survival time. please act now
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patienceGC
Registered Users (C)
dsatish
That was a really pathetic post. I cant believe someone who got to the US would ever say "down with globalization". You shouldnt be afraid of what is gonna happen be more prepared to tackle it. No I am not a person who made a lot of $$$ during the boom. But I do have the confidence that I can find something if push comes to shove! If you arent prepared to update your skills or are afraid of change... you should seriously consider another profession.
Its sad to see American IT hypocrites complain about jobs being taken out of the country when they still drive Lexuses and BMWs, use Electronics made in Taiwan, Shirts made in India, etc. They wont be caught dead driving a Chevy! Those whiners dont deserve a petition. There are still people who can find 5 jobs in a day. If you are not one of them, its your fault. You should make yourself valuable and irreplaceable. If you are just another mediocre programmer... you better watch out!
That was a really pathetic post. I cant believe someone who got to the US would ever say "down with globalization". You shouldnt be afraid of what is gonna happen be more prepared to tackle it. No I am not a person who made a lot of $$$ during the boom. But I do have the confidence that I can find something if push comes to shove! If you arent prepared to update your skills or are afraid of change... you should seriously consider another profession.
Its sad to see American IT hypocrites complain about jobs being taken out of the country when they still drive Lexuses and BMWs, use Electronics made in Taiwan, Shirts made in India, etc. They wont be caught dead driving a Chevy! Those whiners dont deserve a petition. There are still people who can find 5 jobs in a day. If you are not one of them, its your fault. You should make yourself valuable and irreplaceable. If you are just another mediocre programmer... you better watch out!
Well said waytoolong, WheresMahGreen and PatienceGC (I'm glad we can agree on this).
But the thing is, this hue and cry will be there till the economy comes back on trial and when it happens, everyone will magically forget these issues. But who knows when this is going to happen.
Talking about the liberal, bed-wetter CNN - if you have watched the Lou Dobbs Money Line show, he was very much against the exporting of jobs to other countries. Can't he, being someone who knows economics, realize that this is good for the US in the long run? Also while reading the feedback for that program, he read only the negative ones - wouldn't there be someone who would have written positively about this? That's why I watch Fox News.
But the thing is, this hue and cry will be there till the economy comes back on trial and when it happens, everyone will magically forget these issues. But who knows when this is going to happen.
Talking about the liberal, bed-wetter CNN - if you have watched the Lou Dobbs Money Line show, he was very much against the exporting of jobs to other countries. Can't he, being someone who knows economics, realize that this is good for the US in the long run? Also while reading the feedback for that program, he read only the negative ones - wouldn't there be someone who would have written positively about this? That's why I watch Fox News.
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Do you think, only IT jobs exist in this country? Even this county's flag i bought is made in China. They killed manufacturing industry, which can absorb more, and more people then IT. Toyotas and Hondas are killing job market in this country.
It is just not the problem with IT. It is policy of this country "Where it is cheap, go their"
In spite of the entire Human right problems all kinds of problems why China is MFN. Why Japan?
Talk about India, It is not even 10% of these countries.
It is just not the problem with IT. It is policy of this country "Where it is cheap, go their"
In spite of the entire Human right problems all kinds of problems why China is MFN. Why Japan?
Talk about India, It is not even 10% of these countries.
i don't believe this . . .
you guys . . . of all people . . . how can you complain about globalization, about the "cheap" labour?
next thing you know you will complain about "those immigrants" taking your jobs . . .
yes it is about more for your buck . . . so companies will always try to cut costs, but companies need to make and sell products to make money. this country is indeed 50% retail economy, but there is still another 50%. And they are trying to come up with new products and take market share. And when you do that, it's about time to market, not just cost. You can't outsource everything and still expect to come up with new products on time. You need innovation, you need those employees who will be motivated by owning parts of the company, etc.
Who do you think gets the money when stuff is outsourced? Engineers? no way. There are too many middlemen. Engineers gets his paycheck and he is not going to work his ass off for these middlemen. Did you guys already forget how you got here?
Did you work your asses off for those bodyshops that did your first H1??? Or did you keep your cool until you got the right job for the right company?
My company is outsourcing as much as it can, but i'm not worried about that the least bit. I know what kind of quality comes out of those outsourcing initiatives and who has to fix all that stuff and makes it work. Even more work for me
After i read some of the messages here and some of the articles about outsourcing, i think some people just never reallized that outsourcing always existed. It looks like some folks were born yesterday.
How can they be against outsourcing? How can they be against cutting costs? Can you go against gravity too??? They tried turning rivers back in my home country
What are you going to do? Tax companies for outsourcing? Most of the companies who do outsourcing are smart enough to be international corporations and they do not need to be limited by a law of a particular country. Tax them here they'll make products THERE. Not just outsourcing, but completely there. Business is gone, you'll have to buy the same stuff made THERE, not here. And i'm not just talking manufacturing. I'm talking investment, R&D, everything. Then you'll import that stuff and your trade deficit will go even higher. Currency will go even lower. It will infact reach the point where american salaries will be lower then european . . .
then nobody will even want to apply for H1.
I guess this will make some people very happy. After all, there will be no one left to mess with Texas . . . (i don't know where that came from
you guys . . . of all people . . . how can you complain about globalization, about the "cheap" labour?
next thing you know you will complain about "those immigrants" taking your jobs . . .
yes it is about more for your buck . . . so companies will always try to cut costs, but companies need to make and sell products to make money. this country is indeed 50% retail economy, but there is still another 50%. And they are trying to come up with new products and take market share. And when you do that, it's about time to market, not just cost. You can't outsource everything and still expect to come up with new products on time. You need innovation, you need those employees who will be motivated by owning parts of the company, etc.
Who do you think gets the money when stuff is outsourced? Engineers? no way. There are too many middlemen. Engineers gets his paycheck and he is not going to work his ass off for these middlemen. Did you guys already forget how you got here?
Did you work your asses off for those bodyshops that did your first H1??? Or did you keep your cool until you got the right job for the right company?
My company is outsourcing as much as it can, but i'm not worried about that the least bit. I know what kind of quality comes out of those outsourcing initiatives and who has to fix all that stuff and makes it work. Even more work for me
After i read some of the messages here and some of the articles about outsourcing, i think some people just never reallized that outsourcing always existed. It looks like some folks were born yesterday.
How can they be against outsourcing? How can they be against cutting costs? Can you go against gravity too??? They tried turning rivers back in my home country
What are you going to do? Tax companies for outsourcing? Most of the companies who do outsourcing are smart enough to be international corporations and they do not need to be limited by a law of a particular country. Tax them here they'll make products THERE. Not just outsourcing, but completely there. Business is gone, you'll have to buy the same stuff made THERE, not here. And i'm not just talking manufacturing. I'm talking investment, R&D, everything. Then you'll import that stuff and your trade deficit will go even higher. Currency will go even lower. It will infact reach the point where american salaries will be lower then european . . .
then nobody will even want to apply for H1.
I guess this will make some people very happy. After all, there will be no one left to mess with Texas . . . (i don't know where that came from
Ok, here are some points to ponder.
This is not for any 15 mins of fame.. but my real story.. and I felt the need to tell this to change the mood of the participants here..
1. Came on H1B in late 97 through a bodyshop in Michigan at 35K/annum.
2. Switched job in July 98 to American Employer after hard bargain and testing the waters in the hot market. Got 75K + expenses /annum.
3. Being sent on 4 month project, converted it into 2 yr long project by putting lot of efforts and building relations with client.
4. Because of client's trust and committment for one year, I could switch the H1 to umbrella and still maintain the client on hourly rate. Money was almost the same or little better.
5. Went to India in late 99. Started small office. Hired couple of BE graduates fresh out of college.
6. Started knowledge transfer literally using ICQ after coming back to US. Invested every extra penny I could get from my own pocket to survive in the early days.
7. Got first project in late 2000 for the Indian team.
8. Changed my own project and moved to a client in late 2000 where much more responsibility was involved as well as access to lot of resources. Rate was handsome as well.
9. Team India got bigger and got couple of nice projects by word of mouth.
10.Filed GC from Umbrella ..in early 99 while I was at old client.
11. Got LC done in late 2000. Meantime moved to new client.
12. Spent another year at the same client while nurturing team India. The size was 12 now.
13. Had GC screw up by the lawyer. Found out in Late 2001. Changed H1, again filed for LC. Still negotiated with the corp and maintained the handsome rate.
14. Got LC. Filed for 140 and 485 concurrently in late 2002. The 6 year deadline was looming in front.
15. Got 140 recently and EAD/AP.
16. Meantime, formed the corp here in US to manage the business as a subsidiary of Indian corp. No personal involvement in any operations. Completely managed by the Indian office. ...speak of technology
17. Got nice contracts. Team India is around 35 People on payroll now. Opened office here to market. Last yr. turnover is $1.5 mil.
18. I am still waiting for 485.. but have no worries since even if I don't get it.. I have an office back home and I can come to US anytme I want. Not only that but nice contracts are coming up in Europe as well now.
19. The most interesting part of all this is not money.. or your lifestyle.. I was thinking otherwise in the start.. but just visited India after I140 and after the visit in late 99 when we started and saw a flourished operation full of professionals.. .. and realized that joy of creativity to convert a raw talent into professional ... is unbeliveable.....
20. Gist of all this is...don't loose hope.. there will be end of any tunnel.. bad or good... keep your eyes open..knock on opportunities.... it is true they say that this is land of opportunities...
This is not for any 15 mins of fame.. but my real story.. and I felt the need to tell this to change the mood of the participants here..
1. Came on H1B in late 97 through a bodyshop in Michigan at 35K/annum.
2. Switched job in July 98 to American Employer after hard bargain and testing the waters in the hot market. Got 75K + expenses /annum.
3. Being sent on 4 month project, converted it into 2 yr long project by putting lot of efforts and building relations with client.
4. Because of client's trust and committment for one year, I could switch the H1 to umbrella and still maintain the client on hourly rate. Money was almost the same or little better.
5. Went to India in late 99. Started small office. Hired couple of BE graduates fresh out of college.
6. Started knowledge transfer literally using ICQ after coming back to US. Invested every extra penny I could get from my own pocket to survive in the early days.
7. Got first project in late 2000 for the Indian team.
8. Changed my own project and moved to a client in late 2000 where much more responsibility was involved as well as access to lot of resources. Rate was handsome as well.
9. Team India got bigger and got couple of nice projects by word of mouth.
10.Filed GC from Umbrella ..in early 99 while I was at old client.
11. Got LC done in late 2000. Meantime moved to new client.
12. Spent another year at the same client while nurturing team India. The size was 12 now.
13. Had GC screw up by the lawyer. Found out in Late 2001. Changed H1, again filed for LC. Still negotiated with the corp and maintained the handsome rate.
14. Got LC. Filed for 140 and 485 concurrently in late 2002. The 6 year deadline was looming in front.
15. Got 140 recently and EAD/AP.
16. Meantime, formed the corp here in US to manage the business as a subsidiary of Indian corp. No personal involvement in any operations. Completely managed by the Indian office. ...speak of technology
17. Got nice contracts. Team India is around 35 People on payroll now. Opened office here to market. Last yr. turnover is $1.5 mil.
18. I am still waiting for 485.. but have no worries since even if I don't get it.. I have an office back home and I can come to US anytme I want. Not only that but nice contracts are coming up in Europe as well now.
19. The most interesting part of all this is not money.. or your lifestyle.. I was thinking otherwise in the start.. but just visited India after I140 and after the visit in late 99 when we started and saw a flourished operation full of professionals.. .. and realized that joy of creativity to convert a raw talent into professional ... is unbeliveable.....
20. Gist of all this is...don't loose hope.. there will be end of any tunnel.. bad or good... keep your eyes open..knock on opportunities.... it is true they say that this is land of opportunities...
theEP you are right.
opportunities are out ther.
i've seen time and time again people making it.
a coworker of mine went to a startup here in US a few years ago. his company got bought out and he got rich.
i'm glad your startup worked out great.
I think it's about startup, not about outsourcing.
It's just that when you feel you've got enough experience and enough guts to start your own.
I've started my own a few years before i went for us. back in my home country. unfortunately i didn't have the guts to deal with all the corruption . . . my business was an ISP. for every piece of copper i had to pay under the table to the officials. try to put somethine in the groud on in the air and they'll make you pay for every paper, and you just can't get enough "permissions" to do what you need there will always be another govt organization that will come to you and tell you that you didn't pay them yet and therefore what you are doing is illegal.
then criminals showed up and demanded i pay for "protection". business is still alive though. had to sell to a bigger company that already had "protection" and it's own "brothers" to settle things with the officials. Perhaps if i started business here i'd have less problems with corruption and more with competition . . .
Ever since i came in here i've been working in my industry doing stuff i do. No management anymore, no investments, no startups. And so far it worked out pretty good. I'm making good money and a lot of progress in terms of experience. Perhaps someday i'll try a startup again, hopefully by that time market will be hot again
opportunities are out ther.
i've seen time and time again people making it.
a coworker of mine went to a startup here in US a few years ago. his company got bought out and he got rich.
i'm glad your startup worked out great.
I think it's about startup, not about outsourcing.
It's just that when you feel you've got enough experience and enough guts to start your own.
I've started my own a few years before i went for us. back in my home country. unfortunately i didn't have the guts to deal with all the corruption . . . my business was an ISP. for every piece of copper i had to pay under the table to the officials. try to put somethine in the groud on in the air and they'll make you pay for every paper, and you just can't get enough "permissions" to do what you need there will always be another govt organization that will come to you and tell you that you didn't pay them yet and therefore what you are doing is illegal.
then criminals showed up and demanded i pay for "protection". business is still alive though. had to sell to a bigger company that already had "protection" and it's own "brothers" to settle things with the officials. Perhaps if i started business here i'd have less problems with corruption and more with competition . . .
Ever since i came in here i've been working in my industry doing stuff i do. No management anymore, no investments, no startups. And so far it worked out pretty good. I'm making good money and a lot of progress in terms of experience. Perhaps someday i'll try a startup again, hopefully by that time market will be hot again
waytoolong
Registered Users (C)
when companies outsource :
people react in two ways :
(1) one group cries foul (includes some ex-H1Bs)
(2) the other group seizes the opportunity to create their own shop
people react in two ways :
(1) one group cries foul (includes some ex-H1Bs)
(2) the other group seizes the opportunity to create their own shop
patienceGC
Registered Users (C)
just a correction
Includes PRESENT H1bs
Includes PRESENT H1bs