Renting an apartment by "foreigners"

JoeF said:
State laws apply to the whole state. Companies can not pick and choose.
Furthermore, there is a federal law that applies in all 50 states.
It is the other way around. The landlords that didn't ask followed the law, the ones that asked for the papers probably did so illegally. While it probably was illegal, a lot of companies get away with it because people don't know their rights, or are not willing to fight for them. If you are willing to give away your rights...I have been on both ends of the issue, although not in the US, i.e., I have both rented and was a landlord. Yet another reason why I will never again get into the rental business...
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I would not fight against them, as I need a roof above my head. If you are willing to win the battle, I again ask you to come visit me, and we will both go to the rental office, you apply for the rent with $25 application fee, let them run your credit score, and we will wait another day for them to get back with us. Once you are cleared and they offer your the space, at that time, when they ask you to show the proof of your legal status ( I assume you look like typical asian or any other native who is neither black or white also your accent usage, well NY does varities of accent, so you may get away with your accent, but for the color of your skin, even you put yourself in big cloak, they will notice you are not american), then we will go to the court and win the battle - that way all Yankies fan will be happy for you that you finally are the one who put this discrimination in trash. You will shine in NY times, wall street will be all over you, you will be famous... you wanna take a chance, if yes, let me know, otherwise dont stay there hiding and shower your words - I will do this, do that, it is good in writing, not in real life challenge.
 
Originally posted by JoeF

I am living in CA and have no intention to move out of this state. If I were to encounter such a practice in CA, you can bet that I would immediately sue their a**es off. I love big paydays.
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---I am not asking you to move away from CA, just to get the big paydays, why dont you take a trip for couple of days??? You dont have to move in here, just few days, please.... we will share the big apple this time. Are you willing to accept the offer?
 
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JoeF said:
No, what for? I don't play such cheap games. I don't pretend to do something, like moving to NY, when I don't. The ACLU can help you prove discrimination, if necessary. You don't need me for that. I fight only for myself.

Huh? I didn't get that. Are you saying that there is only one apartment complex in the town where you are? That must be a really small town then. Or are you saying that the company only owns one apartment complex? If that's the case, you could just move to another one across town, that is owned by somebody else.
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There are many apartment complex in here, but the one I live is close to my work, and I love it. Thats the reason I dont want to go anywhere else.

Well, if you dont want to come down here, thats fine. But I would have made everything sure that your stay would be enjoyable. Its not about games, its all about your fame. I am not looking for any legal help. I was happy to show them my H1B when being asked, as I feel proud to be an immigrant. I thought you were interested in making big pay, thats why I was showing you the way. Well, now it seems like you are defering it, its all good.

Again, the thing is if you live in NY, they may ask you for your legal status, and this is not discrimination. (unless otherwise proved from court)
 
JoeF said:
vitalsigns doesn't understand US anti-discrimination laws and continues to give wrong advice. It is amazing what some people will do to hide their lack of understanding of the laws.
Here is how it goes: private companies are not allowed to ask people if they have a legal status in the US or not. Landlords are not allowed to ask that. Shop owners are not allowed to ask that. It is none of their business.

What baffles me is that you fail to understand that the manager has no business of knowing that. They are not allowed to ask for that. Only government officials, e.g., CIS and ICE, are allowed to ask for legal status. Even for working, the only thing companies are allowed to ask is to check if a person has work authorization.
Private citizens do not have any right to ask you for your legal status. The cashier at your local grocery store doesn't have that right, the owner of a car dealership doesn't have that right, a landlord doesn't have that right.
Why not? Government discriminates all the time (see Special Registration, for instance.) That's allowed discrimination. Government requires that employers check work authorization (not legal status.)
However, when I buy a service or goods from a company (and renting is just buying a service), that company has absolutely no right to check my legal status. The laws do not allow that. Period. End of story.

Oh, and following the laws goes both ways. Sure, somebody who is illegal violates the law. But that does not mean that a landlord can himself violate the law by asking for legal status. And even I, as Legal Permanent Resident, would not show any proof of my legal status, because it is illegal for the landlord to ask for it.
It is in fact all about following the law. The law does not allow a landlord to ask for legal status. So unlike you, I am very consistent in my insistence of following the law.
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JoeF, you are wrong this time. Private companies can ask for immig. status when you apply for a mortgage to buy a house. The only reason they are doing this is to protect their investment. By the same reasoning, why can't a landlord ask for immig. status to protect his investment?
 
Well, I ignored this thread for a while because I am pretty much ignorant on all these landlord-tetant rules.

Today morning I did a simple google and found this site:
Renters' Rights: The Basics

Reading this article what I understood that it's legal to ask for immigration status (or US citizenship status). However, asking special question to certain applicant (and not asking others) or asking for additional documents from certain applicant (and not asking others) can be considered discrimination. Read what it says (Section 2: "Question One, Question All"):

"For example, landlords who ask about immigration history should ask all tenants, not just those whom they suspect might be in the country illegally. Questioning only Hispanics would amount to illegal discrimination on the basis of national origin."

So, when 'arizonian' is asked to fill-up "Supplemental Rental Application for non-US Citizens", from the face value it looks like OK. However, I still would contact landlord and make sure if this form is required to be filled-up by every non-citizen. Because, not asking every non-citizen can be considered discrimination.
 
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JoeF said:
That's a legitimate reason.
Huh? What would a landlord have to protect? They get rent and a security deposit. That covers their risk. They protect their investment by having full occupancy.
That's the whole point: there is no legitimate reason for a landlord to ask for legal status. They provide a service and get a rent check for that every month. If the person (US citizen or not) leaves for whatever reason, and doesn't pay the rent, the apartment gets cleaned out, and rented out to somebody else. Quite different from a 25-year mortgage.
To reiterate: a landlord does not have any legitimate business reason to ask for the legal status of a tenant. I could rent an apartment and leave the country. As long as I pay the rent, it does not matter to the landlord.
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There is a loss suffered by the landlord if a person simply leaves the country. The appt. cannot be rented out till the end of the term unless the landlord starts eviction proceedings. In fact it should be easier for the mortgage company to confiscate the house as there is a clause for that when you sign the mortgage. So there is no reason they should be worried about immig. status.
-- Also it is legally possible to discriminate and charge higher interest rates for non-permanent residents, my guess is thats the only reason the companies are interested in knowing the immigration status.
 
Screening and Rental Procedures--Immigration status checked?

As per HUD--FHEO info'.
*'The Act does not prohibit discrimination based solely on a person's citizenship status. Accordingly, asking housing applicants to provide documentation of their citizenship or immigration status during the screening process would not violate the Fair Housing Act. In fact, such measures have been in place for a number of years in screening applicants for federally-assisted housing.'
*'Example 2: A person who is applying for an apartment mentions in the interview that he left his native country to come study in the United States. The landlord, concerned that the student's visa may expire during tenancy, asks the student for documentation to determine how long he is legally allowed to be in the United States. If the landlord requests this information, regardless of the applicant's race or specific national origin, the landlord has not violated the Fair Housing Act.

*See HUD Regulations at 24 CFR 5.506-5.512'
Link:http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/library/sept11.cfm.
The above will shed the light on the changed circumucstances and
rests some of the above questions.
 
Participant said:
As per HUD--FHEO info'.
*'The Act does not prohibit discrimination based solely on a person's citizenship status. Accordingly, asking housing applicants to provide documentation of their citizenship or immigration status during the screening process would not violate the Fair Housing Act. In fact, such measures have been in place for a number of years in screening applicants for federally-assisted housing.'
*'Example 2: A person who is applying for an apartment mentions in the interview that he left his native country to come study in the United States. The landlord, concerned that the student's visa may expire during tenancy, asks the student for documentation to determine how long he is legally allowed to be in the United States. If the landlord requests this information, regardless of the applicant's race or specific national origin, the landlord has not violated the Fair Housing Act.

*See HUD Regulations at 24 CFR 5.506-5.512'
Link:http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/library/sept11.cfm.
The above will shed the light on the changed circumucstances and
rests some of the above questions.
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BINGO !!!!

Hopefully this would cool down some folks here....
 
JoeF said:
So, as usual, it all depends on the exact circumstances. I would still not rent from somebody who asks for that information. I am not willing to give out that information except to government officials. So the landlord will have lost a tenant with stable, high income. Tough luck for him.
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This is your choice and you are totally entitled to it.
But I still fail to see discrimination based on national origin.
 
Coming back to the basic question of the issue--
Whether it is illegal to ask a tenant about his status and some body can fight it out and win etc..etc..
the above post gives one clue about the situation and what is allowed in pratice.
Regarding if one goes or not to a land lord who asks for this info'--
it is his personal choice and may not go to him at all and decline any offer from a land lord,stipualting these conditions.He has the right.
But this will not surrogate or camouflage the basic issue ---regarding the land lord and he still can give lease his property to that who ever meets his requirement (of other leaglly allowed things) as well and challenge to this may be very remote.
 
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Last November (2004 Nov), I went ahead and bought a house. Back then,
I was on my 9th year extension and my h1b was valid till the 1st week
of November 2005 (now I have a PR which is a different story).

When I applied for a mortgage loan, the guy who deals with the loans
spoke to me and asked for my immigration status; he did understand
about h1b and was kind of wondering why I am buying a house when I have
only one year left in my h1b. I told him that my GC is under process. He didn't ask any more questions and approved my loan.

This happened in TX, by the way.
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