Job Change < 180 days

Originally posted by hopegclucky
So from your point of view, everybody should be fine as long as your I-485 has been pending for more than 180 day from RD? And nobody will revoke your I-140 before 180 day?
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No - not quite, the way I read it is

1) it is absolutely crucial that the I-140 is approved and unrevoked at the 180-days-after-I485-RD point to be eligible for AC21

2) If the I-485 is adjudicated before the 180 day point then the applicant is not eligible for AC21

3) after the 180-days-after-I485-RD one can go do any job as long as it is same/similar to the LC description as long as #1 is valid.

4) I think a applicant can also change jobs before the 180 day point as long as #1 is true and #2 is false
 
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waytoolong

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At the time of adjudication, If the I-485 has been pending for less than 180 days and the applicant has changed jobs, the approved I-140 does not remain valid with respect to a new offer of employment
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waytoolong, i couldnt find the word "At the time of adjudication" in the official document. could you please post the sentence where you found that word.
 
If you meet the requirements of AC21, did not inform BCIS yet about a job change (assume you get layed off ) and your employer informed BCIS about say revoking the I-140. Then my question is whether the NOID is issued during the time the I-485 will be adjudicated or when the I-140 is revoked ?

BB
 
Agree with waytoolong

I tend to agree with waytoolong's interpretation. It follows logically from the earlier line of the memo:

"If the Form I140 has been approved and the Form I485 has been filed and remained unadjudicated for 180 days or more, the approved Form I140 will remain valid even if the alien changes jobs or employers as long as the new offer of employment is in the same or similar occupation"

Both sentences seem to be describing the validity of new employment based on the time I485 gets adjudicated - more than 180 days from filing or less than 180 days from filing.

That is my interpretation - my lawyer seems to be non committal.

Of course by the time my 485 get adjudicated, INS will have issued numerous such memos by then ;-)
SDD

Originally posted by waytoolong
At the time of adjudication, If the I-485 has been pending for less than 180 days and the applicant has changed jobs, the approved I-140 does not remain valid with respect to a new offer of employment
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Re: Agree with waytoolong

Originally posted by sdd
I tend to agree with waytoolong's interpretation. It follows logically from the earlier line of the memo:

"If the Form I140 has been approved and the Form I485 has been filed and remained unadjudicated for 180 days or more, the approved Form I140 will remain valid even if the alien changes jobs or employers as long as the new offer of employment is in the same or similar occupation"

Both sentences seem to be describing the validity of new employment based on the time I485 gets adjudicated - more than 180 days from filing or less than 180 days from filing.

That is my interpretation - my lawyer seems to be non committal.

Of course by the time my 485 get adjudicated, INS will have issued numerous such memos by then ;-)
SDD
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Also I don't think BCIS can put any preconditions on employment (before GC approval) since the GC is basically for a future job (yes, even if you are working for the sponsor during the petition). However, BCIS can challenge the INTENT of filing (both of the employer and the employee) and thus the long list of conditions on the I-140.

Why the long list ? Because before AC21 law, applicants were expected to work for the sponsor for 6+ months to prove intent. The intent clause has been put in the memo to prevent abuse of AC21.

What kind of abuse ? fradulent companies can sponsor GC petitions for folks (for $$$s) without actually ever employing them (or intending to employ them).

Lawyers will remain non-committal since, well, they are lawyers. Did you know that 50% of all lawyers graduated from the bottom half of their class ?
 
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Re: I am in the same deep $h**

Originally posted by waytoolong
pardon my french - This is my outline and my argument for AC21. Mine was not a concurrent (linear?!) filing
1) laid off < 180 days : No problem since GC is for future job
2) Was employed by sponsoring employer at the time of approval of I-140 - this goes towards poving my intent to work for the sponsor (barring unforeseen circumstances like layoff)
2) Got new job after 180 days, job same/similar by O*NET definition - I-485 was unadjudicated at that point (180+ days) and I-140 approved and unrevoked
3) Previous employer did not revoke I-140 before the 180 day mark : this goes towards proving the employer's intent to employ me when the LC/I-140 was applied for and approved

My stand is that all time periods refered to by BCIS (e.g. 180 days) will have to do with adjudication , it cannot refer to current or past employement because GC is for a future job.
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Waytoolong

My case was just like your and I got approval without any problems

Layoff before 180 days, got new job after 180 days. same type of job. RFE for employment and easy approval
 
I know there may be questions about why "180 day" since seems like no case will be adjudicated within 180 days.

I also know some EB1 cases they DO get adjudicated within 180 days. One of my friends is working in a Univ with VSC. He filed I485 on Jan. 2002 and got approved on June 2002. There may be exceptions but this is the fact...
 
Good to know that Greenpeace case got approved even after a RFE for employement, though he got laid off before 180 days. It's a good sign for people like me....

Spoke to the lawyer and according to him she doesn't see any problem as per the current law that exist, but she seems to be non-commital.
 
I think everybody is saying the same things but using different words. Please let me try to simplify and anybody can tell me if there is a flaw in this.

If BCIS does not act on the 485 within 180 days (words describing can be unadjudicated etc) and 140 stays alive for this duration (emploYER requests cancellation and/or BCIS revokes approved/unapproved 140), then the emploYEE is safe to change jobs.

One question for <180 days that I have is when bcis asks for tax returns what are the alternatives/arguments for emploYEE ? should he show the past employer pay ?
 
The point is "the date that one leaves the sponsoring company" is more important and makes more sense than "the date he/she joins a new employer". The term "changing job" is meaningless because it actually contains two steps: leaving old employer, joing new employer. Therefore, since BCIS doesnot say anything about "leaving old employer", the term "joining new employer" can only be measured according to the date the case is to be adjudicated -- where the 180 day is measured.

anything like paystubs, w4, tax return are ok as long as the case is pending for more than 180 days without adjudication provided that your I140 is not damaged by anybody.
 
thanks thunder1900. Its not clear what you said.

I am talking with respect to a simple case, 485 pending for > 1 year but the move to the new company happened in 95 days. (I can easily prove it to be the employers fault since he stopped paying and I asked the new company to pay my sign on bonus as the pay of the period that my past employer didnt pay)

This would mean that my w2 can approximately show when i left the old company. i am sure paystub etc is not going to be a problem.
 
This is just my understanding not BCIS adjudicators'.

As I interpreted, "changing job" actually must be a procedure of a period, not a time point. This period starts from leaving the old employer (whatever reason, resignation or layoff) and ends at the time you join a new employer. If only the time for joing a new employer donimated an I485 case, it would make no sense, which is a commonsense for everybody (I have another post talking about this matter). However, in AC21 2001 memo, BCIS emphasized on wording "changing job". In 2003 memo, "new employment offer" is emphasized". But "leaving old employer" is not mentioned (and actually as greenpeace' case was approved, and you can also see people are asked for employment letter, not "when you got laid off or left the sponsoring company directly", it is decided NOT to be mentioned). Therefore the date of leaving the old employer takes no effect on the case.

For your case, as I said, your case has already passed 180 day line and your I140 is good, then you don't have to worry.

The only thing people might worry about is joining a new employer before the 180day line. However, as I explained above, since the date of joining new employer has no sense compared to the date of leaving old employer, and the date of leaving old employer takes no effect on I485 case in the current BCIS behavior (e.g., greenpeace' case), logically, it should be fine. Then how to interpret the words in the memos? See waytoolong's posts in red text.
 
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What I cannot understand is how bcis will even know when i left the previous company. They will know when I started bcos of the new emp letter. So the only date that can make sense seems to be the date I joined the new company. (original company can send revokation letter before after or during the 485 process)

Realistically speaking, there has not been and for another year or two there will not be any adjudication of 485 within 180 days. So waytoolong's posting is not relevent. My case is joining the new company <180days.

So the memo seems to be clear and well written.
 
You know if they want to know they can just ask you this question "when did you leave the old employer and why". This is very easy for them. But they don't. I also have sense that some EB1 cases will be adjudicated within 180 days.
 
RFE Help - AC21 < 180 days

Guys I received RFE on my case recently. Here is my detail:

RD: 01/28/02
Service center: VSC

I left company X with which my I485 was filed before 180 days from above date and joined company Y. Company X was going to file for Chapter 11 and laid off all engineers. Also moved from NY to Miami to join company Y. Company Y is one of Fortunate 500 company.

RFE asks about two different documents:

1. Submit a completed Form G-325A, Bigrapic Information Sheet.
Note: though I remember I sent this information in my initial application.

2. Submit an original letter on company letterhead from your current employer stating your <B>date of hire</B>, duties, remuneration and prospect for continued employment.

My questions are:


Q1. Is the RFE item 2 is normal text for employment verification kind of RFE? Is there any sample response to such RFE item?

Q2. Is it OK if I do not mention my start date with new employer Y?

Q3. My employer Y has it's own law firm to handle such cases but they are saying that I need to handle previous company's sponsored I485 by myself. Is it OK that I send such employment verification letter signed by my managment? Will that be acceptable by VSC?

Q4 Or it should be from HR/Immigration Department offical?

Q5. I also plan to notify VSC about my job change as part of response to this RFE. Is this suggested to do this? Is there sample letter for AC21 job change notification?

Please guide.

Thanks.
 
Shusterman's Chat on !80 Day Portability

Here is what I could compile from tonight's chat ...... It has good suggestions for those who got/going to be laid off befor completing 180 days after applying I-485. I'm one among them.
 
Re: Shusterman's Chat on !80 Day Portability

Originally posted by Hopes2003
Here is what I could compile from tonight's chat ...... It has good suggestions for those who got/going to be laid off befor completing 180 days after applying I-485. I'm one among them.
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This is a good post - the chat session answers a lot of the questions around 180 day rule. I suppose the rule depends on the attorney's interpretation, in a jam - find an attorney who will work for you.

Hope2003 - could you please post the link to the chat ? I am not trying to verify the information - I want to post the link in the AC21 FAQ secition I am putting together in this thread :

http://www.immigrationportal.com/showthread.php?threadid=93273
 
For waytoolong ... Re: link to the chat

waytoolong,

I was personally there in the chat room (in fact in this chat, one of the questions is mine reg. layoff before 180 days and taking a new similar job - to which the Attorney has replied very elaborately !!). I copied the text from the chat conversations screen, then compiled it by discarding unnecessary junk and posted here.

Hope, this helps all our friends in need of suggestions regarding < 180 days situation. In order to get the chat transcript from the attorney's site itself (http://shusterman.com/toc-chat.html), probably they will take 4 to 7 days to post it there.

Thanks.
Hopes2003
 
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