Visiting Russia - Visa Questions

[Vorpal]

After immigrating to the U.S. in the fall of 1989, I have finally decided to visit Russia this coming September. Although I was aware that U.S. citizens require a visa to enter Russia, I was certainly not aware of how many hoops I will have to jump through to obtain one.

Since my family left Russia when it was still USSR, my parents had to obtain exit visas from the government. The Russian Consulate requires all U.S. citizens who have previously held Russian/USSR citizenship to prove that they are no longer a citizen. In fact, the tourist visa application instructions specifically name the exit visa as valid evidence that the applicant is no longer a Russian/USSR citizen, as one had to renounce his/her citizenship, as well as the citizenship of minor children immigrating with them, in order to obtain said exit visa.

Since I was 11 years old at the time, I did not have a Soviet passport and didn't require my own exit visa - I was, however, listed on my mother's exit visa. Here's the million dollar question: would my mother's exit visa, in conjunction with my original USSR birth certificate (of which I have a certified English translation, if necessary), be sufficient proof of the fact that I am not a Russian citizen?

 

[WBH]

Privet!

Did you call Russian consulate or embassy?

The best way to find out is to actually apply for a visa to see how it works. I am not sure
if you know any travel agency opened by a Russian immigrant in Russian community, which
may handle visa application on your behalf.

By the way, what if you can not prove you are no longer a Russian citizen, then you are qualified
for a Russian passport instead of a Russian visa? That would turn out to be better outcome
so you have two citizenship and no more visa is required any anymore

 

[Vorpal]

Privet!

Did you call Russian consulate or embassy?

The best way to find out is to actually apply for a visa to see how it works. I am not sure
if you know any travel agency opened by a Russian immigrant in Russian community, which
may handle visa application on your behalf.

By the way, what if you can not prove you are no longer a Russian citizen, then you are qualified
for a Russian passport instead of a Russian visa? That would turn out to be better outcome
so you have two citizenship and no more visa is required any anymore

Haha, trying to reach the consulate on the phone is like pulling teeth. Since I work a couple of train stations away from them, I'm considering dropping during a lunch break one of these days.

If you can't prove whether or not you are a Russian citizen, you have to petition the embassy/consulate to provide a document that states whether you are or are not a Russian citizen. Unfortunately, this document takes up to 6 months to process (USCIS-like efficiency at work), and I don't have 6 months. I may just let a travel/visa agency handle this for me. They may have an "in" at the consulate.

 

[WBH]

A side comment: all those countries who ban their citizens from leaving the country are practamatically stupid. A country should encouareg its people to immigrate to all corners fo the world in order to spread gene and opffsrping all over the globe.

If you want to build a wall, you should alwasy build it for the purpose of preventing poeple coming in
rathern than going out.

Just imagine 500 years from now, those countries with bast land and fewer people will be toiled and farmed
by swarmed by descendents from your own country, what exciting ppicture it is.

 

[König]

Here's the million dollar question: would my mother's exit visa, in conjunction with my original USSR birth certificate [...], be sufficient proof of the fact that I am not a Russian citizen?

Yes, it would. And it is not a million dollar question.

As for obtaining a Russian visa, your best bet would be to do it through an authorised (by the consulate) travel agency. Doing it yourself directly with a consulate is too much of a PITA to even try.

 

[Vorpal]

Yes, it would. And it is not a million dollar question.

As for obtaining a Russian visa, your best bet would be to do it through an authorised (by the consulate) travel agency. Doing it yourself directly with a consulate is too much of a PITA to even try.

Thanks for clearing this up. I guess Russia is still the same bureaucratic mess it was back in the 80s. Based on my attempts to gather the necessary documentation (letter of verification? travel voucher? are they serious?), the experience has already proven to be a royal pain. I'll follow your advice and deal with ILS, the visa service listed on the Russian consulate's page.

As an aside, here's a quote directly from ILS-USA.com:

"We will do our best for you to get a visa to visit the Russian Federation; it has become a very comfortable and pleasant procedure."

Maybe if you're a masochist...

 

[cafeconleche]

Haha, the stories coming out of Russia these days seem to point to an immovable behemoth that wants to make things difficult for EVERYONE. I have never been there, but reading travel blogs is sufficient. My Dutch friends are going to take the Trans-Siberian from Moscow to Beijing in the summer, so I look forward to hearing what they have to deal with.

 

[Vorpal]

Haha, the stories coming out of Russia these days seem to point to an immovable behemoth that wants to make things difficult for EVERYONE. I have never been there, but reading travel blogs is sufficient. My Dutch friends are going to take the Trans-Siberian from Moscow to Beijing in the summer, so I look forward to hearing what they have to deal with.

I've read a couple of threads on FlyerTalk and another forum whose name I can't remember, where people former Russian citizens had no documentation proving that their are no longer a citizen and ended up canceling their trips to avoid dealing with this nonsense. There really needs to be visa reciprocity between Russia and USA. The only reason why Russia forces US citizens to jump through hoops to obtain a visa is because the US does the same thing to Russian citizens.

 

[König]

Well, to be fair, gaining the entry permission to the USA can be as difficult as in case of Russian Federation. Also, if you are born in the USA but moved out as a child and want to come as a visitor on a non-US passport, you are likely to have problems. This is why London mayor Boris Johnson had to give up his US citizenship. Anyway, regardless of the hassles one has to go through to come to Russia, once you are in, it can really be a pleasant experience - the country has a lot to offer. Personally, taking a Trans-Siberian is a long time dream of mine.

 

[Vorpal]

Despite having to navigate the bureaucracy to get there, I am definitely looking forward to going to Russia. In fact, I haven't been this excited about an upcoming trip for a very long time.

As far as visa support documentation is concerned, here's what I have:

1. My mother's USSR exit visa, with me listed as a dependent
2. My original USSR birth certificate, along with a certified English translation
3. My natz certificate, with my new last name
4. Name change certificate (to prove that I am the same person as the one described in the exit visa and birth certificate)

If that's not enough, I'll count my blessings that I got refundable plane tickets. I'm booked for September, and I really don't want to have to deal with the Russian consulate to obtain proof of absence of Russian citizenship.

 

[König]

1. My mother's USSR exit visa, with me listed as a dependent
2. My original USSR birth certificate, along with a certified English translation
3. My natz certificate, with my new last name
4. Name change certificate (to prove that I am the same person as the one described in the exit visa and birth certificate)

It seems that you have everything a consulate might want to see before issuing you a visa. Your mother did a good job keeping all these documents safe - without 1 and 2, you would likely have to go through citizenship verification process.

 

[WBH]

It seems that you have everything a consulate might want to see before issuing you a visa. Your mother did a good job keeping all these documents safe - without 1 and 2, you would likely have to go through citizenship verification process.

I still don't get it. What will happen if you can not verify you are not a citizen of Russia?

In such case, Which of the following three will happen?

(1) Take your word and give you a visa as a nonciztizen
(2) Treat you as a citizen and you are entitie to a Russian passport even they know you are naturlaized to be a US citizen already
(3) Place you into a "status unclear" category and this also has two consequences
(3.1) Permanently unable to enter Russia in this life
(3.2) Russia create a new kind of visa specially for such unclear citizenship situation

 

[nwctzn]

I still don't get it. What will happen if you can not verify you are not a citizen of Russia?

In such case, Which of the following three will happen?

(1) Take your word and give you a visa as a nonciztizen
(2) Treat you as a citizen and you are entitie to a Russian passport even they know you are naturlaized to be a US citizen already
(3) Place you into a "status unclear" category and this also has two consequences
(3.1) Permanently unable to enter Russia in this life
(3.2) Russia create a new kind of visa specially for such unclear citizenship situation

Reminds me of a petition for Mitt Romney: He needs to prove that he is not a Unicorn

 

[voldemarv]

I still don't get it. What will happen if you can not verify you are not a citizen of Russia?

In such case, Which of the following three will happen?

(1) Take your word and give you a visa as a nonciztizen

Never...

(2) Treat you as a citizen and you are entitie to a Russian passport even they know you are naturlaized to be a US citizen already

No

(3) Place you into a "status unclear" category and this also has two consequences
(3.1) Permanently unable to enter Russia in this life

My vote for this one

(3.2) Russia create a new kind of visa specially for such unclear citizenship situation

LOL

 

[WBH]

Never...

No
My vote for this one
LOL

If not being able to present exit visa will put you into a limbo, then what about
those who did not get exit visa in the first place? It is said that
in USSR the rule is that either you leave the country on the permanent basis
which requires an exit visa, or no one be allowed to leave teh country
on temporary basis for private matter. If so then such people do not exist.

But I can not believe such rule can be enforced 100%. Therefoer there bound to be
people who left USSR on tenmporary basis for private matter but once out, decided to stay
outside USSR permanently (that is teh case for many F-1 students anyway).

Then such people do not have exist visa in teh first place. Does it mean they will never be able to go back tp Russua?

 

[voldemarv]

Exit visa is not the only proof. There are exit stamps in passport that can prove that you were out of country in 1992. If in doubt, consul can send a request to your last residence to confirm registration (propiska) at that time. If somebody left temporary and is still registered in Russia, he can apply for Russian citizenship.
P.S.
I don't think this is right place to discuss Russian visa. If you can read and write Russian you are welcome to privet dot com

 

[Vorpal]

It seems that you have everything a consulate might want to see before issuing you a visa. Your mother did a good job keeping all these documents safe - without 1 and 2, you would likely have to go through citizenship verification process.

It turns out that my mother doesn't have the old exit visa. I will be retaining the services of a travel agent who specializes in Russian visas and has a direct line of contact with the Russian consulate. As a result of my post-naturalization FOIPA filing, I have copies of all initial immigration filing documents, some of which reference my mother's exit visa by its serial number and its period of validity. Wish me luck.

 

[cafeconleche]

Why don't you just reclaim Russian citizenship? Isn't it useful?

 

[WBH]

Why don't you just reclaim Russian citizenship? Isn't it useful?

To do that, he needs to prove he did not use the exit visa. Merely not having it now is not a proof.

 

[voldemarv]

To do that, he needs to prove he did not use the exit visa. Merely not having it now is not a proof.

Not exactly. He needs to proof that he was resident of Russia in 1992.