Drug conviction impact on Citizenship qick question please help

[baikal3]

Guys,

All of you who claim the OP will be able to sail through the N400 process, maybe you will think again after coming across this posting this morning. See the link and read what the wife said about her husband with a drug possession of 3/4 of weed from 1987 or so. (I might be incorrect about the time frame).

http://forums.immigration.com/showthread.php?t=303151

Actually, I think it was 1 and 3/4 oz (that is 7/4 oz), or about 49 grams of marijuana in the post you cite. As I remember, a single conviction for marjuana possession below 30gm is not considered deportable, but anything above 30gm or a conviction on any other drug charge (e.g. intent to distribute) does make one deportable:
"(B) Controlled substances
(i) Conviction Any alien who at any time after admission has been convicted of a violation of (or a conspiracy or attempt to violate) any law or regulation of a State, the United States, or a foreign country relating to a controlled substance (as defined in section 802 of title 21), other than a single offense involving possession for one’s own use of 30 grams or less of marijuana, is deportable.",
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/8/usc_sec_08_00001227----000-.html

So perhaps the amount made a difference here. Still, it is rather surprising that they decided to initiate deportation proceedings for such an old and fairly minor drug conviction...

 

[WBH]

So perhaps the amount made a difference here. Still, it is rather surprising that they decided to initiate deportation proceedings for such an old and fairly minor drug conviction...

Charge may be more than just self-consumptions. It is surprising that husband did not consult a lawyer before applying

 

[Al Southner]

Guys,

I erred in my calculation about the amount. However, the core focus of my post was and is: the OP in this case has a huge problem awaiting him at this N400 interview because no matter what the statute on the possession of weed is, this will be at the discretion of the IO and his case might be denied and referred for deportation. USCIS usually likes to up the stakes on some of these issues. The possession of weed though minor in the eyes of the law due to the amount, the immigration law function on its own and at its marches at its own pace... In this case, the Ukranian might need to drink a "kavorka" to evade the wrath of USCIS. I find that his case is too fresh and new, USCIS will likely delve into it with more focus and determination. I know there are lots of people who claim that he will be fine, I would like to believe that, but I am placing a bet of kosher lean beef that he's going to get nailed on the wall by USCIS for this moral violations.

 

[WBH]

However, the core focus of my post was and is: the OP in this case has a huge problem awaiting him at this N400 interview

I agree the OP has a big issue. But what is done can not be undone
so he has no choice but to face it. What he need to decide
is whether to withdraw or go ahead or even do not disclose it
(he said there is no arrest so no FP and the datebase may not be uodated for name check hit)


It is all up to him to decide

 

[tnwalker]

Get a good lawyer who knows immigration and see what you can do. Don't balk at money and try and get it thrown out.
But you had marijuana in a bottle with your name on it!!

 

[Al Southner]

I agree the OP has a big issue. But what is done can not be undone
so he has no choice but to face it. What he need to decide
is whether to withdraw or go ahead or even do not disclose it
(he said there is no arrest so no FP and the datebase may not be uodated for name check hit)
It is all up to him to decide

WBH,

Here is a quote from his post: " Also they got my fingerprints. Now I don't know what to do, can I be denied because of this for citizenship? My record was clean prior to this. I was thinking what if I just say I am not guilty so i get a court date(also cop said because they are booked now court date will be scheduled in like 5 months)and while I am waiting for the court try to get over the interview like nothing happened and get my citizenship."

I am certain when the FBI conduct a background check, his name is going to appear with a charge which will then be referred to USCIS for further examination as it affects the adjudication of his N400 application. In reading this again, he's of the view that a case delayed is a non-existent case of which we can sail through the N400 application process without informing USCIS. I beg to differ, lying to USCIS will never yield any positive outcome.

 

[WBH]

Has it ever occurred anyone with a conviction record insisted he is innocent
and he is just wrongly acused adn convicted and the IO take his words
and agreed with himn that he is indeed innocent and thus granted him the citizenship?

 

[Al Southner]

Has it ever occurred anyone with a conviction record insisted he is innocent
and he is just wrongly acused adn convicted and the IO take his words
and agreed with himn that he is indeed innocent and thus granted him the citizenship?

I would implore you to watch Shawshank Redemption. Andy Dufrain, Ellis Red and Norten Warden are main characters in that movie. Unfortunately, has lot of profanity which takes away from the beauty of that movie. All the convicts there claim to me innocent...

You can claim innocence before an IO, but he or she's NOT a recognized court of law. The OP should fight and be cleared by a jury of his peer if he is that innocent. With a bottle of weed with your name on it, good luck... I doubt the prosecutor is going to be aggressive, he's going to recommend to the OP to plead guilty, pay a fine and be on probation. I suspect the public defendant is going to recommend the same thing as the prosecutor to the OP, he can't afford a vigorious representation from a criminal defense lawyer. Can he?

 

[WBH]

I would implore you to watch Shawshank Redemption. Andy Dufrain, Ellis Red and Norten Warden are main characters in that movie. Unfortunately, has lot of profanity which takes away from the beauty of that movie. All the convicts there claim to me innocent...

You can claim innocence before an IO, but he or she's NOT a recognized court of law. The OP should fight and be cleared by a jury of his peer if he is that innocent. With a bottle of weed with your name on it, good luck... I doubt the prosecutor is going to be aggressive, he's going to recommend to the OP to plead guilty, pay a fine and be on probation. I suspect the public defendant is going to recommend the same thing as the prosecutor to the OP, he can't afford a vigorious representation from a criminal defense lawyer. Can he?

I am not talking about this OP particular case but in general sense. What if
someone is really innocent and get convicted? Such things happens no matter how hard the defendant tried incourt and appealling. If such a person apply for citizenship, Should he insist he is innocent to USCIS or pretend he really did what as charged and show repent?

In one episode of "The Pratice", there is a parole hearing. The lawyer advise the applicant to show repentence saying the poarole hearing boartd did not care
and to them teh conviction is conviciton
and the convict just insisted he was innocent

 

[Jackolantern]

If such a person apply for citizenship, Should he insist he is innocent to USCIS or pretend he really did what as charged and show repent?

He should be as silent as possible, and present the relevant court documents. As long as the conviction is not overturned, claims of innocence will be ignored.

Note that for the crimes involving arrests or convictions, the N-400 doesn't ask if you did them. It just asks if you were arrested or convicted for them. So answering Yes to that question doesn't mean you are admitting guilt.

 

[WBH]

He should be as silent as possible, and present the relevant court documents. As long as the conviction is not overturned, claims of innocence will be ignored.

Note that for the crimes involving arrests or convictions, the N-400 doesn't ask if you did them. It just asks if you were arrested or convicted for them. So answering Yes to that question doesn't mean you are admitting guilt.

But N-400 also say you can write an explanation if you answer Yes to any of those questions so you can write that you are wrongly accused due to whatever reasons. In fact if you answer Yes to any of those questions, I can imagine USCIS IO often ask "what happened? " You just tell USCIS IO the US criminal court is greatest but mistake still happens and you are a victim of such a mistake and you can ask USCIS to do a polygraph test to trust you.

 

[WBH]

Note that for the crimes involving arrests or convictions, the N-400 doesn't ask if you did them. It just asks if you were arrested or convicted for them. So answering Yes to that question doesn't mean you are admitting guilt.

There was once a report that someone with a shoplifing charge got approved but in the interview he said the IO, a nice old lady ask him what happened
and he said"this was a very stuid thing he did".

N-400 says if you answer Yes, you need to explain. You can explain
not with your words but just provide court documents. But if you
are really innocent then you have to make choice between
(1) pretend you are really guilty and show an attitude of repent
or
(2) insist you are innnocent but risk the IO don't believe you and
consider you never repent for a crime

 

[Al Southner]

WBH,

You are on the losing side of the battle on this particular issue. Claiming innocence anywhere outside the court of law is irrelevant in the US legal system. So, if you committed a crime and are acquitted by a court of law, bring the documentation which proves your innocence to USCIS officials. USCIS officials are required to follow the law, so there is no IO who can ask you, did you really do it? Remember that "The Practice" and "Boston Legal" are meant to provoke and keep viewers interested in the next week's episodes, which means some of the scenes are outside what is acceptable legally. For example, Danny Crane grabbing women's butts will never happen in any law office, big lawsuits and disbarment from bar association for a conduct unbecoming of an officer of the court. I am a big fan of Boston Legal, but I know it offers a good show. Have you ever watched the episode when Alan Shore and Danny Crane sued the US govt? The judge asked them with a sense of incredulity, are you suing my America? They answered YES, and he said NO, how dare do you sue my America under these circumstances? No judge can offer a fair and impartial hearing while holding such views, but it makes for good television.

I would encourage anyone who has committed a crime to fight to be proven innocent by the legal system as opposed to convincing an IO with no legal training that the justice system somehow erred. We all know there are cases where people are wrongly accused and even convicted, but USCIS is and NEVER will be an appropriate forum to debate this issue. For example, what if the IO who is interviewing you, has a family member who was killed by someone in broad day light, and this person protested his innocence and was acquitted by the jury of his peers, walked free whereas his family member lied dead in the graveyard. Do you really want to convince him that you were wrongly accused? His experience will make him think otherwise and gain his ultimately revenge against the accused killer on you...

 

[WBH]

For example, what if the IO who is interviewing you, has a family member who was killed by someone in broad day light, and this person protested his innocence and was acquitted by the jury of his peers, walked free whereas his family member lied dead in the graveyard. Do you really want to convince him that you were wrongly accused? His experience will make him think otherwise and gain his ultimately revenge against the accused killer on you...

Thenb on the other hand, the IO can have his/her spouse who is totally innocent but in death row so that this IO have fully sympathy with anyone
who claim to be wrongly convicted.

 

[WBH]

if you committed a crime and are acquitted by a court of law, bring the documentation which proves your innocence to USCIS officials.

The issue is what you should say to the IO if you did not comiit any crime but wrongly convicted for a crime?

WBH,

USCIS officials are required to follow the law, so there is no IO who can ask you, did you really do it?

What law prevent the IO from asking such a question? Even if they may not
as bluntly as "Did you actually do it?", they will almost surely ask "what happened? ", "Why were you arrested?", "What did you do so that you were
charged" etc. Let's assume you tell the truth, then if you are innocent then you have to say "I di dnot do it the government made a mistake thinking I
did it" or if you really did what as charged, then how can you avoid answering such a question?

 

[Al Southner]

The issue is what you should say to the IO if you did not comiit any crime but wrongly convicted for a crime?

What law prevent the IO from asking such a question? Even if they may not
as bluntly as "Did you actually do it?", they will almost surely ask "what happened? ", "Why were you arrested?", "What did you do so that you were
charged" etc. Let's assume you tell the truth, then if you are innocent then you have to say "I di dnot do it the government made a mistake thinking I
did it" or if you really did what as charged, then how can you avoid answering such a question?

WBH,

I clearly said "USCIS is required to follow the law". I meant that if a duly appointed court of law has acquitted an individual and he has the documentation attesting to his innocence, then USCIS has no business doubting the individual. Following the law means: accepting the court's finding as a final ruling, even if there is an appeal process being pursued by prosecutor to the higher court. The IO happens to be an individual who can have his own opinions regarding your acquittal, but he has no legal basis to argue the court's finding and thereby deny your citizenship.

IO can ask why were you arrested? What happened which resulted in your arrest? He is conducting business on behalf of US govt, so he's gather facts to make a ruling on your N400 and he's required to ask those question if he so desire. I will be hard pressed to find any IO gunning to prove someone is guilty... He will be off base and clearly wrong...

 

[WBH]

WBH,

I clearly said "USCIS is required to follow the law". I meant that if a duly appointed court of law has acquitted an individual and he has the documentation attesting to his innocence, then USCIS has no business doubting the individual. :

If you trace back the thread, you'll see my original question is about what should one person do if he was innocent but was wrongly convicted not about
someone who is really guilty but got acuited.

 

[Al Southner]

If you trace back the thread, you'll see my original question is about what should one person do if he was innocent but was wrongly convicted not about
someone who is really guilty but got acuited.

That one is easy. Once you are a convicted felon, you will never ever get to apply for naturalization. Whether you are innocent or not, once the court have determined you to are guilty of a particular crime, end of the story, you are royally screwed.... You can apply from prison, but we know that you will be deported the minute you are released from prison. In short, claiming innocence in front of the IO won't happen...

As I said, claiming innocent within the USCIS system is like trying to break down the former Berlin wall with a 2 inch rock hammer. An impossible and unlikely task in my view... If I were advising immigrants, I would encourage them not to commit any crimes, until they becomes USC, then you can go wild and do whatever you want, no deportation is going to follow. However, prison will ensure you enjoy the American dream, free cell, free clothes, meals and did I mention, HBO and Showtime from prison 24/7 and 365 days? When in prison, you can smoke all the weed you eyeballs can afford...

 

[WBH]

That one is easy. Once you are a convicted felon, you will never ever get to apply for naturalization. Whether you are innocent or not, once the court have determined you to are guilty of a particular crime, end of the story, you are royally screwed.... You can apply from prison, but we know that you will be deported the minute you are released from prison. In short, claiming innocence in front of the IO won't happen...

Conviction does not have to mean felon and jail time and not all offense are deportable.

 

[Al Southner]

Conviction does not have to mean felon and jail time and not all offense are deportable.

OK...whatever you say... I am certain you can be convicted of a traffic offense and be found guilty, and that wouldn't be a felon. I am well aware of this issue. Once again, you are right and I am wrong...