognized the separation) on the date of your eDV then you were MARRIED. I think what you are saying means you were not legally separated until jan 15th 2013.

That is cause for disqualification by itself.
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It may be a problem, but it is not what the CO used as a pretext for denial. From what I understand, they really do the background check AFTER they picked you in the lottery.
 
Sm1smom said:
Yes, there's a difference between the eDV application 'lottery form' and the DS230 form. And yes, they will not point out to you that the information you've provided on both forms do not match. KCC will simply flag the case as possibly fraudulent when it gets sent to the embassy
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Agreed. In this case the forms should NOT have matched, because by the time he submitted his forms he was then legally separated - but was married at the time of the eDV.

Bluecheese - I assume they asked to see the legal separation document during the interview?
 
bluecheese said:
1) Kids are in29 and NOT in 31a and NOT in 31b.
2) NO DS230 for kids.
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This is quite baffling becuase the CO shouldn't have been expecting to see the kids in that case. The kids shouldn't have been listed on the IL in the first place.

And I'm assuming you indicated something like "None" on both 31a and 31b? If you did, the kids names shouldn't even have been listed as derivatives on your IL letter to start with. If you left those sections blank, my guess is KCC might have assumed you intended for the kids to immigrate with you hence their being listed on the IL.
 
bluecheese said:
They did and I provided an original copy of the court document.
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Well that would be correct, because the forms you sent (122/230 would have listed you as legally separated). However, if you put legally separated (which is an option) on the original entry, the document you provided them shows that was incorrect. You stated above you were separated from September 2012 - so I am wondering if you saw the word separated and ticked that. A call to KCC might confirm that - or they might refuse to discuss it with you.
 
Sm1smom said:
This is quite baffling becuase the CO shouldn't have been expecting to see the kids in that case. The kids shouldn't have been listed on the IL in the first place.

And I'm assuming you indicated something like "None" on both 31a and 31b? If you did, the kids names shouldn't even have been listed as derivatives on your IL letter to start with. If you left those sections blank, my guess is KCC might have assumed you intended for the kids to immigrate with you hence their being listed on the IL.
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This sounds more like it. KCC made the mistake and the OP is paying for it.
 
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