Unemployment for 5-year, any problem?

cgiz

Registered Users (C)
Understanding that if one has no job nor studying on schedule, the interviewing officer may ask for Affidavit of Support from the sponsoring party during the naturalization interview.

What if my dad who has been sending me money on a regular basis for 5 years? He did not sign any Affidavit of Support paperwork for me. But I have all bank transactions. I got my GC through employment but was laid off two months after getting the PR status and couldn't find work ever since. I support myself through personal savings and family financial means.

Does the above scenario create any problem for naturalization?
 
cgiz

First and foremost, having a job is not a requirement to be naturalized. Further, the immigration laws pertaining to Naturalization are not the same as the laws pertaining to obtaining a US Permanent Residency wherein you are required to submit ‘Affidavit of Support’ form (I-864) from a sponsor to prove that you won’t be a financial burden to US govt. That being said-you could still be naturalized even if you don’t work or make a very little income. However, if a person doesn’t have a visible means of income then USCIS automatically presume that such person is either working off the book (under the table) or s/he might have been involved in illegal activities like illegal gambling or drug dealing or prostitution either as a prostitute or a pimp, etc…And all these are a sign of bad character and an involvement in illegal activities. And having a good character is very important to be naturalized. Thereby, under these circumstances given the benefit of their doubts, USCIS most probably would deny N-400 for lack of moral character if a person won’t come up with a reasonable reasoning for how s/he has been supporting himself/herself in the absence of visible means of income. The burden to prove otherwise to their presumption is always carried on the shoulder of applicant.

In this scenario, applicant can present an ‘Affidavit’ from someone who can say that s/he has been supporting the applicant. This Affidavit is not called-‘Affidavit of Support’ as you above say it. Actually this is just a normal affidavit being on a simple piece of paper than of being some kind of prescribed form like I-864. Besides, there is no sponsoring party for applicant at the time of naturalization. At the time of naturalization, applicant stands by himself/herself on all grounds than having sponsors to back him/her up. You can also show the bank statements if you were having enough money there to support yourself. And you can surely submit the receipts of all the money transfers that your dad made when he sent money to you. The bottom line is you need to come up with some documentary evidences than your own empty words. Hence, you having said that you are supporting yourself thru personal savings and family financial help means nothing to USCIS until you submit/show them documentary evidences to prove your position on it, otherwise you should not wonder if they would presume otherwise about you and would deny your N-400. And, you would also need to make sure that you have been receiving enough money from your dad or were having enough money in your bank during the time when you did not work to prove that such money was enough to maintain an average lifestyle in the US. Suppose, your dad has been sending you $500 a month, it might not be enough for Adjudication officer to get convinced that you are living on this money alone. Thereby, officer might think otherwise and would deny your N-400. Don’t try to give a run-around to me on it. You would really need to come up with a reasonable figure and a reasonable answer on it. Pay attention here-“reasonable”.

Unless you will be interviewed by a very good and kind officer or a very stupid one, you would surely run the risk of being asked all kind of questions during your N-400 interview about why you are not working for that long. And it might also be possible that you might run the risk of loosing your Permanent Residency. Because, anyone including adjudication officer would wonder why you are here if you are not working for the last 5 yrs especially when the only reason for you to have given the opportunity to stay here is just because of employment purpose. It is not like you were given the opportunity to stay here because of family or something else, wherein you can say that you have other reason to stay here. Were you given the privilege to stay in US just to live here without working? You know that you are actually allowed to stay here just because of your job, which you are not doing for the last 5 yrs. If your unemployment situation would have been only temporary then I could understand it, but being unemployed for 5 yrs is beyond anyone’s imagination.

And, no matter how many explanations you would give here on this forum for you not having worked for 5 yrs, nothing would justify. No fools here. Just remember that. I could understand if you were not able to get the job in your line/field for that long, but I can never understand why you were not able to get the work in other fields even if it would have been for time being only. Tell me why USCIS should not revoke your Permanent Residency when you are not working for that long particularly when you were granted the Residency at first place because of your service in your work? If I were to be an adjudication officer, I would revoke your green card within a second and would place you on deportation. Millions of skilled and hard working people are waiting to migrate here from across the world. You might be thinking something else to come up with, and I also know that I might sound very harsh on it, but if you see a big picture of your situation then you would realize that I am right about your situation.

Your situation would anyway most definitely raise the eyebrow of USCIS when they would see that you were laid off SUDDENLY after two months later of obtaining your green card. In case if you don’t know, it is the job of USCIS to try to detect immigration fraud during Naturalization process. And they pay very close attention during naturalization if an alien who obtained LPR based upon employment basis but left/laid off from his/her job so shortly after obtaining LPR, or if an alien obtains LPR based upon marrying to a US citizen, but got divorced shortly after obtaining LPR. You can give all the explanations here on this, but it won’t help. Instead, you would need to prepare yourself to convince USCIS otherwise. Because they will surely question your eligibility/motive in obtaining LPR, I can bet on it.

Though it is not my business why you are not working for that long, but based upon my experience, I have kinda hunch on it. Either you are working under the table to avoid taxes, or you are involved in gambling since a lot of people are doing it to make easy and fast money especially no taxes are paid on it if you win on table games since no track of earning on table games, or you are being supported by your girlfriend since many men are being fully supported by their girlfriend. No need to explain anything especially when I gave only my hunch on it than telling a sure thing.

Good Luck.
 
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cgiz said:
Understanding that if one has no job nor studying on schedule, the interviewing officer may ask for Affidavit of Support from the sponsoring party during the naturalization interview.

What if my dad who has been sending me money on a regular basis for 5 years? He did not sign any Affidavit of Support paperwork for me. But I have all bank transactions. I got my GC through employment but was laid off two months after getting the PR status and couldn't find work ever since. I support myself through personal savings and family financial means.

Does the above scenario create any problem for naturalization?

It's better to take the affidavit of supp form with you. Why can't you just ask you dad? If he's so generous as to keep sending money to you, he should have no problem signing a piece of paper! The bank statement could be a useful supplement, but it doesn't show your dad's name, does it?

I think, based on what I read here and elsewhere, the possible problem in your case is that you left your GC sponsoring employer soon after the receipt of your GC. For the interview, you should bring the layoff letter, to be ready to show, if asked, that it wasn't your decision to leave the company..
 
JohnnyCash said:
. Thereby, under these circumstances given the benefit of their doubts, USCIS most probably would deny N-400 for lack of moral character if a person won’t come up with a reasonable reasoning for how s/he has been supporting himself/herself in the absence of visible means of income. The burden to prove otherwise to their presumption is always carried on the shoulder of applicant.

.
Good Elaborate explanation of above.
What happens in these situations. ?Any idea pl.
1)A person whoworked for two years out of five years and applying for nat.
and has savings to live and above poverty limits/annum limit.
2)A person who worked only for 5 months got some kind of huge state lotto.
and deicided not to work further years.Apply for nat.Will it come under gambling and his application will be denied?
 
Participant said:
Good Elaborate explanation of above.
What happens in these situations. ?Any idea pl.
1)A person whoworked for two years out of five years and applying for nat.
and has savings to live and above poverty limits/annum limit.
2)A person who worked only for 5 months got some kind of huge state lotto.
and deicided not to work further years.Apply for nat.Will it come under gambling and his application will be denied?

for the #2, that person needs to pay for the state tax. it should not be a problem and the application should not be denied. yes, it will come under gambling, but s/he also requires to pay tax, therefore, it should be ok.

for the #1, the person just has to show the documents about amt of the saving he had and proof it was about poverty limits.

i guess everything comes to a point which it is "to prove what a person claims is valid".

if a person says he has tons of $$ in the bank bc he made $$ from the stock market previously, he just has to show the bank statement, and the tax he files for the stock gain... etc
 
cgiz said:
I support myself through personal savings and family financial means.

Does the above scenario create any problem for naturalization?

I guess so. JohnnyCash already elaborated that. I assume you and your parents are wealthy enough to support you for 5 years without job. In that case I guess green card thru invenstment (EB5 category) would have been safer option for you. But obviously that one has requirements and conditions too.
 
I think some people did not realize that this chap has TWO underlying problems. The first one is about him being unemployed for the last 5 yrs, which is not that big problem though if he can come up with something reasonable. And the second one is about him having laid off very shortly after obtaining LPR even though it wasn't his fault, but it would sure seem a immigration fraud. Every alien in this situation say the same thing that they had no intention to quit the job or they were unfairly got laid off, etc.., but no matter what- this situation is seemed to be a immigration fraud to USCIS.

And people should also understand that there is no any criteria for an income like above or below the poverty line at the time of naturalization, instead USCIS just want to get convinced how a person is supporting himself/herself in the absense of visible income. That is. They are not saying that you have to have income upto certain level or should have worked for whole 5 yrs instead of only 2 months or 2 yrs. I mean- if someone has money in the bank whether this money comes from winning a lotto or thru someone as a gift or from the previous job or from saving for a long time then a person would be okay so long s/he can show that he has money to support himself than having nothing. By the way, lotto is not a gambling. And a gambling is legal so long it is not illegal gambling like some people play in home or operate places without licenses. Of course, a person doesn't need to work if s/he has money but s/he needs to show the proof of having money to the officer to prove that s/he is being able to support himself/herself without visible income because s/he has money.

I remember a case wherein a person went to citizenship interivew wearing an expensive suit and very expensive watch and nice colonge, but he had mentioned on his application that he did not work for a long time. Officer got suspecious about how he could maintain that kind of lifestyle when he wasn't working for a long time. Officer asked him how he was supporting himself. He answered that he was being supported by his family and friends, but officer did not buy his story since he did not show any evidence from them. Officer denied his application, and placed his case for field investigation. During the course of investigation, it was found that he was involved in pimping women for living.
 
Unemployment for 5-year, any problem? Yes!

The real question is what are you doing here, what happens when your means of support ends (probably will happen). How are you going to support yourself, I'm sure the USCIS will assume some kind of illegal activity.
I'm not saying for a second that is what I believe, but I'm sure they USCIS will ask that question.
 
I guess the situation will depend on how the interviewing officer treat my situation.

Where can I obtain the Affidavit of Support form? My dad will be more than happy to sign it for me.

Many people are curious why I haven't found anything during the past 5 years. All I can tell you is I got the greatest hit in the Silicon Valley with the burst of IT bubble! It's not unusal to see someone with over 10-year experience being jobless for several years. But on the other hand, I simply don't want to find a McDonald job with min. pay where I can't use what I learn with my skill set.
 
cgiz said:
IBut on the other hand, I simply don't want to find a McDonald job with min. pay where I can't use what I learn with my skill set.

1. Taking money from dad.
2. Working at MacD in min wage.

I just wonder which one is more honorable! :rolleyes:
 
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cgiz said:
But on the other hand, I simply don't want to find a McDonald job with min. pay where I can't use what I learn with my skill set.

i believe it is the main reason.

some people would do anything (legally) for a living. someone just do not do the low level job because they think they deserve more. etc etc
 
cgiz said:
It's not unusal to see someone with over 10-year experience being jobless for several years.

I doubt. I live in sillicon valley. It's a fact that many lost jobs. But all the people I know who had hard time to get another job in same fields, they changed their professions. I know people who became project managers to teachers (part time/full time), or real estate agents (real estate business is pretty good in this area), or taking jobs in Indian BPO companies and doing back-and-forth.
 
cgiz said:
It's not unusal to see someone with over 10-year experience being jobless for several years.

for a year or so, yes, i think it is not unusal. however, for several years? something wrong of the person anyway.

i am glad you are not taking the unemployment benefit because someone might really need that.
 
Unemployment/Collecting Disability/ has nothing to do with Citizenship. In a nutshell the only requirements are

a) Continous Residence, Physical Presence
b) Clean Record, Good Moral Character
c) Approx $400 fee!
d) Patience!!!!
THATS IT!
 
cgiz

“Where can I obtain the Affidavit of Support form?”

Have you not read what I said earlier that there is no such form for Naturalization purpose? You should read my posting again, but pay attention this time. I assume you are more than 30 yrs old since you said that you have experience over 10 yrs in your field of work. But then I really wonder how you cannot even comprehend a simple information that was given to you earlier. I’m only 29 yrs old and I don’t miss such a simple information. It’s not about being wise; instead I leaned to read carefully and attentively before asking the same thing over and over.


“My dad will be more than happy to sign it for me.”

Here we go again. Daddy’s little boy!!! When would you learn to live by your own without depending on your Daddy?


“I simply don't want to find a McDonald job with min. pay”

Your this comment really made me to wonder how some people could be that shallow. What is more important to you-depending on your daddy’s money that he might have earned with his hard work or earning your own as honorable money particularly when you are an adult? And since you are unable to find a job in your field for the last 5 yrs then would you still remain in this country for your whole life on the expense of your dad if you would not find a job in your so called-“Silicon Valley”? Did you bother to think to move to other places in the search of job as you have been unable to find a job in your field in "Silicon Valley"? Do you think it is morally okay for an adult to live without work AND depend on parents? Even a millionaire does something to generate income then why not you? Do you think US govt. should continue allow you to live here without working for that long especially when you were given the privilege to live here based upon employment basis? They would assume that you used your previous employment just to obtain LPR, otherwise they would wonder why you did not bother to work for that long.

If you would have been unemployed only for couple of months or for 1 yrs then people could understand your situation, but for 5 yrs!!!!!!!!!!!. You’ve got to be kidding. Like I said-no fools are here. There must be something that you don't want to tell here, but I've already said about my hunch on it.To be honest, you have been lucky so far because you haven’t come in the radar of USCIS as of yet, but you would surely come to their attention at the time of naturalization if you don’t find a job very soon. It doesn’t matter what kind of job, so long you have a job. How do you expect officer to be satisfied with your story when it is shown very clearly that a male, a healthy one is not working for such a long time? Not as a legal point of view, but as a moral point of view, adjudication officer would question your character and motive of being living in this country. If you have plan to live on your daddy’s money then in my honest opinion without any offense to you that it would be better for you to live in your country with your parents particularly when you can remain close to your loved-ones.

To me- I would rather work in a McDonald on a minimum wage than depending on someone else to take care of me. I don’t know why but it gives me a great satisfaction to know that I earn such money by my sweat and hard work. Nor I’m ashamed to do anything so long I would be making an honest living. Matter of fact, I’ve done all kind of jobs in my life. I remember selling Newspapers on the streets of New York City when I was very young just to go to school and to take care of myself. In those days, snow used to be up to 4’-5’ during wintertime. I also worked as a ‘babysitter’, waiter, grass-chopper, housecleaner, sale persons at Dunkin Donut for $ 1/hr even though minimum wage was $3.15/hr at that time, and I also worked at other jobs that came in my way to make an honest living to survive myself than depending on my parents or someone else. Just you to know that my parents were/are multimillionaire in US dollars. I could have asked them any kind of help very easily particularly when I’m the eldest son in the family. They love me very dearly and would still do anything for me. But I did not want to ask anything from them, and wanted to grow up by my own. They used to live in other State, so obviously they never knew what I did to survive and to go to school. I never told them even though they asked me about it many times.

It wasn’t easy for me in the beginning, trust me. I encountered all kinds of problems and obstacles in these jobs like anyone else. Since I was very cute when I was young especially when I never worked anything even in my home, and my face and hands were like very soft and clean, which made some people to think to take advantage of me. While selling newspapers to make only 5 cents per newspaper, I was approached by many gay men who wanted to take the advantage of my situation. Of course, they were disappointed when I called the cops on them for making sexual advances on a minor. Also, there were many “matured” and very rich single women in uptown Manhattan who wanted me to be their “toy boy”. And there were also many homeless black people who used to beat me on the street and used to steal my newspapers. Though I called police on them, but they always used to get away before Police used to come. I also had difficult times in handling those odd jobs because I was not used to do those kinds of jobs. So obviously, I did not come to the expectations of my employers in the beginning. The most challenging job was doing a babysitting for two young girls-5 and 9 yrs old. Now, I’m doing thing other than what I’ve skilled for. But I enjoy and have no complaint in my life.

If I would have thought something bad about odd jobs like you did then I would not have worked those odd jobs at first place especially when I never even warmed a cup of water myself for a tea or I never boiled even an egg myself before. My family raised me like a flower. They pampered me with all kind of love and caring. I had people in my house who used to work for us like driver, cook and housekeeper. But then I worked myself as a housekeeper here in NYC for others. But I’m not ashamed of what I did as I did not rob anyone by doing those odd jobs. Instead I made an honest money/living with dignity. I’m actually proud of what I did because it gave me a lot of experiences in the life as well as it has made me a strong person inside. Life is not all about having proud or having things easily. And certainly life is not always as easy as we think. Life is a challenge. It has its ups and downs. Sometimes you feel very down, while other times up. Perhaps, that is the beauty of it.

Like I said previously that you can still be naturalized without having any employment so long you can come up with a reasonable answer on how you have been supporting yourself in the absence of visible means of income. But I do believe strongly that you do need to grow up a little bit if not whole. Hopefully, you would understand what I mean.

Good Luck.
 
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johnnyCash

take it easy and i totally agree of what you said.

i find out it is hard to believe someone cannot find a job in United States. It is not they can't find a job, but it is like they do not want to find a job.
 
JoeF said:
American friends of mine have been unemployed for a year, but that was mainly because they didn't want to move out of the SoCal area...
Looking outside the immediate vicinity speeds up getting a new job quite a bit.
Anyway, being unemployed for 5 years in the IT industry pretty much means that you won't get a job again there, because technology moves on rather quickly (of course, unless you stay involved with the IT world, e.g., by participating in Open Source developments.)
Another possibility would be to go back to college and get another degree. I know several people who did that after the dot-com crash.

I have been out of consulting world for just 1 year, even thought I am still in the IT field. I do not even know if I can get back to the consulting world again. Things change so quick and if you just let go for year(s), you are not going to catch it up.
 
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