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Immigration Reform - Need action..

Discussion in 'The Complaint' started by Tim_h, May 17, 2006.

  1. Tim_h

    Tim_h Registered Users (C)

    Immigration and the long term viability of the American Dream.

    Respected Sir/Madam,


    We, the undersigned, are signing this online petition to express our views regarding the ongoing Immigration debate. Immigrants desiring to come to America have in some way or the other come across the term "The American Dream". Simply put, it is the United States' ability to attract talent from around the world, provide an environment for entrepreneurship and technological development and a society with high living standards. For the American dream to remain viable, the United States congress needs to seriously consider the Immigration reforms that are being brought forward. Below are few key points relevant in this discussion.

    Legal immigrants in the United States mainly constitue intellectual talent from around the world who are generally professionals like Software engineers and doctors. These category of Immigrants have had no desire to move to countries like Mexico, El-Salvador, Cuba or Haiti. If the United States encourages illegal immigrants from these countries, it is going to be less attractive for the intellectual immigrants to come to the United States. Because if left unchecked the United States is going to be like one of these countries.

    Today, it is no secret that India and China are becoming hotbeds for economic progress and technological advancement. If America does not maintain its attractiveness to this global intellectual resource pool, it is going to negatively affect the prosperity of the United States, while the talent moves towards India and China.

    Some of the brightest students in the United States universities are immigrants from countries like India and China. There is no incentive for these students to stay back resulting in an outward brain drain.

    More and more intellectual immigrants who are currently in the United states legally, are considering going back to their homelands because of the hassles legal immigrants face in gaining long term legal status. Many are on visa programs like H1-B which is valid only for 6 years.

    Legal immigrants mainly employed in the United States through H1 and L1 visas pay on an average between $20,000 and $40,000 annually in income taxes.

    Legal immigrants contribute significantly in driving the United States economy with their superior buying power.

    Legal immigrants pay huge amounts of money to the Immigration dept for visas, visa renewals, employment authorization cards, Advance paroles and various other fees to maintain legal status. Illegal immigrants do not pay any fees or taxes and the government is considering handing out Citizenship to them.

    All our lives, we have been taught to never jump a line and to patiently wait in line for your turn. Today, illegal immigrants are allowed to jump the line and get ahead of all the legal immigrants who struggle hard with burdensome documentation to maintain legal status. It takes a legal immigrant about 10 years to get citizenship, whereas for illegal immigrants, there is no debate about visas or green cards or permanent residence, instead the talk is about granting straight citizenship. How is this fair to all the legal immigrants waiting in line?

    Legal immigrants today are divided into two groups. One group is questioning the attractiveness of America as more and more illegal and uneducated immigrants dilute the living standards and quality of life in America. With emerging markets providing greater oppurtunity and stability they are considering moving to these countries. The second group still believes that America is the place to be, but unfortunately, the legal immigration system is so inefficient, backlogged and slow that they are forced to leave in despair. Either way, both groups are leaving the United States.

    We as a group of legal intellectual immigrants are not opposed to Immigration reform, but strongly believe in a better process. A process which would be beneficial to the United States. If the United States were a corporation, it would only make sense to recruit the top level intellectual immigrants as citizens, that would move the corporation forward with huge profits. Instead the move United States is considering is akin to hiring 12 million janitors; sure the place will be clean, but America will be poor and bankrupt.

    Please forward this message widely so that it reaches the senators and the US congress.

    Hope for the best,
    Legal Intellectual Immigrants.
  2. TheChosenJuan

    TheChosenJuan Registered Users (C)

    Very well said Tim_h.
  3. irachka

    irachka Registered Users (C)

    I don't agree...

    I totally disagree with you there. Let's leave the illegal immigrants aside for a moment and let's chanel the energy towards the "American minds".. talking about immigrants taking the jobs of Americans?? here is how the "professional immigrants"... by taking high paying jobs that an AMERICAN should have.

    I say: dramatically reduce work visas (all types), cancel lottery visa and increase family visas for categories: 1,2A, 2B, 3 & 4. Americans have the RIGHT to have their children (all ages, single or married) and siblings with them. IMMEDIATELY.
  4. legal_alien

    legal_alien New Member

    Amen!!! Totally agree with you Tim_H
  5. monochrome86

    monochrome86 Registered Users (C)

    humble pie, humble pie.

    that commentary...wow. you of all people should understand the plight of illegal immigrants.

    I myself hold an F-1 visa. I do everything in that I can to stay in line and not disobey the multiple laws (even those that are superfluous) that have been set for me. However, you and I are quite fortunate people. Unlike the many illegal immigrants, we were able to prove to a visa officer that we are pretty much well off people. We come from well established families. If anything, many of us "legals" need to eat some humble pie and empathize with those that aren't as lucky as us. True, some people who get visas are purely lucky. But we all know that those that make it had to have shown a substantial amount of money, properties, social ties, whatever to be able to be here. Unfortunately, some of the illegals cannot do that. You of all people should know how hard it is to get in, right? SOME against their will do what they think would be in the best interest of their families. If they were able to make a decent living in their own countries, of course they wouldn't exactly be flocking to the US! Barely anyone wants to leave their roots unless they have to.

    It is unfair to generalize that illegal immigrants are simply jumping the line. The current status being debated by the Congress doesn't stipulate that illegal immigrants will simply be handed their citizenship. It's not like they're saying "here, you are now an American, off you go!" No. There is a looooong process that they have to undertake, back taxes to be paid, and numerous fees. I'm not saying this is unfair, all I'm saying is that it's not as easy as you make it sound. Plus, some have been living here for such a long time! 11,12 years of not seeing their families...not being able to see their kids grow up, missing out on so many things back home. Many of us (admittedly not all) are able to fly home if we want to. Can't you be gracious enough to let people be happy?


    "If the United States were a corporation, it would only make sense to recruit the top level intellectual immigrants as citizens, that would move the corporation forward with huge profits. Instead the move United States is considering is akin to hiring 12 million janitors; sure the place will be clean, but America will be poor and bankrupt."

    And you call yourself an intellectual? Please. To call the rest of illegal immigrants janitors is degrading and quite scathing. hardly intellectual at all! There are different faces to illegal immigrants. It's true that there are some that cause trouble and give the rest of immigrants a bad face. First off, you are making it sound like being a janitor is a common job for illegals, and second, you are making it sound like they are degenerates who are not as intellectual and as educated as you.

    As a matter of fact, many illegal immigrants boast great education backgrounds. They, too, are doctors, engineers, scientists. There are many that are degree holders. Most importantly, they are fathers, mothers, brothers, and sisters. They are dreamers and entrepreneurs that simply want to find a better life that unfortunately, their country cannot give them. These are people who have been established within their communities. They are parents of children that have grown up here and strive to revitalize the "dream" for the next generation.

    You see, if we continue to simply glorify those on the "top" of the corporation, you aren't always guaranteed to get good results. Many illegal immigrants hail from countries ruled by the "elite" that mainly care for themselves.

    Oh, and as I recall, America is the land of opportunity...you're free to pursue what you want, whether you want to be a doctor or a janitor. I don't recall it as the land of the pompous.

    And by the way, to be an intellectual does not simply mean being educationally accomplished. It's also about being well-rounded, wise, humble, and most of all gracious for the privilege. Intellectuals don't glorify themselves. Narcissists do. :)
    Last edited by a moderator: May 26, 2006
  6. jynger

    jynger Registered Users (C)

    monochrome86 sounds like another illegal immigration lobby group.... typical ACLU, La Raza types.. who don't care for US law.

    It doesn't matter if you are a mother, father, daughter or doctor, engineer... IF you are illegal, it mean you broke the law and lawbreakers do not deserve special paths to legal status...
  7. monochrome86

    monochrome86 Registered Users (C)


    If i don't care for US laws, then why the hell do I bother keeping myself in legal status? Of course, I care!

    However, there are some people who don't have the ability to do that. To enter the country legally, like for example with an H visa, you have to prove that you have a ton of money to come back to back home. Now, if you don't have a college degree, and desperately want to go to the US for a job, then you're basically out of luck. The US won't let you in.

    True, this isn't the US' problem and many countries really need to do a better job of looking out for their citizens especially in terms of giving them opportunities.

    All I'm saying is, as legal immigrants, do not be a jerk and persecute all other illegal immigrants, seeing as you should know how hard it is to secure a visa and stay legal. If illegals were given a choice, I hardly think that they would want to stay illegal, and second, they're not trying to get ahead of you in line! Everyone's complaining about how they're all getting benefits and how they're getting ahead in line. Nobody said that. So stop being so pompous. I'm not trying to defend the state of being illegal. All I'm saying is, there should be an opportunity for them to improve their lives and be right with the law, as they are still held responsible anyway for their past actions ANYWAY!

    It's not like the US is asking you to pay penalties and such, right? Why on earth is it such a problem for you then? Don't think you're some pure god-like person because you are documented.
  8. monochrome86

    monochrome86 Registered Users (C)

    on and btw

    Tim_H, you're complaining that it takes 10 years for a legal immigrant to get a visa.

    Fromt the proposed legislation by the senate, that is if you as an "intellectual" update yourself with current events, only immigrants that have been in the country for 5 years and over are being granted a path to citizenship. The rest are either work visas or are being asked to leave...that is, if it passes. And you know how long the proposed "path to citizenship" is? 11 years. Yep, you could well be here for 20 years, but it will still take 11 years to get it. So stop whining. Sheesh.
  9. puceml72

    puceml72 Registered Users (C)

    totally agree with you at 110% peoples have no clue how hard it is to be here legally! and most of people that complains don't even know most of laws anyway if you don't have to deal with you don't know so all the people that are against illegal just go to your room and pray to GOD to forgive you of judging people! that's all I have to say!
  10. monochrome86

    monochrome86 Registered Users (C)

    thank you!

    exactly. sheesh. instead of being judgmental, let's help each other out. Stop being all technical that illegals "broke the law". How about children that were brought here illegally by their parents? Somtimes, it's not by choice. Many situations encompass the current conditions of illegal immigrants. If you get off your "legal throne" and actually bother to listen to them, you will be humbled and you'll see how filing all these papers and such to stay legal is not as much of a pain as being illegal and always watching your back. No insurance, narrow opportunities...have a heart, jerks.
  11. susan ward

    susan ward Banned


    Stop winging, start doing something, to help the legal immigrants who are landlock in this country whilst their E and L visa's are taking 24 weeks + to review

    There are many sad cases on www.expatvoice.org where partners or close relatives have passed away, The time has come for legals to stand up and be counted.

    Whilst the Dream act protects illegal children , there is NO protection for children of E visa holders to remain in the uSA upon reaching 21 years old,

    If these children are very bright and parents rich enough to afford college, then all well and good, but what about the poor children who are not bright enough to attend further education, or their parents able to afford the fees

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