Passport-Tracking-Online Status

We've received two passports so far -- my daughter's and my wife's (I haven't had my interview yet (so I'm still a ways from applying for a passport)).

Both were mailed to the same location on an expedited basis. Each was processed at a different facility, neither of which was where we sent the application.

Governments work in mysterious ways.
 
Hi Newly,

I guess I will get the old one as well. I can pick it up at 11:30 a.m. tomorrow. When I filed the application, I asked about the new passport. The lady said they had not started to issue them yet at the D.C. facility. I told her 'well, how come that I know 10 people who applied at this very facility between December 05 and July 06 and all of them got the ePassport. Neither one of them is a diplomat, by the way'. The clerk was absolutely clueless, what a surprise.

Gov't bureaucracies..no matter if it is USCIS, DHS, State etc. etc. have no idea what they are doing... .

Oh well...the new passport has its advantages. One being it is not that blatantly 'gung ho American' as the new one. That might be an advantage depending on where you travel ;-).

Cheers!

Legal


NewlyMinted said:
I just pick up my passport, but it wasn't the epassport. I called the National Passport information Center and they representative told me they're only processing the epassport in Colorado. When I told him that several people in DC have received it, he said "that's news to me." Then he said he'll e-mail his supervisor to find out.


LegalAlien: Let me know how it goes with yours.

Cheers,

Newly
 
NewlyMinted said:
I just pick up my passport, but it wasn't the epassport. I called the National Passport information Center and they representative told me they're only processing the epassport in Colorado. When I told him that several people in DC have received it, he said "that's news to me." Then he said he'll e-mail his supervisor to find out.


LegalAlien: Let me know how it goes with yours.

Cheers,

Newly


He is right! I do not know a signle person from Washington DC who has gotten the new e-passport recently. People who claim that their friends have gotten the passport do not know what and how the epassport looks like. I have not once been proven right in this.

State Deparment started issuing in Colorado passport agency the epassports but this is just to say that they are respecting the deadlines. They have issued few only and most in Colorado are still getting the old passports. They have just ordered the chips from Germany so it is impossible that they issue passports now. And I was told by the NPA that they will start issuing epassports from Januray onwards.
 
ITC,

Well, I physically had the new ePassport in my hands. It looked exactly like the one on the website of the U.S. Dept. of State. It was issued to a woman who went on one of the trips to Europe my former employer had organized.

The other day, a current co-worker of mine picked up his ePassport at the Wash D.C. Passport Agency for his upcoming trip to Russia. We met for coffee that day and he proudly showed his new ePassport to me. It is pretty obvious that it was the new one. The difference to the old-style passport is VERY clear. It had the liberty bell, Mt. Rushmore etc. etc. on the visa pages and a big U.S. flag above the the biographic page.

Maybe some of the passports issued at the D.C. facility are produced someplace else.

Either way, does it really matter what kind of passport one gets? If the ePassport is of fundamental importance to somebody, just 'loose' or 'wash' the old -style passport, file a report and apply for an ePassport once all passports issued bear the new design.

Let us not get the passport thread out of hand in the same way the 'speeding tickets' thread did a few months back ;-).

Cheers!

Legal


itc said:
He is right! I do not know a signle person from Washington DC who has gotten the new e-passport recently. People who claim that their friends have gotten the passport do not know what and how the epassport looks like. I have not once been proven right in this.

State Deparment started issuing in Colorado passport agency the epassports but this is just to say that they are respecting the deadlines. They have issued few only and most in Colorado are still getting the old passports. They have just ordered the chips from Germany so it is impossible that they issue passports now. And I was told by the NPA that they will start issuing epassports from Januray onwards.
 
LegalAlien99 said:
ITC,

Well, I physically had the new ePassport in my hands. It looked exactly like the one on the website of the U.S. Dept. of State. It was issued to a woman who went on one of the trips to Europe my former employer had organized.

The other day, a current co-worker of mine picked up his ePassport at the Wash D.C. Passport Agency for his upcoming trip to Russia. We met for coffee that day and he proudly showed his new ePassport to me. It is pretty obvious that it was the new one. The difference to the old-style passport is VERY clear. It had the liberty bell, Mt. Rushmore etc. etc. on the visa pages and a big U.S. flag above the the biographic page.

Maybe some of the passports issued at the D.C. facility are produced someplace else.

Either way, does it really matter what kind of passport one gets? If the ePassport is of fundamental importance to somebody, just 'loose' or 'wash' the old -style passport, file a report and apply for an ePassport once all passports issued bear the new design.

Let us not get the passport thread out of hand in the same way the 'speeding tickets' thread did a few months back ;-).

Cheers!

Legal

I agree with you. Not to deflect from subject but discussing about epassport is exactely on the subject, that is timelines. Remember that it does not matter where you live, but where your passport is made. It is possible also that DC office prints epassport although that was never officialy said. Therefore your observations are accurate.

Now, personally I have been waiting for the epassport. Simply because other countries may impose same requrements US had imposed on them and simply because it is less likely to be stolen and forged and automatically less likely for one to be stopped at the borders and checked. Aside that it looks nicer. That is all. The point is that one should delay if possible getting new passport now, till January unless he has to travel. I would have to travel for Christmas so most likely I will be getting unfortunately the old passport in Nov/Dec. All the best to you. All the best.
 
Hi buddy,

Yes, point well taken. Maybe they run some kind of trial period in D.C.? I am sure I will get an old-style passport as well.

You might very well be right about your observations regarding mandates imposed by other countries on the United States. If I am not totally wrong, the new German passports are also ePassports. We will see... .

Best wishes,

Legal
 
Hi itc!

I just checked. All German passports are ePassports since November 2005. This would add to what you mentioned in your last post. I would not put it past the gov't to at some point say 'okay, all those with an old U.S. passport need to apply for the ePassport if they want to travel'.

Cheers!

Legal
 
I doubt that will happen, but hey, 10 years is a long time, perhaps they might change their mind. So far, nothing done related to these passport changes and requirements has been retroactive. For visa waiver countries there are clear guidelines about when the requirement for mechanical readable and electronic passports started. I doubt they will come back 4 or 5 years later and say all those passports which are not electronic are not valid anymore. For example, green cards have been left to live their full useful 10 years life, even as newer more secure cards were issued the older ones were not automatically invalidated. One could argue this leaves a 10 year security issue, but that's life. I think it is better this way, just to incrementally replace these documents instead of forcing everyone to replace their documents at once.

On the other hand, what is the rush to get a new passport that although can look nicer and might seem to provide a smoother passport control experience could potentially subject you to tracking, skimming and eavesdropping. With an ePassport you'll always have to wonder whether your personal information is secure or not. I know, I know, they are supposed to be secure, same way as the DVD encryption protection was supposed to be fairly good, and we know what happens today. I would see a more likely possibility of an ePassport to be "recalled" over security issues that a regular passport having to be replaced because any country stops accepting them.

I don't know why they insisted in making the passport contactless, as one always gives the passport to the immigration officer and they could easily introduce it into a reading machine that would read it by contact. For me, this is a technology that is not going to do much for security and can just make the unsuspecting regular folk more trackable. Add this to other ways of tracking, like credit card payments, having your cell phone on, security cameras. I know, I know, people say if one has nothing to hide then it has nothing to worry. Well, say that to the Jews in Nazi Germany, or to the Tutsi in Rwanda, or to any other group that from a peaceful situation go into being persecuted and killed. Would you like someone, or the government to know you so well then when the winds change against you? Personally I prefer my freedom with as much privacy and anonymity as possible.

My 2 cents.
 
Huracan said:
I doubt that will happen, but hey, 10 years is a long time, perhaps they might change their mind. So far, nothing done related to these passport changes and requirements has been retroactive. For visa waiver countries there are clear guidelines about when the requirement for mechanical readable and electronic passports started. I doubt they will come back 4 or 5 years later and say all those passports which are not electronic are not valid anymore. For example, green cards have been left to live their full useful 10 years life, even as newer more secure cards were issued the older ones were not automatically invalidated. One could argue this leaves a 10 year security issue, but that's life. I think it is better this way, just to incrementally replace these documents instead of forcing everyone to replace their documents at once.

On the other hand, what is the rush to get a new passport that although can look nicer and might seem to provide a smoother passport control experience could potentially subject you to tracking, skimming and eavesdropping. With an ePassport you'll always have to wonder whether your personal information is secure or not. I know, I know, they are supposed to be secure, same way as the DVD encryption protection was supposed to be fairly good, and we know what happens today. I would see a more likely possibility of an ePassport to be "recalled" over security issues that a regular passport having to be replaced because any country stops accepting them.

I don't know why they insisted in making the passport contactless, as one always gives the passport to the immigration officer and they could easily introduce it into a reading machine that would read it by contact. For me, this is a technology that is not going to do much for security and can just make the unsuspecting regular folk more trackable. Add this to other ways of tracking, like credit card payments, having your cell phone on, security cameras. I know, I know, people say if one has nothing to hide then it has nothing to worry. Well, say that to the Jews in Nazi Germany, or to the Tutsi in Rwanda, or to any other group that from a peaceful situation go into being persecuted and killed. Would you like someone, or the government to know you so well then when the winds change against you? Personally I prefer my freedom with as much privacy and anonymity as possible.

My 2 cents.

Very nice post. I agree with your logic. Here are my comments on issues mentioned.

1. True, it is very unlikely that rules will be retroactive. Although, this will depend on OTHER governments , not US governement. That will make it less reliably to predict the future. At least one country may say that they do not accept US passports the way they are anymore. Your examples about green cards and so, concerned this country and its own documents. Here it is not so. The reason why US has not imposed onitselves the epassport deadline is simple that they can always verify its own citizens.

So, yes , it probably does not matter now, but in 6-7 years , when most of the passports are epassports, they may be taking a closer look at yours more frequently.

2. Again, epassport to my mind is just more safe. At least I know that if I loose it people would not be able to use it. From this point it also follows that if you show your epassport people will know it is not forged. Especially if you look "foreign" or you are with a foreign name and accent. Nobody will have any doubts.

3. I am unclear as to machine readable vs wireless. I know that you have to have a chip that has the same info your cover page has. That is the whole point and idea of the epassports. Apparently, it is extremely difficult if not impossible to alter the data on the chip. Now, can the chip be read just with contact rather than contactless? I do not know that. What I heard is that inorder to read the chip you have to swipe the passport first that generates a code that will be use to communicate with the chip. And chips can be read only few inches. So, no, I am not afraid that somebody will steal my data and those will be only my name and DOB, the same info that is on the cover page.


4. As far as government goes, they already have all the data and more than I want to. Just think of your IRS form and what info you send them. A chip that has the same info as my cover page does not bother me much.

All the best
 
itc said:
Very nice post. I agree with your logic. Here are my comments on issues mentioned.

1. True, it is very unlikely that rules will be retroactive. Although, this will depend on OTHER governments , not US governement. That will make it less reliably to predict the future. At least one country may say that they do not accept US passports the way they are anymore. Your examples about green cards and so, concerned this country and its own documents. Here it is not so. The reason why US has not imposed onitselves the epassport deadline is simple that they can always verify its own citizens.

So, yes , it probably does not matter now, but in 6-7 years , when most of the passports are epassports, they may be taking a closer look at yours more frequently.
That could be, that's why I left this open ended. However, I doubt it. The US has been the main force behind pushing for this technology and hasn't pushed any country to invalidate old non electronic passports. Still I understand your point, there is a possibility of this happening.

itc said:
2. Again, epassport to my mind is just more safe. At least I know that if I loose it people would not be able to use it. From this point it also follows that if you show your epassport people will know it is not forged. Especially if you look "foreign" or you are with a foreign name and accent. Nobody will have any doubts.

Yes, these passports seem to be more resistant to forgery. At the very least the degree of confidence that the picture stored inside the chip matches the bearer of the passport should help to match the passpor to the holder. However, I guess it would be possible for someone to get an extra passport in their country by submitting forged documents. I guess in this case is where the backoffice facial recognition would be put to test, but I am digressing.

itc said:
3. I am unclear as to machine readable vs wireless. I know that you have to have a chip that has the same info your cover page has. That is the whole point and idea of the epassports. Apparently, it is extremely difficult if not impossible to alter the data on the chip. Now, can the chip be read just with contact rather than contactless? I do not know that. What I heard is that inorder to read the chip you have to swipe the passport first that generates a code that will be use to communicate with the chip. And chips can be read only few inches. So, no, I am not afraid that somebody will steal my data and those will be only my name and DOB, the same info that is on the cover page.
Machine readable are passports which have the two lines of data at the bottom of the identification page. The electronic passports are also machine readable. As you mention the machine readable part has to be read to generate a key to read the chip contents. Wireless I mean the RFID chip inside the electronic passport that is readable wirelessly. Yes, the data in the chip I'm sure it is difficult or impossible to modify. The ePassports cannot be read by contact. I was suggesting that it would have been better to make them readable only by contact with the chip (like on a smart chip). If someone steals your data they get your DOB, name, country and picture at least. Some countries might choose to add fingerprints to the chip. In old passports someone had to physically steal or gain access to your passport to find this information, if someone figures out how to break the security of the ePassports then they will be able to do it remotely without you even noticing. I don't want to scare anyone, perhaps this is the first digital application to be completely and absolutely unbreakable, it would pretty much be a first.
itc said:
4. As far as government goes, they already have all the data and more than I want to. Just think of your IRS form and what info you send them. A chip that has the same info as my cover page does not bother me much.

All the best

Yes, you are right. They already have the information anyway when you apply. It is the possibility of getting tracked, skimmed or eavesdropped that could be potentially open with the ePassport. Some people have mentioned the possibility of U.S. citizens to be targeted in non-friendly countries if people figure out how to read the passports remotely.
I know that the risks at this time are low because the technology is new, but give it some time and perhaps someone will figure out how to break the protections. I would be more afraid of an ePassport being recalled to upgrade security than the possibility of a third country to stop taking valid non electronic passports.
Again, I know the risks for all the bad case scenarios I depicted are low, but I think they are worth mentioning on the pro/cons list.

My 2 cents.
 
Why do you need a passport prior to Interview???

This may be a crazy question, but I am a bit confused.

I am a USC and my husband and I have the Interview scheduled for 11/8/06. Someone mentioned the other day that needs to get his passport prior to the interview and that his Consulate ID card will not be sufficient as ID for the interview.

I understand that one may need a passport when traveling outside of the country, but since passports are no longer stamped at the interview (if I understand everything clearly), why would my husband need this passport???
 
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