No one wants a never ending lawsuit like we’ve seen the last 2 years. This was the reason for starting now and taking a specific approach for the consular issues in Sydney. They could seriously resolve the issue and process interviews well before 9/30/22.
DV 2022 OC Selectees
- Thread starter Melb2021
- Start date
I agree with this.Agreed, Im in the same boat. On one end, its a once in a life time opportunity, so any amount is worth it if it helps. The main question is just, what are your odds of getting it without this? So its just kind of a gamble, pay and have a good chance at getting your interview, pay and get your interview and find out later you could have gotten it without paying, or not joining and completely missing out and regretting it? :/ Obviously the best chance at getting an interview is joining, just hard when we dont know the odds of getting it without joining. For all we know the embassy could open in April whenever they do complete construction and just resume interviews like usual, but up to the individual to decide whether they want to risk that or not I guess.
Im leaning towards wanting to join to try and "guarantee" I get my interview, worst case I just spent some money when I didn't have to, but at least didnt miss out on an interview. Definitely fine with the lower costs if the case is resolved quickly, just the upper limit is a lot (of course most of us can afford it if we are moving countries, but its still a lot, just not in the grand scheme of things. Small price to pay for a life changing event I guess.
Its crazy that we have pay at all for something we won that is meant to essentially be free (aside from embassy fees etc). Not aimed at Jesse, but aimed at the government not giving us our interviews, we shouldn't even need a lawsuit to get our interviews
Hello all.
After weighing up all the options, I have decided to join the lawsuit and have signed up as a plaintiff. Moving to America is my dream and with the amount of time and effort I've put into this already, I want the best chance possible. Do your best @blesjm1! Thanks for fighting for us.
After weighing up all the options, I have decided to join the lawsuit and have signed up as a plaintiff. Moving to America is my dream and with the amount of time and effort I've put into this already, I want the best chance possible. Do your best @blesjm1! Thanks for fighting for us.
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Hi All,
After the call this morning I have signed up as a plaintiff and feel confident this is the safest path forward. Being a plaintiff in this case not only puts someone in our corner fighting for us, but unlike all the other lawsuits/class actions, we have a bespoke case for our specific issues in Au/Sydney and I don't want to miss that train.
While we could wait and see what happens, we have no movement, no communication, and no guarantees that when Sydney opens they will even take DV cases. I don't want to take any risks with this opportunity of a lifetime, it's a small price to pay in grand the scheme of things.
It could work out without being a plaintiff but I would rather have as many eggs in the basket as possible! Thanks @blesjm1
After the call this morning I have signed up as a plaintiff and feel confident this is the safest path forward. Being a plaintiff in this case not only puts someone in our corner fighting for us, but unlike all the other lawsuits/class actions, we have a bespoke case for our specific issues in Au/Sydney and I don't want to miss that train.
While we could wait and see what happens, we have no movement, no communication, and no guarantees that when Sydney opens they will even take DV cases. I don't want to take any risks with this opportunity of a lifetime, it's a small price to pay in grand the scheme of things.
It could work out without being a plaintiff but I would rather have as many eggs in the basket as possible! Thanks @blesjm1
090521@0411
Active Member
why would you doubt it? if I were in the U.S. and someone bought some vexatious lawsuit against me and I had to pay lawyers to represent me and I won I would be certainly asking the Court for an order that the losing party pay my legal costs, otherwise it would be an invitation for every vexatious and vindictive a-hole to start suing people they didn't like, run them around in circles whilst running up their legal bill, and when they lose laughing their heads off knowing they caused you thousands of dollars in legal fees. I'm not for one minute saying Jesse's lawsuit is vexatious or without merit, what I am saying is I suspect the U.S. civil jurisdiction allows a successful party to a lawsuit to recover their legal costs from the unsuccessful party, especially if, for example in this lawsuit, Jesse gave the DOS an option to start interviewing before the lawsuit was filed, and the DOS ignored/declined that offer.
Its the same in Australia, every court action I have litigated, all self represented, and all against governments, I have won, and on every occassion I gave them a written opportunity to comply before I filed the Court application, and when they refused and I won in Court those written offers were placed into an affidavit where I then sought costs, and on every occassion I was awarded costs, on the basis I would not have incurred my costs had the government accepted my offer before going to Court. Last win was September 2021, Qld District Court, Qld Police ordered to pay around 1k, all avoided had they complied, not bad for about half a days work by someone who has zero legal training.
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2022OC5XX
DS 260 submitted November 2021
No documents requested or submitted
Scheduled for interview December 2021
Current as of January 2022
I work in software engineering. I have zero legal knowledge in Aus and less than zero in the US. I said I doubt it because there was no mention of it in the contract and call this morning. Rather than go back and forth, let’s wait for someone with US knowledge.
Thanks for your very quick reply!
That’s great to hear - definitely makes the lawsuit more appealing to join
Hey, I find your posts really disruptive and negative during an already anxious visa process. If you have any specific questions, Jesse has provided his email. Otherwise your comments are just mansplaining speculation and unhelpful for others. Many of us made a conscious effort to jump on the Zoom this morning, if you missed it and have questions please email Jesse, he and his office will have helpful advice.
I will definitely be joining this lawsuit. The team is very experienced and has a great track record of success. We’re working in unprecedented times and 2020, 2021 winners can also attest to that. Nothing is certain so I’ve decided I’m doing to do whatever it takes so if it doesn’t workout, I can at least say I tried all avenues.
Hope everyone had a great weekend, stay safe out there!
Hi Everyone - I have thought a little more about it and wanted to share my thoughts. The cost does appear to be a lot. I also also cautious as to why its being rushed now (still in Q1 2022) whilst we have up to September 2022. I would be more comfortable if it was in, say, May this year whilst we see how it progresses for the next few months (or at least 50% through the visa year for which we are not). @Britsimon can you please let us know what other legal schemes that are available that we could still qualify for? I would be more comfortable paying a smaller nominal fee and the DV place be reserved to pick up whenever that might be...
P.S. I see our situation as a "group" to get the visa issued and what to support/help our cause jointly...
P.S. I see our situation as a "group" to get the visa issued and what to support/help our cause jointly...
090521@0411
Active Member
its a reasonable question to ask if your liable to pay the DOS's costs if you lose, or if you can recover your costs if you win, and despite asking this question a couple of times now, over a couple of days, no one, including Jesse, has answered it, despite Jesse being able to answer other questions in this thread (sometimes almost instantly).
You've signed up have you?, and you don't like my "negative comments"? Maybe you should scroll back to my first comment, WHO was it that recommended an AU lawsuit "ASAP"? based on my "negative comments"?, with BritSimon within hours announcing a possible AU lawsuit, Im sure it was just a coincidence.
Like it or not there is going to be negativity in this process, and like it or not not everyone in OC will get their visa. No law suit in the world will get you an interview if COVID gets worse here and the consulates here close solely due to COVID, thats why I said a lawsuit needs to be filed ASAP, to deny the DOS an opportunity of blaming COVID for not interviewing a single OC DV2022 selectee in AU as of today.
If you don't like my comments, don't read them, but for everyone else, if you think someone who does have some (successful) court room experience has valid questions to ask, your more than welcome to read, and constructive criticism is always welcome. But if you want to basically tell me to POQ, your wasting your time, been up against worse than keyboard warriors, and have never lost when it counts.
"mansplaining"? .... no, I won't give you the satisfaction here, but your welcome to PM me.
Good luck to all the plaintiffs
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2022OC5XX
DS 260 submitted November 2021
No documents requested or submitted
Scheduled for interview December 2021
Current as of January 2022
For those who don’t already know, if you click someone’s username, there’s an option to ignore (mute) them.
I think some people just come to argue/be generally unhelpful - I’ve seen it in quite a few other threads.
090521@0411
Active Member
and some people have valuable experience that helps contribute to the thread, I like to think my input likely kick started a lawsuit that was likely already in the pipelines. Likewise, with my courtroom experience, ALL against governments, who else in this thread (other than Jesse) has the first hand experience of seeing what kind of excuses/delaying tactics etc governments can (and will use). You think only AU governments use these tactics?
But hey, you can take the advices of nonothings and mute, Im getting a family member to photograph the SYD Consulate construction site, so if you mute, you won't see those photos here
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2022OC5XX
DS 260 submitted November 2021
No documents requested or submitted
Scheduled for interview December 2021
Current as of January 2022
Britsimon
Super Moderator
Just to clarify, the reason the lawsuit was announced was based on discussions Jesse and I had in December and early January before you posted anything in the forum. You can see a note from me saying that I had met with the Legal Eagles a couple of days before your post. I'm sure your post about legal action after that was just a coincidence, so no, you're not the "who", if that even matters.
Let's chill out huh.
Just had a thought, since a lot of us are on the fence about it (costing a lot, and some preferring it was done later eg in like May). Is there a possibility for a second law suit if the first one goes well and is resolved quickly?
Ie. If a bunch of us (10-20) joined now, and a month from now all have interviews rescheduled, is it just too bad to those that didn't join in time, or is it possible for a "second round" lawsuit after seeing if this one was successful for people. As I'm sure a lot of people would be willing to sign up if they saw the process already happen once, not only would it ensure them that it will work out, but would give them a timeframe of how long the first law suit took to see if any partial refunds were given (if the first group was resolved within 2-4 weeks).
Not really sure how it works, so not sure if Jesse can just walk back in a month after and be like "Hey, I've got another 20 plaintiffs that want their interview as well."
Ie. If a bunch of us (10-20) joined now, and a month from now all have interviews rescheduled, is it just too bad to those that didn't join in time, or is it possible for a "second round" lawsuit after seeing if this one was successful for people. As I'm sure a lot of people would be willing to sign up if they saw the process already happen once, not only would it ensure them that it will work out, but would give them a timeframe of how long the first law suit took to see if any partial refunds were given (if the first group was resolved within 2-4 weeks).
Not really sure how it works, so not sure if Jesse can just walk back in a month after and be like "Hey, I've got another 20 plaintiffs that want their interview as well."
Britsimon
Super Moderator
Let's talk options.
Jesse is doing a Sydney targetted lawsuit. We know the "normal" arguments but specifically Sydney have been unbelievably uncaring in their closure due to moving. They had two years to plan for that. The terms for that lawsuit were discussed today and are detailed on the info page. This lawsuit will be a very small number of plaintiffs with a specific focus. The cost is higher because of the "bespoke" nature of the suit with a limited catchment. Economics 101. You can read the details here:
Password: DVAustralia
Jesse is also doing a more general suit and said today that people could choose to be on that. But of course that would not be about suing Sydney specifically, and whilst is still intended to be small, it would likely be 200-300 families. Details:
Link: www.wasdenbanias.com/dv22landing
Password: DV22delay
Immpact (Charles Kuck and co) are also launching a generalized lawsuit. They have extended the "earlybird" pricing to 1/21 ($1500 instead of $2000) and will close interest on 1/28. Immpact are also a good choice if you want a general lawsuit. Details:
DV-2022 Delays | IMMpact Litigation | Diversity Visa Attorneys
We are onboarding a new case. Learn about it here. Our diversity visa attorneys are ready to fight for you.
www.immpactlitigation.com
Curts Morrison will get in the fight in the next few weeks I imagine. He has stated he does not want to file too soon, which I believe is about being able to prove irreparable harm. However, as Jesse and Chuck have pointed out Judge Mehta did question why the lawyers had delayed filing if the harm was so obvious and serious.
There may be other suits already and possibly in the future.
I feel "obliged" to mention this. I am not a lawyer and I am not involved in any lawsuits in any way for payment of any kind. I have provided information to all three firms in the form of background information, "expert" declarations and so on. Again, without payment of any kind. Like Mom and SusieQQQ here I do the DV stuff as a hobby, to give back, and for personal satisfaction. Oh, and also to show off to my daughter about being a social media "influencer" (which pisses her off).
090521@0411
Active Member
Simon, I was having a great Saturday afternoon until somebody attacked me, and basically told me to raise any questions I have with Jesse directly, and my input was unhelpful.
Yes you are correct, after checking, your legal eagle comment predates my first comment, sorry for that, but I absolutely reject my comments are unhelpful, nor am I seeking any credit for input I raise that assists this lawsuit, and I challenge anyone to list just one occassion where I have posted unhelpful content. My immediate comment above clearly says this lawsuit was likely in the pipelines before my first comment. I also note I suggested an FOIA request, and now I see on Jesse's landing page thats exactly what will be sought. Am I saying Jesse used my suggestion?, absolutely not, rather What I am saying is Jesse and I are thinking along the same lines, and in my respectful opinion, thats the kind of input that is the kind of input that is helpful to this thread, and lawsuit. Ive used FOIA info many times in Court successfully, thats why I suggested it.
As for being told to raise my questions directly with Jesse, aside from that poster having zero authority to tell anyone on this forum to do anything, I prefer the BritSimon YouTube approach of raising a question in the public forum, where everyone benefits from the answer, rather than privately.
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2022OC5XX
DS 260 submitted November 2021
No documents requested or submitted
Scheduled for interview December 2021
Current as of January 2022
Britsimon
Super Moderator
You could ask Jesse about that. He answered a similar question once (about the larger suit) that he would rather not do that because it is not really "fair play" to the government. But he may see this smaller suit in a different way. He'll probably answer tomorrow.
Britsimon
Super Moderator
About contacting Jesse direct. Understand your point, but Jesse has a slightly different syle to some other lawyers (deliberately, I believe). He won't be super vocal about strategies and trying to embarrass/shame the government lawyers. Having said that you can ask a concise question here (perhaps with less additional info) and I would imagine Jesse would answer it. I have asked lawyers about suing for costs before and while it is as I understand it, technically possible, I don't think you should bank on getting that in these cases. It hasn't happened in any of the cases I have seen yet and Jesse's strategy for Sydney is progress by the gov making the problem go away quickly.
And yes I remember Jesse mentioning FOIA requests way back in December and Curtis does that too. So - it's a normal strategy, and therefore no surprise you were thinking on the same lines.
As for input to the lawsuit, if you don't mind I would say this. I have had some experience with some people who thought they knew the best ways to win the lawsuits and were very vocal about it. We refer to them as barrack-room lawyers in the UK. There was one particularly painful guy last year that caused problems in one of the lawsuits by inappropriately reaching out direct to one of the Federal Judges (and the guy was a plaintiff). So - Jesse has an open mind and will, I'm sure, respectfully listen to all input, but if you do choose to litigate you should decide whether you want to be the lawyer or the plaintiff. If you are the latter you should trust the lawyer and let them do what you hired them for. That would be my suggestion.
And as for the forum, we are lucky to have a really great "vibe" in this forum and particularly in the OC threads each year. It's one of the reasons I came here specifically to talk about the Sydney case, and this forum was on my mind when Jesse and I started discussing the handful of embassies that are on my "shitlist". Let's not ruin that vibe, please.
May not be fair to the government, but neither is letting a few reschedule because they threatened with a lawsuit and others didn't
Look forward to hearing Jesse's response on that though! The sooner the better of course, but May would also let people see if they won in DV23. For me I mostly want to see the time frame as like I stated earlier, 2k AUD is a lot more reasonable than the potential 6k.