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"Have you ever been removed, excluded or deported from the United States?"

Discussion in 'US Citizenship' started by realexm, Jul 16, 2008.

  1. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    Quick question: when I applied for my Green Card abroad in Europe, I told them about a minor criminal record (I have another thread open regarding this). Initially, the consulate considered it 'moral turpitude' and they rejected a tourist visa I applied for pending my Green Card process.

    Throughout the process they discovered that my conviction actually was NOT moral turpitude and the consular office told me he was going to 'erase'/'clean' my record because of mistakes made on their end.

    Now my I am wondering about question: "26. Have you ever been removed, excluded or deported from the United States?"

    According to the consulate, they never should denied my tourist visa and they say they have corrected my records. On the other hand you can say that yes, I have (wrongfully) been excluded once by (once again wrongfully) denying me a tourist visa.

    Your thoughts?
     
  2. Bobsmyth

    Bobsmyth Volunteer Moderator

    I would say answer is "yes", but include letter from consulate admitting their decision was wrong and explain circumstances at interview.
     
  3. vdostoi1

    vdostoi1 Volunteer Moderator

    Yes, I agree. I would say yes. Think about this situation: if you were thrown in jail because you were being persecuted by some political group and even though in the eyes of the law you were defending your freedom or whatnot and it was wrongful to be thrown in jail, how would you answer the question "have you ever been to jail"? Of course, yes, and then you would explain what happened. Same in this case as well. That's just my thinking.
     
  4. Triple Citizen

    Triple Citizen Registered Users (C)

    My opinion is to answer it as "no" since you were never admitted to the US.

     
  5. Bobsmyth

    Bobsmyth Volunteer Moderator

    If you're excluded you would never have been admitted in the first place, so the answer would still be "yes".
     
  6. Triple Citizen

    Triple Citizen Registered Users (C)

    The OP was refused a visitor's visa. The key would would be the refusal code. Otherwise all applicants who ever got a 214(b) would have to answer yes to this question.


     
  7. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    Shouldn't all this 'consular information' be in my INS file to begin with and shouldn't the IO have reviewed it in advance? Just curious....

    Does it makes sense to explain the background to the IO during the interview and ask what according to him/her the proper way to answer this question is? I am still confused why the IO should not have all this information...
     
  8. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    The refusal code would be 'Being involved in a crime involving moral turpitude' (or something similar). But then again, the consular office cleared my name.

    They actually told me they send a request to the (I believe) European IRS HQ in Germany to do this name clearance; this process took about 2 weeks. Immediately afterwards I received my Green Card paper/envelop.

    My major concern on one hand is that I do not want to lie on my application but on the other hand also do not want to raise any unnecessary red flags.
     
  9. Bobsmyth

    Bobsmyth Volunteer Moderator

    Correct, but the OP indicated that he was denied (albeit incorrectly) a visa based on a CIMT (8 USC 1182 2 (A)). This means he was specifically found inadmissible at the time based on excludability, and not on illegibility like others who ever got 214(b).
     
  10. aabbcc11

    aabbcc11 Registered Users (C)

    Since the exclusion/denial was in error and should not have been done in the first place, am guessing the answer should be no. I thought that qn was meant to see if the applicant was sent out of teh US after entry.
     
  11. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    Bob, thanks for your insight. Does this mean that according to you I should answer 'Yes' to this question, even although INS has admitted they have been mistaken?
     
  12. Bobsmyth

    Bobsmyth Volunteer Moderator

    Excluded means you are barred from entering the US whereas deportation means removal from the US. Since OP was excluded by denial of a visa based on CIMT, I would think the answer would be "yes".
     
  13. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    But I think that the key here is that I was excluded by mistake (so it never should have happened). The consular officer mentioned to me that the 'correction' they places in the system erased all records from any previous entries linked to my name.

    Does it makes sense to discuss this situation with the IO and see what his/her recommendations are? I'm not even sure how the interview works and to what extend the IO will assist applicants with the application.
     
  14. Bobsmyth

    Bobsmyth Volunteer Moderator

    That's why you would explain the circumstances behind the consulate's error if you choose to answer "yes", instead of relying on what the consular officer told you about how the system erases any decisions based on error and answer "no". It seems like a gray area, since it can be interpreted either way. Have you tried calling the consulate to see if they can send you a letter explaining the circumstances behind the denial?
     
  15. orangeandwhite

    orangeandwhite Registered Users (C)

    You were refused a visa, yes. But that's not what they are asking. They are asking if you were removed, excluded or deported. These all essentially mean that you were forcibly made to leave the country.

    These are legal terms of art, defined in the INA. "Excluded" does not have the common sense meaning you are ascribing to it.

    My view: the correct answer is no.
     
  16. CrossHairs

    CrossHairs Registered Users (C)

    u can say Yes, and attach explanation and any evidence of conclusion.
    That way ur being 100% truthful.
     
  17. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    So excluded does not mean 'visa denied'?
     
  18. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    Thanks. I am calling the consulate tomorrow, but I don't have high hopes of any explanation from their end. My experiences in the past have been extremely positive with the 'real' consular officers, but extremely negative with the 'local' consulate personnel.
     
  19. aabbcc11

    aabbcc11 Registered Users (C)

    Like Orange says, I thought that qn meant -- have you been deported at taxpayer charge? I do not know for certain. My pers op is that this is a non issue which you chould explain to the IO at the time of interview; for the time being answer NO on the n400. That's what I would do I guess.

    Good luck, calling a consulate and expecting help is really expecting miracles.
     
  20. realexm

    realexm Registered Users (C)

    :)

    Just a quick update: I tried calling the consulate but their hours are 8-12. And this is GMT time.... So I have to get up early tomorrow.
     

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