Will this country be doomed if too diversified?

[WBH]

You are out of your mind if you think immigration is BAD. The mistake being made in Europe is the maintenance of tight immigration controls. The US is quite competitive and exciting very much DUE to our immigration policies rather than IN SPITE of it. Check out Zakaria's article http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2011/06/28/america-risks-losing-its-immigration-advantage/

Compettion relying on immigration can not go one forever and is not sustainable forever. It is more like a family never had children or very little children and always depend on adoption. There is nothing wrong with that but giving birth to one's own children should be the first choice.

Seriously. You benefit from it, and then you want to shut it down. Does it remind you of anyone? Maybe the 'native born' Americans whose ancestors came here sometimes only decades rather than centuries ago. How quickly we forget.

I have repeatedly said it is hypocracy for anyone to turn against immigration once immigration is done but just as you said, if you want
to be upright completely, this land shoudl rbe restored to native Americans and everyone else should pack up and leave. and since
no one do that so moral is not the issue here to discuss.

 

[nwctzn]

... I would just stayed in my home country.

That's easy to say once you are in. Anyway, you are a US citizen now. Just vote for the party which represents your immigration view. And how about if you express your views publicly (and not only on this forum)? I am wondering what answers you will get from fellow immigrants who do all the hard work from low-paying jobs up to the highest academic levels.

--

 

[WBH]

That's easy to say once you are in. Anyway, you are a US citizen now. Just vote for the party which represents your immigration view. And how about if you express your views publicly (and not only on this forum)? I am wondering what answers you will get from fellow immigrants who do all the hard work from low-paying jobs up to the highest academic levels.

--

I would vote for Ron Paul but don't think he can make it. and I am now registered as independent so can not even vote for him in primary election

 

[tedS]

Immigration in itself is not bad per se. What is bad is, one, people who do not adopt the American identity and way of life, and keep living like they did in their own countries. Well geniuses, if your way of life was so great, you wouldnt be running to escape your country, would you? Embrace America as your country and way of life.

Secondly, I noticed at the interview and oath ceremony, how some of these new citizens showed no respect for the occasion. Some of these did not even understand simple english. Many seem to want to take advantage of the system created by the hardworking tax payer.

The above two types of immigration is bad for US.

 

[WBH]

Immigration in itself is not bad per se. What is bad is, one, people who do not adopt the American identity and way of life, and keep living like they did in their own countries. Well geniuses, if your way of life was so great, you wouldnt be running to escape your country, would you? Embrace America as your country and way of life.

Secondly, I noticed at the interview and oath ceremony, how some of these new citizens showed no respect for the occasion. Some of these did not even understand simple english. Many seem to want to take advantage of the system created by the hardworking tax payer.

The above two types of immigration is bad for US.

You have to accept the reality the majority of the people do not have that kind of romantic feeling.
Citizenship is just a change in legal status. Many won't fight for USA even they swear to do so
and since the chance for need to fight is zero anyway so it won't matter.

 

[nwctzn]

Immigration in itself is not bad per se. What is bad is, one, people who do not adopt the American identity and way of life, and keep living like they did in their own countries. Well geniuses, if your way of life was so great, you wouldnt be running to escape your country, would you? Embrace America as your country and way of life.

Secondly, I noticed at the interview and oath ceremony, how some of these new citizens showed no respect for the occasion. Some of these did not even understand simple english. Many seem to want to take advantage of the system created by the hardworking tax payer.

The above two types of immigration is bad for US.

Greencard holders are hardworking tax payers before their naturalization. Once they become US citizens, they become hardworking tax payers who can vote in the elections and who can carry a US passport.

 

[WBH]

Greencard holders are hardworking tax payers before their naturalization. Once they become US citizens, they become hardworking tax payers who can vote in the elections and who can carry a US passport.

A teacher from my history course at a local community college says one of reasons why the Roman Empire
collapsed is because citizens did not work and relied on noncitizen slaves who worked hard in order to
become citizens to earn the privilesge of not working. One of his homework qquestion is: do you
see anything similar in the USA?

 

[nwctzn]

A teacher from my history course at a local community college says one of reasons why the Roman Empire
collapsed is because citizens did not work and relied on noncitizen slaves who worked hard in order to
become citizens to earn the privilesge of not working. One of his homework qquestion is: do you
see anything similar in the USA?

Aha, the US and Roman Empire analogy. So what?

 

[tedS]

You have to accept the reality the majority of the people do not have that kind of romantic feeling.
Citizenship is just a change in legal status. Many won't fight for USA even they swear to do so
and since the chance for need to fight is zero anyway so it won't matter.

I am not really implying any romanticism associated with getting the citizenship.

It is a fact that immigrants who fail to adopt the culture and values of US will ultimately lead to a sub-optimal result for this country.

American became great based on some values that are part of the American culture - freedom of religion and speech does exist here, politeness, fairness, equality - they all do exist here. They dont exist back in most of our own countries. Corruption is more prevalent in some of our countries than it is in USA.

Hence, what I am arguing is that immigrants who come here and remain Chinese, Indians, and Turkish, more than American, will result in a not so good outcome for the country.

 

[tedS]

Downlyl research

Greencard holders are hardworking tax payers before their naturalization. Once they become US citizens, they become hardworking tax payers who can vote in the elections and who can carry a US passport.

Point noted. But some of us are more productive members of society and pay higher taxes. And not all of us had to go through F1, then H1B, then GC to citizenship process. Many of us are just looking for a loophole so that government can take care of them for the rest of their livs. Maybe I am being a snob, but at the oath ceremony, I saw several people I thought were there just so they can get handouts.

 

[WBH]

Hence, what I am arguing is that immigrants who come here and remain Chinese, Indians, and Turkish, more than American, will result in a not so good outcome for the country.

and if Country X and COuntry Y are fighting each other and America now is sideing with Country X, then immigrants
from Country Y would natually think if they mutiply enough, their vote will eventually influence American foreign policies.
Of course in the meantime, Ethnical group associated with Country X should multiply more also to compete with ethnical
groups assiciated with Country Y.

 

[WBH]

Aha, the US and Roman Empire analogy. So what?

Roman empire did not hold permanently as a country because the empire is too large to be Romanized. The same thing can happen to any such country. A

 

[nwctzn]

Point noted. But some of us are more productive members of society and pay higher taxes. And not all of us had to go through F1, then H1B, then GC to citizenship process. Many of us are just looking for a loophole so that government can take care of them for the rest of their livs. Maybe I am being a snob, but at the oath ceremony, I saw several people I thought were there just so they can get handouts.

I went exactly through that process; i.e., F1, H1B, GC, and finally citizenship. And then there are those who win the GC via the lottery. So what? I am totally fine by that.

 

[nwctzn]

and if Country X and COuntry Y are fighting each other and America now is sideing with Country X, then immigrants
from Country Y would natually think if they mutiply enough, their vote will eventually influence American foreign policies.
Of course in the meantime, Ethnical group associated with Country X should multiply more also to compete with ethnical
groups assiciated with Country Y.

There are always groups (whether ethnic and/or religious based) who will want to influence US foreign policy. So what? I still do not see your point in this thread.

 

[WBH]

There are always groups (whether ethnic and/or religious based) who will want to influence US foreign policy. So what? I still do not see your point in this thread.

These groups can become larger and larger and eventually Second American War will break out and unlike first Civil War which
was ideological based, ethnic or reglious based civial war will balkanize this country.

Of course you can also it is human nature to fight. If they don't fight over this issue, they will fight over that issue
anyway so big deal.

 

[WBH]

I went exactly through that process; i.e., F1, H1B, GC, and finally citizenship. And then there are those who win the GC via the lottery. So what? I am totally fine by that.

I guess a lot of immigrants are parents of those F1-H1b-GC-citizenship type immigrants. By the time when the immigrant in the later caregory reach citizenship, their parents reach retirement age in their home countries. Parents can then immigrate as benefiary of petitions by their childrens who are now citizens.

 

[nwctzn]

I guess a lot of immigrants are parents of those F1-H1b-GC-citizenship type immigrants. By the time when the immigrant in the later caregory reach citizenship, their parents reach retirement age in their home countries. Parents can then immigrate as benefiary of petitions by their childrens who are now citizens.

No offense, but I didn't get this one.

 

[nwctzn]

These groups can become larger and larger and eventually Second American War will break out and unlike first Civil War which
was ideological based, ethnic or reglious based civial war will balkanize this country.

Of course you can also it is human nature to fight. If they don't fight over this issue, they will fight over that issue
anyway so big deal.

That's a pretty pessimistic view. So what's your advice? Should we de-naturalize and move back to our "original" and "stable" country?

 

[WBH]

No offense, but I didn't get this one.

I am saying a lot of immigrants are family-based immigrants. It is not necessarily that they don't work but some fo them
may not work at all but tend to be evetualy live off welfare. I think this is probaly what the other poster was talking about

 

[WBH]

That's a pretty pessimistic view. So what's your advice? Should we de-naturalize and move back to our "original" and "stable" country?

If fighting over a pie is ugly, you as an individual should not quit to make it less uglier. But You hope other quit, especially
after you already get your share.

The bottomline is we as indivduals don't have to think in long-run big pictureterm. But if we are to discuss it, I can see that
in 200 years yoour original country will sill be inhabited by descendents of current people of your country. But America will most likely be different. American can not depend on immigration forever. It better become a nation-coountry like all other nations.