Working abroad and citizenship interview

[greencarder]

Dear all,
I would really like to get your feedback about my case. I came to the US in 1992 and it took me 11 years to get my green card through the tedious asylum process. Now, and exactly 15 years after my first arrival to the US, I finally became eligible to apply for citizenship. I will do my fingerprint tomorrow and will then wait for the interview. I feel that I will face many difficulties during the interview (if I am lucky enough to have one soon). My concern stems from the fact that I am currently working for a private American enterprise in the country I was born in. Conditions have drastically changed in that country and I am no longer concerned about my safety there. I also have not visited that country during a period of 11 years and only after I was assured that things have changed. I am also one of advisors of one of the international relief organizations that help refugees in that country, and I do that for free. During the last 5 years, I was out of the US for only 280 days. The longest period was 5 months and 10 days just before I applied for the citizenship. I had to come to the US for 4 days to do my fingerprints and will go back in the weekend. You can tell how serious I am about getting my citzenship by making such a short trip to get fingerprinted. I am very worried that the IO will accuse me of not being serious in living in the US. I committed myself to work for a university in the States during the summer to circumvent this possible concern. I regularly pay my student loans and my credit card debts that I accrued during my years in grad school. What do you think? Do you feel that my application will be denied? Do you think that the officer will tell me that since I work aborad I am not eligible to be a citizen. My work there is temporary and the experience I am getting is immeasurable. Eventually, I will work in the US but I needed that opportunity so badly. Your thougths will be realy appreciated and thanks.

 

[N400Applier]

Dear all,
I would really like to get your feedback about my case. I came to the US in 1992 and it took me 11 years to get my green card through the tedious asylum process. Now, and exactly 15 years after my first arrival to the US, I finally became eligible to apply for citizenship. I will do my fingerprint tomorrow and will then wait for the interview. I feel that I will face many difficulties during the interview (if I am lucky enough to have one soon). My concern stems from the fact that I am currently working for a private American enterprise in the country I was born in. Conditions have drastically changed in that country and I am no longer concerned about my safety there. I also have not visited that country during a period of 11 years and only after I was assured that things have changed. I am also one of advisors of one of the international relief organizations that help refugees in that country, and I do that for free. During the last 5 years, I was out of the US for only 280 days. The longest period was 5 months and 10 days just before I applied for the citizenship. I had to come to the US for 4 days to do my fingerprints and will go back in the weekend. You can tell how serious I am about getting my citzenship by making such a short trip to get fingerprinted. I am very worried that the IO will accuse me of not being serious in living in the US. I committed myself to work for a university in the States during the summer to circumvent this possible concern. I regularly pay my student loans and my credit card debts that I accrued during my years in grad school. What do you think? Do you feel that my application will be denied? Do you think that the officer will tell me that since I work aborad I am not eligible to be a citizen. My work there is temporary and the experience I am getting is immeasurable. Eventually, I will work in the US but I needed that opportunity so badly. Your thougths will be realy appreciated and thanks.

Fist of all you need to speak with a qualified immigration lawyer. Most people giving advice on this forum are not laywers and can only give very general advice. I personally believe that your case is strong. Just take all documentation and explain at the interview. However, I am NOT a lawyer....

 

[baikal3]

I do think that you will have a problem with naturalization.
There are several basic difficulties with your case.

The main one is that, prior to the time of naturalization, you have to maintain your status as an LPR (legal permanent resident) in the U.S. This means that your primary place of residence and employment must be in the U.S., and that all trips abroad must be temporary in nature. It is not enough to come back to the U.S. from time to time for 2-3 weeks or even 2-3 months.
From what you wrote it seems clear that your main place of residence and employment is in your home country: "I am currently working for a private American enterprise in the country I was born in.". It sounds like your job in your home country is your primary place of employment and your summer university jobs in the U.S. are secondary ones.
It seems to me that this may cause a difficulty with you proving to the IO that you have been maintaining an LPR status up to this point.

Another issue is the requirement that at the time of filing N-400 and of naturalization you must be a resident in a particular U.S. state for at least 90 days. The word "resident" here again means maintaining your primary place of abode in that state.

Also, you are required to file federal tax returns a U.S. resident on your WORLDWIDE income, while your are an LPR. It is not clear from your post if you did that. If you did not file tax returns for some of the past years (when you had a Green Card) or if you filed as a non-resident alien (form 1040NR), this would create problems at the naturalization interview as well.

With this kind of a case talking to an immigration lawer, and maybe bringing a lawer to the interview, certainly seems advisable.

 

[greencarder]

I do think that you will have a problem with naturalization.
There are several basic difficulties with your case.

The main one is that, prior to the time of naturalization, you have to maintain your status as an LPR (legal permanent resident) in the U.S. This means that your primary place of residence and employment must be in the U.S., and that all trips abroad must be temporary in nature. It is not enough to come back to the U.S. from time to time for 2-3 weeks or even 2-3 months.
From what you wrote it seems clear that your main place of residence and employment is in your home country: "I am currently working for a private American enterprise in the country I was born in.". It sounds like your job in your home country is your primary place of employment and your summer university jobs in the U.S. are secondary ones.
It seems to me that this may cause a difficulty with you proving to the IO that you have been maintaining an LPR status up to this point.

Another issue is the requirement that at the time of filing N-400 and of naturalization you must be a resident in a particular U.S. state for at least 90 days. The word "resident" here again means maintaining your primary place of abode in that state.

Also, you are required to file federal tax returns a U.S. resident on your WORLDWIDE income, while your are an LPR. It is not clear from your post if you did that. If you did not file tax returns for some of the past years (when you had a Green Card) or if you filed as a non-resident alien (form 1040NR), this would create problems at the naturalization interview as well.

With this kind of a case talking to an immigration lawer, and maybe bringing a lawer to the interview, certainly seems advisable.

Thanks for the response, but I kept an address in the US in which I receive my bills during the 90 days prior to applying. Also, I have been permanently living in the US for the last 14 years and it is only the last 6-7 months that I have been working abroad. I am also working for an American company. I filed my taxes for the last 14 years but have not done this year yet because I am still waiting for the W2 from the company overseas. I think I should have waited for that job.

 

[equate]

I see problems with this case. There is an obvious continuous residency issue. 14 years of residence is of no consequence. Only last 5 years counts for the purpose of citizenship application. OP must provide enough evidences that he has not abandoned the residence in US. The positve is it has only been 6 months (plus the additional time until interview date) so there are some chance it won't be scrutinized over.

The second problem is OP got a green card through the refuge route but he is currently working in the very same country he claimed to be a refuge of. A common sense tells me that would be a red flag. I see there might be some explaining to do.

 

[greencarder]

I see problems with this case. There is an obvious continuous residency issue. 14 years of residence is of no consequence. Only last 5 years counts for the purpose of citizenship application. OP must provide enough evidences that he has not abandoned the residence in US. The positve is it has only been 6 months (plus the additional time until interview date) so there are some chance it won't be scrutinized over.

The second problem is OP got a green card through the refuge route but he is currently working in the very same country he claimed to be a refuge of. A common sense tells me that would be a red flag. I see there might be some explaining to do.

Like I said, conditions have drastically changed there and I also work with refugees who are temporarily residing in that country. I think you are right though. It is a huge mistake that I applied

 

[boatbod]

My $0.02...

The fundamental problem you face is that you are CURRENTLY living and working abroad, regardless of the US address that you have been maintaining. There are very few circumstances where LPRs residing abroad are allowed to file for naturalization - typically only military or some govt postings.

If you were to immediately return to the US and make it your bonafide residence (and be able to prove it), your case would probably be approved with many fewer tough questions at interview. As it is, the longer you remain working abroad, the more likely you are to break residency in the eyes of USCIS, regardless of the interval between visits to the US.

You may wish to discuss your situation with a lawyer, however I strongly suspect you'll get the same advice.

good luck.

 

[Anami]

+1 with boatbod. If you come back and start living in the US showing your previous 5-6 months outside as temporary then you have a good chance. You can always go abroad and do whatever you want after naturalization. Considering that you have been ok for the past 5 years except for the last 5-6 months consider coming back. But then I am not aware of your requirement to be in your home country. I don't think asylum issues are going to be big since you went back after a long time and after as you say "conditions have changed".

Your current state of applying while living outside the US is definitely going to make your case very difficult. Have you considered filing for N-470 that might be the saving grace.

 

[Anami]

also definitely file for a reentry permit since you may loose your green card also otherwise.

 

[Superstring]

You got a really good advice here. Boatbod and Balkai are right on the money....personally I do not think that even any lawyer would give you much different answer. You guys are so helpful - I've been looking at your posts all across the board and they are always high quality and honest assesments!!!! Thank you for your service.

I will definitelly join their camp and majority of ppl who posted here (except for N400 applier).

You have problems already and you will continue to have unless you do something about it.

If you do not act now, i.e. make up your mind in terms where do you want to live and then stick to it, you will have problems with naturalization process and slowly and surely as it seems with your PR status, too.

If you are going to live in your home country, why bother with US passport, US residency etc.? If you feel safe and secure, just stay there.....

My 2c is that you want to sit on "two chairs", and I have to tell you frankly and openly: "IT IS NOT GOING TO WORK".

If I were you, I would focus on US citizenship (after all you've lived there for 11 yrs or so!!!! you have to feel at least a bit american by now). You have much more ties to this country and you are so close to citizenship. If you've waited for 11yrs, you can wait several more months....for god's sake!!!

I feel that your current work in your home country is more of nostalgic and romantic feelings...like an easy escape from the life and responsiblities. Plus your vision is a bit blinded by the fact that you are temporary making more money by working for these international orgs than 95% of your country-man. And you feel new sense of power...

BUT, WATCH OUT!!!!!!!

I do not know from which country you are (though have an idea).....but international (aid)organizations leave their projects and they do not stay forever. Plus you will realize that great deal of them are the worst possible bureacrats and have basic problems in managing their projects. I feel that you are more there for a "warm feeling" of helping your home-country ands getting sense of power back, and you might find lot of things quite annoying.

When the fairy tale ends, you will wake up having no options. I can almost guarnatee you that your country is not going to change anytime soon. I do not know of any country who went through honest (conflict or) problems that has recovered that fast.

You are living in some sort of Disneyland rigth now.

Do the rigth thing.....ask yourself really what you want and where you want to be...stick to the decision and stop sitting on "two chairs".

P.S.: I'm not a lawyer. I'm not an immgiration expert, but just an ordinary guy. You are soley responsible for your actions.

 

[namedude]

Keep in mind inspite of the scary tales people tell you.

I spent lots of time abroad - about 1 year and 10 months total out of 10 years. There was 1 year when I was out of the US 8 months. But no trip lasted over 6 months. I passed the interview and I am a US citizen.

But I was careful a little at least.

- I had a good reason to be abroad. I had family issues.
- I had a company in the US, paid taxes when I was abroad. Had cell phone, banks accts, credit cards etc.
- Did not have a house though - but I made sure to sign agreement with a friend to lease from him. I even paid him a little bit - not sure if that was needed but still - did that. This way there was a physical residence for me at all times.
- I also applied and got reentry permit. On the reentry permit I explained my situation. But I was never asked for this at port of entry and I was not asked for this at the interview. I never volunteered to show this. Why would you? But I thought this counted in my favor.
- Obviously I filed not only company taxes but also personal taxes as a resident. I declared my worldwide income. I filed taxes with IRS when I was abroad.
- In my home country as a precaution I also identified myself as non resident and made sure not to establish significant ties there. I was never asked for this at the interview - so I am not sure if this was needed.

One thing to note that prior to interview I was physically present withoyt breaks for 10 months in the US. Actually the IO asked me at the interview for the lease agreement - she even photocopied it. I think she was trying to sniff if I really came back after the trips.

I did get a hard time when I was grilled how come my address was with a friend and I explained that there is no point in throwing away 1K per month. The purpose of this was to establish a physical residence for me - so that I have somewhere to stay at all times. Although this seemed like a weak point - she got more laid back when she found that the US company was operating while I was away.

So it seems it is all common sense. It is not that you have to be physically present in the US at all times. Just make sure you have ties to the US and you are residing in the US at all times.

Also I did get asked if I filed my taxes on time when I was abroad. Fortunately the answer was a yes. She did not check this.

I felt the interview lasted for 1 hour but my wife told me later that it only lasted for 15 mins. But when I got to a dentist for a 30 min appointment I sometimes feel like a whole day is passing by very very slowly.

With your case I am not sure. The issue is whether INS prefers for you to be back from your trips for sometime like 1 year before you apply. This way you have a better argument that your trips were temporary. If you go to work abroad then they don't know for sure if this is all temporary or completely permanent.

I am a layman and this is not advice for anyone over here.

 

[boatbod]

The issue is whether INS prefers for you to be back from your trips for sometime like 1 year before you apply. This way you have a better argument that your trips were temporary. If you go to work abroad then they don't know for sure if this is all temporary or completely permanent.

I think thats a very important point to be aware of. There is no hard and fast rule specifying how long you must be back before interview, but there is no doubt in my mind that you really must be back and be able to prove it. USCIS only naturalizes residents of the US - its up to the applicant to prove they are genuinely resident.

 

[greencarder]

Keep in mind inspite of the scary tales people tell you.

I spent lots of time abroad - about 1 year and 10 months total out of 10 years. There was 1 year when I was out of the US 8 months. But no trip lasted over 6 months. I passed the interview and I am a US citizen.

But I was careful a little at least.

- I had a good reason to be abroad. I had family issues.
- I had a company in the US, paid taxes when I was abroad. Had cell phone, banks accts, credit cards etc.
- Did not have a house though - but I made sure to sign agreement with a friend to lease from him. I even paid him a little bit - not sure if that was needed but still - did that. This way there was a physical residence for me at all times.
- I also applied and got reentry permit. On the reentry permit I explained my situation. But I was never asked for this at port of entry and I was not asked for this at the interview. I never volunteered to show this. Why would you? But I thought this counted in my favor.
- Obviously I filed not only company taxes but also personal taxes as a resident. I declared my worldwide income. I filed taxes with IRS when I was abroad.
- In my home country as a precaution I also identified myself as non resident and made sure not to establish significant ties there. I was never asked for this at the interview - so I am not sure if this was needed.

One thing to note that prior to interview I was physically present withoyt breaks for 10 months in the US. Actually the IO asked me at the interview for the lease agreement - she even photocopied it. I think she was trying to sniff if I really came back after the trips.

I did get a hard time when I was grilled how come my address was with a friend and I explained that there is no point in throwing away 1K per month. The purpose of this was to establish a physical residence for me - so that I have somewhere to stay at all times. Although this seemed like a weak point - she got more laid back when she found that the US company was operating while I was away.

So it seems it is all common sense. It is not that you have to be physically present in the US at all times. Just make sure you have ties to the US and you are residing in the US at all times.

Also I did get asked if I filed my taxes on time when I was abroad. Fortunately the answer was a yes. She did not check this.

I felt the interview lasted for 1 hour but my wife told me later that it only lasted for 15 mins. But when I got to a dentist for a 30 min appointment I sometimes feel like a whole day is passing by very very slowly.

With your case I am not sure. The issue is whether INS prefers for you to be back from your trips for sometime like 1 year before you apply. This way you have a better argument that your trips were temporary. If you go to work abroad then they don't know for sure if this is all temporary or completely permanent.

I am a layman and this is not advice for anyone over here.

thanks my friend. I am keeping a bank account and 3 credit cards. I am keeping my cell phone. I am paying my student loans every month. I am paying off my credit card. I filed my income tax return and will do the taxes for this year very soon. My work abroad is temporary and it is important for building a career but it is only one step towards it. I am working with refugees in a respectful organization. I came for 4 days just to get fingerprints and I am leaving tomorrow (FP done today). Does not that prove that I am serious about being an American? I cannot stay 10 months at this point because I need to finish the job i started. However, I will work in the States in the summer. Your response created so much relief for me so thank you so much.

 

[greencarder]

I think thats a very important point to be aware of. There is no hard and fast rule specifying how long you must be back before interview, but there is no doubt in my mind that you really must be back and be able to prove it. USCIS only naturalizes residents of the US - its up to the applicant to prove they are genuinely resident.

I agree but I think it will eventually depend on:
1. the attitude of the officer
2. The convincing argument I will make

I know for sure that I am doing this on a temporary basis and I have ample circusmtantial evidence for that, including the fact that my field has no future in my country. I know for sure that I showed enough evidence that I give a damn about being an American including making a 4-day visit to be fingerprinted. The challenge is to find a sympathetic flexible officer.

 

[happigal]

My work abroad is temporary and it is important for building a career but it is only one step towards it. I am working with refugees in a respectful organization. I came for 4 days just to get fingerprints and I am leaving tomorrow (FP done today). Does not that prove that I am serious about being an American?

Just remember this advice....what you think is seriously wanting to become American, USCIS might not see it that way. What they are looking for are people who are residing in this country and not just wanting citizenship out of convenience. They are quite serious about whether you have been out of the country for too long of a time etc. You working abroad for whatever length of time can cause red flags to USCIS and give them more ammunition to deny your application.

Ultimately, it's up to the Immigration Officer if they approve you or not.

All I'm saying is don't be surprised if USCIS deny's your case. I hope that everything will go smoothly for you and that you get approved and become a citizen.

Good luck!

 

[mant0478]

Talk to an immigration lawyer

After having said that, I have two friends that have been residing out of US for a year and half and both of them passed the interview, one of them had a discrepency with the green card dates, I think the date that was stamped on the green card was different than what was in the system, so they are straightening that out. They both work for the same consulting company that has operations in US and in India, they have letters from the company that says that they are in India temporarily and they still get their pay checks in US$ and get deposited in a US bank. So if you have a strong proof that you are there temporarily and still maintain the US address and get paid in US (if that is the case), that may be enough proof. Reading the N-400 instructions and postings in this forum I thought they would not get their citizenships but it was a cake walk for them, I am sure there are examples where people were denied in similar situations. It may depend on your luck and you may increase your chances if you take a lawyer with you to the interview.

This is my general observation/opinion regarding the advice you get in this forum

Most of the people that give advice in this forum give advice per the book, valid advice but in most cases it is very conservative and assume the worst case and because you may be thrown out of the country in the worst case, but how likely is that, I would venture to guess not a high probability.

For instance you are supposed to carry your green card all the time with you per the book and the appropriate paper work and passport when are here on a visa (F-1, H-1, H-4 , L-1, B-1 etc) but I do not know a single person that did that except when they are travelling abroad, another example is mentioning traffic tickets on N-400 app, there are lot of people that advice to put them on the app, I do not know anyone other than the members in this forum that included it on the app., I chose not to include them either on the app.

 

[Flydog]

One thing you should consider doing is that even if you are "eligible" to apply the moment you come back from abroad, wait a year or two. That will help establish your intent to reside in the US.

Bring all your docs, but also bring an attitude to the interview that is something along the lines of "now that I live in this great country, I felt an urge to help my old country *as an American*". You need to impress upon the IO that you were going as an American citizen to help folks that you were familiar with, that you weren't "going back home".

Of course, I no nothing of this - my case was *much* more straight forward. But, it is important that you be able to prove your intent to reside in the US.

 

[greencarder]

One thing you should consider doing is that even if you are "eligible" to apply the moment you come back from abroad, wait a year or two. That will help establish your intent to reside in the US.

Bring all your docs, but also bring an attitude to the interview that is something along the lines of "now that I live in this great country, I felt an urge to help my old country *as an American*". You need to impress upon the IO that you were going as an American citizen to help folks that you were familiar with, that you weren't "going back home".

Of course, I no nothing of this - my case was *much* more straight forward. But, it is important that you be able to prove your intent to reside in the US.

I agree that I need to prove my intent. I have no intentions of abandoning my privileged life as a resident of the best country in the world. I know I will convince the officer because I am very passionate about staying here and becoming an American.

 

[greencarder]

After having said that, I have two friends that have been residing out of US for a year and half and both of them passed the interview, one of them had a discrepency with the green card dates, I think the date that was stamped on the green card was different than what was in the system, so they are straightening that out. They both work for the same consulting company that has operations in US and in India, they have letters from the company that says that they are in India temporarily and they still get their pay checks in US$ and get deposited in a US bank. So if you have a strong proof that you are there temporarily and still maintain the US address and get paid in US (if that is the case), that may be enough proof. Reading the N-400 instructions and postings in this forum I thought they would not get their citizenships but it was a cake walk for them, I am sure there are examples where people were denied in similar situations. It may depend on your luck and you may increase your chances if you take a lawyer with you to the interview.

This is my general observation/opinion regarding the advice you get in this forum

Most of the people that give advice in this forum give advice per the book, valid advice but in most cases it is very conservative and assume the worst case and because you may be thrown out of the country in the worst case, but how likely is that, I would venture to guess not a high probability.

For instance you are supposed to carry your green card all the time with you per the book and the appropriate paper work and passport when are here on a visa (F-1, H-1, H-4 , L-1, B-1 etc) but I do not know a single person that did that except when they are travelling abroad, another example is mentioning traffic tickets on N-400 app, there are lot of people that advice to put them on the app, I do not know anyone other than the members in this forum that included it on the app., I chose not to include them either on the app.

Thanks for cheering me up!

 

[Superstring]

......I am sure there are examples where people were denied in similar situations. It may depend on your luck and you may increase your chances if you take a lawyer with you to the interview.....

Well, while there is luck, there is also a way how you are going about doing things.

The best cure is prevention and thinking about what is going to happen in the future if you are going to do X vs. doing Y vs. doing Z.

Hoping for the best is the lausy strategy. One should take more sophisticated approach and do the best what he/she can to be successful.

Presence of lawyer helps, but also attracts problems....It is a double sword....

This is my general observation/opinion regarding the advice you get in this forum.....Most of the people that give advice in this forum give advice per the book, valid advice but in most cases it is very conservative and assume the worst case and because you may be thrown out of the country in the worst case, but how likely is that, I would venture to guess not a high probability.

I would agree with you that lot of advice tends to be conservative. But it is right on the money and can keep you out of trouble.

People who like to be on the edge typically get in trouble (sooner or later). No one is untouchable.

In fact, I personally know an immigrant who was about to be thrown out of POE (including taking her green card) because she was outside of US for 7 months. It was a horryfing experience for her and she was hold at secondary inspection for about 3hrs. She cried the whole time and I belive that they felt sooo sorry for her. They decided to let her go but told her that she can not apply for citizenship any time soon and that they personally would mark her passport that she broke continuous residency.....

I was once taken to the secondary inspection when I told them that I was out of US for about 2 months. After 20-30 minutes questioning, I was let go. Certainly, they did not have any case against me nor I was worried, but it happened.

Prior to 9/11, these things were sort of tolerated.....However, today they are more diligently enforced.

For instance you are supposed to carry your green card all the time with you per the book and the appropriate paper work and passport when are here on a visa (F-1, H-1, H-4 , L-1, B-1 etc) but I do not know a single person that did that except when they are travelling abroad, another example is mentioning traffic tickets on N-400 app, there are lot of people that advice to put them on the app, I do not know anyone other than the members in this forum that included it on the app., I chose not to include them either on the app.

Well, that is not the same game or same risk. You are talking about different things.

#1 Probability that someone will ask for your GC on the street of NYC is pretty low. However, this probability is pretty high if you are at certain Arizona's airports at certain time. There were a number of people at this forum reporting an "incident" of being asked to produce GC.

#2 Tickets and N-400 can go both ways....I would honestly advise anyone to report them....but that is a long story and I understand that ppl have disagreements about it.

However, I know one thing.......if you report tickets, there is nothing to worry about it. If IO does not care about them, you might have actually a nice smile from him/her and sense of confidence that you are squeky clean about your application. If nothing else, you can create trust relationship with your officer..........Get a "credit" for other parts of the application.

If you do not, there is SOME chance that things might go wrong. Why a rational person would take such risk? Because, person is lazy to report them....???? That is not a good excuse for me..Sorry....That is a poor risk management strategy.

Good luck to everyone!