I-485 Portability -- AC21 -- IMPORTANT

R

root

Registered Users (C)
I posted this in the LC thread, did not get any response, may be this is the right thread for the AC21 question:



AC21 Question for the Experts on the board:

Scenario 1) 140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, company shuts down. I use AC21 to join another company with same job/salary, will I get my GC eventually?


Scenario 2) GC applied by a company with Virtual office (from faster LC state with no office, PO BOX address etc), I-140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, I use AC21 to join new employer (same job/salary), later CIS suspect the office and the job offer and send RFE to the company and ask for proof of bonafide office and job offer, The company does not respond to the RFE, what happens, will I get the GC eventually?


Please provide your valuable feedback.

Thanks
 
root said:
I posted this in the LC thread, did not get any response, may be this is the right thread for the AC21 question:

AC21 Question for the Experts on the board:

Scenario 1) 140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, company shuts down. I use AC21 to join another company with same job/salary, will I get my GC eventually?
>> If no other problems, Yes

Scenario 2) GC applied by a company with Virtual office (from faster LC state with no office, PO BOX address etc), I-140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, I use AC21 to join new employer (same job/salary), later CIS suspect the office and the job offer and send RFE to the company and ask for proof of bonafide office and job offer, The company does not respond to the RFE, what happens, will I get the GC eventually?

>> you are asking suggestion on Fraudulent case, this forum is not for seeking help on fraud cases

Thanks
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root said:
I posted this in the LC thread, did not get any response, may be this is the right thread for the AC21 question:



AC21 Question for the Experts on the board:

Scenario 1) 140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, company shuts down. I use AC21 to join another company with same job/salary, will I get my GC eventually?


Scenario 2) GC applied by a company with Virtual office (from faster LC state with no office, PO BOX address etc), I-140 approved, I-485 pending for more than one year, I use AC21 to join new employer (same job/salary), later CIS suspect the office and the job offer and send RFE to the company and ask for proof of bonafide office and job offer, The company does not respond to the RFE, what happens, will I get the GC eventually?
Thanks
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Scenario 1) Yes, If you behave good.

Scenario 2) Besides what GreenCardVirus said is the best answer, at any stage of GC if and when its determined by USCIS that some kind of fraud is in place, not only you will not get GC but also face legal action.
 
Ok, so you think not having office or using a PO Box for office address is fradulant ? I don't think. Besides that was not my point. that's why
i was refering two scenarios to make my point.

there has been debates on this issue and no clear cut answers.
the bottom line is there a loop holes in the immigration system and people have exploited it big time, CIS is aware of it.

there are thousand of consulting companies in both coast who operate from one BDR apartment home and have several consultants working who got green card w/o any problem.

anyways back to the question:
1) if the person can get GC in scenario one using AC21 even if the sponsoring company is shutdown and the employer does not respond to the RFE,
why not in the second case, after all the LC is aproved by the state and 140 is aproved by CIS (what ever may be the case regarding office), and 485 is pending for for more than 6 months, the only problem is the employer is not responding to CIS rfe which is the same case as in scenario one.
It may or may not be a fraudulant case, but bottom line is how does CIS know about it till they hear from the employer, which in both scenarios is not happening.

Can they assume it is a fradulant case for scenario 1 if they don't hear from the employer ?





 
i looked at your signature, yours seems to be a classic case, man.
and you think having virtual office or PO box is fraud?
so is LC substitution and that is why ins is working hard to get rid of this, but till then it is legal and can not be challanged.
same goes for virtual office and po box, if anything, it is the Labor department who can questions the authenticity of the job offer due to virtual office, but even that has been challanged, you should have read Khanna;s response to DOL.
i am not advocating this $hit, but face it, that's the reality.
I know employer (Cybersoft in NJ) who got busted for several LC substitution,


Cheekoo said:
Scenario 1) Yes, If you behave good.

Scenario 2) Besides what GreenCardVirus said is the best answer, at any stage of GC if and when its determined by USCIS that some kind of fraud is in place, not only you will not get GC but also face legal action.
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root said:
Ok, so you think not having office or using a PO Box for office address is fradulant? I don't think.
Click to expand...

If the office is in a geographic location where the company does not do business solely for the purpose of providing a lower wage or faster LC processing, then yes.

there are thousand of consulting companies in both coast who operate from one BDR apartment home and have several consultants working who got green card w/o any problem.
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So long as there's actual business being done there, that's just fine. That's the distinction you appear to be missing. I can run a business out of my spare bedroom here in Atlanta, but I cannot claim that my business is really located in North Carolina just because I have a PO box there.
 
I think you do have a point there. The company needs to be doing business in the geographic area.

Please consider another scenario:
let's say i have software consulting business (body shopping) located in California (my apartment) and I have 150 software consultants working at various client locations throughout the country but none of them are based in California, all the 150 consultants reside and work in different states but none in California. I do not have single client in CA and no revenue is generated from within the state of California, so basically, though I have an office in CA, I am doing most of my business out side California and for that business I do not need office of any kind out side California.
I apply for LC based GC for my employees and since my VIRTUAL OFFICE is based in California, I file the LC there.
what happens then, please note none of my current employee are based or working in CA, they may or may not work in CA after the GC is aproved, we are not sure, they will work where ever the project is.
Do you still think applying LC from CA would be fradulant ?

thanks for your response.

TheRealCanadian said:
If the office is in a geographic location where the company does not do business solely for the purpose of providing a lower wage or faster LC processing, then yes.



So long as there's actual business being done there, that's just fine. That's the distinction you appear to be missing. I can run a business out of my spare bedroom here in Atlanta, but I cannot claim that my business is really located in North Carolina just because I have a PO box there.
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unitednations said:
If you argue it is future base job and person has intent to move to california then when they start digging into it they will figure out how can 150 people move to an office that is 200 square feet.
California sometimes does challenge legitimacy of company in the way I mentioned before. Before California only would challenge saying company is staffing agency and no permanent job. They denied a few large companies for this reason. It is only a matter of time before other service centers start doing the same thing.
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>>> so you are saying that job in a consulting company (staffing) is not permanent and CIS can deny case based on that, I myself, and I know several other who work for small to big staffing companies for last 6 to 8 years as full time permanent employee with all the benefits etc.
how do you define permanent job ?
and I know one guy (he is US citizen) who has been working for one staffing company at a client location for last 17 years.

I think, all you need is good lawyer and this should not be an issue.

with regard to Virtual office, I think even that should not be as issue, all you need is good laywer and proper documentation.
The very nature of software consulting business is such that there is no need for physical premises. You can have employee work from home/work at client location, company can make billions and still not have office.
I know at least two people who work for a NY based company, never gone to office in last 2 years, work from home over VPN, and attend telecom meetings.

I think uscis has to take a different approach in treating cases for IT workers and factory or restaturant employees with regard to work location
once again you need competent lawyer not some form filling, mail forwarding law firm.
 
unitednations said:
The only time one is 100% safe is if they are working with the company on the date labor was filed, they are getting paid at least the labor wage everyday and working in the location of the company and stay until they get the greencard and then stay 6 to 12 months after that.
.
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I agree on this, for smaller consulting (body shoppers) companies it makes a better case if the person is already on the company payroll when the LC is filed, but I don't think he has to be actually be employed in the same state where the LC is filed. The consultants are required to move all over the place depending upon the assignment.

FRAUD:
well, as soon as DOL allowed RIR filings, pretty much 75% of the cases I think can be challenged and classiffied Fraudulaent. Did the employer did a good faith recuirting of US nationals? I don't think so. The employer has already decided to hire this foreign national and will do every thing in his capacity to not hire a US national, the whole adverteisment and interview is pretty much bull$hit, in my opinion.
I know one case, where the employer recieved at least 25 resumes from US citizens in response to the ads, pretty good match, but the lawyer when filing the LC, said "no quilified responses received", now that I think is FRAUD.
pretty much all LC based cases are same or similar I think.
I think, the same is not true for non-rir cases.
 
OK -- back to original question

back to original question (modified)

1. LC aproved, I-140 Aproved, I-485 pending for more than 6 months.
employee used AC21 to switch to new permanent job (same/similar), same or higher salary.

After few months, USCIS sends RFE to employer for the I-140 (what ever reason, not necessarily virtual office case, i-140 not revoked by employer), but the employer does not respond to the RFE.
will the person get his GC eventually ?

please note, it could be a simple RFE or could be to check the authenticity of the job offer, my question is does a "no reply" from employer makes the I-140 invalid and subsequent denial of I-485 ?

thanks
 
where is Ac21 ?


Well then the AC21 is not really working, is it ?

Let's say employee leaves the company once the I-140 is aproved and after 180 days of I-485 pending.
For some XYZ reason, USCIS sends an RFE/Enquiry for the I-140 and employer does not respond to it, because he is pissed off and want the employee to go to h3ll, since he left the sponsoring employer.
Even if the I-140 is perfectly genuine and approvable. (already aproved for that matter)

where is AC21 relief for him. I thought one can leave the spnsoring employer as soon as he meets all the Ac21 requirements, but I guess not.
 
you are funny man,
I don't have any issue like that, neither there is any fraud.

I am merely discussing the AC21 and how it failes to protect the benefeciary in certain situations.
you get personal when you run out of arguments.

My point was if the origianl employer refuses to responsd to the I-140 RFE, for any reason (it could be the company no longer in business and hence nobody to respond to the RFE etc), the AC21 can not protect the employee even if everything else was done correctly.

Scenario:
A company applies for LC, I-140 for employee A, no fraud, all done by law, by the book. The employee A changes job after 1 year of waiting for I-485.

In the mean time same company applied for employee B, all by book, by law, USCIS issue an RFE, received no response since the employer is no longer in business. INS suspect something is wrong and send RFE for employee A's I-140, receives no response as the employer no longer in business.

Note: there is no fraud of any kind, will the employee A get his GC ?

It is possible the company is not shutdown, but the employer no longer wish to support I-140 as employee A has already left, for some other reason he does not want to support employee B also and hence does not respond to his RFE too.

Please don't use words like "Fraud" and "Grey area" in law any more.





unitednations said:
What is your real issue?

Is your employer caught in some type of fraud in that he had a virtual office and was sponsoring anyone who paid him?

If 140 is revoked by uscis your greencard is gone. Repeat: Gone. AC-21 doesn't mean crap if uscis thinks it was approved in error or fraud.
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unitednations said:
There has only been one situation that I am aware of where person eventually got through ok.

Person went to local office interview. Interviewing officer researched company business filings and saw that company did not maintain their registration and were no longer operating. Person was using ac21 and it got approved. Other then company shutting down or merger and both situations happening after 485 is pending for more then 180 days not much will protect you if uscis wants to revoke 140.
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What is the scenario if the GC sponsoring company has revoked 140 after the employee left after 180 days. Can USCIS come in now and revoke 140 all over again?
 
unitednations said:
greencardvirus; everytime i discuss this topic, you always ask me this question. :)
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I did? I had a feeling that I did but wasnt sure.

Maaaan, my memory is failing :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Actually, your answers also get better and better with your latest experiences.
 
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