I want my social security tax money back!!

sigh007

Registered Users (C)
Seems like no body cares about legal immigrants, then I don't see why we should contribute our share in the social security tax pool prior of being a GC holder. It's just so ridiculous to go through this whole retrogression fieasco especially it may take years to resolve, at the rate it's going now.

I've been patiently waiting for my GC for too long. It's not right to be treated this way. Can't understand why they lump legal immigrants stuff into the same bill as illegal immigrants'. I'd like to get my money back since my equal contribution is so insignificant. Anyone knows if there is any way that we could get our social security tax money back?
 
this has been discussed on this forum in the past......it is not possible unless our home country has a tax treaty with usa.........india does not have tax treaty.
 
You are missing the point ..

sigh007 said:
Seems like no body cares about legal immigrants, then I don't see why we should contribute our share in the social security tax pool prior of being a GC holder. It's just so ridiculous to go through this whole retrogression fieasco especially it may take years to resolve, at the rate it's going now.

I've been patiently waiting for my GC for too long. It's not right to be treated this way. Can't understand why they lump legal immigrants stuff into the same bill as illegal immigrants'. I'd like to get my money back since my equal contribution is so insignificant. Anyone knows if there is any way that we could get our social security tax money back?

sigh007,

Have you ever thought long and hard about why legal immigrants are never given priority? Its pretty simple actually. Politicians know that legal immigrants pay tons of taxes and are not eligible for any benefits. That is a dream come true for them. We are their cash cows. It is in their best interest to keep us in this state of limbo for as long as possible. The hope is that enough of us will abandon the process or become otherwise ineligible through layoffs etc. They are fully aware that there are thousands of immigrants waiting in the wings to replace us and get into the same legal immigration trap. In essence they want us to keep paying for services that benefit others and their hope is that we never become beneficiaries. Its one of the many hidden truths of this "great" immigration system.

Unless your country has some special treaty with the US (not many have it), you can kiss your money goodbye.

regards,

saras76
 
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Other alternative is work 10 years in the US and contribute Social Security (SS) taxes.

If you have 40 quartes (10 yrs) of social security contributions you dont need to be a US Citizen or PR to get SS.

Ex I have already put in 10 yrs plus of contributing towards SS. Technically when I get old I am eligible to receive social security payments wherever I am in the world even without green cards.

Wether SS system will survive or colapse by them is a totally different ball game. SS Reform is another hot potato issue that no one wants to touch.
 
I don't think you can get the money back. In my opinion at least part of that money should be refunded in case we take off. I think only a reputable attorney could answer this for sure, but I notice that there is not much interest from groups to go that route. Not sure why though or perhaps they already consulted lawyers and that is not feasible. Unsure.

Now regarding our cause attached to the illegal alien bill:
In my view the times that our group should be lobbying and educating senators about our issue has passed. Now enough senators know about our plight. I think we should move on and ask Senators to initiate a separate bill to address our issues. We should only request modest and realistic goals, which should receive broader support. I would say if senators could at least come up with a mere recapture of visa numbers, allow people with PD > 2 years file I-485 upon approval of LC, allow people with PD > 3 years change jobs on EAD without restrictions. No, it would not reduce the greencard processing time to 2 years, but at least it could be a relief should be a remedy for veterans waiting for 4 years on this insane process. Realistic things should be addressed, more like on a relief basis and leave the more complex and Sen. Santa Claus provisions to a future bill (to be passed in 2090 perhaps).

Honestly, anything attached to such absurd guest-worker/amnesty program seems to me a mirage. Moreover, even if such guest-worker/amnesty bill ever passes, imagine how busy the USCIS adjucators would be ? It would be a total chaos and I believe that it is fair to assume that our cases would be given - as usual - low priority.

Read recent feedback below from someone who has experience:

One of the Chief Administrators of the 1986 Amnesty Speaks Out Against Repeating a Failed Policy

William King Jr., one of the top government officials responsible for carrying out the amnesty provision of the 1986 Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA), spoke out at a press conference Thursday, April 6 flanked by Representatives Virgil Goode (R-VA), Tom Tancredo (R-CO) and Walter Jones (R-NC) asking lawmakers and the public to remember the failed legacy and flood of illegal immigration that followed the ill-fated amnesty of 1986. Under IRCA, which lawmakers promised would be a one-time-only offer, some 3 million illegal aliens received amnesty in exchange for a government commitment to crack down on future illegal immigration to the United States.

“As a nation, we seem to be suffering from collective amnesia about why amnesty programs, like the one being decided in the Senate today, have never and will never work,” said King, who served as a regional director for the INS and served more than 27 years with the U.S. Border Patrol, and was one of five regional U.S. planners tapped to put the 1986 amnesty program into effect. King recalled the widespread use of counterfeit documents that resulted in many people obtaining amnesty fraudulently, and the government’s failure to make good on promises to enforce the nation’s borders and punish employers who knowingly hire illegal aliens.

“Anyone in the federal government who supports amnesty for millions of illegal aliens is recklessly endangering the security of the nation and undermining the economic security of just about everyone in this country who works for a living” King declared. “Based on my knowledge of the 1986 amnesty program, coupled with 49 years of continuous experience in immigration law enforcement, I can say there is no possible way that the proposals now under consideration for a guest worker program and/or general amnesty should receive approval. With at least 12 million people living here illegally, there will be no way to prevent massive fraud or even to conduct cursory background checks on applicants. It cannot be done.”


sigh007 said:
Seems like no body cares about legal immigrants, then I don't see why we should contribute our share in the social security tax pool prior of being a GC holder. It's just so ridiculous to go through this whole retrogression fieasco especially it may take years to resolve, at the rate it's going now.

I've been patiently waiting for my GC for too long. It's not right to be treated this way. Can't understand why they lump legal immigrants stuff into the same bill as illegal immigrants'. I'd like to get my money back since my equal contribution is so insignificant. Anyone knows if there is any way that we could get our social security tax money back?
 
Great point

texancanadian said:
Other alternative is work 10 years in the US and contribute Social Security (SS) taxes.

If you have 40 quartes (10 yrs) of social security contributions you dont need to be a US Citizen or PR to get SS.

Ex I have already put in 10 yrs plus of contributing towards SS. Technically when I get old I am eligible to receive social security payments wherever I am in the world even without green cards.

Wether SS system will survive or colapse by them is a totally different ball game. SS Reform is another hot potato issue that no one wants to touch.

texancanadian,

You bring up a great point regarding the solvency of the SS system. At the current rate it will probably collapse well before any of us can take advantage of it.

regards,

saras
 
So if u have spent 10 yrs

in US paying SS, how do u go about getting it in ur old age ? What should u do ? And at what age ?
 
Until U are a citizen

Until u r a US citizen, you will not get SS benfits irrespective of whereever u r
 
my2cents said:
Until u r a US citizen, you will not get SS benfits irrespective of whereever u r


NOT TRUE. If you have contributed for 40 credits (10 years) you will get SS benefits irrespective of you are GC Holder, Citizen or outsider
 
My Plan of Action

As everyone knows, we need 40 credit to became eligible for SS. My Plan of action is as follows:-

1) I have already worked for 5 years in the US, so I have 20 credits.

2) Move to Canada next year (my accumulated SS credit will be 24) and work there for 3 years to become a citizen.

3) Since US SS can be transfered to Canada, once you are a Canadian citizen you will be elibile for it anyway.

4) There is no risk of bankruptcy of social insurance system of Canada which is already funded for next 100+ years.

5) Less out of pocket payment for medial coverage.

Those who want to think long term....may want to look at the above direction as well.
 
How about the tax rate and the quality of jobs available for educated immigrants ? Have you considered that or is your move based solely on saving the SS money !



JANHK said:
As everyone knows, we need 40 credit to became eligible for SS. My Plan of action is as follows:-

1) I have already worked for 5 years in the US, so I have 20 credits.

2) Move to Canada next year (my accumulated SS credit will be 24) and work there for 3 years to become a citizen.

3) Since US SS can be transfered to Canada, once you are a Canadian citizen you will be elibile for it anyway.

4) There is no risk of bankruptcy of social insurance system of Canada which is already funded for next 100+ years.

5) Less out of pocket payment for medial coverage.

Those who want to think long term....may want to look at the above direction as well.
 
Lets Get It To Indian Govt....its A Lot Of Money And Going In Drain.
If Illegals Wud Hv Paid This Much To Us, They Wud Hv Been Citizens By Now.
 
Join our class action plan, we need 1000 people and $500. Check out this thread, it tells you also to file a 1447b and a Writ of Mandamus with all documents one would need to file a case against those USCIS and FBI bastard. Learn from this thread and you will be better off. We have had a lot of success with folks filing their own cases without lawyers and winning their Green Card cases. Read on and let's join the fight.

http://boards.immigrationportal.com/showthread.php?t=194681&page=77&pp=15
 
Why Not encourage Indian Gov't to get a tax treaty.

I am sure Chidambaram et al. are smart enough to realise the win win situation here. They need to get into a tax treaty with the USA soon. In one way it puts pressure on the US since letting us go will cause a large repatriation of funds, and secondly we and our native country can benefit from what we rightly worked for should in case we be asked to return.
If there are 200K people from India here, who either have returned or will return in the next few years, even assuming they contributed 35K in medicare and social security over their time here, you are looking at almost 7 billion dollars, not a small chunk of change. To say nothing of the additional 2-3 times that conservatively that will be gone in savings repatriated.
 
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It is true that as per the laws currently you do not have to be a US citizen or GC to get money from social secutiry once you turn 65.
But as a matter for practicality no one knows what will happen 20-30 years from now, when all of the IT pros working here turn old. If social secutiry is in trouble at that time, guess whose benefits will be cut first ?
Obvioulsy it is those people who are not US citizens or GC holders and are sitting in some other country. They will not get a dime.
So even if you are eligible now after 40 credits, do not assume that you are going to get anything if you are not a citizen. ( even GCs might have trouble if there is no money as preference will go to citizens. )
 
OK guys this is my area of speciality.
Granted that Social Security is a Govermental body and things may work different here. However any regular Benefits plan ( Defined Benefit- Pension or Defined Contribution - 401 K) can not just be taken away accordiung to ERISA laws. Benefits already earned are always Grandfathered ( ie they can say no additional benefits, or no new ppl can join etc) but they cant take away the benefits of someone who already has earned a benefit.
Therefore unless they go contrary towards their own rules which they created for their private sector (or even other governmental bodies like schools etc) they will have to protect benefits earned. But you never know.

As far as giving the money to India (tax treaty etc) the issue here is that India does not have a national pension system for all citizens (like social security). Technically US only has corresponding agreements with Governments who have their own national old age pension system like Social Security. That is the issue here. India has a Pension System for Govt employees but not for all Citizens. Therefore India can not offer reciprocity. That is the US Govt's argument on this.


blister1889 said:
It is true that as per the laws currently you do not have to be a US citizen or GC to get money from social secutiry once you turn 65.
But as a matter for practicality no one knows what will happen 20-30 years from now, when all of the IT pros working here turn old. If social secutiry is in trouble at that time, guess whose benefits will be cut first ?
Obvioulsy it is those people who are not US citizens or GC holders and are sitting in some other country. They will not get a dime.
So even if you are eligible now after 40 credits, do not assume that you are going to get anything if you are not a citizen. ( even GCs might have trouble if there is no money as preference will go to citizens. )
 
I do not know about the technicalities of all this, but just remember something. If there is a shortfall in the social secu fund 30 years from now and people hear that the US govt is paying benefits to non citizens or non GC holders in foreign countries, while shortchanging their own citizens, there will be rioting on the streets.
So any agreements can be changed and any contract can be voided, when the situation is not good. It will be the easiest to do that with people who are not in this country and do not have any voice, even if they played by the rules earlier and accumulated 40 credits....
Sorry, but this is how the world works.....
 
blister1889 said:
I do not know about the technicalities of all this, but just remember something. If there is a shortfall in the social secu fund 30 years from now and people hear that the US govt is paying benefits to non citizens or non GC holders in foreign countries, while shortchanging their own citizens, there will be rioting on the streets.
So any agreements can be changed and any contract can be voided, when the situation is not good. It will be the easiest to do that with people who are not in this country and do not have any voice, even if they played by the rules earlier and accumulated 40 credits....
Sorry, but this is how the world works.....

if we can get unemployment without having GC or Citizenship, why can't we get SS benifits?

My spouse (not primary applicant) got unemployment on EAD for 4 months.
 
I think it makes a difference if you are in the country or not. Being on EAD means that you are moving towards GC. Also unemplyment is short term


I am talking baout a situation where the US govt has to pay a lot of money to foreign citizens year after year when they are not cotributing anything to the US. I am not saying this is right since they already fulfileld the commitment of 40 credits.
But the most likely people to be cut off benefits if there is shortfall in social secu is the non citizens or non GCs in foreign countries who were once in the US and completed 40 credits. Sine they will be foreigners, old and have no voice they will be the first to cut off
 
Friend,

In my field of expertise, I can find good jobs in Canada. Been there recently for H1 stamping & a short vacation, and tell you the truth...I am confident and impressed, especially with my US education, I can get a good stable job.

Well, I have to think about my family when considering a move to up north. I am very convinced that the tax given to the govt. is very well compensated by a well funded pension plan of Canada and the universal health care. Housing seems reasonable, compared to SF bay area, more employee favoring labor laws....I would say that Canada is a socialist country.

US SS is broken, just like the immigration system. The big deficits created today will be taken care of by way of increased taxes in future. There is no other way to pay off the debts, excpect by increasing taxes. The debt situation seems out of control. Therefore the idea of higher taxes in Canada is not that well received nowadays, especially keeping in mind the US debt situation.

When you are ready to take out your pensions (401K) that money will be taxed at the tax rate of that time. I think that is why it is called tax deferred. So, in future if US taxes are going to go up, then your pension will be taxed at higher rate than of today. So, if you average the tax burden of your entire life earnings, you may not find much difference between Canada and the US. But in case of Canada, you will be eligible for health care for free. Here, if you loose your job and not on H1/GC, then the burden of insurance premium falls on you.

These are my worries....just trying to share these with you guys. I am not trying to argue anything to prove something or someone is wrong....just trying to make myself understand where we are going from here.

Best of luck.



BrainDrain said:
How about the tax rate and the quality of jobs available for educated immigrants ? Have you considered that or is your move based solely on saving the SS money !
 
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