Fraudulent greencard?

K

karl.g

New Member
Hi

My sister in law got her greencard when she was 13(1993). she stayed in the US till highschool, She left the coutry around 1998 and was away until 2008. Between 1998-2008 she never entered the US and got her GC expired and got married abroad(place of birth). On 2008 she entered the US using a tourist visa and brought with her her old expired greencard, she tried renewing it without declaring it was expired, or she was away of the country for 10 or so years. The officer failed to see the gap between 1993- 2008, She got it renewed and been staying here ever since. Since 2008 she was able to travel in and out of the US twice with a new greencard and new passport that doesnt have the tourist visa "tag". She also got her husband and son petitioned and all are staying in the US. Everything seems to be perfectly placed. My question:

1. Is this considered fraud on how she renewed it?
2. Will this haunt her if somebody reports it that knows all the details? Like a disgranted friend or a family?
3. Is she and family facing deportation proceedings if found?

Thanks
 
If she didn't lie on any forms or to any officers then I don't think it's fraud. Maybe they could be put into deportation.
 
i dont believe she lied on any form, but not declairing that she was out of the country for 10yrs and renewing an expired GC, isnt it misrepresentation? Its like tricking the officer. Does that qualifies for deportation?
 
You're not allowed to enter the US on a tourist visa while you're a permanent resident. The expiration of the green card does not, by itself, invalidate your permanent resident status. You can still renew a green card after it expires, as long as you are still a permanent resident. But in the meantime, you're still a permanent resident, and you can't legally enter the US under any other status like tourist visa.

You are allowed to renounce your permanent resident status, and then enter on a tourist visa, but then your permanent resident status would be void, and you would no longer be allowed to renew your green card.

This means that, unfortunately, your sister-in-law committed immigration fraud (entering the US on a tourist visa while in lawful permanent resident status). The good news is that she probably won't get caught, unless she gets reported (obviously), or unless she applies for naturalization in which case she may well get caught since USCIS does tend to scrutinize previous travel when permanent residents apply for citizenship. Since DHS has a record of her tourist visa, and associated material like I-94/I-94W showing a potential overstay of visa, all it would take is the right database query on their end to bring about a whole host of awkward questions.

If she does get caught, it would be absolutely devastating -- not only would she lose her permanent resident status, but her husband and son would too, since their status derives from her fraudulent status. Yes, all three would get deported if this happens. Even a future grant of citizenship via naturalization can be revoked if the naturalization application was based on prior immigration fraud, and in fact this is the only way to lose US citizenship involuntarily. (Citizenship by birth on US soil is safe and cannot be revoked under any circumstances.)
 
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newacct said:
Not true. Permanent residents can, under some circumstances, enter on a tourist visa for a temporary short-term visit. See 9 FAM 41.31 N15
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Wow, thanks I didn't know that.

Still, 9 FAM 41.31 N15 is, according to the title of the section, intended for "emergency temporary visits" to the US and it does not sound like there is anything even arguably temporary about what the OP's sister-in-law is doing, so it would not apply in this particular case.
 
yup, Most likely coz since she came back to the US 2008 she stayed ever since, with a couple of trips abroad on 2011 using a new passport(no visa stamp).

This problem is takin a toll on their marriage, arguments been increasing. Couples are talking about divorce. Will divorce and marrying somebody who is a citizen solve their problem? Would they eacape deportation? I know it sounds desperate but they are really scared to be sent back to a place where they know nothing about.

How would they prevent deportation if their case is reported?
 
This is a complicated case, and you'll most likely need a lawyer. My own (non-lawyer) opinion is that marrying a US citizen will not work. In general, the law does not confer immigration benefits for "sham" marriages where the marriage is undertaken solely for immigration purposes. But even if the marriage is genuine, it still won't work. The only category of illegal status that can be fixed by marriage is when you overstay a legal visa. That is, if you legally enter the country on a legitimate temporary visa, overstay your visa, and then marry a US citizen without leaving the USA at all in between, then you can file for AOS based on marriage and your overstay will be forgiven. In order for this to work, you must remain continuously in the country from the point when you enter the US on your visa, until the point when you apply for AOS based on marriage. Since your sister-in-law took those two trips abroad in 2011, she would not qualify for overstay forgiveness.

Even worse, your sister-in-law might be banned from the US for a period of ten years, because she accumulated more than 180 days of unlawful presence (one way or another, either by a fraudulent green card, or by overstaying the tourist visa), and then left the country in 2011. There are a few exceptions to the ten-year ban, most commonly an "extreme hardship" waiver but also a few others (minor children, asylum applicants, battered women and children). Marriage to a US citizen does not resolve the ten-year ban, but may (if the marriage is genuine) make it easier to obtain an extreme hardship waiver (note however that extreme hardship waivers are very hard to get, even with marriage).

Again, I am not a lawyer, or even an immigration professional, just a normal person. A lawyer may be able to see some legal loophole that I don't see. The laws are actually quite unclear, and most of them are written for the case where someone sneaks through a border without inspection, not for the case where someone defrauds the system with a real but illegitimate green card. But my personal opinion is that there is basically no legal way to resolve your sister-in-law's status. Your least bad solution is to just pretend everything is all right and hope no one finds out.

I am curious (and you don't have to answer this if you don't want), what sort of disgruntled friend or family member would report this situation to the authorities? I do not understand why friends or family members would ever know the details of her situation. If she just doesn't tell anyone, then no one would suspect fraud. Even if someone suspects fraud, she could just lie and say she got a returning resident visa (which, by the way, is what you're supposed to do if you have a green card and you've been out of the USA for ten years) -- I mean, that's not ideal, but let's face it, lying to friends and family is not a federal crime.
 
Harry Callahan

Its a family friend that helped her get a tourist visa when she was still out of the US, same people helped her on how to renew her GC on 2008. They also helped her get by brother and nephew petitioned,both are here in the US now. My sister in law is not the nicest person so she ended having an argument with them, instead of being gratefull for the help.

This whole fiasco resulted to arguments and pointing fingers between couple and to an extent that they are discussing the possibility of divorce. Thats the reason why I asked you if she can be spared from deportation if she marries a citizen(you answered that part)coz I think that is what she is planning to do. I know it sounds desperate and sick but sometimes people do crazy things just to stay here.

One more question. If they get a divorce and the deportation proceedings starts, would that still affect my brother and nephew's status?
 
Well, if it means anything, those family friends (by helping your sister-in-law commit immigration fraud) are themselves guilty of immigration fraud, and may end up prosecuted for it if they go to the authorities. This is a big reason why you should always either handle immigration matters by yourself (if you can) or else hire a lawyer (the lawyer is protected by attorney-client privilege, and cannot report you).

In the event of deportation proceedings, I am not sure if DHS would cross-check your brother and nephew's status. In theory, DHS has all the information, since they know your sister-in-law sponsored your brother and nephew. But DHS is not very efficient or competent in these matters, and it's possible they simply wouldn't notice. Unless, of course, your sister-in-law or someone else reports them! By the way, it may not even matter for deportation purposes whether or not they divorce. I don't know. As with all things, you'll definitely need professional legal advice here to be sure.
 
Harry Callahan said:
Well, if it means anything, those family friends (by helping your sister-in-law commit immigration fraud) are themselves guilty of immigration fraud, and may end up prosecuted for it if they go to the authorities. This is a big reason why you should always either handle immigration matters by yourself (if you can) or else hire a lawyer (the lawyer is protected by attorney-client privilege, and cannot report you).

In the event of deportation proceedings, I am not sure if DHS would cross-check your brother and nephew's status. In theory, DHS has all the information, since they know your sister-in-law sponsored your brother and nephew. But DHS is not very efficient or competent in these matters, and it's possible they simply wouldn't notice. Unless, of course, your sister-in-law or someone else reports them! By the way, it may not even matter for deportation purposes whether or not they divorce. I don't know. As with all things, you'll definitely need professional legal advice here to be sure.
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Which action done by anyone do you think is fraudulent?
 
newacct said:
Which action done by anyone do you think is fraudulent?
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  1. Applying for a tourist visa, knowing full well that the trip is not intended to be of a temporary nature.
  2. Renewing a green card after being out of the country for more than one year (ten years in fact) without applying for a returning resident visa.
  3. Petitioning for family members on the basis of the illegitimate green card.
According to the OP, the same people did all three things.
 
When i said them helping my sister in law with her Tourist visa & GC, It was just helping her pay for the fees and provided a place to stay for a couple of months. They also helped her pay the fees for the petition of my brother and nephew and acted as a co-sponsor since her income wasnt qualified to sponsor two. Are they in trouble for doing that? They can always say they did not know the card was obtained fraudulenty or misrepresented.

Anyway, thank you for the reply. It enlighted us a lot about things.
 
Under INA 274A(a)(1), anyone who "conceals, harbors, or shields from detection" an illegal alien commits a federal felony. It is possible that providing a place to stay would qualify. Among the many issues is the timing -- if your sister-in-law had not (yet) overstayed her visa during those months, then the friends might be in the clear. (But then again they might not -- her intent was clearly to overstay, even if she had not done so yet.) As an educated layman and not a lawyer, I can only guess.
 
Harry Callahan said:
Applying for a tourist visa, knowing full well that the trip is not intended to be of a temporary nature.
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You don't know that. When she went to the U.S., she probably expected that she had already lost permanent residency, and thus thought it was temporary. She could have decided to file I-90 after entering, perhaps upon hearing from these "people" who later helped her. And even if she decided to file I-90 before entering, that still doesn't mean that she intended to stay in the U.S. for a long time on that trip at the time she entered; the staying could have been due to circumstances that arose after entry.

Harry Callahan said:
Renewing a green card after being out of the country for more than one year (ten years in fact) without applying for a returning resident visa.
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CBP oftentimes let permanent residents in who just have a green card who have been out for more than one year, or sometimes two or more years, without a re-entry permit or returning resident visa, with just a warning, especially on first offense. So being out more than one year does not automatically mean that permanent residency is lost.

The I-90 form does not say that you cannot file it if you have been out of the country a given number of years, nor does it require you to provide dates when you have been out of the U.S. I don't see how filing the form is fraudulent if she did not lie on the form.

Harry Callahan said:
Petitioning for family members on the basis of the illegitimate green card.
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As above, being out more than one year does not automatically mean that permanent residency is lost. No court or agency has ruled that her permanent residency is lost. And in fact, CBP has admitted her as a permanent resident multiple times in the last few years, giving her reason to believe that she is a permanent resident. Abandonment of permanent residency based on being out of the U.S. is a subjective and discretionary matter, so you cannot absolutely say that CBP acted incorrectly. It is possible that some court will one day rule her permanent residency was lost. But based on what she's been told thus far by various agencies, she's been given every reason to believe that she is a permanent resident and can petition family members.
 
OK, but this much is indisputable: Once you enter on a tourist visa, regardless of your original intention, your status for that trip is tourist visa, unless you adjust or change status. Unfortunately, you cannot AOS to permanent resident when you already have a green card. Now, it's possible to file form I-539 to change from B-1 to some other sort of longer-term non-immigrant status like F-1, and if this is the case than OP needs to mention it. But if you just stay in the US on B-1 status from 2008 to 2011 without doing anything about it, then you've overstayed your tourist visa, unless you managed to extend your B-1 status, which requires filing form I-539, and again the OP needs to provide this information if it happened (even if this is the case, I highly doubt DHS would permit B-1 status for three years). Renewing your green card while in the US does not magically change your status for that trip. Changing your status in the US can only be accomplished either: 1. by AOS (not an option here), 2. by filing form I-539 to change to some other status, or 3. by leaving the country and re-entering. Unfortunately, by the time this person left the country, she had already overstayed her tourist visa by more than 180 days, and at this point leaving the country triggers the 10-year ban, green card or no.

Overstaying a tourist visa for any reason, even for reasons beyond your control, does not excuse you from the consequences of the overstay, unless as I mentioned above the person filed form I-539 for an extension of stay, in which case OP needs to mention this pronto, as this affects the outcome.
 
Hi

My sister in law did not do any AOS when she got here, all she did was went to authorities and presented her old GC and it was renewed right away. She didnot mention she was out of the country for more than 10yrs, & actually back with a tourist visa. It was like a cake walk, thats why all(family members) was so surprise on how it happened. After getting her new GC she applied for a new passport so she can travel abroad, a passport without the US tourist visa stamp. Everything fell on the right place for her, not to mention she was able to petition her husband and kid.

If deportation proceedings happends or if its possible for this case, how long does that take? I feel for my brother right now, he is devastated facing this after he waited 6 years for the petition to be approved.
 
After thinking about it some more, all I can say is that it's complicated. Your sister-in-law is (in my non-expert opinion) definitely subject to a 10-year ban on entry to the US, since she overstayed her tourist visa by a lot, without extending, changing or adjusting status at any point, and then subsequently departed the country. But an entry ban does not, by itself, prevent sponsorship of others. It just means that you yourself are not allowed to enter the US. I have no idea how any of this interacts with the six-year timeline of your brother's petition. Your brother's green card may be safe. I don't know. But in order to keep his green card and have everything be legal from this point forward, he would have to stay in the USA, while your sister-in-law serves her ten-year ban outside the USA.

Separately, there is also the issue of whether the earlier ten-year absence from the US invalidates her permanent resident status. I'm pretty sure that if an officer were to scrutinize her case, she would be judged to have lost her residency, because ten years is an enormously long time. If your sister-in-law loses her permanent residency on this basis, then your brother's green card (based on her sponsorship) would be in jeopardy. But since that has not happened yet, you're still OK for now. However, you might not be OK if someone reports her. Again, this issue is separate from the ten-year ban.

I've never faced deportation proceedings, so I don't know how long it would take. My guess it would take several years at least. They might not even take any action at all, because DHS is understaffed and doesn't have the manpower to act on every report. If they do prosecute, please be aware that permanent residents have the right to receive a hearing in front of an immigration judge (they cannot just deport you without a court order). Your family members would qualify for this right, since they haven't lost their green cards yet. You may have to insist on a hearing, and make sure you don't sign anything waiving your rights.
 
My sister in law got her GC(1993) and she is under ir2 category. Does that chanhe the scenario? Does ir2 category expire if your out of the US for 10 years?
 
It's not a matter of the green card expiring; the issue is maintaining US residence. All green card holders are equal in this respect (except for commuter green cards, which you do not have).
 
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