*******Here is What Happened at the 3 June Hearing*****

[Rajiv S. Khanna]

Summary:

1. The judge has decided not to rule on our class action motion. This is to be kept pending. (bad news ).

2. We have been given permission to ask the govt. questions and request documents etc. so we can figure out whether the delays are "unreasonable" (good news ).


I will give you more details. I have also requested a transcript of the hearing (it will take 30 days). I will post it for you all also.

Warmest regards to all.

 

[Rajiv S. Khanna]

Another view

GC_YEAHRIGHT! has just posted in the The Complaint forum of ImmigrationPortal Forums under the title of ****Hearing date rescheduled to June 3, 2004****.

This thread is located at http://www.ImmigrationPortal.com/showthread.php?threadid=124617

Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Hi ALL
Just got back from the Courtroom.
The hearing of the case was pre-poned from 4.45 to 4.15 so I missed all the initial stuff..
The basic summary is as follows:
As Rajiv put it "We got the things we NEED, maybe not all the things we WANT"
Class Certification. Judge has decided that he will rule on this matter after knowing all the facts, which will happen during the "discovery" phase, so for now its postponed.

Regular Case. Judge wanted both parties to meet and start the "discovery" phase. He laso has asked both parties for a "phone teleconference" between the judge, and counsel for both Plaintiffs and Defendants sometime within next 45 days or so (Rajiv has the exact details,)

My views on the proceedings: We seem to have a strong basis for our case. The USCIS lawyer seemed under pressure explaining his points to the judge (my opinion)...he was trying to say that the plaintiffs want their cases processed out of turn and this defeats USCIS's policy of FIFO..Blah..Blah...he was also trying to confuse the issue saying "I-485" means all sorts of cases like Asyleee etc etc, whereas our positions is that, we are only interested in "EMPLOYMENT BASED 1-485's. RAJIV vigorously defended our cause on this point and I think during Discovery phase the judge too will see through USICS fudging of facts.
Anyways all in all I was satisfied with todays outcome and I think the Judge did not wish to make too many rulings until he familiarizes himself with all the "FACTS", which I guess will happen during the "discovery" phase.

Please take above comments as my personal opinion/understanding of the "partial proceedings" that I witnessed and wait for Rajivs comments on this evening's Courtroom events.
All the best to US
***************

 

[dsatish]

Summary:

1. The judge has decided not to rule on our class action motion. This is to be kept pending. (bad news ).

2. We have been given permission to ask the govt. questions and request documents etc. so we can figure out whether the delays are "unreasonable" (good news ).


I will give you more details. I have also requested a transcript of the hearing (it will take 30 ndyas). I will post it for you all also.

Warmest regards to all.

Rajiv,
I don't think that it is fair for us to expect the judge to rule on the class action certification without any hearing. So i don't consider that as bad news . Ofcourse, i am not a lawyer, and there may be instances when the judges make such rulings without much hearings.
So let's start thinking about the possible questions to ask CIS. My first question to them would be why they are not following FIFO ? We have ample evidence from the postings of approval from many people in this forum.

 

[andreab67]

Rajiv,
I don't think that it is fair for us to expect the judge to rule on the class action certification without any hearing. So i don't consider that as bad news . Ofcourse, i am not a lawyer, and there may be instances when the judges make such rulings without much hearings.
So let's start thinking about the possible questions to ask CIS. My first question to them would be why they are not following FIFO ? We have ample evidence from the postings of approval from many people in this forum.

Hi Rajiiv,
thanks for all the effort.
What is bothering me and I think most of the people that are part of this adventure is the stubborness on the USCIS Lawyer that are accusing us to ask to be treated without following the so called FIFO rule.
Now it is time in my opinion to go to the end of this crap.
If there are approvals, and we do have proof of that from the trackers, and the approvals are of cases with receipt notices of 2003 and 2004 it is wrong. That should not happen and should be taken to the attention of the judge and the media.
It looks like people like me with a receipt notice of September 2002 will never get fingerpriniting or Approval note for another 1 or 2 years.
I'm applying now for my 3rd EAD and that is wrong.
I hope somthing happens soon...

Regards

Andreab67

I485 09/13/2002 - Still waiting for FP - Texas Service Center - AKA Wait and Die Waiting

 

[rk4gc]

Thanks to Rajiv and GC_YEAHRIGHT for their updates.

As DSATISH put it, I think we should take even the first point in a positive way. Well Judge didnot rule out the class action, let the Judge get familiar with the case better.

Time for plaintiffs to get prepare . Good luck to all.

 

[feb6361]

Dear Mr. Rajiv,

Seems to me a overall positive day in court for us and atleast judge has not rejected our class action motion and showing keen interest in finding 'FACTS'! and you know, we have lot more FACTS to present in front of Judge.

I don't have any words to express my appriciation to you for every thing you do for us/whole community!!!

With best regards to you and everyone!!

 

[amrcn_attd]

This is not at all good news. This can only drag on and on. What do they want to discover that has not been discovered by us till now?
How long will this go on...till next year, or after that?

In another 2 years, we will all get the GC within 6 months, that is a given, whether we fight or not, because there won't be as many people applying. Fewer H1s applying for GC etc.

America benefits only if able bodied people slog here as long as possible - paying taxes and social security. If one gets a citizenship faster, especially those whose countries have granted dual citizenship, there is very little the US government can do to withhold a good fraction of our earnings.

By 2010 more Americans(due to Baby Boomers) will draw from Social security than the input into the system. Most of the tax payers would then be from the immigrant population.

The best solution for us is to fight to dissociate social security and make it only payable after GC is given, this will automatically speed up the process, the government would even go so far as to 'OUTSOURCE these INS jobs, if that happens.

We can see that illegal immigrants are being raked in for tax revenues and insurance and security(?). It seems they will get a license in California..printed 'Illegal Immigrant', that does not stop them from driving .
Why not give us a 'Incomplete GC' printed on the GC card ? because they do not see any monetary advantage in doing so. Things will happen only if we talk in monetary terms. Nothing else works, till we have electoral weight.

Meanwhile they make memos upon memos, and rake in premium processing fees etc, as if we are not willing to give $10,000 for a instant GC, that is what will be eventually targeted(now it is happening in installments, that is the only difference). Premium processing of H1 is a step in that direction. Wait and see...anything goes...to bring up an ailing economy.

The only way to deal with this is to have an american attitude. Anything less is just plain 'begging'.

 

[feb6361]

Dear Mr. Rajiv & core team,

I would greatly appriciate if you will arrange a conf. call for everyone to know the full detail and next cours of actions!!

Thank you!

 

[dsatish]

This is not at all good news. This can only drag on and on. What do they want to discover that has not been discovered by us till now?
How long will this go on...till next year, or after that?

Don't worry. The immigrationportal.org will make sure that they (CIS directors) won't get away so easily unless they act fast on the backlogs. The D-day for the fight is nearing. So far we have collected $19,500. It's a matter of another $10,000 before our plans go into action. Let us stay united and make a perfect fight both in the court and off the court.

 

[wait-N-watch]

More proof on their Random processing

I hope some threads from this link can also help us show the way USCIS randomly process cases
for both I-140 and I-485

http://groups.msn.com/texasimmigration/txi140page.msnw

http://groups.msn.com/texasimmigration/i485issues.msnw

 

[dsatish]

Conference call on Sunday 2pm EST / 1pm CST / 11am PST

Dear Mr. Rajiv & core team,

I would greatly appriciate if you will arrange a conf. call for everyone to know the full detail and next cours of actions!!

Thank you!

OK, Rajiv has accepted for the public conference call on Sunday 2pm EST / 1pm CST / 11am PST. I will post the conference call number and pass code by Sunday morning. So keep an eye on this thread.

 

[tmc]

some questions to ask...

(1) What is the complete procedure in approving 485? (we need more info than just the standard operating procedure)
- is the security check done at the receipt of the 485. how much time the security check takes. if it is done, why can't they approve the application as soon as the security check is done. do they check the I-140 etc again while approving the 485 (which is a waste of time). if they do check the I-140, how much time on average an officer spends in checking I-140, medical and birth certificates etc (i.e., except security).
(2) Are security checks done for EAD/AP?
- if so, why can't they approve the 485 as well when the security check is complete. if security check is not done, why can't they give a EAD/AP on a walk in basis at the local office.
(3) Why arbitrary processing? i mean two people from exactly same company, geographical location etc have completely different processing. no, i am not talking about couple of months here. there are cases where one person has done FP months before, whereas the other person is still waiting for FP. What is the order in which this is done.

 

[1victim]

Should we concentrate on FIFO or processing in general?

Hello everyone,

First of all my sincere thanks to Rajiv!

Isnt it hard to prove that a "perfect FIFO" is possible ? think about it, it
will be very easy for USCIS to say that the cases we pick to prove they
are not doing the processing in First-In-First-Out needed special and more investigation and hence the delay for those cases. Obviously it is not us which decide who
gets aproved, and which case needs more investigation, and I am sure USCIS have humongous number of "red flags" from which they can pick and attach it to the non-FIFO processed case. ofcourse, what is a "red flag" to them may not be so for us... I think we are better off concentrating the main issue of overall ridiculous backlogs... ( I share the pain of all those applicants whose cases fell behind due to non-FIFO processnig and i dont meant to offend them)

thanks

 

[tmc]

IMHO, actually INS will have a tough time to prove this. suppose two ppl have a perfect I-140, medical and birth certificates. the only redflag can be security. They will have to prove that the name check that was requested for these ppl on the same day resulted in a hit for one of them and hence the delay. they have to show the name check request and the result for that day. i would assume they won't be able to do that (please note that this is my assumption). IMHO, most backlog is just due to INS inefficiency.

in a perfect world, IMHO, as soon as I-140 is approved, i would ask the applicant to go to local office with the medicals in sealed envelope and the I-140 approval notice along with BC (like consular processing). there he gives all documents, gives FP. a month after, if everything is smooth he gets stamping at the same place. otherwise he is told what is wrong. INS, complicates this simple process. approving I-140 takes a lot of skill like evaluating job qualification etc, but not 485.

Hello everyone,

First of all my sincere thanks to Rajiv!

Isnt it hard to prove that a "perfect FIFO" is possible ? think about it, it
will be very easy for USCIS to say that the cases we pick to prove they
are not doing the processing in First-In-First-Out needed special and more investigation and hence the delay for those cases. Obviously it is not us which decide who
gets aproved, and which case needs more investigation, and I am sure USCIS have humongous number of "red flags" from which they can pick and attach it to the non-FIFO processed case. ofcourse, what is a "red flag" to them may not be so for us... I think we are better off concentrating the main issue of overall ridiculous backlogs... ( I share the pain of all those applicants whose cases fell behind due to non-FIFO processnig and i dont meant to offend them)

thanks

 

[visa_chakkar]

Hi Guys,
I think our expectations were very high ..
out main goal was USICS should take care of backlog and they really started on backlog only bacause of LAWSUIT. This is major victory in my opinion.
Since Judge has ordered discovery session in both parties. Pressure is still on them ... they need to continue reducing backlog by same speed.

we started battle in late 2003 , it will take time when come to judgement.

we need to have patience and support rajiv and core team for what they are doing

 

[feb6361]

dsatish,

FYI..I have contributed $200.00 today via paypal..will contribute more in future!!

Thank you for arranging conf. call for every one this Sunday!!

OK, Rajiv has accepted for the public conference call on Sunday 2pm EST / 1pm CST / 11am PST. I will post the conference call number and pass code by Sunday morning. So keep an eye on this thread.

 

[dawnn]

Thanks

Rajiv,
My sincere thanks for fighting on behalf of us.
What are your thoughts on the discovery process?

In my opinion, the developements are not very encouraging. Should it take more that 6 months to realize that this case is actually class action? I am not sure why facts discovered so far are not attributed towards this. What kind of new discoveries are they looking for?


Thanks.

 

[140_takes_4ever]

Here is a letter sent by Don Neufield to a Congressperson when asked about WHY FIFO was NOT being implemented. Is it possible to use this letter to disprove the defence's claim that we want to break FIFO? And to prove to the judge that INS is doing nothing but playing smoke and mirrors with everyone. I am sure Kashmir has a copy of the letter mentioned below and so do a couple of other people on the CSC forum, which can be fedexed over to Rajiv's office.

********
May 26, 2004

Dear Congressman _________

Thank you for your recent letter seeking informaiton about the backlog of employment based Adjustment of Status applications (Form I-485) at the California Service Center (CSC).

I want to assure you that the CSC continues to adjudicate adjustment of status applications. In fact, our records reflect that we approved, denied, or relocated for interview more than 24,000 in Fiscal Year 2003. We have allocated additional resources and expect to complete more than 68,000 applications in the current fiscal year.

Unlike most other applications, I-485's are not necessarily adjudicated in receipt date order. Adjudication can only occur after all backgroupd checks have been conducted, relating files located, and underlying petitions retrieved from file storage, including those of family members. With the added safeguards that were mandated after Septebmer 11, 2001, most applications required additional background checks before they could be properly adjudicated. As response times in conducing these checks varied greatly from case to case, these additional checks further disrupted the chronological processing of applications and significantly delayed the overall adjudication process. Even though we continued to adjudicate thousands of applications as checks were completed, our published processing time showed little progress.

As the older background checks are completed, the processing time for I-485's will continue to improve. Based on current workload projections, we expect to reduce the procesing tim for Adjustment of Status applicaitons to 12 months or less by the en dof September 2004.

I hope I have adequately addressed your concerns. I would be happy to discuss this furhter should you or someone on your staff wish to contact me by telephone. I may be reached at (telephone number whited out).

Sincerely,

Donald W. Neufeld

DN:cm
****************

Link to Original thread

 

[greenEnvy]

Here is some more fodder

From http://www.immigration-law.com

05/14/2004: California Service Center Concurrent Adjudication Pilot Initiation and Warning Against Abuse

We reported earlier that the California Service Center was launching I-140/I-485 concurrent adjudication pilot program for the concurrent I-140/I-485 filing cases inasmuch as it is non-National Interest Waiver case and filed after certain date. Qualified cases were supposed to be adjudicated in less than 90 days.
Apparently, CSC is concerned at this time that those who have already filed concurrent I-140/I-485 cases or I-140 petition alone may withdraw the pending cases to refile a concurrent I-140/I-485 case to take advantage of the pilot program.
AILA reports that CSC will not take such withdrawn-refiling cases qualified for the pilot program and will not adjudicate such cases concurrently. It appears, though, that such decision may raise a legal question of arbitraniness in administration of adjudication function. It may also raise the issue of "equal" protection and fairness. The agency may create a "class" without permissible legal justification or constitutional basis just as seen in the "Francis" decision. We'll see.

 

[amrcn_attd]

From http://www.immigration-law.com
Apparently, CSC is concerned at this time that those who have already filed concurrent I-140/I-485 cases or I-140 petition alone may withdraw the pending cases to refile a concurrent I-140/I-485 case to take advantage of the pilot program.

I think, CSC wants that to happen, that way all old backlog will become current backlog...as if lot of fresh applications came in..without much effort on their part.

AILA reports that CSC will not take such withdrawn-refiling cases qualified for the pilot program and will not adjudicate such cases concurrently.

Is AILA 'really' trying to Help? Then it should block this move by CSC. Instead of snubbing FIFO like this.