Have you seen this - Current Hagel-Martinez may hurt EB ?

[gcstrat]

SHMK bill - how different?

How different is the Specter-Hagel-Martinez-Kennedy (SHMK) bill from SKIL, CIR, and Bill Frist's bill?

From immigration-law.com website, brief comparison of the other 3 bills is below. How does SHMK bill differ?

==========||| Cornyn ||| Judiciary Comm ||| Bill Frist

EB Annual Cap ||| 290,000 ||| 450,000 ||| 290,000

EB Cap Exempt ||| (Advanced Degree) STEM + US Degree in Non-STEM ||| STEM only ||| STEM only

H-1B Cap Exempt for Advanced Degree ||| U.S. Degree only. including both STEM and Non-STEM ||| STEM only but both U.S. and foreign degree ||| STEM only but both U.S. and foreign degree

20,000 Advanced Degree Special Numbers ||| Both U.S. degree and foreign degree ||| U.S. degree only ||| U.S. degree only

========================================

REGARDS

GCstrat

 

[marlon2006]

I took it from the article published. I pasted the link in the beginning of the thread. There are so many news floating around and I wanted to make sure that was accurate. Apparently it was not, what is a good thing.

marlon2006,

First of all. I don't know where you got the figure of 150,000 from. The new total for employment based GCs will become 450,000. Second as per the new bills, skilled immigrants still get 15%+15%+30% =60%. I am not sure how you're defending the 30% quoted by the newspaper. Even if the percentage were to drop from 60% to 30% as per whatever hookey calculation, if the overall numbers of skilled immigrants increase, how does it hurt the skilled immigrants?

 

[saras76]

Something is better than nothing ..

Guys and Gals,

I think all of us have valid points here. I don't think there is any bill that will fix all problems. I would be happy with any bill that adds visa numbers to EB3, exempts dependents from the annual count and provides provisions for Eb2s and EB1s to not count against the quota. Any bill that addresses these issues will help in the short term. I agree that there may be problems in the future but what is the alternative? We really have no choice right now. If the 245i problem is not tackled this year, then we will all sit around for ages discussing the merits and demerits of bills without anything happening. Problems created by legislation this year will have to be tackled in the years to come thru other bills. That is how this system works. Never have I seen an immigration law or bill that solves every problem. Immigration bills solve certain obvious problems but always create equal number of new problems. To oppose a bill that is trying to solve immediate and obvious problems because it "may" have harmful side-effects in the long run is not a smart move on our part. The immediate problem is the shortage of visas in the EB3 category and any bill that solves this problem for a year or two is not bad for us.

regards,

saras

 

[thera33]

The article is unclear about the visa numbers for green cards. It would appear to affect people that are applying for H1 (work permits) rather than the green cards. It clearly says work visas when it mentions the 140K for Skilled workers. Definitely it appears that the bill favors illegal immigrants and their ability to bring their families. I think that we should have a united voice like the Hispanics. How many indians who have a green card come forward to help others like us that are waiting for years? For all they care, they only think that they have been throught it so they dont really want to help.

How many of us would walk out for a day and protest. We are all doing skilled jobs and some are in very highly technical fields but we dont have anyone that lobbies for our cause. There are so influential Indian immigrants but nobody is willing to take up our cause. The only way our voice can be heard is we garner support from all our fellow immigrants.

Be careful of using the word protest in here! you could really put yourself in big trouble. I have seen people like you saying the same thing and they were beaten down and pull from this site. We are independent people and are willing to contribute our money to some other people to go to washington for us, when we can do it for ourselves.

Just look at the total members of this site + guests and you will see that we are a force to reckon with too. The illegals show their might and Washington gets the message. Why cant we barrow a page from their book.

My brother we dont really know what we want, we are only good typist and browsers and we are willing to pay our hard earn cash to some lawyers and some so-called fly-by-night organization who claim they can fix the EB process.

I am with you though.

 

[nyte_crawler]

We dont want to protest because we have options. We are high-skilled folks who make more money than a cherry-picker sharing bunk beds in horrible conditions. We have skills that are valuable and we will leave when the time gets bad. My 2 cents.

 

[nyte_crawler]

I took it from the article published. I pasted the link in the beginning of the thread. There are so many news floating around and I wanted to make sure that was accurate. Apparently it was not, what is a good thing.

It's like in the spin zone. Just make sure that you don't believe in false propaganda.

 

[neocor]

Neocor, please don't give up. Write to vocal commentators such as Michelle Malkin, Lou Dobbs, Michael Savage, Bill O'Reilly, etc. I called in the local radio station today to explain our cause and how this bill has potential to bury us even further. If this thing goes thru, in the mid-term this country may well be a nation of peons.

You mean write to them with our plight and make them sadistically happy.

neo

 

[guldukan]

do you guys realize at this point no one cares about legal immigrants, politicians, media, corporate nobody.

the only hope we have is if the bill for illegal immigrants passed along with that we might get piggyback ride

check our facts,
we pay tax,
we fund social security
we are on their database
corporate enjoys having employees working for them without any raise or benfits
Media enjoys it's rating posing us as a aliens taking away American jobs

if you ask yourself a question whatz in it for politics, media corporate for granting us green card, you will find your answer.

guys this is the reality sooner we understant better it is

 

[docmd]

left behind???

Why are you people so pessimistic? I dont understand. Nobody is putting you behind. the president said the 12 million will be behind those already waiting. The AG on News said the same thing. They are increasing the visa numbers too. Why the pessimism. Or is it a very "indian" thing to keep cribbing?
The irony amazes me. There are so many candidates with MS and PhDs from American universities waiting in line with those having a BE or BS from India. A relative of mine with MS ( A US citizen) had a tough time finding a job. Another buddy of mine a yankee with BS in biotechnology is working as a research assitant. He grumbles when he sees Indians taking away high paying jobs while he is still paying student loans. Personally I dont see any difference between him or any BE from India. Many things have already been working out for you guys. What are you guys complaining about. Be positive and stop making a utter disgrace of yourselfs by cribbing constantly.

This is my opinion and I stick by it.................

 

[guldukan]

Why are you people so pessimistic? I dont understand. Nobody is putting you behind. the president said the 12 million will be behind What are you guys complaining about. Be positive and stop making a utter disgrace of yourselfs by cribbing constantly.

This is my opinion and I stick by it.................

docmd,

I use to be like you, I have been in this country for more than 9 years now, my first company messed up my green card so I have to start all over again, I was very optimistic but for past four years I have to reject two excellent offers and promotion becuase of stupid legal procedure, I had planned my trip four months before and applied for AP, I am still waiting and had to cancel my trip.

about Phds and MS, it really does'nt matter, I work as an Architect with software enginner title in a reputed software comapny and I have seen many so called MS guys good for nothing, in capitalistic world all it matters is what you deliver and how you negotiate, if a BE grad from India is getting highly paid than his American counter part he must be really good, cuz the CEO of company is not his Father-in-law.

finally no body is cribbing here but just trying to analyze the current situation to make meanfull predication of future immigrant life

 

[saras76]

Your take ..

Why are you people so pessimistic? I dont understand. Nobody is putting you behind. the president said the 12 million will be behind those already waiting. The AG on News said the same thing. They are increasing the visa numbers too. Why the pessimism. Or is it a very "indian" thing to keep cribbing?
The irony amazes me. There are so many candidates with MS and PhDs from American universities waiting in line with those having a BE or BS from India. A relative of mine with MS ( A US citizen) had a tough time finding a job. Another buddy of mine a yankee with BS in biotechnology is working as a research assitant. He grumbles when he sees Indians taking away high paying jobs while he is still paying student loans. Personally I dont see any difference between him or any BE from India. Many things have already been working out for you guys. What are you guys complaining about. Be positive and stop making a utter disgrace of yourselfs by cribbing constantly.

This is my opinion and I stick by it.................

docmd,

I agree sometimes we legal immigrants do complain to much but don't you think that your views are a bit naive. You stating that the President said that the 11 million will be behind us in line is ridiculous. Politicians (even in the US) provide lip service. If you have observed this immigration system for any length of time you will realize that at almost every step legal immigrants have had to pay the price for legalizing illegals. In that sense we have been left behind and we have been ill treated. All legal immigrants (Indian, Jamaican, Canadian or whatever) have the right to be upset about this.

As for you pulling examples of well qualified US citizens not being able to find jobs, I think its ridiculos to think they can't find jobs. Maybe they are aiming for something that they are not really qualified for or maybe their aspirations are a bit out of whack. If a well qualified US citizen with marketable skills can't make it here then they can't make it anywhere. I think average Americans have become to lazy over the years and are blaming international competition for the problems thay have created for themselves. They need to get a reality check.

regards,

saras

 

[docmd]

saras comments

Saras,

I have met many fine americans who are much more hard working than my fellow indians. I would not comment on them being lazy since I totally beleive that to be absolutely untrue. I am a physician doing residency and did research for 4 years. In my time here I have met some amazing scientists who can under absolutely no criteria be considered lazy. Additionally prior to moving here from Mumbai ( after complete 4 degrees there) i faced more mean behavior and exploitation there than I ever did here in the states.

Part of being in USA is respecting that this country is very welcoming and literally a melting pot of cultures. You are respected for what you are. I would not characterize my freind as having higher than expected ambitions or lazy neither would I accept "cockiness" that i see so many Indians very aptly display. It is true that the Indian community is doing well here. it is false to assume superiority over your fellow americans.

these are my opinions and I stick to them.....

 

[Nadi]

As for you pulling examples of well qualified US citizens not being able to find jobs, I think its ridiculos to think they can't find jobs.

Yes I do agree with you on this...

Lets take nursing --- high pay -- great bonus -- I know one big hospital was offering $10K as sign in bonus and an SUV... Still they are not not getting nurses.

No one wants to do nursing ... even if it fetches on an average 70K a year.

Well with baby boomers are getting older ... naturally there is a pull of resources for developing countries ... even if they are not properly skilled ... but they are willing.

May not be good for developing nations -- as there resources are getting depleted ...

 

[guldukan]

Hey doc,

on a lighter note, did'nt know you were a resdient , with 120hrs/week schedule I know you hardly had anytime to look around US and understand politics and culture of this country, take it from me, I am a consultant and I lived in Newyork, virginia,california, dallas and currently enjoying sunny flordia, so I have seen'm all.

not everyone in US is like your fellow residents who works crazy hours. there are some lazy bozzos and also some highly talented guys so you can't generalize it will be termed as racial

by the way I really admire the hardwork you guys do.

we are simply debating on unfair legal immigration process

 

[gcstrat]

Lip Service

One of things I have observed in USA:

There are smart people, there are "dumb" people, there are lazy people, there are hard working people, there are arrogant people, there are ignorant people and there are misguided people.

But that has nothing to do with our GC process!

Right now, the only people that matter are people who would be on the SENATE-HOUSE RECONCILIATION Committee. Those 12 or 24 or 50 people are doing to decide the fate of GC process.

Let all the politicians do as much posturing/lip service as they want, let Lou Dobbs "cry, shout, call names" as much as he wants, let the WSJ / NYT / USA-Today, etc. write as many editorials as they want, let AILA/ NumbersUSA/ImmigrationVoice,etc. send as many letters as they want.

The fact is how much influence these folks will have on those 12 or 24 or 50 people in the reconciliation committee is a TRILLION DOLLAR question.

My take is CIR is will be buried in the SENATE-HOUSE reconciliation committee.

Regards
GCStrat

 

[marlon2006]

Not necessarily. If it is true that skilled immigration share has been reduced from ~60% to 30%, I strongly believe that this would be an excellent ammunition to people like Lou Dobbs and Michelle Malkin, etc. That is so true that Rush Limbaugh yesterday commented on this share of legal vs illegal quota. Writing is one of the few actions we can take these days.

You mean write to them with our plight and make them sadistically happy.

neo

 

[texancanadian]

Nadi,
You are so wrong. The shortage of Nurses is not due to lack of applicants but due to other factors. My wife recently got admitted to a Nursing program and they had 800 plus applicants for 100 seats.
There are many reasons why Nursing schools cannot graduate more students. They are

1) Lack of Professors/Instructors - Why would someone work on standard government job when industry is paying 3-4 times salary.

2) Clinical instructors" There is a ratio that for ever 7 nursing student there should be 1 instructor at least when they go to hospitals.

3) Lack of Hospital beds.

Govertment is trying to start new programs, BUT DEMAND IS EXCEEDING SUPPLY.

Yes I do agree with you on this...

Lets take nursing --- high pay -- great bonus -- I know one big hospital was offering $10K as sign in bonus and an SUV... Still they are not not getting nurses.

No one wants to do nursing ... even if it fetches on an average 70K a year.

Well with baby boomers are getting older ... naturally there is a pull of resources for developing countries ... even if they are not properly skilled ... but they are willing.

May not be good for developing nations -- as there resources are getting depleted ...

 

[goodyearahead]

The article is unclear about the visa numbers for green cards. It would appear to affect people that are applying for H1 (work permits) rather than the green cards. It clearly says work visas when it mentions the 140K for Skilled workers. Definitely it appears that the bill favors illegal immigrants and their ability to bring their families. I think that we should have a united voice like the Hispanics. How many indians who have a green card come forward to help others like us that are waiting for years? For all they care, they only think that they have been throught it so they dont really want to help.

How many of us would walk out for a day and protest. We are all doing skilled jobs and some are in very highly technical fields but we dont have anyone that lobbies for our cause. There are so influential Indian immigrants but nobody is willing to take up our cause. The only way our voice can be heard is we garner support from all our fellow immigrants.

You are right the article does not differentiate between work visas and green cards it definitely means work visas this is my view to put us into positive track. Do remember that the illegal ones would not be granted amnesty and they have to go to the end of the line set up by the legal ones. The approvals for illegal ones would be difficult and would have penalties besides following the queue set up by legal ones who are waiting patiently. Hopefully memorial day would bring GOOD LUCK to all us.

 

[goodyearahead]

Bill, Illegal immigration lobby and its effects on Retrogression

The article is unclear about the visa numbers for green cards. It would appear to affect people that are applying for H1 (work permits) rather than the green cards. It clearly says work visas when it mentions the 140K for Skilled workers. Definitely it appears that the bill favors illegal immigrants and their ability to bring their families. I think that we should have a united voice like the Hispanics. How many indians who have a green card come forward to help others like us that are waiting for years? For all they care, they only think that they have been throught it so they dont really want to help.

How many of us would walk out for a day and protest. We are all doing skilled jobs and some are in very highly technical fields but we dont have anyone that lobbies for our cause. There are so influential Indian immigrants but nobody is willing to take up our cause. The only way our voice can be heard is we garner support from all our fellow immigrants.

You are right the article does not differentiate between work visas and green cards it definitely means work visas this is my view to put us into positive track. Do remember that the illegal ones would not be granted amnesty and they have to go to the end of the line set up by the legal ones. The approvals for illegal ones would be difficult and would have penalties besides following the queue set up by legal ones who are waiting patiently. Hopefully memorial day would bring GOOD LUCK to all us.

 

[saras76]

In general ..

Saras,

I have met many fine americans who are much more hard working than my fellow indians. I would not comment on them being lazy since I totally beleive that to be absolutely untrue. I am a physician doing residency and did research for 4 years. In my time here I have met some amazing scientists who can under absolutely no criteria be considered lazy. Additionally prior to moving here from Mumbai ( after complete 4 degrees there) i faced more mean behavior and exploitation there than I ever did here in the states.

Part of being in USA is respecting that this country is very welcoming and literally a melting pot of cultures. You are respected for what you are. I would not characterize my freind as having higher than expected ambitions or lazy neither would I accept "cockiness" that i see so many Indians very aptly display. It is true that the Indian community is doing well here. it is false to assume superiority over your fellow americans.

these are my opinions and I stick to them.....

docmd,

I never said that every American is lazy or that every Indian is smart. Everyone knows that we cannot generalize these things. In every society and culture there are equal number of ambitious people and lazy people. What I stated was that if an American citizen with marketable skills, claims that there are no jobs for him/her then there is more than meets the eye. Either that persons goals are to lofty or they are not as qualified as they think. Most companies would hire American citizens if they could but there aren't enough qualified Americans willing to do jobs at what the companies want to pay. Its pure business. America is currently feeling the pinch of Globalization. If a company can get the same work done for half the price then why would they pay an American citizen to do the same job. We legal immigrants have been made scapegoats here. Americans are not willing to accept that third world countries are competing with them so they keep harping about how we immigrants are taking their jobs. We are here because we are needed. No one is doing us any favors. We are not doing them any favors either. We are needed so we are here. Its a realtionship of mututal dependence.

If Americans really feel that we are a problem then they should eliminate the H1B program altogether. I would like to see how this country would function. If they are able to manage then they need to have laws to get us all out of here.

regards,

saras