India Rising

techy2468 said:
thank you........i didnt know i am being missed :)
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good that you took my post in right spirits. thanks. the thread is titled 'india is rising', you quote all that is close to india is falling. i think your post is bit out of context; might offend those people who are discussing how india is rising ? well, i am not a moderator i like your post, its just my opinion.
 
indian_gc_ocean said:
good that you took my post in right spirits. thanks. the thread is titled 'india is rising', you quote all that is close to india is falling. i think your post is bit out of context; might offend those people who are discussing how india is rising ? well, i am not a moderator i like your post, its just my opinion.
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sorry i should have explained with context........that i am happy that india is doing well........but there are few things which will take atleast 20-30 years to become acceptable.......

why 20-30 years....because politicians are still busy playing reservation and "help the farmers....damn the big business" vote game.

bureacrats have to please these politicians....and of course more than 80% of them are smart enough to make the hay while their sun is shining...


so only continued economic development leading to betterment in standard of life.....which will lead to better literacy and awareness.....leading to better elected officials and bureacrats........will lead to a better system......which will take a hell of a time.....
 
indian_gc_ocean said:
good that you took my post in right spirits. thanks. the thread is titled 'india is rising', you quote all that is close to india is falling. i think your post is bit out of context; might offend those people who are discussing how india is rising ? well, i am not a moderator i like your post, its just my opinion.
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Dr. Saint !!
 
awesome dawg - this is really hilarious.... man either ur imagination is too wild or u have too much time to spare...

gravitation said:
Year : 2050

Place : Two Americans at IBM, USA .
Currency Conversion Rate: Rs.1 = $1000

Alex : Hi John, you didn't come yesterday to office?
John : Yeah, I was in Indian Embassy for stamping.
Alex: Oh really, what happened, I heard that
nowadays it has become very strict.
John : Yeah, but I managed to get it.

Alex : How long it took to get it stamped?
John : Oh, it was nasty man, long queue. That's why
it got delayed. I went there at 2 am itself and waited and returned by 4pm .
Alex : Really? In India , it is a matter of an hour to get stamped for USA .
John : Yeah, but that is because who in India will be interested in coming
to USA man, their economy has been booming.

Alex : So, when are you leaving?
John : Anytime, after receiving my tickets from the client in India and you
know, I will be getting a chance to fly Air- India. Sort of dream come true.
Alex : How long are you going to stay in India ?
John : What do you mean by how long? I will be settled in India,
my company has promised me that they will process my Hara Patta.

Alex : Really, lucky person man, it is very difficult to get a Hara Patta in India.
John : Yeah, that's why, I am planning to marry an Indian girl there.
Alex : But you can find lots of US girls in
Bangalore, Hyderabad and Mumbai.
John : But, I prefer Indian girls because they are
beautiful and cultured.

Alex : Where did you get the offer, Bangalore?
John : Yeah, salary is good there, but cost of living is quite high,
it is Rs. 1000/- for a single room accommodation.
Alex : I see, that's too much for US people, Rs. 1/ = $ 1000/-. Oh
God! What about in Hyderabad , Chennai & Mumbai?

John : No idea, but it is less than what we have in Bangalore .
It is like the world headquarters of Software.
Alex : I heard, almost all the Indians are having
one personal Robot for help.
John : You can get a BMW car for Rs. 5000/-, and a
personal Robot for less than Rs. 7500/-.
But my dream is to purchase Ambassador, which costs
Rs.200000/- but has got a sexy design.

Alex : By the way, who is your client?
John : A pure Indian origin company, specializing in
Embedded Software.
Alex : Oh, really, lucky to work in a pure Indian
origin company. They are really intelligent and
unlike American Bodyshoppers who have opened their
Fly-by-night outfits in India. Indian companies pay
you in full even when you are on bench.
My friend Paul Allen, it seems, used his bench time to
visit Bihar, the most liveable place in India,
probably world. There you have full freedom and no strictions.
You can do whatever you want! I wonder how
that state has perfected that system.

John : Yeah man, you are right. I hope our America
also follows their footsteps.
Alex : How are you going to cope with their
language?
John : Why not? >From my school days I have been
learning Hindi as my first language here
at New York.At the Consulate they
proficiency in tested my Hindi and were
quite impressed by my cent percent score in
TOHIL (Test of Hindi as International Language).

Alex : So, you are going to have fun there.
John : Yeah, I will be travelling in the world's
fastest train, world's largest theme park,
and the famous Bollywood where you can see actors like,
Vrithik(son of Hrithik), and all.
Esselworld is also near to Bollywood.

Alex : You know, the Indian PM is scheduled to visit
US next year, he may then relax the number of visas.
John : That's true. Last month, Narayanamurthy Jr.
visited White House and donated Rs. 2000/- for
infrastructure development at Silicon Valley and has
promised more if we follow the model of Silicon City of Bangalore.
Bill Gates also got a chance of meeting him. Very lucky person.

Alex : But, Indian government is planning to split
Narayanamurthy Jr.'s Infosys & Sons.
John : He is a hard worker man like his father, he
can build any number of Infosys like this.
Every minute he is getting Rs. 1000/-. It seems, if you keep all his
money converted as Rs. 100/- notes you can reach Pluto.

Alex : OK, Good Luck John.
John : Same to you Alex. And don't go to Consulate
in a Kurta Pyjama because
they will think you are too Indianised and may doubt
you will ever come back and hence your
Non-Immigrant Visa may get rejected.
But don't forget to say "Namaste, aap kaise hai" to the Visa.
It seems he likes that and will not give you a visa if
you don't greet him that way.
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GreenCardVirus said:
Dr. Saint !!
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thankyou sir! ;) just reading series of postings in the thread, couldn't stop talking to techy to stop a row when I saw his postingi n completely different tone. what matters is, thankfully techy didn't mind it.
 
Idle curiosity!

I'll be honest in saying that I usually steer clear of such discussions for many reasons.

First, most, if not all, discussions lack real seriousness about the subject or topic being discussed. Granted, they may be motivated by what ails us (tired patience, or general frustration with the system) at the time. It could also be a matter of passing time and hoping to make it look fruitful by engaging in "current" topics of the day.

Second, I am often perplexed to witness that the "creme de la creme" of Indian society, some of the most educated and "intelligent" young men and women from the Indian Society, so easily get into shouting matches over trivial matters. Perhaps not on this thread, but we have seen one too many instances of that on this very forum.

Three, open-ended topics like this one have open-ended responses and answers. And we must accommodate all of them if we are to fully (or better) understand any subject or topic.

Having said that, "India Rising" means totally different things to different people. As other posters have pointed out, rise in crime, disease, pollution, corruption is also a facet of this "India Rising". The mood and determination as well as enthusiasm of indians in competing with the world, being more entrepreneurial, and improving their socio-economic lot is also on the rise. Disparity and inequality of income distribution is also on the rise. Rich men's income is on the rise, while a poor farmer's woes are on the rise (as in the case of farm suicides). If you are an Indian who identifies only with the 10 percent of wealthy and dominant Indians, you are in the "rising" basket...

So, in many senses, many "India's" are rising and it's hard to club it one group as a good thing or all-bad thing. If family values and morality, ethics and principles mean more to your character, then India may be falling, not rising. If the glitz and glamor of indian cities and huge malls is your style, then it's the opposite.

To decide to go back is always a personal choice and decision. In the end, one does it for oneself, not even in the best interest of India. A question that is usually never asked, of us, by us, is "What are we doing to help India rise?"

But, I guess that would make another topic and invoke another idle curiosity altogether...
 
GaramChai2go said:
I don't trust media specially Indian media.
So any thoughts/comments?

India Rising / Shining? How? Why? How fast? How far is it going to go? Is it going to beat US and if yes then how?
Does GC have no siginifance looking at the fact that our friends in India are now in better position than us?
Did we waste 5-10 years waiting for GC - all in pain , away from homeland and our own people?
Why such sudden and frightening real estate boom ? Why so much development all of a sudden?
Who is making money? If salaries have increased so has the cost of living? So who is gaining in this process?
Can we aford going back. Please do not forget the competition is so high out there and it is going to grow, your job is always at risk.
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These are my opinions/comments for your questions.

Changing global economic scenario like competition between the US and EU, rise of China, recent recession in the US economy and other factors are making the developed nations to look for cheaper workforce yet skillful. When I read India is rising, I usually do not see any self dependent trend in technology development but I only see India as a manpower supplier to other countries. How long India can servive by just supplying workforce without actually having itself rising technologically is a million dollar question. So far, India's growth is vastly dependent on the business with US and other developed nations. In this context, I don't know really know whether the question that India beating the US is actually workable.

IMHO, GC does not have any merit over the friends who have settled well in India.

Whether one has wasted number of years waiting for GC actually depends on the chances one has taken and how successful are those trials are in his/her career.

People working in the MNC service sector are finding more money to buy. As the transportation fecilities are not as good as in the US, all the population tries to live inside the cities thus increasing the real estate value. There is very little going on towards something like suburb. If this happens, that may have some potential to reduce realestate prices.

Changing life style is increasing spending. who is gaining ?--people are gaining by leading a better life style.

Can we aford going back -- Well, if you are in IT better stay in the US if one had not made the switch few years back at the beginning of the boom. Indian IT industry is service oriented and average IT person grows more in the management than in technology. It is difficult to for a person to completely fit into the indian IT industry after returning.

These are my comments to your questions only and this certainly does not relate to the entire situation.
 
GC_TRAP said:
I'll be honest in saying that I usually steer clear of such discussions for many reasons.

First, most, if not all, discussions lack real seriousness about the subject or topic being discussed. Granted, they may be motivated by what ails us (tired patience, or general frustration with the system) at the time. It could also be a matter of passing time and hoping to make it look fruitful by engaging in "current" topics of the day.

Second, I am often perplexed to witness that the "creme de la creme" of Indian society, some of the most educated and "intelligent" young men and women from the Indian Society, so easily get into shouting matches over trivial matters. Perhaps not on this thread, but we have seen one too many instances of that on this very forum.

Three, open-ended topics like this one have open-ended responses and answers. And we must accommodate all of them if we are to fully (or better) understand any subject or topic.

Having said that, "India Rising" means totally different things to different people. As other posters have pointed out, rise in crime, disease, pollution, corruption is also a facet of this "India Rising". The mood and determination as well as enthusiasm of indians in competing with the world, being more entrepreneurial, and improving their socio-economic lot is also on the rise. Disparity and inequality of income distribution is also on the rise. Rich men's income is on the rise, while a poor farmer's woes are on the rise (as in the case of farm suicides). If you are an Indian who identifies only with the 10 percent of wealthy and dominant Indians, you are in the "rising" basket...

So, in many senses, many "India's" are rising and it's hard to club it one group as a good thing or all-bad thing. If family values and morality, ethics and principles mean more to your character, then India may be falling, not rising. If the glitz and glamor of indian cities and huge malls is your style, then it's the opposite.

To decide to go back is always a personal choice and decision. In the end, one does it for oneself, not even in the best interest of India. A question that is usually never asked, of us, by us, is "What are we doing to help India rise?"

But, I guess that would make another topic and invoke another idle curiosity altogether...
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Well said!

This same patchy development is however happening across the globe. Even the chinese model is the same. There are a few urban dwellers who disproportionately benefit from the growth. It is simply that 10% of these huge population masses is a huge block of people/markets/consumers/workers etc for the US to take notice.

Even in the US which has huge entitlement programs (love them or hate them) which serve to evenly spread the economic spoils (within reason), nowadays has a widening gap between the rich and the poor and conversely there is huge and increasing pressure on cost containment in those entitlement programs. These are the pressures of globalisation being driven by the emboldened and more freely mobile capitalistic classes.
So the US is also developing this so called 10% class! Which we are all attempting to join I might add.
My point in all this is that this might well be a symptom of the rise of capitalism generally. Not that it is wrong necessarily, since I certainly believe it is needed for wealth creation.

I suspect that this is cyclical. These trends will continue for some time and will result in relatively faster economic growth worldwide. However projections extrapolating this growth out 40 yrs etc are sheer rubbish in my view, lots of unpredictable things will happen in this time. Not the least of which is that eventually social justice will be demanded by the masses and the same old tax the rich, feed the poor paradigm will prevail and perhaps emerge faster in democratic countries. Latin america is already seeing these tendencies emerge. Those tendencies will definitely emerge in India, when is a good question. I suppose that will also depend on how well some of the benefits of the spoils are spread to the masses (both monetarily and in terms of development). In this sense concentrating development longer term in a few urban centers is not wise.

One of benefits of the swing in the pendulum between the democrats and republicans in the US over the years, has been that this has happened in a much less volatile manner and enabled a more balanced growth, things might happen in a more volatile manner elsewhere.
 
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Demanding social justice is happening already in India. Just look at the 50%+ reservations in educational institutions. This is taxing certain communities in India at the expense of others.

There is another economic factor that can play role. Current levels of US expenditure (trade and budget deficits) are being funded by savings of people from India, China, etc. If these economies become self-sustaining, then they may not fund the US expenditure any more. So, the standard of living will level out between the different countries.
 
If 1$= 1Rs

The US companies will pull back all the Jobs back to the US. Infosys will be converted to a hotel with Narayana Narayana Murthy in the Front Desk.... :D

Africa where 1 $ = 1000 pebbles(or what ever the currency will be) will be the Next outsourcing destination.....

The Real Estate fact in India:

Infosys hires 1000 employees.... Real Estate goes up by 100 Rs....
 
GaramChai2go said:
Atleast somebody is looking at the other side of the story.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/08/new...ndia.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2007020909

As I said earlier I am worried about Indians not India.
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i am impressed by this article....exactly my words.........but i will not be surprised if nobody pays attention.....after all the politicians have a different game to play to remain in power.........bureacrats beleive that the poor/unfortunate deserve to rot....

and somehow i see more optimistic picture in indian media (if india continues to grow like this they will be ahead of USA in 2050...etc)....than a realistic one (like what if IT sector goes through another slow down....what if western economies shrink and they stop outsourcing because of their government regulation......etc..)
 
techy2468 said:
i am impressed by this article....exactly my words.........but i will not be surprised if nobody pays attention.....after all the politicians have a different game to play to remain in power.........bureacrats beleive that the poor/unfortunate deserve to rot....

and somehow i see more optimistic picture in indian media (if india continues to grow like this they will be ahead of USA in 2050...etc)....than a realistic one (like what if IT sector goes through another slow down....what if western economies shrink and they stop outsourcing because of their government regulation......etc..)
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Everything mentioned in the article is correct. However, India's progress is impressive relative to what it used to be. If it keeps making this amount of progress, future will be amazing. Not anytime soon (we're talking many decades decades). And it'll not be like a developed country like US, but a well to do country in its own right.

The boom in economics is multifaceted, it's not just IT centric anymore. All sectors are booming: construction, manufacturing, agricultural.
 
GaramChai2go said:
Atleast somebody is looking at the other side of the story.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/08/new...ndia.fortune/index.htm?postversion=2007020909

As I said earlier I am worried about Indians not India.
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I read this article in the morning and wanted to rekindle this thread, you have already done that.

I did not even read the article fully, but it just takes words out of my mouth.

Even with a 9% growth rate, at the rate of poplulation growth we have, it is of no use. As far as I am concerned, India is already in self-destruct mode. (I love my country, no matter what)
 
140jibjab said:
Africa where 1 $ = 1000 pebbles(or what ever the currency will be) will be the Next outsourcing destination.....
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Last week, I had a few 1 cent coins and noticed one of them was slightly smaller. You know what, it was a 1 Paise copper coin from 1940's. I was so happy to look at it.

From 1 Paise copper coin to extinction of a 25 paise coin --- yeah right, India Rising.
 
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Many points in this article is true, however writer choose not to mention many brighter side of India which is more visible and achivied very recently,

remember India is not a superpower yet, it is not developed it, but poised to, at present the problems of India are seen as opportunities

every developing country has poor and hungry people, but in India, these poor will be provided with opportunty in its growing economy 300 million consumer is base is biggest in the world next only to china.

I am very confident where country is going and I am certainly proud to be Indian
 
Exactly right. India can not become superpower unless it eradicate poverty, illterecy, corruption and improve very basic stuffs water, electricity and infrastructure law and order and pollution. It is very bad, if you are not in IT field and there is no scope there. There is massive difference in life style of IT guy in Bangalore and a non-IT guys in next door to him. This kind of targeted growth (only in IT and related subsidery) leads to social and ecomomical imbalance in the socity. Most of the peoples still live in rural and depends on agriculture. There is no improvement in their life style since independance. This is very bad situation.

People willing to bringing walmart there not interested in improving the basic stuffs. India is becoming victim of captalism and consumarism and not concentrating in improving the live style of tons of millions living in rural segments.
 
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