Anything can happen. One can lose his DL and an actual passport card
can be used for ID purpose. If you divide $20 by number of valid years
of a passport card, you won't have much money to lose.
It is each individual's choice.
After Oath - What Next ?
- Thread starter dnbev1
- Start date
Anything can happen. One can lose his DL and an actual passport card
can be used for ID purpose. If you divide $20 by number of valid years
of a passport card, you won't have much money to lose.
It is each individual's choice.
Sometimes American police are more scary. In many other countries, people
can heatedly argue with police when misunderstanding happens. Here you
will get arrested for resisting a cop. the Police here simply tell you if you
want to argue you go to court not with me.
It is also true something trivials in other countries where people do not care
are conisdered very serious here in the USA. In other countries, I can see people fight in street punch and kick each other. Police do not care unless someone is really injured. Here in USA if you do that police will come no matter any ne is hurt or not. That is why I never see people fight not even verbal fight on street in USA
I agree with you about American police - they indeed treat all citizens as if the latter were suspected felons regardless of the circumstances. For instance, European police is much more 'human' and flexible than here.
However, my point was that as an American citizen, you don't have to carry the proof of citizenship. If they start asking you questions, politely inform them that you are a US citizen and that you refuse to continue the conversation with them. If they don't believe you (very unlikely), no matter what you say, you will be detained. So, the best way for anyone would be to refuse answering any further questions, which is, after all, our very own constitutional right
I agree. But carrying passport card does not add too much weight anyway
so why not carry it if you have it?
Not necessarily so. INA 287(g) authorizes police officers to perform immigration duties (including asking you your immigration status when stopped) as long as they have training.
http://www.ice.gov/doclib/pi/news/factsheets/060816dc287gfactsheet.pdf
What exactly is the "Update SSN" for? Notify SSA that the immigration status has changed?
If you look latino, and live near the Mexican border - the odds would be lot higher than that.
My neighbor is a naturalised citizen, is latino by appearance, and has heavily accented English. We live in Southern California. He carries a passport card in his wallet. The other night he was pulled over in a traffic stop - reason for the stop is unclear, but, it was late, he was in his beat-up work truck, in a fairly isolated area. The police officer approached the car with his gun drawn, and my neighbour was called out of the care, and had to lay on the ground. He told me the police officer asked him if he was illegal, and threatened to arrest him. He was able to show his passport card, prove citizenship, and drive away. If he did not have the card, he may have been detained, had to call his wife and have her drive with citizenship certificate etc.
So, whether you want to debate the legality of having to be able to prove citizenship, in some circumstances, it just seems good common sense to carry it with you.
On the other hand, I am a middle aged blond caucasian female, and drive a boring newish crossover SUV - I may love in the same area, but feel no need to have a passport card we me.
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Agree. I was a bit ethnocentric here.
Just because he was driving a beat-up truck in an isolated area is not a good reason to treat him like that. Even considering that the American police is a bunch of trigger-happy cowboys, this story still lacks a considerable amount of information to make any conclusion.
spiderman03
Registered Users (C)
You must be seriously paranoid if you intend to carry the proof of the US citizenship with you everywhere. Inside the country - even within 160 km from the border - you can simply say "I am a US citizen", and it should be enough for any law enforcement agent. The only county police that vigorously enforces the immigration laws is Maricopa county sheriff department just because it is headed by a lunatic Joe Arpaio.
Of course, it is up to you whether to carry documents all the time, but keep in mind that some native-born US citizens don't even have any proof of their citizenship at all. When they need to prove their citizenship, they simply request their birth certificates from the issuing agency. How do they get around on a daily basis?However, I understand your fears because in my native country, I had to carry internal passport all the time. I just overcame my old habits.
Paranoid? First of all, please do not committ the mistake of comparing native born white Americans with other naturalized minorities. Second, you got to see immigration news regularly. Now, many of the county police are authorized to check the immigration status of people even if they are pulled over for a broken tail light. 3) My close friend who was doing a travel job was pulled over for speeding and asked for immigration proof. He was a naturalized citizen. He was taken into custody but fortunately his wife was able to bring his passport and get him released. Since then, he was carrying a passport card in his wallet.
Sounds like a case for the ACLU...
So, police stops you, asks you whether you are a citizen, then says: "I don't believe you" and detains you? It would indeed make a good case for the ACLU. I guess I am lucky to live in a place where police is expected to be at least somewhat reasonable and utilise probable cause.
The only conclusion I anticipated anyone making form this was that it saved him a whole lot of hassle by having a passport card with him.
Al Southner
Registered Users (C)
The operative content there: training on immigration law. I have the great privilege of living in Montgomery County, wealthy county which doesn't fit police cruiser with dash cameras because the police union is against them. This also added another benefit, no training of police officers on immigration law because it will create constrains in their day-to-day work duties.
However, VA is a different beast, police in Prince William County routinely arrest hispanic looking men, check their immigration status and send them to ICE for deportation. In DC, police don't care about immigration status of people they arrest, because this is viewed as a federal scope...
Al Southner
Registered Users (C)
Your neighbor should have filed a complaint against the officer. The ACLU should have wiped the floor with that police department, especially as from what I read in your post, the hispanic man posed no threat whatsoever to the officer...
Oh...crap, he did pose some threat, being brown and driving a beat-up car at night... In this case, the officer fears were valid, but the ACLU should still eat him alive...Konig, it seems to me that you have hardly had any experience with cops. In most cases, cops are reasonable. But there are times when you either meet with a disgrunted or prejudiced or even a racist amongst them. Just like it is in everyday life and not just cops related matter. I live in one of the richest counties in the US (at least top 20). Ocassional you get pulled over for speeding or some other reasons. Usually your legallity in this country will not be an issue but if you for whatever reason look like you are an immigrant or sound like one, its now a requirement to some level by homeland security that the cops request for proof of citizenship - illegal immigrant control and security matters.
The truth, it does not matter where you live. It may not even matter the way you dress and the kind of car you drive (truth, all these are factors) but as soon as you have any feature of a possible illegal immigrant, then you need to save yourself the embarrasement by carrying some proof of citizenship. We know anyone can claim anything but as far as law is concerned, evidence or proof is a huge material factor but if you want to go about believing that when issues happens that cops are going to just take your word for it, well its your choice. The card you are required to carry is 1 millionth times a less burden compare to the embarrasement it may cause you if you dont have one on you when occassion calls for it.
Just my own drop of rain.
Your neighbor should have filed a complaint against the officer. The ACLU should have wiped the floor with that police department, especially as from what I read in your post, the hispanic man posed no threat whatsoever to the officer...
Do you seriously think the cop will not have a defence? He could claim 101 things - remember the law is more on his side. We can all decide to make already complicated matters worse or decide to live a simple life. It's the choice we have to make. Carry a simple card avoid potential embarrasement or refuse (which is also your right) and wished you have it when occassion calls for it - the choice is ours. Even Homeland Security and USCIS highly recommends that you carry one.
Al Southner
Registered Users (C)
I agree, the police officer can accuse the hispanic man of being a threat to him which will have the law sleeping on this side. It is also possible as part of the discovery that the same officer might be a serial offender, which might show a pattern of abuse of immigrants. ACLU has been very good at defending civil rights of individuals...
