Urgent advice needed for acquaintense: child turning 18 soon, how to proceed with citizenship?

[ludhianvi]

Hello experts:

I met one lady today who was looking for the oath place (oath on 14th Feb), and asked me for directions to the place. I guess she asked me because I looked like someone from her place, and found out that actually we are from the same state in India. Anyhow, her interview was today, and since her child turns 18 next month, the officer scheduled her oath for this week. Nice of the officer for helping her.

She is a single-mom (I don't know if she is divorced or widow, didn't ask). I guess I can call and ask her if there will be a difference because of that. I am not sure, but based on my interactions, I feel she is not much educated and knowledgeable as she paid someone to fill her forms. Or may be she was paranoid about messing something.

One of her kids turns 18 next month (March), and she wants to know what forms to fill to get citizenship for her kids. I am not sure myself, so I told her that I will find out the answer (from experts here), and give her a call. Since she is a single-mom, can her kids get citizenship based on their mother? If yes, what forms to fill?

Or, if they want to save money, can she apply for the passport for her kids without citizenship certificate?

If she can apply for the passport, should she apply for the certificate or save the application money needed for certificate? She told me that she can't afford to pay someone money to fill the forms for her kids, so I am thinking that she is not financially sound either. I was surprised that people are charging 70 or more dollars to fill forms. Man, can't you just help people who can barely afford? I am thinking of offering to help her fill the forms, and if she wants my help, should I help her, or it might cause any problems with my own case?

On a side note, Sacramento is doing oath ceremony this Thursday, Feb 14th. Another one is next week (based on some posts here and trackit). So, I am not sure, if they do weekly or monthly oaths in Sacramento.

 

[WBH]

One of her kids turns 18 next month (March), and she wants to know what forms to fill to get citizenship for her kids. .

If she take oath before her kid turn 18 next month, her kid will automatically get citizenship assuming other conditions met.
So she wont need any form to get citizenship but she need some form to get proof of citizenship of hier kid.

The form is called N-600. Even this is optional but strongly recomended if a few hundred dollars is not a big deal.

 

[ludhianvi]

Thanks WBH.

She will take oath this week, and her child will turn 18 next month. So, based on your reply, her kids will automatically get citizenship. When you say if other conditions met, you mean the conditions listed on instructions for N-600 form, right?

Can she apply for the passport for her kids after she becomes citizen (but before the citizenship certificate for her kids)? If yes, what does she need to show for her kids passport application?

What is the advantage of getting citizenship certificate if she can get passport without that? I am asking this if she asks me the same question.

Also, what is the recommended course of action in this case:

File N-600 before kid turns 18 (preferably as soon as possible after her oath this week), or get US passport first (again, applying soon after oath), and then file N-600?

Sorry for so many questions, I just want to help a single-mom who seems overwhelmed with such tight deadline.

TIA.

If she take oath before her kid turn 18 next month, her kid will automatically get citizenship assuming other conditions met.
So she wont need any form to get citizenship but she need some form to get proof of citizenship of hier kid.

The form is called N-600. Even this is optional but strongly recomended if a few hundred dollars is not a big deal.

 

[Jackolantern]

She will take oath this week, and her child will turn 18 next month. So, based on your reply, her kids will automatically get citizenship. When you say if other conditions met, you mean the conditions listed on instructions for N-600 form, right?

Conditions include the kids being permanent residents, and living with her in the US with her having legal custody. She'll need court papers (or a death certificate, if widowed) to prove custody.

Can she apply for the passport for her kids after she becomes citizen (but before the citizenship certificate for her kids)? If yes, what does she need to show for her kids passport application?

Yes, she can get their passports without the citizenship certificate.

What is the advantage of getting citizenship certificate if she can get passport without that? I am asking this if she asks me the same question.

The citizenship certificate doesn't expire, but the passport will expire every 5 or 10 years. And if her kids don't get their own citizenship certificate, they may need to rely on her (their mother's) naturalization certificate and other documents to get a new passport if their passport is lost or stolen.

File N-600 before kid turns 18 (preferably as soon as possible after her oath this week), or get US passport first (again, applying soon after oath), and then file N-600?

The passport is faster and cheaper than the certificate, so it's recommended to get the passport first if not applying for both at the same time.

It is not necessary to apply for the N-600 before the kids turn 18. As long as she naturalizes before they're 18, and the other conditions are met (kids with green card, custody etc.), they can apply for N-600 at any time in the future. If she doesn't want to apply for the N-600 immediately, she should at least inform her kids about it so they are aware of the opportunity to apply for it on their own when they want to. Even if they apply for it after 18, the certificate will show that they obtained US citizenship before age 18 (typically retroactive to the date of naturalization of their parent).

It's also not necessary to apply for their passports before the kids turn 18. Once they meet all the necessary conditions, they become citizens, and the passport or N-600 would be for proof of citizenship which they already obtained.

 

[WBH]

What is the advantage of getting citizenship certificate if she can get passport without that? I am asking this if she asks me the same question.

Everyone should have a basic root document for him/sherslf in his/her oen posesstion for such important things.

Beside, although the purpose of N-600 is not to get citizenship but to get proof of citizrnship, if you get N-400
down, you ahve assurance that your citizenship is really real. There are examples reported here
that some such childrne apply for US passport several times and when later decide for N-400
they were told theyr were not citizens due to something so they need to apply for citizenship
(their use of US passport is not their fault so it is not an issue)

So advanatge of doing N-600 is obvious. Only thing you need to coinsider is balance of N-600
vs a few hudnred dollars. Of course it is not an "either do now or never" issue. You can do N-600
for teh kid a few years or even many years down the road but not now.

 

[Jackolantern]

Sorry for so many questions, I just want to help a single-mom who seems overwhelmed with such tight deadline.

There is no tight deadline, other than the need for her to be naturalized before her oldest kid turns 18. After that there is no urgency to get N-600 or a US passport, unless they plan to travel in the near future. Just don't make things difficult by delaying it for years.

However, if the kids don't already have green cards, that involves a different need for urgency -- she should not wait long to apply for their green cards.

 

[ludhianvi]

Thanks Jackolantern and WBH. Your replies really make sense, and help a lot. I will convey the responses to her. These responses help me also, as I have to do the same for my child also when I become a citizen, hopefully soon.

WBH: Just one thing is not clear to me, why would someone want to do N-400 when they are already citizens? Or I interpreted your post wrong?

 

[ludhianvi]

Thanks Jackolantern. I don't know if her kids are GC holders or not, but I sincerely hope that they are. That will make their mom's life so much easier.

There is no tight deadline, other than the need for her to be naturalized before her oldest kid turns 18. After that there is no urgency to get N-600 or a US passport, unless they plan to travel in the near future. Just don't make things difficult by delaying it for years.

However, if the kids don't already have green cards, that involves a different need for urgency -- she should not wait long to apply for their green cards.

 

[WBH]

WBH: Just one thing is not clear to me, why would someone want to do N-400 when they are already citizens? Or I interpreted your post wrong?

The story posted here ,as I remmeber is:

(1) The person's father become a natualizaed citizens before teh person became 18.
(2) So the person toght he was a US citizen and applied for passport and got it
(3) A few years later, he did N-600 but this time USCIS found some condition is not met at the time of perons' fater's natualization
and decided that the person thus di dnot become a citizen and was still a PR and denied his N-600. (I don't recall exact reason
why the person was not a citizen perhaps because he was not living with his father at teh time of father's natualization?)
(4) So the person realized he was not a US citizen even he got a US passport. So he decided to apply for himself thru N-400
and he needed to answer Yes to that "Have you ever claim to be US citizen" question on N-400.
This would not be an issue since this was an innocent mistake on part of department of state actually

 

[ludhianvi]

Oh ok. Thanks for helping with my curiosity, WBH!!

 

[Jackolantern]

That scenario of getting a passport without fulfilling all the conditions for derivative citizenship is much less likely these days. After a number of similar cases where the person got a US passport and then later had the N-600 denied, the Department of State is now doing a much better job of checking for all the required conditions and evidence before issuing the passport.

But still, the point is that the certificate is more definitive proof of citizenship, because with a passport alone there is a small possibility of ultimately being found not to be a US citizen and having the passport revoked. Whereas once the certificate is issued and delivered, it is never questioned again unless there is some indication of fraud.