3 years degree EB3, 140 at NSC - please advice

3 Yr Extn..

Guys,
One question - My 140 got approved a couple days back. For me to work on beyond the H1 6 yrs, is it necessary that the 3 yr H1 extn be APPROVED before the 6 yr expiry or JUST FILING before the 6 yr expiry is enough?
Thanks guys
M
 
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surabhi..

surabhi said:
I-140 form has one check box for both!!
I-140 approval notice shows both categories that is default in case of Eb3 cat. But Attorneys has to request explicitly in case of skilled worker.

Can you ask him?.Please let me know.

Surabhi
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I will ask him...hang on
 
Sheila R Danzig said:
gccracker is correct. I have helped students gain admission into us Masters programs with a solid evaluation showing the equivalency to a us bachelor's degree. One was admitted into the DUKE University MBA program - one of the top programs in the US. Harvard, Georgetown and other top universities have accepted students with 3 year degree into their masters programs. Saying that the 3 year programs are a second choice to the engineering programs is like saying being an accountant is a second choice to being a doctor. Medical school is more difficult to gain admission to then an accounting program but it does not mean that the accounting program is not excellent.
-Sheila
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Was their admission conditional? Were they asked to take any deficiency courses? Any good university requires people to cover deficiencies so that when they start their masters program, they are capable and can compete with the people who came through the more challenging programs.

I do not have a problem with 3 year degree people gaining a graduate program admission into the US universities, making up for their deficiencies by taking those extra bachelors level courses and then graduating with their Masters.

What I see here is people with sub-par education (3 year Bachelors + experience) wanting to be treated at the same level as those who competed in the various undergraduate engineering entrance exams (I'm taking India as the example as that's the system I know) and beat out these aforementioned people and earned their Masters based on their talent & capabilities.

Someone wrote that 3 year Bachelors is still a Bachelors degree. I'd like to sell you my older model Honda at the same price as my one year old BMW. They are both cars!!
 
Meaning

UN,
What do you mean by "It would have been 100% if the alternative requirement was combination but it is what it is."? Do we have any provision to mention like the above in PERM applicaiton? Please throw light.

Thanks,

unitednations said:
Your denial was due to the 3 year degree issue. USCIS made a determination that you are not qualified for the labor. That is the first step; second step is which category to file.

Your saving grace is in box 14 which states any "combination". Your lawyer needs to pound on this to say the labor allows for combination.

Note: As I've stated before; perm labors bring unique issues. I had posted a long time back that if what is in line 14 is shown on a labor USCIS can take a position that company is willing to take less then a full four year bachelors or masters degree. If it is willing to take less then it is not qualified for eb2.

However, this sentence is key in a perm labor in allowing combination if that is what you need to qualify for the labor.

It would have been 100% if the alternative requirement was combination but it is what it is.

For sure: Your Lawyer needs to pound on box 14 that it allows combination and you are using combination.
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Maansi,
What is there in your PERM LC colume H.8.B?

maansi28 said:
repost:
Hi friends, me again

My lawyer now says that he will apply for an EB3 for me using the approved EB2 labor -- AND -- that my present education/expereince WILL DEFINITELY qualify for a bachelors in EB3 (even though it didn't fly in EB2)..... not as a skilled labor, but as a prefessional.

Can you pls advise if this is good?

My ETA says "

H.6 - Is exp in the job required for the job - YES
H.6A - If yes, no. of months required - 24
H.7 - Is there an alternate field of study that is acceptable - YES
H.8 - Is there an alternate combination of of education and experience that is acceptable -YES
H.8.A - If yes, specify the alternate level of experience required - BACHELOR'S
H.8.C - If applicable, indiate the no, of yrs of experience - 4
H.9 - Is a foreign educational equivalent acceptable -YES
H.10 - Is exp in an alternate occupation acceptable - YES
H.10.A - If yes, no. of months needed -24
H.14 - ..."Any reasonable combination of education, training and experience is acceptable for the position offered"

much thanks
M
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"Someone wrote that 3 year Bachelors is still a Bachelors degree. I'd like to sell you my older model Honda at the same price as my one year old BMW. They are both cars!!"

--Mr.BMW, forgive this earthly mortal for trying to put sense into your celestial brain. But that is exactly the point. If someone wants a car, he gets a car. If he/she specifically requires a honda, then better ask for it specifically. Dont tell me that honda is not a car at all.

Apply this to your thinking process that is still overexcited about your 4-year degree. 3-year degree is also a bachelor's degree as long as it is awarded as such. It has its own place ofcourse. And 4-year degree too. This does not make 3-year degree as no bachelor's degree at all.

Again, let me reiterate, as long as your employer is not looking for a genuis like you (specifically with a 4-year degree ), I am sure any 3-year degree "homosapien" can fit in the job that you hold now. Who knows, they might even do a better job (No pun intended).
 
very well said

anilt75 said:
"Someone wrote that 3 year Bachelors is still a Bachelors degree. I'd like to sell you my older model Honda at the same price as my one year old BMW. They are both cars!!"

--Mr.BMW, forgive this earthly mortal for trying to put sense into your celestial brain. But that is exactly the point. If someone wants a car, he gets a car. If he/she specifically requires a honda, then better ask for it specifically. Dont tell me that honda is not a car at all.

Apply this to your thinking process that is still overexcited about your 4-year degree. 3-year degree is also a bachelor's degree as long as it is awarded as such. It has its own place ofcourse. And 4-year degree too. This does not make 3-year degree as no bachelor's degree at all.

Again, let me reiterate, as long as your employer is not looking for a genuis like you (specifically with a 4-year degree ), I am sure any 3-year degree "homosapien" can fit in the job that you hold now. Who knows, they might even do a better job (No pun intended).
Click to expand...
 
Anyone..?

Guys,
One question - My 140 got approved a couple days back. For me to work on beyond the H1 6 yrs, is it necessary that the 3 yr H1 extn be APPROVED before the 6 yr expiry or JUST FILING before the 6 yr expiry is enough?
Thanks guys
M
 
Apply premium H1b ext and leave the pressures/USCIS gimmicks and Enjoy the life.

maansi28 said:
Guys,
One question - My 140 got approved a couple days back. For me to work on beyond the H1 6 yrs, is it necessary that the 3 yr H1 extn be APPROVED before the 6 yr expiry or JUST FILING before the 6 yr expiry is enough?
Thanks guys
M
Click to expand...
 
maansi28 said:
Guys,
One question - My 140 got approved a couple days back. For me to work on beyond the H1 6 yrs, is it necessary that the 3 yr H1 extn be APPROVED before the 6 yr expiry or JUST FILING before the 6 yr expiry is enough?
Thanks guys
M
Click to expand...

Maansi,

You used the same labor that led to 140 denial ( or RFE) in EB2 correct?

Filing new H1b extension before your current H1B period expires should do. You dont have to have an approval.

When are you applying for citizenship? :D
 
anilt75 said:
Maansi,

You used the same labor that led to 140 denial ( or RFE) in EB2 correct?

Filing new H1b extension before your current H1B period expires should do. You dont have to have an approval.

When are you applying for citizenship? :D
Click to expand...
--------------
Hey anil,
i was wondering no congrats from you? maybe you were busy scolding "celestial beings" on thE forum! :D

Yes, same labor was used.
So, no no need to wait for approval and I'll just file for the extn and reap the benefits! Thanks again, anil.

And also, the 3 yr extensions are indefinite, right?

M
 
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I-140 denied, what to do?

I have a 3 year Bachelors and 2 year Masters degree from India. My labor was approved by PBEC after almost 5 years of painful wait. When we were ready to file I-140, I read here that people with 3 year degrees have problems. My lawyer was confident that I would not have this problem as my labor requires Masters degree only. He got my degrees evaluated from Trusteforte. When I saw that evaluation, I got very worried. It was such a shabby job :eek: The person who evaluated my degrees did a simple cut and paste job and didn't even bother to read it afterwards (there were sentences with some one else' information instead of mine- I had these corrected before submitting it to NSC). Their evaluation essentially stated that my Bachelors and Masters is equal to US Masters. I pointed out to my lawyer that NSC does not like combining degrees and better would be to get just Masters evaluated as equal to Masters but he assured me that it would be ok because we were not combinig 2 Associate degrees to show Bachelors. Anyway, filed I-140 last week with PP. Today got a letter from bastrads at NSC with denial. :mad: (No RFE, straight denial).

The main reason they cited was that US Masters requires 6 years college whereas I had 5 years and they referred to "Matter of Shah" (??). Now my lawyer wants to appeal with a new evaluation. I am asking him to get my degrees re-evaluated to show my Bachelors as equal to US Bachelors and Masters equal to US Masters (I am planning get evaluation done by Sheila) and refile under PP.

Anyone knows anyone whose I-140 was approved after refiling with new evaluation? What are the chances of success with refiling? What are my options now? The job I am in has supervisory responsibilities and has to be under EB2. If I had to start all over again with PERM, what should I do make sure that I do not get into this problem again? I'll appreciate any suggestions.

Edit: I wanted to add that my job is in exact same field as my degrees are, and the company I am working for is a huge corporation with more than 50,000 employees.
 
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for fcukNSC

fcukNSC,
3 yrs= 4 yrs evaluation would have worked better for you than MSc=MSc. So far i understand, Trustforte did 3+2= 2 yrs US MSc. Thats kind of weird. 2yrs=2yrs Msc might also not work because you have 5 years education before Masters course not 6yrs (NSC wants that). As it got denied, honestly speaking, i don't see any hope with re-evaluaton. NSC will deny again for same reason. If money is not a problem, you can give it a shot and prepare LC under EB3 with right descripton on it. (i.e equivalent and combination). You should have used Sheila in the first time.
I'm sorry about your case.

GCcracker

fcukNSC said:
I have a 3 year Bachelors and 2 year Masters degree from India. My labor was approved by PBEC after almost 5 years of painful wait. When we were ready to file I-140, I read here that people with 3 year degrees have problems. My lawyer was confident that I would not have this problem as my labor requires Masters degree only. He got my degrees evaluated from Trusteforte. When I saw that evaluation, I got very worried. It was such a shabby job :eek: The person who evaluated my degrees did a simple cut and paste job and didn't even bother to read it afterwards (there were sentences with some one else' information instead of mine- I had these corrected before submitting it to NSC). Their evaluation essentially stated that my Bachelors and Masters is equal to US Masters. I pointed out to my lawyer that NSC does not like combining degrees and better would be to get just Masters evaluated as equal to Masters but he assured me that it would be ok because we were not combinig 2 Associate degrees to show Bachelors. Anyway, filed I-140 last week with PP. Today got a letter from bastrads at NSC with denial. :mad: (No RFE, straight denial).

The main reason they cited was that US Masters requires 6 years college whereas I had 5 years and they referred to "Matter of Shah" (??). Now my lawyer wants to appeal with a new evaluation. I am asking him to get my degrees re-evaluated to show my Bachelors as equal to US Bachelors and Masters equal to US Masters (I am planning get evaluation done by Sheila) and refile under PP.

Anyone knows anyone whose I-140 was approved after refiling with new evaluation? What are the chances of success with refiling? What are my options now? The job I am in has supervisory responsibilities and has to be under EB2. If I had to start all over again with PERM, what should I do make sure that I do not get into this problem again? I'll appreciate any suggestions.

Edit: I wanted to add that my job is in exact same field as my degrees are, and the company I am working for is a huge corporation with more than 50,000 employees.
Click to expand...
 
3=4

I agree with max2005. 3 years degree might be with less horse powers like the Honda but still its a degree. There are tons of screwed up universities in USA which provides 4 yrs degree but in terms knowledge, a 3yr indian knows better than him/her. I admit that a 4 years US degree man might have little bit extra credits and courses than 3 years degree, but still its a less HP BSc degree. And people are working in companies like HP, MS, IBM, GS, Chase with that less horse power degree and earning not a penny less than the US bachelors.

GCcracker
 
Doesn't you Labor allow for combination of edu and exp? I do not know how the re-evaluation would work but my suggestion would be not to loose your old priority date. If EB2 is not going to work for you in this case atleast try to get it approved in EB3 and once that is approved you file new PERM LC and port this old PD to your new case. With this you can atleast protect your priority date.

fcukNSC said:
I have a 3 year Bachelors and 2 year Masters degree from India. My labor was approved by PBEC after almost 5 years of painful wait. When we were ready to file I-140, I read here that people with 3 year degrees have problems. My lawyer was confident that I would not have this problem as my labor requires Masters degree only. He got my degrees evaluated from Trusteforte. When I saw that evaluation, I got very worried. It was such a shabby job :eek: The person who evaluated my degrees did a simple cut and paste job and didn't even bother to read it afterwards (there were sentences with some one else' information instead of mine- I had these corrected before submitting it to NSC). Their evaluation essentially stated that my Bachelors and Masters is equal to US Masters. I pointed out to my lawyer that NSC does not like combining degrees and better would be to get just Masters evaluated as equal to Masters but he assured me that it would be ok because we were not combinig 2 Associate degrees to show Bachelors. Anyway, filed I-140 last week with PP. Today got a letter from bastrads at NSC with denial. :mad: (No RFE, straight denial).

The main reason they cited was that US Masters requires 6 years college whereas I had 5 years and they referred to "Matter of Shah" (??). Now my lawyer wants to appeal with a new evaluation. I am asking him to get my degrees re-evaluated to show my Bachelors as equal to US Bachelors and Masters equal to US Masters (I am planning get evaluation done by Sheila) and refile under PP.

Anyone knows anyone whose I-140 was approved after refiling with new evaluation? What are the chances of success with refiling? What are my options now? The job I am in has supervisory responsibilities and has to be under EB2. If I had to start all over again with PERM, what should I do make sure that I do not get into this problem again? I'll appreciate any suggestions.

Edit: I wanted to add that my job is in exact same field as my degrees are, and the company I am working for is a huge corporation with more than 50,000 employees.
Click to expand...
 
gccracker said:
I agree with max2005. 3 years degree might be with less horse powers like the Honda but still its a degree. There are tons of screwed up universities in USA which provides 4 yrs degree but in terms knowledge, a 3yr indian knows better than him/her. I admit that a 4 years US degree man might have little bit extra credits and courses than 3 years degree, but still its a less HP BSc degree. And people are working in companies like HP, MS, IBM, GS, Chase with that less horse power degree and earning not a penny less than the US bachelors.

GCcracker
Click to expand...

USCIS has structured the categories EB1, 2 & 3 according to the level of education and not based on what the employers are willing to make do with. If some desperate employers are willing to lower their standards and settle for lesser qualified people then that is the employers prerogative.

CIS wants to give higher preference to someone who is more educationally qualified because in general, the more educated make larger contributions. And they are not denying you a green card becuase of your sub-standard degree. They have a path and you are expected to follow that path. EB3 is meant for people like that.

When you advertise in the local market asking for bachelors degree candidates and claim in the LC application that you could not find any, was that a fair assessment? Someone locally available with an associates degree or some other lesser diploma could have fit the bill. Did you advertise and search for such a person and then make your claim? If you did not and you want to force yourself into a higher category, they the CIS will rightly boot you. Going by your logic, I could be from a country where my dog's behind is called bachelors and I could bring a dog along and demand GC in EB2.
 
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