Is it too late for citizenship - Divorce case

LP168

Registered Users (C)
Got married in 06/2003. Obtain Conditional GC based on marriage on 01/2004. Received Permanent GC on 01/2006 that expires in 2016. On 06/2006, my husband and I signed dissolution of marriage based of irreconcilable differences from out of state. Now the court has sent him back a paper for me to sign in order to finalize our divorce.

My question is can I file for my citizenship at this point
Is it too late to file for citizenship?


Our marriage lasts legally for 3 years because the divorce has not been granted. But I assume once I send back the paper to court, we will be announced divorce. I did not know it might still be okay to file for citizenship until I read this thread. I wish I could have find more information myself first.

I’d appreciate any information you can give me.
 
You are NOT eligible to file for Naturalization application on the basis of marrying to a US citizen for 3 yrs. Why? Because under this ground applicants are not only required to be legally married UNTIL THE OATH IS TAKEN, but also they MUST need to be HAPPILY MARRIED (meaning living happily together).

But since your divorce would be finalized pretty soon, which would definately be before you would take oath then obviously you are not eligible to file N-400 under this ground. Plus, you are not HAPPILY living together, which alone excludes you from filing the application. USCIS normally asks so much documentary evidences under the ground in most cases.

You will be eligible to file for N-400 in 10/2008 under the eligibility ground of being a GC holder for 5 yrs, which is not that far if you ask me. It's the time when you would complete 4 yrs and 9 months after obtaining conditional GC since you obtained your conditional GC in 01/2004. And there is a high possiblity that law might change on this time period because there was a Bill introduced in the Congress last year which could have allowed immigrants to file for Naturalization after 4 yrs of being a GC holder. And since Democrats now hold the majority in the Congress then anything could happen especially when they are the ones who introduced this Bill.

Good luck.
 
LP168, you definitely want the cake and eat it too :eek: I guess it is the wedding cake. Count yourself lucky if you keep your permanent residency and don't have problems naturalizing in the future. Hey, I'm kind of kidding, but it is possible that at time of naturalization the officer will ask you questions about your marriage and divorce. I think you'll have to wait at least until you have your Green Card for 5 years. I think Johnny Cash has given you correct information.
 
I think you just have to be married to and living with your USC spouse. Happily married is not a requirement. Sorry, I couldn't resist.
 
Got married in 06/2003. Obtain Conditional GC based on marriage on 01/2004. Received Permanent GC on 01/2006 that expires in 2016. On 06/2006, my husband and I signed dissolution of marriage based of irreconcilable differences from out of state. Now the court has sent him back a paper for me to sign in order to finalize our divorce.

My question is can I file for my citizenship at this point
Is it too late to file for citizenship?


Our marriage lasts legally for 3 years because the divorce has not been granted. But I assume once I send back the paper to court, we will be announced divorce. I did not know it might still be okay to file for citizenship until I read this thread. I wish I could have find more information myself first.

I’d appreciate any information you can give me.

You need to be very careful when you apply for naturalization because USCIS might revoke your Permanent Residency and would place you on a deportation proceeding as a result of breaking of your marriage within a few months of obtaining full GC. I was an aggressive Immigration attorney and know so many cases wherein USCIS has done this. At the time of naturalization, applicants WHOLE IMMIGRATION JOURNEY is scrutnized. You might say that you were genuinely married to your spouse for 3 or more years but whenever a marriage breaks down within a few months of obtaining GC then it's an automatic presumption of USCIS that there might be a possible immigration fraud.

When I said earlier that applicants are also required to be happily married until oath is taken for naturalization purpose then I was meant that USCIS shouldn't know that marriage is getting rocky/shaky or on the verge of breaking it up; otherwise they would definately deny the application under that ground. Just being legally married alone is not enough, unless USCIS won't know about the shaky marriage. The ground of allowing applicants to file N-400 after being a GC for 3 yrs if they are still married and living to a US citizen is ONLY for the benefit of US citizen. So if an applicant is not legally married or not living happily with a US citizen then such applicant cannot file N-400 under this ground. Period.

In your case, even waiting for many years for Naturalization won't keep you out of the hook because the fact would still remain the same that your marriage fell apart shortly after obtaining GC. Thus, it's VERY important for you to collect as many documentary evidences as possible about the bonafide of your marriage.

Good luck.
 
Got married in 06/2003. Obtain Conditional GC based on marriage on 01/2004. Received Permanent GC on 01/2006 that expires in 2016. On 06/2006, my husband and I signed dissolution of marriage based of irreconcilable differences from out of state. Now the court has sent him back a paper for me to sign in order to finalize our divorce.

My question is can I file for my citizenship at this point
Is it too late to file for citizenship?


Our marriage lasts legally for 3 years because the divorce has not been granted. But I assume once I send back the paper to court, we will be announced divorce. I did not know it might still be okay to file for citizenship until I read this thread. I wish I could have find more information myself first.

I’d appreciate any information you can give me.


At first blush, it would be better for you to wait a few years coz it looks very suspicious if you break up soon after you get a permanent GC. On the other hand, even if you wait a few years to naturalize you will STILL have to explain why your marriage failed only 6 months after you got your permanent GC. So in one sense it doesn't matter when you apply to naturalize coz that issue is always going to be a problem for you. I suppose this issue doesn't matter because as others have stated you can't benefit from the 3 yr marriage to a USC rule because you are about to be divorced. The issue you have to worry about is when you do become eligible to naturalize, will your marriage will be veiwed as a sham marriage or not. If it is viewed as a sham marriage this would likely result in you losing your GC and you being deported and banned from returning to the US for either 3 or 10 years.

If I had your problem I would solve it by gathering a lot of paper evidence that I was in fact married and living with my ex-spouse: joint bank statements or and credit cards from throughout the marriage, joint mortgages or leases, joint car notes, tax returns, lots of wedding photos, lots of photos of you and your spouse and of the two of you with common friends from before you got married and throughout your marrige, vacations taken together, sworn affidavits from friends and family, of course if you have kids born during the marriage well then that would be a HUGE plus... even evidence of a miscarriage would work etc. Just get a mountain of paper evidence and organize it and send it proactively with your N400 application so that when you show up for the interview the IO has already looked through it and likely made a decision.
 
I agree, you need to wait until you have been a PR for five years. You do not fall under the marriage category due to your divorce. However, I don't think that you should send documentation about your marriage with your N400. They don't ask for it; you shouldn't send it. Legally, you marriage is irrelevant if you apply under the five-year rule, unless there is something glaringly wrong with your original GC case. Anyway, I would carry stuff to prove that your marriage was legitimate to the interview, but not send it with the application. Again, send what you are asked for; nothing more.
 
But, if you are planning to naturalize, get all the proof of your life together (now) and keep it in a safe place - don't burn it the day the divorce goes through. You'll probably want to have it with you during your interview - not that you'd mention it first.
 
I agree, you need to wait until you have been a PR for five years. You do not fall under the marriage category due to your divorce. However, I don't think that you should send documentation about your marriage with your N400. They don't ask for it; you shouldn't send it. Legally, you marriage is irrelevant if you apply under the five-year rule, unless there is something glaringly wrong with your original GC case. Anyway, I would carry stuff to prove that your marriage was legitimate to the interview, but not send it with the application. Again, send what you are asked for; nothing more.


Actually, the marriage IS relevant even if you apply under the 5 year rule for two reasons: 1) because the marriage is exactly how he/she got the GC in the first place; and 2) when you apply to naturalize, USCIS is permitted to reexamine anew your whole immigration file... but they examine especially closely what you have done in the five years preceeding your application. Everything you did in the five years before you apply, including the marriage, is on the table. So maybe you would be better served by waiting till your 6th or 7th GC year before applying so that the marriage is farther in the past. USCIS would still be within their rights to examine the marriage closely because that is how you got the green card but it seems intuitively correct that the farther in the past the marriage and divorce is the less rigorous the examination will be.

Regarding sending the marriage evidence beforehand, as a general matter, I always think it is better to err on the side of full-disclosure in a situation like this where you KNOW you will be questioned closely. If your marriage had lasted, say, 2 years after you got the permanent GC, then I probably wouldn't be proactive, but 6 months after you get your green card seems to me to be a slam-dunk to raise red flags. I imagine USCIS has guidelines about how long after getting a marriage-based permanent GC people need to remain married without raising suspicions. Obviously, if you were married for 20 years after getting the permanent GC then they probably won't ask you about whether or not the marriage was a sham... but 6 months?... you can bet your house that they will want to know more. So how can it hurt to be proactive? You may want to ask an attorney what those guidlines are.

Another reason to be proactive that it will probably save time. At the interview they will want you to prove your marriage was legit. You will hand them this fat folder full of mortgage documents and baby photographs. You can be almost sure that they will take your documents and want to examine them in detail so they will send you home and tell you to wait for a letter. This will add months to your application process. If they have the documents beforehand they will already have the evidence and it will save you time.


Basically, my take on this is it comes down to how quickly you want your N400 process to go. If you don't care how long it takes, then don't be proactive. If you want to shorten the process, it can't hurt to be proactive. But you should probably ask a currently practicing immigration attorney who is in contact with the USCIS folks regularly whether or not it is a good thing be proactive in your particular situation.
 
She got the green card on 01/2006 and signed the disslution of marriage in 06/2006 (only 5 months later). This indicates they probably got separated almost immediately after obtaining the green card. It is indeed a highly suspicious circumstance. The common sense dictates IO will probably suspect a marriage of convinience, as would most people.
 
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I am worried as my case seems a negative one. Indeed, me and my husband were dating way back in the mid 90's when we were college students. We dated so many many years before we decided to get married. I don't know if this history will prove that our marriage is a genuine, not a convenient or fake one. His family has asked me to marry him for a long time but I don't see marriage as a shortcut to get my permanent status. So I insisted for so many years before I decided to marry him.

So here I am...after dating with him for 10 years, we broke up and now it's jeopardizing my application for citizenship or with a bigger consequence of deporting me and revoking my GC. It's not his fault, it's mine. We just have difference in our lives and I am seeing someone else now. But we are still caring each other as friends. We are not mad at each other or what.

Do you think it's possible to bring him for the interview? Because he knows that I don't marry him for money or convenience. Or will it hurt his credentials if the IO will record down everything we say? If he ever gets a government job and do a background check, will this hurt him?

One final question. I know it's bad to ask but since everyone is giving me a real negative response. Let me ask this one last question (you can yell at me). If we hold back the final signature of the dissolution paper to the court until I get my citizenship, will this raise another question to the immigration?

I know it's bad to ask but I really don't want to be kicked out of this country because the intent of our marriage is not because of the status issue. But after things fell apart, I am worried now. :(

Thanks for all your responses.
 
The immigration will have no reason to look at your file unless there is an application pending. So, is not filing the application an option?

Since there is always the date that you filed for devorce...that's when you got sepaprated..... final sig just makes it final.... But the intent counts just as much..

Immigration does not allow anyone else's presence during citizenship interview.
 
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Well, I guess I will be the odd one out. I have a friend that got married ( a real marriage) and 1 1/2yr after that he's wife left him (this was before he even received his conditional gc or even went for his initial interview). They did not have an amicable divorce and she was even threatening him. He went through the interview with prove of marriage...bills, credit cards, and pictures and was granted a ten yr gc.

Annie
 
Well, I guess I will be the odd one out. I have a friend that got married ( a real marriage) and 1 1/2yr after that he's wife left him (this was before he even received his conditional gc or even went for his initial interview). They did not have an amicable divorce and she was even threatening him. He went through the interview with prove of marriage...bills, credit cards, and pictures and was granted a ten yr gc.

Annie
That's a totally different scenario. That just means he had to file a waiver and go through the tough process. Never was there any choice for him. Either he had to do that or get put into a removal proceedings. He's just lucky he survived. Some waivers get approved and some don't.....is all.
 
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I would advise against sending evidence about the marriage preemptively with the N400. It's not in fact certain that you'll be questioned about it. The N400 instructions are very clear about what to send; there's absolutely no need to send anything extra. But, of course, you can ask an attorney. It would be helpful if someone who has gone through a similar experience could post some information.
 
I would agree that it doesn't seem that you need to be proactive in sending documentation, but probably you have to be proactive in being ready to answer questions during interview and have documents and pictures to back up your claims. You would need to fill out the N-400 faithfully, but beyond that I don't think you need to do anything else.

My 2 cents.
 
Thanks everyone for your input. I will wait my 5 years period to file for citizenship. Indeed, we purchased our first home before we even got married and I am the one who put down the down payment for the house. I still have the checks when I was packing up my stuff and ready to move on. We also have our car with both of our names, he is under my medical insurance. We also have joint bank accounts, home insurance, credit cards. Some of these I can find and some I can't. Because I really did not expect we will get divorced in our life time.

What kind of questions I will expect the IO to ask if they really suspect? I get nervous very easily even for a job interview.

Reading this forum is helping me a lot. I did not know traffic violation is important to naturalization. I do remember I had one before in my 11 years driving record. If I can't recall when, what should I do?

Thanks a lot for your advices.
 
Do NOT even consider/think to send (or tell) anything to USCIS about your marriage. Read it again-DO NOT. Applicants need to send only those supporting documents which are mentioned on the list provided by USCIS along with the naturalization application than anything else. Anything more than those documents could jepordize their situation. Even at the interview, NEVER EVER say anyting voluntarily to the officer. If USCIS would like to know/see something, they would either send REF (Request for Evidence) or would ask for an explaination at the time of interivew, and that's the only time applicants should provide documentary evidences or explaination.

Since each person is different and unique in this world then it goes to immigration officers too. Some officers are easier than others. Thus, it could be possible that the officer who would interview you might overlook this critical fact in your case and might not ask anything about your marriage. All I've said earlier is that since you got separated from your husband so shortly after obtaining your green card then your marriage most probably be seen as a sham marriage even though you have your story to say otherwise, like having dated him for 10 yrs prior to getting married and didn't marry him before when his family asked you...etc..etc...

That's why it's very important for you to collect as many evidences possible to prove the bonafide of your marriage. These documents should be more than what you provided when you requested to remove the condition on your temporarily green card. A lot of folks mistakenly believe that once a green card is granted then govt. cannot take it especially if someone would have it for many years. But these folks are wrong. Govt. can revoke a green card anytime they want. Having a green card is a privilege, and not a right. If govt. would suspect or come to know something material to fraud/lie then they can even revoke the citizenship even after 100 of years later...

And many people also mistakenly believe that at the time of naturalization USCIS cares about the applicant's life only since s/he became a Permanent Resident which is not true at all because naturalization relief is different than any other immigration relief. By applying for naturalization, applicants put themselves to get scrutnized by US govt. I don't have time to mention about thousands of cases wherein USCIS revoked the Permanent Residency when those immigrants filed for naturalization because govt. found something which they called-fraud/lie to US govt. at the time of obtaining green card or at the time of obtaining any kind of nonimmigrant visa at US embassies/consulates. Just because someone had no problem at the time of obtaining green card, that doesn't mean s/he won't have any problem at the time of naturalization. Similarily, just because someone had no problem in removing the condition on their temparory green card or in becoming naturalized citizen then that doesn't mean that every applicant wouldn't have the problem. You won't get the same officer who approved your green card application or the same officer who approved other people's case without a question. Thus, you should always prepare yourself for all kinds of situations based upon your own situation than others.

As for you asking if you could remain married for the sole purpose of being naturalized then I don't give my opinion on how to circumvent immigration laws for a selfish reason but if you gon't get divorce until Oath would be taken AND don't tell ANYTHING to USCIS about your separation and shaky marriage AND would collect documents to prove that you and your husband are happily living together then you don't have any problem in getting naturalized under 3 yrs rule. But the key point is-you must need to have enough documents to prove that you and your husband are happily living together like having same address on both of yours driving license, jointly filed taxes, joinly owned house or lease in both names, joint bank account, alot of pictures together, and etc...Must be current documents though if you want to file N-400 under 3-yrs rule...

Who is paying to the house or who bought it, is totally irrelevant here. Also, having dated your husband for 10 yrs prior to being married is also irrelevant because many people date multiple people at the same time but get married only later on just for a selfish reason. As for being nervous, then you don't need to get nervous. USCIS normally asks just general questions about marriage at the time of Naturalization. Pretty much they just ask for documents. If you get nervous then they would suspect more. Bringing your husband to naturalization interview or having an affidavit from him about the bonafide of your marriage is meant nothing to USCIS. Otherwise there won't be a need for an interview for a green card based upon marriage to a US citizen.

Good luck...
 
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I am in a similar situation.

I got my 10 year card in 9-2005. (valid till 2015)
I am resident since 9-2002. (sais so on the card)
Married in 8-2001. (been married for over 5 years)

Got a son in 2-2005 who is US citizen (born here).

But now the marriage might end. What is going to happen to me? I dont want to lose my son, and i want to do what is best.

I hate to take over the thread but I am desperate. (I am greatful to have found this forum)
 
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