LC substitution - I140/CP option

K

kppr

Registered Users (C)
kd, Raju and other knowledgeble folks;

Here is the scenario;

I was recently laid off by company A and have less than a year left on my total H1 period of 6 years. Company A did not apply for my GC (another painful story...). So, now that I have < 1 year left on H1, I was on the lookout for a company with approved labor and fortunately found one, say company B. This new company B has an approved labor that was filed for someone in year 2000 with requirements of Bachelor degree + 1 year experience.

Now, I have a masters degree in US (passed out in May 98) with a total of 5+ years experience until now and am wanting to find out whether this would cause any problem in;

1) substitution of labor - by when do I approximately come to know that there will not be any problems?

2) At what stage of GC does EB2/EB3 etc. come in to picture? I.e. at the time of Labor filing or I140 filing?

3) If it comes into picture during the filing of I140 then, what category should I file under considering the above scenario, i.e. EB2 because I have MS and 5 yrs experience or EB3 because the original labor is Bachelor and 1 Yr. experience?

4) Also, as a sub question of #3 above, what would be the pros and cons of filing under any one of these categories if I am eligible to file for either (i.e. EB2 or EB3)?
 
kppr:

1) substitution of labor - by when do I approximately come to know that there will not be any problems?
Answer: As late as when your I-140 is taken up for further process/ approval is when you MAY get an RFE. Double check my response by posting on murthy.com chat on monday nights from 9-10 pm EST.
==============================================
2) At what stage of GC does EB2/EB3 etc. come in to picture? I.e. at the time of Labor filing or I140 filing?
Answer: I-140.
==============================================
3) If it comes into picture during the filing of I140 then, what category should I file under considering the above scenario, i.e. EB2 because I have MS and 5 yrs experience or EB3 because the original labor is Bachelor and 1 Yr. experience?
Answer: EB3. BTW...what service center?
==============================================
4) Also, as a sub question of #3 above, what would be the pros and cons of filing under any one of these categories if I am eligible to file for either (i.e. EB2 or EB3)?
Answer: Not big difference between EB2 vs EB3 currently.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Originally posted by kppr
kd, Raju and other knowledgeble folks;

Here is the scenario;

I was recently laid off by company A and have less than a year left on my total H1 period of 6 years. Company A did not apply for my GC (another painful story...). So, now that I have < 1 year left on H1, I was on the lookout for a company with approved labor and fortunately found one, say company B. This new company B has an approved labor that was filed for someone in year 2000 with requirements of Bachelor degree + 1 year experience.

Now, I have a masters degree in US (passed out in May 98) with a total of 5+ years experience until now and am wanting to find out whether this would cause any problem in;

{THIS IS IMPORTANT. At the time of filing the LC you should
have had the Bachelor's degree and the 1 year experience}

1) substitution of labor - by when do I approximately come to know that there will not be any problems?

{You will know for sure when your I-140 is approved}

2) At what stage of GC does EB2/EB3 etc. come in to picture? I.e. at the time of Labor filing or I140 filing?

{At the time of filing the I-140 and obviously follows the
content of the LC}

3) If it comes into picture during the filing of I140 then, what category should I file under considering the above scenario, i.e. EB2 because I have MS and 5 yrs experience or EB3 because the original labor is Bachelor and 1 Yr. experience?

{I feel the I-140 follows the LC and would be EB3 and not
EB2. This is from my personal experience. I have a masters
degree but the LC I used was for a person who only had
a Bachelor's. So the case was EB3}}

4) Also, as a sub question of #3 above, what would be the pros and cons of filing under any one of these categories if I am eligible to file for either (i.e. EB2 or EB3)?
Click to expand...
 
Thank you Gentlemen (kd and Raju).

Really appreciate your prompt comments/suggestions.

A couple more as follows;

1) kd, the service center will be VSC.

2) Any idea on whether they check my background experience (by calling the person mentioned in the experience letter), on whether I really have the experience mentioned in “substituted labor”? If so, what if that person is no longer with that company?

The reason for question 2 above, is that the approved labor is in the networking field and I have not worked on the technologies mentioned in labor. I briefly spoke to the lawyer and he said that as long as I can get an experience letter from the company that I worked "before the labor is approved" stating the technologies mentioned in the approved labor, it should be fine.

I can get an experience letter from a collegue of mine who can write me such a letter. We both joined the firm together but he quit after a year of joining and I continued for another year. The question is how detailed can the enquiry be as that person now works elsewhere. Are the inquiries directed to the company or the person who wrote the experience letter? because that person is no longer with that firm.

Again, just to recap, the approved labor is Bachelor + 1 Year experience.

3) What process is recommended in this scenario? i.e. I140/CP (preferred) or I140/485 concurrent filing?

3) If I opt for CP, then, do you anticipate any problems, considering the above scenario? i.e. any complications with LC substitution of someone whose initial labor was approved with minimal qualification and experience ( Bachelor + 1 yr exp.) and me having a lot more education and experience?

Sorry for posting such a lengthy query but your inputs are very valuable and will be appreciated immensely.

Again, Thanks a ton.
 
kppr:

NOTE: I made one change in my answer. There was a typo with my answer to question 3 above. The Answer is EB3 as raju said...I hit the wrong key on my keyboard initially. I changed it to EB2.
==============================================

1) kd, the service center will be VSC.

Answer: EB2 is taking about 14 months for approval and EB3 about 12 months assuming there is no RFE. With RFE, add another 60-90 days!
==============================================

2) Any idea on whether they check my background experience (by calling the person mentioned in the experience letter), on whether I really have the experience mentioned in “substituted labor”? If so, what if that person is no longer with that company?

Answer: Not always do they contact but since this is a substitute labor there is a higher chance but anytime before your I-140 approval.
==============================================

The reason for question 2 above, is that the approved labor is in the networking field and I have not worked on the technologies mentioned in labor. I briefly spoke to the lawyer and he said that as long as I can get an experience letter from the company that I worked "before the labor is approved" stating the technologies mentioned in the approved labor, it should be fine. I can get an experience letter from a collegue of mine who can write me such a letter. We both joined the firm together but he quit after a year of joining and I continued for another year. The question is how detailed can the enquiry be as that person now works elsewhere. Are the inquiries directed to the company or the person who wrote the experience letter? because that person is no longer with that firm.

Answer: I know a lot of people do this and lawyer in some cases ask the candidates to lie about the technologies but this is not right TECHNICALLY! It is okay if the person mentioned in the letter is no longer with the company specified as long as he/ she can concur with every word mentioned in your letter of experience. Again the question is if your friend left the company before you did how can he confidently say he knows your technical skills? How will you answer this RFE if you get it? Remember you may need to carry the same experience certificates at the time of 485/ cp interview....
==============================================

3) What process is recommended in this scenario? i.e. I140/CP (preferred) or I140/485 concurrent filing?

Answer: 485 taking 2.5-3 years from time of 485 application and CP about 6-8 months after I-140 approval. CP is normally a prefered choice if job is secured until cp interview date, no out-of-status issues exceeding 180 days, no contagious medical history, no criminal record in any country after the age of 16. Research more on this site before deciding.
==============================================

4) If I opt for CP, then, do you anticipate any problems, considering the above scenario? i.e. any complications with LC substitution of someone whose initial labor was approved with minimal qualification and experience ( Bachelor + 1 yr exp.) and me having a lot more education and experience?

Answer: Problems (if any) at cp interview stage come bcoz of the reasons mentioned in answer to question 3 (10-15 lines above). Issue with your experience may show up (if at all) during your I-140 processing.
 
Kd,

So, as per your reply, I will have to carry my experience letters etc. at CP interview (and may be necessary even at 485, if I opt to go for it.). Lets say, once I140 is cleared and I get an interview for CP. Question is do they check again in Bombay on past experience as mentioned in the experience letter? or it is done only during the I140 stage here?

Please pardon me for asking such stupid questions but, If the experience letter only carries importance during I140 stage, why is it required during CP or say, I-485?

Also, further to the question below, although my friend left that firm before me (after one year, whereas I was there for 2 years), he can still write me an experience letter for me for that "1 year" he spent there and the labor also requires only 1 year of experience. So, in that case, would'nt this work? What do you think?

And, if they do query, which as you said the chances are higher since this is a substitution of labor, do they query the person directly or they call the company and ask to speak to that person? as I mentioned before, he works elsewhere now. Any idea, what happens in this scenario?

Does the experience letter need to have company address or just the company logo is good enough?

Is it really required to have a company experience letter (with company logo, address etc.) or it is ok to get an affidavit from this friend I mentioned?

Thanks kd, really appreciate your inputs on this.
 
Originally posted by kppr
Kd,

{I am sure kd would offer his view on this. I also would like
to put in my thoughts}

So, as per your reply, I will have to carry my experience letters etc. at CP interview (and may be necessary even at 485, if I opt to go for it.). Lets say, once I140 is cleared and I get an interview for CP. Question is do they check again in Bombay on past experience as mentioned in the experience letter? or it is done only during the I140 stage here?

{I can understand your concern in this matter. While we
do not know the actual process of how these letters are
validated, the normal assumption is once the I-140 is
approved the Consulate may not re-visit this issue. But
you need to carry the documents that were the basis for
the I-140}

Please pardon me for asking such stupid questions but, If the experience letter only carries importance during I140 stage, why is it required during CP or say, I-485?

{This is simple, if a material fact is wrong the Agency can
always reverse its decision based on such fact. As I said
earlier the Consulate may not dig into your experience
at the time of interview.

Whenever there is a slight weakness in the case this type
of concerns haunt the candidate, and he/she can only hope
for the best}

Also, further to the question below, although my friend left that firm before me (after one year, whereas I was there for 2 years), he can still write me an experience letter for me for that "1 year" he spent there and the labor also requires only 1 year of experience. So, in that case, would'nt this work? What do you think?

{This is a point which can raise up during the I-140 approval.
You just have to wait and see whether they are convinced
by the letters or not. I do not know in what shape and style
you got this letter from your friend. That matters.

Ex: Your friend can give a letter on the letter head of the
company he is working for right now, clearly mentioning
that you and him were colleagues at such and such place
and he personally knew you and the areas you were working
on ...... He should also mention the exact position held by
you, by him, your start date, end date etc. }

And, if they do query, which as you said the chances are higher since this is a substitution of labor, do they query the person directly or they call the company and ask to speak to that person? as I mentioned before, he works elsewhere now. Any idea, what happens in this scenario?

{We can only speculate. None of my earlier companies got
any phone calls from INS}

Does the experience letter need to have company address or just the company logo is good enough?

{Question not clear. Is this the letter head of the company
your friend is currently with OR the letterhead of the earlier
company??.

}

Is it really required to have a company experience letter (with company logo, address etc.) or it is ok to get an affidavit from this friend I mentioned?

Thanks kd, really appreciate your inputs on this.
Click to expand...

{my responses}

Raju
 
kppr:

My answers would be no different than raju's. I totally concur with raju. Dont get stressed out about 'what if'. Try to get the letters on that company letter head but since the person who is giving you the letter is now with another company he/ she can give the experience letter on his/ her current company letterhead or his own person letterhead. Bottom line is it should explain your experience so as to clarify any doubts that USCIS/ consulate may have.
 
Kd and Raju,

Thanks a milllion to both of you, really appreciate your thoughts on this.

BTW, clarifiation for Raju -

"Does the experience letter need to have company address or just the company logo is good enough?

{Question not clear. Is this the letter head of the company
your friend is currently with OR the letterhead of the earlier
company??. "

What I meant is that whether the experience letter need to have address and/or logo of my earlier company. But, I guess, its pretty clear to me now as you mentioned that my friend can write me an experience letter on his "current company letterhead" about my experience with previous company.

All my questions are answered, Once again, thank you gentlemen.

Out of curiosity though, and although my case is genuine about my friend having actually worked with me in the earlier company, but it then seems that anybody can write an experience letter for anybody, is'nt it? (as the letterhead of actual company where one worked is not an absolute must).

Thanks again.
 
kppr:

Out of curiosity though, and although my case is genuine about my friend having actually worked with me in the earlier company, but it then seems that anybody can write an experience letter for anybody, is'nt it? (as the letterhead of actual company where one worked is not an absolute must).

Answer: Theoretically yes anyone can give this letter. Whether it is immigration or otherwise in life, when one tells one lie then a number of lies have to follow and it is never possible to keep up with lies.

A word of advice: It does not make sense to lie about something as simple as work experience. What happens if USCIS decides to cross verify which I am not sure how they would but just in case that happens then that person along with the person who forged the experience letter can be in deep trouble!
 
Originally posted by kppr
Kd and Raju,

Out of curiosity though, and although my case is genuine about my friend having actually worked with me in the earlier company, but it then seems that anybody can write an experience letter for anybody, is'nt it? (as the letterhead of actual company where one worked is not an absolute must).

{Though it may look like that, you should note that experience
letters are just one part of the story. If there was fraud and
if it was suspected it would be easy to establish the facts
by referring to the pay stubs, W-2s etc.

The person who takes such risks knows that
and worries about them }

Thanks again.
Click to expand...

{my responses}

Raju
 
LC Substition - I140/485/EAD and CP question

KD1403 and Raju

Quick question guys, and again, really appreciate your response on this.

The scenario is as follows;

I have a project with a major financial firm. I am planning to go with a subsitition of labor with company A. Now, there is a strong possibility that this financial firm will give me a fulltime offer few months from now. Hence, to take this opportunity I am opting to apply for I140/485/EAD together along with labor substitution with the company A and wait for I140 to get approved after which I can join the financial firm on EAD, if they agree to wait till then.

However, if they dont give me an offer, I would prefer to go the CP route after I140 approval (i.e. AC-140 etc...). My question is whether this is possible? In other words, after having applied for I140/485/EAD/AP concurrently, can I still opt for a transfer to CP route after I140 is approved?

and if possible, what would be an approximate time frame before which I get called for an interview?

I would appreciate your reply.

Thanks
 
KD, Raju,

I have been eagerly waiting for an answer for many days and you guys are always so prompt in replying.

Please guys, whats the matter? I really hope I have not offended any one of you in any way at all. Once again, I would very much appreciate your reply to this.

-Kppr
 
kppr:

However, if they dont give me an offer, I would prefer to go the CP route after I140 approval (i.e. AC-140 etc...). My question is whether this is possible? In other words, after having applied for I140/485/EAD/AP concurrently, can I still opt for a transfer to CP route after I140 is approved?

Answer: Yes you can file I-140 with 485 concurrent based on labor subsitution and on I-140 approval you can change to AC I-140 provided you are with the sponsoring company. But only certain consulates allow AC I-140 which is a process where you do 485 then change mind to do CP by filing I-824 and based on I-824 receipt (not approval) and other documents that form the AC I-140 packet you can pursue consular process.

Let us know what consulate you fall under or find out if your consulate accepts AC I-140. If it does not accept AC I-140 then if you have 485 going and want to change to CP then you will have to wait for I-824 approval which is currently taking anywhere from 9-12 months and on its approval you can follow the traditional CP process which takes about 6 months.
 
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Re: LC Substition - I140/485/EAD and CP question

Originally posted by kppr
KD1403 and Raju

Quick question guys, and again, really appreciate your response on this.

The scenario is as follows;

I have a project with a major financial firm. I am planning to go with a subsitition of labor with company A. Now, there is a strong possibility that this financial firm will give me a fulltime offer few months from now. Hence, to take this opportunity I am opting to apply for I140/485/EAD together along with labor substitution with the company A and wait for I140 to get approved after which I can join the financial firm on EAD, if they agree to wait till then.

{So you want to have your GC Process with Company A, on
their substituted LC and get their H1 first.

After this you want to go and work for this Financial firm. After
you have spent the required 180 days with Company A then
you want to leave Company A and join the F. Firm on your
EAD.

This is possible. Correct me if I was wrong}

However, if they dont give me an offer, I would prefer to go the CP route after I140 approval (i.e. AC-140 etc...). My question is whether this is possible? In other words, after having applied for I140/485/EAD/AP concurrently, can I still opt for a transfer to CP route after I140 is approved?

{I assume your question is after having applied for 140/485/EAD with Company A, can you change it to CP with the
same company? . Then the answer is 'Yes'.

But you should be able to carry an employment verification
letter from Company A to the interview, and after coming back
with Visa you are expected to join Company A and not the
Financial Firm. You can keep working for this F. firm but you
would remain on the rolls of Company A}

and if possible, what would be an approximate time frame before which I get called for an interview?

{I do not know what you plan on doing so I would not know
what to say about the time frame}

I would appreciate your reply.

Thanks
Click to expand...

{my responses}


Raju
 
KD, Raju,

Thanks much guys, really appreciate it.

KD - I am from Gujarat and hence would fall under Mumbai consulate.

Raju - Your first assumption is correct and I got my answer, however, for the second one, my question is as follows;

As you are saying that I need an employment verification letter from Company A to take with me to the interview in mumbai, but upon my return with permanent visa stamped, why do I still have to be on the rolls with Company A and not join F. Firm fulltime?

Is there any time frame before which I can join F.Firm full time?

For the last question, what I meant is that having initially applied for I140/485/EAD etc., (the only reason to do this is so that I dont miss out the full time opportunity that this firm may offer me, which I could only accept if I am on EAD) once I get I140 approved, and then opting to switch for CP, how long will it be before I get called for an visa interview ?

Also, whether having applied for EAD along with 140/485 will create any problems when opting to transfer to CP or not.

Again, your answers and time are very much appreciated.

Thanks a ton.
 
Originally posted by kppr
KD, Raju,

Thanks much guys, really appreciate it.

KD - I am from Gujarat and hence would fall under Mumbai consulate.

Raju - Your first assumption is correct and I got my answer, however, for the second one, my question is as follows;

As you are saying that I need an employment verification letter from Company A to take with me to the interview in mumbai, but upon my return with permanent visa stamped, why do I still have to be on the rolls with Company A and not join F. Firm fulltime?

{A good question ! Let us look at the basics. For you to get
the GC the sponsoring company is telling the INS that for
a particular position you are the only suitable person and
hense you may be given a Permanent Resident status, so
that you can join them and work for them.

So the premise is that once you are given the Immigrant
visa you are supposed to join the sponsoring company}

Is there any time frame before which I can join F.Firm full time?

{There is no specified time frame. At the time of getting your
Green Card you should have the intent of joining the
sponsor. However you can change your mind later and a
safe period professed by several is a minimum of 6 months
with the sponsor.

However if the sponsoring company itself lays you off before
that , then you can join other company }

For the last question, what I meant is that having initially applied for I140/485/EAD etc., (the only reason to do this is so that I dont miss out the full time opportunity that this firm may offer me, which I could only accept if I am on EAD) once I get I140 approved, and then opting to switch for CP, how long will it be before I get called for an visa interview ?

{ If you have got EAD and used it to join the Financial Firm,
then how would you take the employment letter from
Company A ? Have you not given up your job with them?.

I think , by using the EAD you have made the decision to
stick with the 485 process }



Also, whether having applied for EAD along with 140/485 will create any problems when opting to transfer to CP or not.

{As long as you have not made use of the EAD and remained
with Company A then, you can change your mind and
go for the CP process by filing the Form I-824 and going
for the AC 140 }

Again, your answers and time are very much appreciated.

Thanks a ton.
Click to expand...

{my responses}

Raju
 
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